DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Hogan the starter part 2 ..

He means .. 500 yards passing.. first throw an 80 yard TD pass.. 28 of 30 passing.. and a WIN !!!

( maybe exaggerating.. but that is the way I remember it )

Things that make you go hmmmmmmm

Hogan's 40 yard time at the combine 4.78
Kizer's time 4.83

Vertical jump
Hogan 32.5
Kizer 30.5

Broad jump
Hogan 113.0
kizer 107.0

3 cone drill
Hogan 6.9
Kizer 7.4

20 yard shuttle
Hogan 4.31
Kizer 4.53

Hmmmmmmmmmm........

He also gets the ball out in a timely manner. I hope we're seeing (and saying) these same things a month from now.

His college experience is vastly different/better as well. 3 1/2 year starter after a red-shirt year.

You forgot hand size...never forget hand size.

If he can do the job, that's really all Hue needs at this point. Kizer was doing as you could expect the youngest rookie starting QB to play, but I think Hogan is better for Hue right now.

Will it result in a win? Minimizing mistakes can't hurt. If Hogan is going to be that guy, he should be starting.

Terry's Talkin'

By Terry Pluto, The Plain Dealer terrypluto2003@yahoo.com
CLEVELAND, Ohio -- Talkin' about Kevin Hogan ...

1. Now that he's the starting quarterback, what if Kevin Hogan can do the job originally assigned to Cody Kessler? Heading into the summer practices, Kessler was supposed to be the starter. The idea was for Kessler to play so there would be no need to rush DeShone Kizer into action. When Kessler failed, the Browns turned to Brock Osweiler.

2. By the third preseason game, Hue Jackson had turned to Kizer as the starter. Hogan was slowly moving up the depth chart. By the time the regular season opened, Hogan was the backup and Kessler was No. 3.

3. Hogan came to the Browns with many of the attributes they liked in Kessler. He was a four-year starter for a team that played a pro offense. That was true of Kessler at USC and Hogan at Stanford. I'm told the Browns had Hogan on their list of quarterbacks to take lower in the draft. They obviously rated Kessler above him. Hogan had a big fan in Pep Hamilton, who had coached him at Stanford. Hamilton was an assistant coach with the Browns last season.

4. Hogan played in 50 games at Stanford. His athleticism has always been underrated. He set a Stanford rushing record for quarterbacks with 1,246 yards for his career. Browns fans saw Hogan's mobility when he ran for 104 yards against the Bengals last season. He took over for the injured Kessler.

5. An interesting story by Jim Sannes for Numberfire compared Hogan to Kizer in a variety of areas. But the most surprising were results from the NFL Combine in the 40-yard dash, the vertical jump, the broad jump and the three-cone drill. In each area, Hogan was slightly superior to Kizer. Both guys are pretty athletic. The difference is few noticed that about Hogan.

6. Kizer has a stronger arm and has ideal NFL quarterback size at 6-foot-4, 230 pounds. This is not to turn Hogan into a better long range prospect than Kizer. Nor is it to insist Hogan is the long-term answer at quarterback for the Browns.

7. But it appears the Browns underrated Hogan. That's probably because they didn't draft him. They went with Kessler in the third round of 2016. Hogan was picked in the fifth round by Kansas City.

8. The Browns claimed Hogan after the Chiefs cut him right before the 2016 season. When Kansas City coach Andy Reid cut Hogan, I considered that a red flag. Reid is very smart when it comes to quarterbacks. At the time, Kansas City had Alex Smith and Nick Foles -- two veteran quarterbacks.

9. Hogan will be 25 on October 20. He spent all last season learning Jackson's system. The Browns wanted a quarterback who could keep the offense in order and generally look like he knows what he's doing this season. Then at some point, the plan was to give Kizer a chance.

10. The Browns ended up doing what they originally didn't want to do -- rushing Kizer into action. Hogan has said his "head was swimming" last season when he played in parts of a few games as a rookie. If that's the case for a four-year starter from Stanford's pro offense, is there any reason to believe it would have been different for Kizer this season? Kizer is only 21 and had 24 starts in a pure college offense at Notre Dame.

11. Kizer had a promising debut against Pittsburgh, completing 20-of-30 (67 percent) passes for 222 yards. He had only one interception and threw a TD pass. Since then, it's been pretty dismal for Kizer: 61-of-129 (47 percent) passing, two TDs compared to eight interceptions. It's very hard to keep him on the field when he is overwhelmed.

12. One of the reasons the Browns hesitated immediately proclaiming Kizer the starter is they wanted to keep him away from being proclaimed "The Franchise Quarterback." That is especially true in Cleveland, where it's a desperate quarterback situation featuring constant change on dismal teams.

13. They played Kizer anyway. And he had significant problems, which should be no surprise. But Kizer probably was shocked at how hard it was to play in the NFL, especially in terms of being a quarterback for the Browns. Regardless of what anyone says to the media, Kizer was regressing. His confidence was shaken.

14. This is not to blame Kizer for everything. The Browns receivers have been awful. Isaiah Crowell has had a difficult season at running back. The offensive line has improved the last few weeks, but it was ragged early. All of that also had a negative impact on Kizer.

15. To make the main point: This is not to say Hogan is the long-term quarterback solution. But early indications are he could do the job that the Browns originally hoped Kessler or Osweiler would handle -- bringing some stability to the position.

http://www.cleveland.com/pluto/index.ssf...art_river_index

Good post and all good points. The one that really stuck out to me was #10. If it was tough for KH in his 1st year trying to learn the playbook with 50 starts in college you can understand how much more difficult it was for DK with less than half the starts and what was probably inferior coaching at Notre Dame. DK should never have been our starting QB this year. I said it before the season started and it has become apparent in the 1st 5 games. He's a smart kid, a good kid that seems to want to learn and do well. I like him. Let him sit, learn and catch his breath.

9 burning questions for Browns QB Kevin Hogan

Andrew Gribble
Senior Staff Writer

The former Stanford standout makes his first NFL start Sunday

Hue Jackson likes to refer to Kevin Hogan as “steady Eddy.” That could apply to the former Stanford standout both on and off the field. Little rattles Hogan’s poise, whether it be an adverse in-game situation or a flurry of questions from reporters.

ClevelandBrowns.com cornered Hogan for one last interview heading into his first NFL start Sunday in Houston.

CB.com: Walk us through what the week’s been like now that you’re the starter.

Hogan: It’s a lot of the same things. You’re preparing the same way, kind of keeping to your routine. You don’t want to change too much. When I was playing before, I was trying to prepare as if I was the starter. Obviously some things are a little different, getting more reps in practice, spending more time with the guys, talking through communication and what’s going to go down Sunday. Just trying to make sure you’re on top of everything and in communication with guys on the team.

CB.com: You mentioned earlier this week that this is your comfort zone because you played so much at Stanford. Was that an advantage for you coming into the league?

Hogan: I think it was definitely an advantage, especially with the offense we were in. It was mostly pro-style so we were handling a lot of the protections and the run game, kills and stuff. I played a lot of games so I saw a lot of things on defense. I pretty much saw it all. I think having that experience and then coming here, it doesn’t really surprise me as much. I’ve seen a lot of it before. Obviously, everyone’s a lot better at it at this level, but it’s not something that’s new.

CB.com: A lot of Browns fans remember what you were able to do last year in Cincinnati with your legs. You rushed a lot in college but not at that level. When you came away from that game, what were you thinking about what you’d just done?

Hogan: That week, I wasn’t sure how many reps I was going to get in the game. I was ready to get three, four or five, however many reps but it just kept working. We were able to make positive plays. Then, when I had to come in and play quarterback, it was still there and I was able to take off and run when the pass plays broke down. Then we had our zone-read gains and it just worked out. It’s something I’m confident in. I trust my ability. I don’t rely on it, but I trust it. I’m never afraid to take off and get a few yards.

CB.com: Have you learned the proper way to take a hit because of all of that running?

Hogan: I learned how in college so I try and protect myself. I try and get down, get out of bounds. I try to be smart with that.

CB.com: What’s it meant for your development to be in this system for more than a year?

Hogan: It’s night and day from last year. Last year, I got here about Week 1 and I was trying to learn the offense week by week through the game plan installs. I was still kind of unsure how coach wanted each week to be. Then having a full offseason with OTAs and camp to really go through coach explain the way it’s supposed to be run, it kind of all makes sense. It’s like a light flicks on in your head. That allows you to play so much faster and more confidently knowing what you’re seeing, knowing where your guys are going to be. When you react to what the defense is doing and you know where your guys are, you can get the ball out.

CB.com: You worked this offseason with a private coach to improve your footwork. Was that one of the biggest changes you’ve made to your game?

Hogan: I’ve always tried to stick with my rhythm. In this kind of offense, it’s all about timing so I try and have a very specific rhythm for each drop I take based on the routes that are going out. My footwork was huge this offseason, really kind of shortening my stride and trying to eliminate a long stride, pitching motion. I feel like it’s helped a lot. It’s still a work in progress, but it’s something I’m excited about because I know I can continue to improve on it.

CB.com: It seems like you’ve had a good connection with David Njoku when you’ve been out there. Does that go back to being a Stanford guy and playing with so many good tight ends?

Hogan: We like to call ourselves Tight End U. I think five of my tight ends are in the NFL now. I was very lucky to have such great talented tight ends in college. I kind of knew where I could put the ball for those guys and how they run their routes. I’m starting to feel that with our tight ends here, with Seth (DeValve), David and Randall (Telfer). Obviously, David is super talented and gifted and I just kind of throw the ball in his vicinity and he goes up and makes an unbelievable catch. It’s really nice having those tight ends work the middle of the field and I’m excited to keep going to them.

CB.com: There’s been a lot of turnover at receiver this year, but how would you define your chemistry with them?

Hogan: It’s been great. This is my first week really working with the ones. I felt like we had a really good week. For me, it was just about getting completions and feeling comfortable. I know these guys are super eager for this opportunity coming up this Sunday to go against a good defense. I feel like we had a really good week of preparation.

CB.com: Have you heard from any different people than you usually do going into your first NFL start?

Hogan: I’m just going to go out there and try and treat it like a normal game. I’m not going overboard with anything. I’m treating this like a normal game and not let any of the outside stuff get to me. It’s a business trip. We’re going down there, everyone will be watching. I’m just going to take care of my business.

Link

My bad

Hand size
Hogan 10 1/4
Kizer 9 7/8

QB pass velocity (MPH):

Kizer 52

Hogan 53

(Oh yeah ... Kessler 55)

http://blogs.ourlads.com/2017/03/16/quarterback-ball-velocity-at-nfl-combine-2008-2015/

j/c:

****Begins Google search for "2018 Mock Draft Site".****

I like it.

That's what I was implying. DA threw tons of TD passes in his 1st start, and people tore him apart, wanting the "name" guy.

Those numbers are less then worthless though.

We report, you decide.

What's not to like? I'm loving Hogan so far

Kevin Hogan’s high school coach saw a lot of Jerry Hogan in Kevin Hogan. Three years after Jerry’s death, he still does. A look at how a father shaped the outlook of the man who might be more than just a stopgap as he approaches his first start for the Browns.

If the world wants to think Kevin Hogan is just keeping the job warm, Hogan will pour himself into proving otherwise without mentioning anything to the world.

He gets that from his father. Jerry Hogan wanted his life to be about purpose and good living, not dwelling on dark tangents, throughout the long process of losing his life to colon cancer.

Jerry was diagnosed in 2010, when Kevin was a senior at Gonzaga College High School in Washington, D.C. The father insisted that Kevin, the youngest of three siblings, follow his heart to the other side of the country.

Jerry went through the recovery grinder while working in Washington, keeping his suffering to himself. He made it almost through Kevin’s third year as Stanford’s starting quarterback and was able to travel to games until near the end.

Jerry relied on his Catholic faith, his zest for life, and his wish for his family to be of good heart. Kevin kept it quiet, too, in part not wanting his burden to become that of the team he was leading.

The team discovered what Kevin was going through very late in the game. The family was back in Virginia, in the bedroom community of McLean, home to congressmen, CIA workers, FBI types, lobbyists and all manner of people making good livings in Washington.

Kevin flew back from California in time to spend final hours at his father’s bedside. Jerry, 64, died on Dec. 8, 2014, 10 days after the last regular-season game of Kevin’s junior year, a 31-10 road win at No. 9-ranked UCLA.

An entry in the funeral home’s tribute book reflects the essence of the situation and of Jerry:

“Donna and family. I just this minute found out about my friend Jerry. I am utterly stunned. I had no idea he was ill. He was as wonderful and as capable a man as I have ever known. It was my great pleasure to serve with him at church. God bless all of you in the days and months ahead.”


Another entry touched on Jerry’s approach to his job in Washington and to life:

“I will miss the email, phone calls and especially the lunches I had with Jerry. They were consumed with football talk and bits about work, but I’ll always remember how he lit up any time he spoke about his family. I was in awe of the pride and joy he took discussing anything related to (wife) Donna (and children) Brian, Kelly and Kevin. He was an example for the man, husband and father I’d like to be. Rest in peace, my friend!”

And another:

“I will miss Jerry’s smile, his quick wit, and how he always asked questions about how my family was doing.”

As one learns more of the new No. 1 quarterback of the Cleveland Browns, one begins to appreciate parts of why his countenance is quiet, determined, bright ... reflective.

Kevin doesn’t consider it an imposition that so few observers took him seriously in camp. Even now, the popular assumption is that he is just passing through on a team that never keeps QBs.

“You might not believe me,” he said, “but that is not something I ever think about.”


For now, Hogan is playing while rookie Round 2 pick DeShone Kizer chills.

“This is another opportunity to go out there and play some ball, which I love,” Hogan said.

The Chiefs drafted Hogan in Round 5 last year. They didn’t love him. At the end of the 2016 preseason, they cut him, and he cleared waivers, allowing him to choose Cleveland’s practice squad (his primary influence was assistant coach Pep Hamilton), rather than joining Kansas City’s.

As late as Sept. 1, Hogan was the No. 4 quarterback on the Cleveland depth chart. The Browns’ infamous QB machine turned. He now replaces Kizer, who started the first five games.

(A side note: Jerry Hogan was educated at Notre Dame, where Kizer started for two years; Jerry earned a law degree from the University of Toledo, in the town where Kizer became an All-Ohio QB.)

Browns fans digested the life stories of Brock Osweiler, Cody Kessler and Kizer while those three made their way in and out of the starting job. Hogan’s biography was not in demand.

In terms of raw football résumé, he is a 6-foot-3 1/4, 220-pound righty who ran a 4.78 40 at the 2017 Combine.


He spent five years at Stanford, including the 2011 season in which he studied quarterback Andrew Luck, the No. 1 pick of the 2012 draft. He became a starter late in his redshirt freshman year of 2012, going 5-0 with a Rose Bowl win over Wisconsin.

Hogan extended his college win streak to 10 in his sophomore year, in which he finished 11-3. His best game was a duel against Cal’s Jared Goff: 329 passing yards, five touchdowns, no interceptions.

ADVERTISING



His junior year, which coincided with Jerry taking a turn for the worse, was his worst. He was 5-5 before beating Goff again, and then winning that UCLA game before Jerry died, and then heading back out for a bowl game against Maryland.

He had a bright senior year, going 12-2. His last two regular-season games were duels against Kizer and Kessler, both wins.

What was Hogan doing all the way out in California after growing up in Virginia and playing high school ball in Washington, D.C.?

It began with an almost accidental recruiting visit from Pep Hamilton, who had become a member of Jim Harbaugh’s Stanford staff during Hogan’s senior year of high school in Washington. The school, Gonzaga, is in the heart of it all. Extra points literally land on the street that is a few blocks from the Capitol building.

“Pep was in the area, and he called wanting to swing by and see Kevin throw,” said Aaron Brady, who was the head football coach at Gonzaga then. “Pep wasn’t even recruiting the area. He just had heard about Kevin. Stanford already had kids committed at quarterback, but Pep wanted to see Kevin.


“He watched him throw. We talked about him. From that day, he was a Kevin Hogan believer.”

Brady was a believer all along. He is fired up about Hogan’s start against the Houston Texans.

“I was shocked Kevin was drafted so low,” Brady said. “I mean, he’s a winner, and he had won in a pro offense at Stanford.

“I guess it had to be his arm strength. And maybe people didn’t really realize how athletic he was, because Stanford didn’t use him that way that much.”

In Hogan’s first NFL regular-season game last year, in relief of an injured Kessler, Hogan ran for 104 yards against Cincinnati. In his most recent game, after replacing Kizer in the second half against the Jets, he completed 16 of 19 passes for 194 yards and two touchdowns. In each of his three relief appearances this season, he has led a touchdown drive on his first series.

Aaron Brady doesn’t sound surprised. The high school coach thought of a game seven years ago, one that convinced Stanford that Hogan might be more than an ordinary recruit.

“DeMatha is a major high school power and was in our league,” Brady said. “Gonzaga hadn’t beaten DeMatha in 11 years. The scores had been pretty outrageous.


“In Kevin’s senior year, we beat them, and we did it on Kevin’s back, through his confidence, through him leading the team that day.

“Near the end of the game we had the ball but still needed one more first down, and the game was over. But it was third-and-11.

“DeMatha called a timeout and everybody said, ‘Run the ball and take our chances.’ Kevin wanted the first down. He wanted to throw it. He convinced me. We hadn’t beaten these guys in 11 years. Let’s take a chance.

“He threw the prettiest comeback route you could imagine. It was a perfect throw. It ended the game.”

Of course, Jerry Hogan was there. Jerry would live to fly to many a Stanford battle across the first three years Kevin started. Everyone in the family understood what it meant when Jerry had to stop coming to the games.

If you know the story, you get the idea you can see it in Kevin’s face now. If you don’t, you might think his countenance strangely placid.

“Kevin internalized everything,” said Brady. “He didn’t wear his emotions on his sleeve.


“He knew his dad was sick, but they didn’t know how long it would be. His dad got some extra time.

“I think he kind of made it about playing for his dad and his family. He didn’t take anything for granted.”

http://www.cantonrep.com/sports/20171014/how-fathers-life-shaped-browns-qb-kevin-hogan

Cancer sucks, I hate it with a passion. tough story.

Beating Goff, Kizer, and Kessler is cool though. didn't know that.

I am really pulling for this kid to be our guy. I hope he can get it done.

Thanks for the read. I think he is our guy.

40
Hogan:4.78
Watson:4.66

Vert
Hogan 32.5
Watson: 32.5

Broad
Hogan 113.0
Watson 119.0

3 Cone
Hogan 6.9
Watson 6.95

20 yard shuttle
Hogan 4.31
Watson 4.31

Hogan and Watson are nearly identical athletes.

He is not the answer.

So, question for the board.

If dude ends up winning us 5-6 games this year.....how do we proceed?

Your guess is as good as anyone's at this point, Peen. There are a lot of things to like about him. A lot. I think some people are actually afraid he could be our guy. If he turns out to be the second coming of Tom Brady, or even just "the guy" a lot of people will look foolish. There's a lot of distance between today's start and becoming "our guy" but I hope he does well. It won't bother me at all if he is.

You draft another QB next year, start Hogan and cut Kessler. You head toward the playoffs with Hogan, Kizer, and the rookie. And the whole world STFU about the Browns. Problem is, the team around him probably isn't good enough to win that many games, even if he is. but we'll see.

If he wins 5-6 games with the crappy tools he has to work with, I think we've found our guy. That said, I have a better chance at a hot tub session with Kate Upton than for this to happen.

But one went to Stanford.

Seems like all the comments from his team mates,the first word is usually smart.I don't think we've had a smart QB since Bernie.
Everyone called Bernie a giraffe behind center,but he could read a defence and knew where the ball should go..
This may be interesting.

We proceed by winning 8-9 games with him next year....

Yep. Forgo the 1st Rd QB and take the best whatever you want. Ideal situation!

drafting a QB with our #1 pick IMO

I can't do it if nobody shows worthy in the next month or so.

Besides, still not sure on this groups evaluation!

ya'll sure we should draft a qb though if Hogan wins 5-6 games this year?

we already have a QB on the roster to groom in Kizer. why not use those first 5 picks and get Hogan some weapons, as well as a decent secondary?

No decision has to be made for 5 months... Why don't we wait and see how it all plays out first... grins. I know .. no fun.. but what the heck

We absolutely should. I don't think people realize what an accomplishment winning 5-6 games with this crappy offense would be...it would have to take well above average qb play to do that. We need some weapons.

If Hogan can become the franchise qb
Then it's a win win for everyone
Hogan has played better in a limited sample better than Weeden Manziel Kizer combined.
I think Hogans football i.q is higher than those 3 combined
It doesnt matter how you get your franchise qb as long as you get it
If it's Hogan then he comes at a very affordable price tag

I was just thinking about what we might do with those picks. I'm thinking QB, WR, CB, LB, and FS. I'm also thinking RB & OT will be closely looked at in the 3rd round. Who knows what they'll actually do, but to me this would be ideal. It's a very deep QB class. It would almost be foolish to pass on one of them. JMHO.

Imagine what this team would look like with say Josh Allen (sitting behind Hogan & Kizer), Equanimeous St. Brown, Tarvarus McFadden, Micah Kiser, Marcus Allen, and Myles Gaskin on our 53.