DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Sashi Brown fired

Really? I am guessing players who have worked hard and sweated to have a successful season only to go winless thus far have suffered more but maybe the fans have it much worse than I realize. Maybe Hue, whose reputation has taken a big hit, might have suffered also.

I don't expect wholesale slaughter, but I would expect to see some of our youth at depth to be replaced with Vets. It's likely much of that cap space will get used.

If he uses it wisely that is fine, if he tries to make us the next "dream team" with all that money, that isn't so fine. He has a reputation for overpaying vets.

good...exactly whats needed for the next 2 years.

Agreed.

Yep. We will overpay vets by default until we are competitive enough to "lure" them. The sooner we "overpay" some veteran talent, the sooner we get to point B.

And at point B you realize that you still have a losing record and no money left to upgrade.

at point b your young talent should be good enough to take over... never going to reach point b with a 1 and 28 record.. why you overpay.

They're not going to break the bank and we all know it. I'm guessing two maybe three decent acquisitions tops. But we will have to overpay for any real quality.

average players are a improvement on what we have now.

Sure, they're hurting also, I didn't say otherwise. But... players are still getting paid. Hue is still getting paid. They are going to be fine despite what happens in the few short years they've been in this mess. None of them have languished with this pathetic team since 1999 like we have.

A couple of ways to answer. It does not matter what I think, it was Haslam thought.

Me, yes he was the head honcho and spent too much time looking for perfection, when acceptable was needed. I have no idea why the Browns let McCown and RG3 go. Either one would have been an upgrade over Kizer. So if you want to figure out why the Browns are 0-12 look at the QB play.

Why Sashi Brown's plan for the Browns was ill-fated from the start

Late Thursday, Haslam hired former Chiefs GM John Dorsey as his new GM and gave him a four-year deal and final say over all roster decisions.

With two first round picks in 2018 and three second-rounders in a rich QB class, Haslam couldn't take the chance of Brown passing on another Carson Wentz, as he did in 2016, or Deshaun Watson in 2017. Overall, they have 13 picks next year.

"The 2018 draft and offseason is pivotal for our franchise,'' wrote Haslam in his statement about firing Brown. "We need to ensure that we maximize our opportunity for success; with our picks, free agency and building our roster."

Haslam also recognized that he put Hue Jackson behind the eight-ball with a lack of talent at key positions, especially quarterback and receiver. He'll give him another shot next season, "but we feel it's necessary to take significant steps to strengthen our personnel department."

In his two seasons, Brown had 24 draft picks, made 17 trades and had more cap space than almost anyone in the NFL -- and all he had to show for it was one victory.
What's more, he was the architect of a unnecessary teardown and needlessly put the beleaguered fan base through two seasons of gut-wrenching losing.

Arguably, the best roster that Jackson had was the one he inherited when he was hired on Jan. 13, 2016. It included center Alex Mack, right tackle Mitchell Schwartz, left tackle Joe Thomas, left guard Joel Bitonio, quarterback Josh McCown, receivers Travis Benjamin, Taylor Gabriel and Terrelle Pryor, running backs Isaiah Crowell and Duke Johnson, cornerbacks Joe Haden and K'Waun Williams, safeties Tashaun Gipson and Jordan Poyer, linebacker Chris Kirksey and defensive lineman Danny Shelton.

All Brown had to do was resign free agents such as Mack, Schwartz, Benjamin and Gipson, and then draft Carson Wentz with the No. 2 overall pick. A high-level NFL personnel exec told me at the Senior Bowl in January of 2016 that the "Browns would be set for the next 15 years if they draft Wentz" -- so it's not like no one knew.

Sure, Mack, a four-time Pro Bowler, wanted a fresh start, but money talks and if the Browns had paid him, I'm sure he would've stayed. The Falcons gave him $9 million a year, which was apparently too steep for the Browns at the time, but then they paid guard Kevin Zeitler an average of $12 million this year.

If the Browns had drafted Wentz -- and I wrote on Sunday that Jackson preferred him over Jared Goff, who went No. 1 to the Rams -- they could've surrounded him with a few top-notch receivers such as former Ohio State star Michael Thomas, whom they could've drafted in the second round in 2016. Thomas, picked No. 47 by the Saints, notched 1,137 yards and nine TDs last year, and has 875 yards and 3 TDs this year. They could've also signed former Bengals receiver Marvin Jones, whom Jackson wanted, but Brown didn't even bring in for a visit.

Instead, Jones signed with the Lions, where he had 930 yards and four TDs in 2016, and has 821 yards and 8 TDs this year.

So wrap your brain around that for a moment: a 2016 offense featuring Wentz, Michael Thomas, Jones, Benjamin and Gabriel, along with a star-studded offensive line and a couple of good running backs in Crowell and Johnson. Think they could've done better than 1-15 last season? And better than 0-12 this year in the second season for Wentz and Thomas?

As for the players Brown drafted from that Wentz trade, they're receiver Corey Coleman, right tackle Shon Coleman, quarterback Cody Kessler, receiver Ricardo Louis, safety Derrick Kindred, receiver Jordan Payton, offensive lineman Spencer Drango, safety Jabrill Peppers and DeShone Kizer.

They also still have an extra first-rounder in 2018 from the Texans and an extra second-rounder from the Eagles in 2018 from that original trade.

If you look closely at that haul, they wouldn't have needed most of them if they had re-signed their own free agents. Corey Coleman with the No. 15 overall pick? You don't start your rebuild with a small, injury-prone receiver. Shon Coleman? You already had Schwartz, who signed with Kansas City for only $6.6 million a year -- and made second-team All-Pro last year.

Kessler in the third round? Most teams had him as a sixth or seventh round pick. Louis? Wouldn't you rather have Benjamin or Gabriel? You didn't need Kindred if you had kept Gipson or Poyer, who are both excelling this year.

So instead of getting ahead, Brown spun his wheels with most of those picks.
Of those 14 selections in 2016, second-rounder Emmanuel Ogbah is shaping up to be the only difference-maker.

In the 2017 draft, Hue Jackson and Gregg Williams had to fight for Myles Garrett, while some in the front office wanted Mitch Trubisky. The jury is still out on that one, because it can take a few years to evaluate a quarterback.

Brown then had another quarterback staring him in the face in Watson at No. 12, and traded the pick to the Texans for the No. 25 overall selection, which he used on Peppers, and the first-rounder next year.

If Brown and company were top-notch evaluators, they would've known that Watson was going to be as good as he was this season before tearing his ACL.

Brown looks to have hit upon David Njoku at No. 29, but the successes are too few. Meanwhile, the Browns are still in search of their quarterback of the future, and can't afford to head into another draft without anyone in the front office qualified to identify a franchise quarterback.

http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2017/12/why_sashi_browns_plan_for_the.html

YUCK!

Finally, thank goodness.

This has the potential of turning into the disastrous Julio Jones trade.

I agree. It can't be less than .500 next year It's not like this was the year we weren't going to take a QB at #1

we were going to take a QB this year

j/c:

I don't want the team to get "old," but I think we desperately need some veteran leadership. I'm talking about guys who have won before.

Sashi didn't bring in guys who came from very successful teams to help mentor the youngsters. He was always caught up in numbers. He reminds me of the guy at the office who is pretty smart and thinks he knows more about football than the football guys.

How hard can it be?

You found out, Sashi. And that arrogant attitude is why your ass is currently unemployed.

Will you please stop whining?

How do you know we would have been .500 w/Sashi?

How do you know that we were going to take a qb this year?

You backed the wrong horse. Time to man-up and admit it.

To be fair to peen: just because Sashi got fired first doesn't mean peen backed the wrong horse. We still don't know if hue is the right horse. It doesn't help that the horse track's owner is a broken-legged jackass . Sorry I had to finish there... Lol

I'm glad Hue is here for 2018, but 2019??? Not guaranteed

. Sashi did good things IMO, not always, but if he and Hue were dysfunctional, the right guy was fired.

Okay.

I just got sick of him constantly talking about how Hue should be fired. I didn't like him calling Hue a "punk." I don't like all of his one-sided attacks on Hue and telling us how much talent we had. Pffttttt.......

I didn't really like Sashi, but I didn't talk about him needing to be fired multiple times each day like peen and some of the other guys did.

Screw those guys!

I am in a good mood, though.

Are you Hue Jackson's mom? You certainly whine and cry an awful lot about mean internets picking on Lil' Hue. Or are you so desperate for relevance that you hope Hue will one day stumble across DawgTalkers, click on a few forums and say "WoW! This Versatile guy! He's been my knight in shining armor, defending my virtue with the veracity of a King defending the virtue of his virgin princess.

I think I might sign a football for him"

Neither. Just a guy who got sick of the one-sided rhetoric from guys like you.

Ah yes, Versatile Dawg... the paragon of Truth, Justice, and Fairness.. the shining example of what too think, how to think, what to post, and how to post.

Sometimes I feel bad for you. You spend all this time banging your head against a brick wall trying to moderate the boards, when it's neither your job, nor is it necessary.

Your warts are showing. Sore loser much?

Seems a little early to be claiming winners and losers. Let's see if Hue can actually win games with the "football guy" now before getting too excited.

The Hue truthers got their way, but there's no need to kick the FO backers while they're down.

I hope it works, and it could, but I want to see it before letting the positive side of my bipolar disorder run rampant.

Wait a second? Aren't you the one who said this:

This is false.

Sashi worst GM along with Farmer since the return
Look no father than the 1 27 record
Worst span of 28 games in NFL history
Yet somehow Sashi still got praise.
What did someone say months ago if Sashi turns this around
He will be considered a "hero"
Funniest thing I ever saw posted on here

Even false would call that false.

I am definitely in agreement with you here. In regards to the paragraph I bolded above:

Lots of guys in DIII college football look like a God on the field. Even though he did those things well in college, it's still difficult to project him - or anyone at that level - replicating that in the NFL. We need the kind of scouting that can identify the right guy. It must be difficult to do because a lot of teams don't appear to do it very well.

While I do agree with the vast majority of your post, there is one caveat I would like to make.

Wentz did not show the ability to make post snap reads in college. His offense didn't require him to do that. It's almost impossible to see that in a college scheme because few colleges use a pro style system that require this from their QB. While I was a huge advocate for drafting Wentz, it was the one question I simply couldn't answer in my attempt to evaluate him.

It's one of the deciding factors in my support of drafting Rosen if he passes the character evaluation.

The thing is that we don't know how it went down. I do know much of the reason why Hue was brought here was to find a QB.

Maybe Sashi went rogue once he had the tie breaker vote and decided that was the only vote. That could be....power does that to people.

On the other hand, he seemed like a level headed guy. I think there was more concensus then is being led to believe.


At any rate, we have a proven football guy. He will provide great talent and Hue will coach that talent. Should be a clear cut improvement day 1. We should easily win 6-7 games next season. Probably more since I think we should have won 3-4 this season, but I'll stick to the number 7.....lucky 7.

j/c

Not to you per se, but to everyone.

I'm sick of, each time we get a new coach, each time the front office changes, and each time we draft, people saying "Oh, yeah! This time we got it right!"

Screw that.

Color me impressed when we start winning games. Until then? I'll have my doubts.

No longer will I get excited about any changes or drafts.

Get some W's on the field.

Didn't go to a single game last year or this year. I'm not ashamed or embarrassed to admit it.

And I sure as heck am not "excited" about Dorsey, or any other part of the Browns organization at this point. And I guarantee the draft won't excite me one bit.

W's, that's what we need. Period.

I am right there with you. I think Hue and Sashi are both responsible for the product on the field..and Haslam for hiring them. Maybe with an OC Hue can focus on managing a game and coaching a young qb, but like you I'm not getting my hopes up until we win some games. We're frickin' 1-27 or whatever and trying to decide who is more to blame is a joke. The new GM has a royal mess to fix here. The last time I felt positive at all was when Hoyer was at his peak here.