DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Haden: Why the Steelers and Why He Was Released

I am going to strongly disagree w/this notion that Haden was dogging it here.

That's beyond lame.

Just stating what the consensus is here in Pittsburgh so far.

He has played his entire career on a bad team, was deflated emotionally, and now seems to be all in and showing them in practice he is ready to play.

we wont know until gameday - I am just relaying what the word is around here where I live. They have him listed as the #1 CB, we had him listed at what 3?

Joe's a professional. Our FO might be wrong in their evaluation of him, but I've never thought of him as the type of guy who would be "dogging it" in practice.



The FO doesn't think that Joe is worth is salary. He didn't want to take a payout (can't blame him), and at his salary he didn't fit into their plans and they cut him.

His play the last two seasons has been sub-par. They decided to cut him. Can't say I agree with their decision, but it's theirs, and we'll see how it plays out.



But in no way have I ever thought Joe would be the type of guy dogging it. He's been one our best team leaders and a good example of how to be a professional (except for the drug suspension early in his career) for a long time here

I don't think he was dogging it either. But I do think there is a chance that human nature could be in play here. It's probably hard to get yourself amped up and be at your best when your season is over every year by week 4. I'm not saying that's what's happening here, but he could feel rejuvenated and more focused playing on a team that will compete for a championship this year.

He was not playing very good before he got hurt two years ago. He was not playing good this preseason when he had supposedly got healthy. I don't think he would have played well had he stayed on the team. But I do think he could get himself more dialed in and raise his level of play because he's happier being on a winning team.

Again, I am pulling for him. I want him to do well. I also don't mind that we let him go. It just wasn't happening for him here.

I don't think Haden was dogging it in Cleveland to try and get out of there...i think he may have been taking it easy in practice and for the little bit of preseason game action he saw to try and make sure he didn't get injured again in ameaningless game or practice. That said.. He was running straight line step for step with Heyward Bey... the fastest wr on the team... but that double groin injury is all about change of direction. Almost time to see what the deal is.

HACK

Sorry, but that sounds total koolaid. Haden may still be good and productive and when he isn't playing the browns I wish him well. I wish he was still a brown even if he was the 3rd best cb on the team ...... But reports of him keeping pace with your fastest wr on the team ..... Simply do not believe that's legit.

its not kool-aid.

Haden will have a Pro Bowl year this year...he had been hurt the past two seasons and still played and now that he is finally healthy again we gave up on him.

Haden wasn't the 3rd best CB on our team, he was best one. This will be readily apparent sunday...you will see the 2014 Joe Haden this year in Pittsburgh

Unless DHB is the one dogging it...... lol

You heard it right here, folks!

That's good to hear but he never was the fastest CB. (He was like a 4.6 at the combine, I think.) He relies more on smarts and physicality.

You hit the nail on the head about the change of direction. Joe's best attributes were his change of direction, fluid hips and ability to break on the ball. In preseason this year, he still wasn't showing any of that.

I don't agree with anyone that thinks he was dogging it either. He is just running like a guy with a groin injury. Playing two years on a bad groin has taken it's toll and he just isn't back to what he once was. Will he ever be? I'm not sure, but I have my doubts if he keeps playing instead of taking time off. He isn't giving himself a chance to heal.

Again, I am just pointing what is being floated around, don't shoot the messenger.

I agree with what one poster said, that leaving a team like ours for a contender would be more a rejuvenation and hope to play in a playoff game. I don't think "dogging" it was happening here, I think he just wasn't all in anymore knowing we are so far away, and he could be on his last leg w/ his injury history.

I think BBC will surprise a lot people, and I have him as going to be our #1 CB, and think he will be pro bowl level.

Wait.........are you saying that it's being reported that Haden was dogging it in practice? That is a strong, strong accusation against a man's character.

Could you provide some links that say he was dogging it in practice?

Not koolaid?? Then let's call it for what it is ..... A big fat lie.

Haden 40 time. 4.57
DHB 40 Time 4.3

It's really simple.

No, he didn't. At least, that's not how I read it.

He said Haden was reported to be keeping pace with Heyward-Bay in practice, insinuating that he has his straight-line speed back. Questions still remain regarding his change of direction speed.

You just have to realize that this is what a lot of Browns fans do. They love their players and will stick up for them no matter what. Until they're cut. Then they will find every excuse in the book why the guy is a bum.

I disagree, its not that simple

Many players in the NFL keep up with guys that run faster 40 times then they do. in 2014 Haden kept up with many guys who ran faster 40 times then him including Julio Jones and many others.

Darrell Green was the fastest guy in the NFL at one point and one of the fastest in the history of the NFL and he still got chased down from behind in games and even got burnt by WR at times that ran slower 40 times then him...40 times don't matter as much in game as you think, and the different in 40 time between Haden and Bey is pretty small. 0.2 secs isn't huge.

Not to mention DHB is a horrible route runner and Joe Haden is a master of sticking with a WR, by putting his hands on him. I'm not surprised Joe Haden could keep up with him. Also, Joe's weaknesses are double moves and refs who watch Joe's hands.

Lets just be honest with ourselves here ...

Its not only lame its STUPID to even suggest he dogged it here ...

Yep that's why half this board is still in love with Josh Gordon.

The report didn't mention Haden sticking with his man, or planting him at the line ..... it said he was out running the Steelers fastest WR. Maybe that means something different to some --- to me that means in a straight line foot race, Haden is as fast or faster in a straight line than anyone on the WR core of Pittsburgh. To me it has nothing to do with route running or CB ability - this was a reference to speed only. I flat our don't believe what was said. Not even as a young man in his prime.

I think people take NFL players running in shorts at a combine as some real comparison to what their speed is on game day in full pads.

The NFL isn't the same as a track meet.

Agree 100% .... but whether it is pads, shorts, thong, spedo or otherwise. I don't believe Haden beats out or keeps up with DHB or Bryant ... probably not even Brown over 40+ yards.

If you disagree and think Haden wins a foot race with those WR's feel free to say so.

I know he sure managed to cover A.J. Green pretty well. And on paper, based on combine numbers, Green is supposed to be faster.

How long ago did he manage to cover A.J. Green ? ? ?

When he was healthy. Like he is now.

Is that reply to me?

I am questioning the validity of reports saying that Haden was dogging it w/the Browns.

It was a reply to you.

There weren't any reports saying he was dogging it. Just reports that said he was keeping up with Heyward-Bay in practice, which could invite speculation that he was all healed up and (therefore) dogging it. Other posters pointed out that changing direction would be affected by the groin surgeries, not so much straightline speed.

Okay, but the posters said that there were reports of Joe dogging it in Cleveland, which would indicate that he was purposely trying to get cut.

I don't believe that.

He was not one of my favorite players and I've bashed him, but I am not going to question his character. He played w/two bad groins last year.

Over on the official steeler website there is a video interview with Haden after practice where they ask him about running step for step with DHB. His answer was he is healthy again, said he was always surprised by questions on his speed. That the combine 40 really stuck to him. He said he ran 4.3s at his pro day but he couldn't escape that combine..I don't remember his proday.. But he also said he always covered the fast guys in college. That I remember.

HACK

I don't remember the exact time, but I can confirm that his Pro Day was faster.

Watching Joe play, I don't ever think he was a burner. He's always been very "handsy," and I think part of that is to compensate for his speed issues.

I will say that he has looked slower the last couple of years and in preseason this year. Whether or not that is due to injury is something I don't know.

I remember you posting from the old days. You're a smart guy. Watch him and make up your own mind. Concentrate on the crossing routes where he is basically even w/the receiver. Does that continue through the route or does he fall behind?

I do think you're going to like how physical he is. He's not a big guy, but he is a good tackler and will really lay the wood.

I do vaguely remember that. His 40 at the combine did dog him up to the draft, and he did run much better at his pro-day, but those numbers were ignored. He had to answer a lot of questions on his straight-line speed leading up to the draft, which wasn't fair.

That being said, he has had trouble with WRs with the elite top-end speed, and the little super shifty guys.

Browns have like $60 million in available cap space.. seems like an odd time to force the issue on a couple million dollar pay cut for Haden.. but whatever.

I agree - if Haden is a bonafide NFL CB this season for the Steelers - then cutting Haden will have been the dumbest move yet by this FO. If he's anything close to a #1 CB - mentioned as a possible probowler .... then the decision will live in infamy and taint Sashi forever. I'd compare that to the FA signing of Bowe.

But it seems a lot of folks are making the assumption that Haden is 100% back to health and also will remain so for a full season.

I am not making that assumption and I have argued w/many posters over the past few years about just how good Joe was playing.

I am not saying he is a great corner. I am not saying he will be a Pro Bowler.

I'm simply saying that I think that our other corners aren't better than he is. I just don't see the logic in cutting players who are better than those you are keeping.

And we kept a guy who is actually older than Joe, so it isn't about the youth movement or developing younger players. It was a financial decision and that irks me in a number of ways.

Once Joe retires he will be Brown in my eyes again. I don't blame him at all for signing with Pittsburgh once we cut him. I think he made a good move for himself, and his family.

Now with that being said he shall forever be a waste of human flesh as long as he dawnes the black and yellow.

Matches my sentiments exactly, GM, but you were a tad more eloquent

j/c

to me, the three dumbest moves by this FO:

not re-signing Pryor
not re-signing Schwartz
releasing Greco

Haden isn't on my list because I don't think he's good anymore
Mack isn't on my list because he literally wouldn't sign here

... but I will add: they can make up for it if Kizer turns out to be a FQB