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Originally Posted By: WSU Willie
Originally Posted By: devicedawg
Originally Posted By: Versatile Dog
Originally Posted By: ChargerDawg
I see the comment being more about Brown and Heckert.

Quote:
* He reiterated his No. 1 criteria for a QB: "Can he win? There's some physical traits within that, but the bottom line is 'do you win?' If your quarterback can win, that does good things for the organization. The intangible that we in the NFL always want to try to find out is what lies within and that's the mental quickness, the ability to process, how do you react to adverse situations? Those are the skillsets that you do try to find. How do they react under pressure?"


This makes me smile. I cannot agree more. QB is as much about decision making quickness as it is physical skills.


This got me to thinking.......When he says "can he win," who does that describe more than Alex Smith? I didn't think we would go after him, but if Dorsey wants to win the division next year like he claims, getting Smith makes quite a bit of sense.



Also sounds like Baker Mayfield.


You beat me to it...exactly what I thought when I read that.


Well, Mayfield is 23-3 the last 2 years and Darnold is 21-5. Both guys are winners, so it could be either.


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Originally Posted By: WSU Willie
Hue likes to talk and say things publicly...Dorsey likes to talk publicly. What could possibly go wrong? Personally, I think they both talk too much. I'm off to stock up on lollipops.


Two people who like to publicly trash others within the organization? Indeed, what could possibly go wrong.

They can rally against Sashi now, but when they only have themselves to point at, there is every indication this thing could get ugly.

I hate it. Just stop talking. Do your job, stop giving the media soundbites that they can use to belittle the franchise, and focus on how to turn this thing around. That's all they both need to be doing.

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Things could get ugly? LOL We won 1 game under Sashi. That is ugly.

I think we are on the right track now. I like both Dorsey and Hue.

The players better understand that they are now going to be held accountable for their play on the field. The days of making the team just because the prior FO drafted you are over.

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Originally Posted By: Versatile Dog
Things could get ugly? LOL We won 1 game under Sashi. That is ugly.

I think we are on the right track now. I like both Dorsey and Hue.

The players better understand that they are now going to be held accountable for their play on the field. The days of making the team just because the prior FO drafted you are over.


If one is looking for the definition of agenda-posting....there you have it.

Sashi was an awful Head Coach who only managed one win in two years. Dorsey has been here a week and churned three guys off the roster in demonstration of the synergy between he and Hue now that the weak-minded, soft-spoken Hue no longer has the all-powerful Ogre holding him back.

And lastly? The players will NOW be held accountable because some guy in a suit is no longer in the owners' box. Hue is now so relieved that he will be able to hold his players accountable for their play on the field starting with game 14.
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Originally Posted By: BDU
... this thing could get ugly.


The 'romance' has just begun but the 'courtship' may be short...


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Originally Posted By: WSU Willie
And lastly? The players will NOW be held accountable because some guy in a suit is no longer in the owners' box. Hue is now so relieved that he will be able to hold his players accountable for their play on the field starting with game 14.willynilly


I may have missed something here but if it took 29 games for Hue to hold his players accountable then obviously he's no head coach. LOL


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The lack of accountability came from the FO. They drafted guys and kept them no matter how crappy they performed. They cut guys who were better players.

I think that Dorsey and Hue will work together. That is a positive and all the crying from Hue's Hate Club isn't going to change the fact that we are in now a better position to win.

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The quote is odd....

The guys before,the current system....

I take that as farmer and prior.....can’t really argue with their ineptness

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Originally Posted By: Versatile Dog
Things could get ugly? LOL We won 1 game under Sashi. That is ugly.



We won 1 game under Hue 1-28 more than lost under Sashi.

Dorsey is 0-1.

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Originally Posted By: teedub
The quote is odd....

The guys before,the current system....

I take that as farmer and prior.....can’t really argue with their ineptness


He's clearly referring to Sashi & Co. There's no confusion IMO. Here's the quote:

Quote:

"And you know what? I'll come straight out with it. The guys who were here before, that system, they didn't get real players.''


He's obviously referring to the analytics system. At least it seems obvious to me.


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Originally Posted By: rastanplan
Originally Posted By: Milk Man
Originally Posted By: oobernoober
We've pretty much tried every single FO setup at this point.


Unless I'm mistaken, the Browns have never tried the "traditional" approach of allowing the GM to interview and hire his own head coach. The Browns have always taken a convoluted approach that culminates in a awkward and/or forced marriage.


Sashi was the one who hired Hue.

Hue was Sashi's Head Coach, but clearly Sashi wasn't Hue's GM, but Dorsey apparently is.


Sashi did not hire Hue. Jimmy and Dee hired Hue with help of Jed Hughes and the Korn Ferry search firm. When you Hue was hired it was Jimmy and Dee who were out front introducing him and the reason the Haslams set Hue and Sashi up as both reporting directly to Haslam.

Sashi was just along for the ride during the hire.

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Originally Posted By: Vambo
Originally Posted By: Versatile Dog
Things could get ugly? LOL We won 1 game under Sashi. That is ugly.



We won 1 game under Hue 1-28 more than lost under Sashi.

Dorsey is 0-1.



Some have trouble admitting it...

Last edited by mac; 12/15/17 12:47 PM.

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j/c...

For all the talk of Dorsey trashing the prior FO, I found these comments from Dorsey to be worth noting.

On the radio, Dorsey refused to guarantee Jackson will be the Browns’ coach next season.

“I live in the present, and I build for the future,” he said. “Right now, the sun’s out, the tarps are coming out, we’re practicing outside, we’re getting ready to play the Baltimore Ravens, and that’s my sole focus. And then it’s also getting familiar with the whole layout and the organizational structure.”

Either way, Dorsey said his objective entering next season will be to win the AFC North and he’ll consider anything else “unacceptable.”


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Originally Posted By: Milk Man
Originally Posted By: rastanplan
Originally Posted By: Milk Man
Originally Posted By: oobernoober
We've pretty much tried every single FO setup at this point.


Unless I'm mistaken, the Browns have never tried the "traditional" approach of allowing the GM to interview and hire his own head coach. The Browns have always taken a convoluted approach that culminates in a awkward and/or forced marriage.


Sashi was the one who hired Hue.

Hue was Sashi's Head Coach, but clearly Sashi wasn't Hue's GM, but Dorsey apparently is.


Sashi did not hire Hue. Jimmy and Dee hired Hue with help of Jed Hughes and the Korn Ferry search firm. When you Hue was hired it was Jimmy and Dee who were out front introducing him and the reason the Haslams set Hue and Sashi up as both reporting directly to Haslam.

Sashi was just along for the ride during the hire.




We talked about who would be part of that coaching search and talked a little bit about the process. First of all, I want to thank (Executive Vice President of Football Operations) Sashi (Brown), who you will hear from in a little bit, (Owner) Dee (Haslam) and (Chief Strategy Officer) Paul DePodesta. I also want to recognize Jed Hughes, who did an outstanding job from Korn Ferry and really helped us with our process.

................

i would say he was in on it.. i think your just making things up...


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Originally Posted By: Milk Man
Originally Posted By: rastanplan
Originally Posted By: Milk Man
Originally Posted By: oobernoober
We've pretty much tried every single FO setup at this point.


Unless I'm mistaken, the Browns have never tried the "traditional" approach of allowing the GM to interview and hire his own head coach. The Browns have always taken a convoluted approach that culminates in a awkward and/or forced marriage.


Sashi was the one who hired Hue.

Hue was Sashi's Head Coach, but clearly Sashi wasn't Hue's GM, but Dorsey apparently is.


Sashi did not hire Hue. Jimmy and Dee hired Hue with help of Jed Hughes and the Korn Ferry search firm. When you Hue was hired it was Jimmy and Dee who were out front introducing him and the reason the Haslams set Hue and Sashi up as both reporting directly to Haslam.

Sashi was just along for the ride during the hire.





Again from bleach report, and you can find a ton of sources.

Hue was Sachi coach, and He stood by his coach until the end.


"There wasn't any bungling, in-fighting or Three Stooges references. Under its owner, executive vice president of football operations Sashi Brown, chief strategy officer Paul DePodesta and Jed Hughes of search firm Korn Ferry Sports, the team targeted a specific coach to fill the opening and landed its top choice."

Worst decision he ever made....

Last edited by rastanplan; 12/15/17 01:14 PM.
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I have no idea what you are trying to point out other than rehashing what I said.

My overall point has been I do not recall a situation since '99 where the GM has directly hired his HC.

Sashi being in on the search and not being the point man does not prove whatever small point you think you are making.

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Nothing has worked in the past. People are looking to lay the blame on Hue or Sashi.

Haslam is the one at fault. For a guy who was a part owner of the Steelers it is surprising. He had plenty of time to look around and have a legit plan. Haslam is smart enough to know he is at fault.

I am glad that Haslam came to the conclusion that a professional evaluator had to be hired to handle the roster decisions. I am sure he checked within and outside the organization to conclude that Hue was not the problem.

It all starts at the top. We all know how important continuity is. Yet it has taken a long time for Haslam to figure out how to build the right organizational chart and the right people to fill the positions.

I am hopeful that this can work. The team has added some talent and has the cap space and draft capital to make serious strides.

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Originally Posted By: Milk Man
I have no idea what you are trying to point out other than rehashing what I said.

My overall point has been I do not recall a situation since '99 where the GM has directly hired his HC.

Sashi being in on the search and not being the point man does not prove whatever small point you think you are making.



It goes 100% against what you are saying. Haslam hired Sachi and his team who then found and hired their coach.

They could have thrown Hue under the Bus ages ago, but never did.

Sachi is fired because he couldn't find a QB when Hue was hired has a QB whisperer...

It was commented by media has the end of the 3 stooges reign, and a sign of professionalism of the FO.

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jc..

It's not about finding someone to blame..

It does matter...


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Originally Posted By: rastanplan
Originally Posted By: Milk Man
I have no idea what you are trying to point out other than rehashing what I said.

My overall point has been I do not recall a situation since '99 where the GM has directly hired his HC.

Sashi being in on the search and not being the point man does not prove whatever small point you think you are making.



It goes 100% against what you are saying. Haslam hired Sachi and his team who then found and hired their coach.

It was commented by media has the end of the 3 stooges reign, and a sign of professionalism of the FO.


Dee was the on who proudly walked introduced Hue to the staff in Berea to a round of applause. Jimmy was the one who drove Hue from the airport to Berea. Jimmy was the one introducing Hue at Hue's initial press conference.

But you want me to believe it was Sashi that directly hired Hue as his HC and then made sure he and Hue were on equal footing by setting up the structure where they reported directly to Haslam.

Got it.

It's cool if you want to believe that Sashi hired Hue. I have no problems with that.

Merry Christmas!

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Originally Posted By: bonefish

Nothing has worked in the past. People are looking to lay the blame on Hue or Sashi.

Haslam is the one at fault. For a guy who was a part owner of the Steelers it is surprising. He had plenty of time to look around and have a legit plan. Haslam is smart enough to know he is at fault.

I am glad that Haslam came to the conclusion that a professional evaluator had to be hired to handle the roster decisions. I am sure he checked within and outside the organization to conclude that Hue was not the problem.

It all starts at the top. We all know how important continuity is. Yet it has taken a long time for Haslam to figure out how to build the right organizational chart and the right people to fill the positions.

I am hopeful that this can work. The team has added some talent and has the cap space and draft capital to make serious strides.


According to the new GM, we have no real players.... but apparently we have a real Coach (go figure...)

So its back to the drawing board to get some real players to the wonder coach....

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Originally Posted By: Milk Man
Originally Posted By: rastanplan
Originally Posted By: Milk Man
I have no idea what you are trying to point out other than rehashing what I said.

My overall point has been I do not recall a situation since '99 where the GM has directly hired his HC.

Sashi being in on the search and not being the point man does not prove whatever small point you think you are making.



It goes 100% against what you are saying. Haslam hired Sachi and his team who then found and hired their coach.

It was commented by media has the end of the 3 stooges reign, and a sign of professionalism of the FO.


Dee was the on who proudly walked introduced Hue to the staff in Berea to a round of applause. Jimmy was the one who drove Hue from the airport to Berea. Jimmy was the one introducing Hue at Hue's initial press conference.

But you want me to believe it was Sashi that directly hired Hue as his HC and then made sure he and Hue were on equal footing by setting up the structure where they reported directly to Haslam.

Got it.

It's cool if you want to believe that Sashi hired Hue. I have no problems with that.

Merry Christmas!


Not wanting to be insulting, but I'm here guessing if you have some reading comprehension problems...

I quoted one of the many articles there are on the Hue hiring process conducted by Sashi...It was widely advertised at the time.

Hue was the first showing of the new moneyball approach.

Hue was Sachi's coach. Don't think you can find info saying the opposite, but if you do, please post the references and I will look it up.


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j/c

Dorsey told the truth. Our roster is the weakest in the NFL. It's void of talent on the O side of the ball and the secondary sucks.

People can try to blame Hue for that all they want, but it's the people who have created that roster whose to blame.


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Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
j/c

Dorsey told the truth. Our roster is the weakest in the NFL. It's void of talent on the O side of the ball and the secondary sucks.

People can try to blame Hue for that all they want, but it's the people who have created that roster whose to blame.


The roster is most definitely weak (I think mostly because it is very young). But there have been times on gameday when we should have won and didn't. That is on the coaching staff.

The collapse against Green Bay. On the coaching staff.

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"The players stink. Also, we should win the AFC North in 2018."

Quote:
"I'm the eternal optimistic," Dorsey said Thursday during an appearance on WKNR 850-AM, via Cleveland.com's Mary Kay Cabot. "I believe we have to be competitive in the AFC North and my total objective going into the '18 season is to win the AFC North. Anything else to me is unacceptable."


http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000...ign=Twitter_atn

What players is he going to win with?

I think John Dorsey is/was a good hire (especially considering the circumstances), but he should probably stop talking.

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Originally Posted By: cfrs15
"The players stink. Also, we should win the AFC North in 2018."

Quote:
"I'm the eternal optimistic," Dorsey said Thursday during an appearance on WKNR 850-AM, via Cleveland.com's Mary Kay Cabot. "I believe we have to be competitive in the AFC North and my total objective going into the '18 season is to win the AFC North. Anything else to me is unacceptable."


http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000...ign=Twitter_atn

What players is he going to win with?

I think John Dorsey is/was a good hire (especially considering the circumstances), but he should probably stop talking.


It means a veteran QB, of that I'm certain. You don't promise a 2018 AFC North title if you're planning on starting a rookie QB.

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Originally Posted By: BDU
Originally Posted By: cfrs15
"The players stink. Also, we should win the AFC North in 2018."

Quote:
"I'm the eternal optimistic," Dorsey said Thursday during an appearance on WKNR 850-AM, via Cleveland.com's Mary Kay Cabot. "I believe we have to be competitive in the AFC North and my total objective going into the '18 season is to win the AFC North. Anything else to me is unacceptable."


http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000...ign=Twitter_atn

What players is he going to win with?

I think John Dorsey is/was a good hire (especially considering the circumstances), but he should probably stop talking.


It means a veteran QB, of that I'm certain. You don't promise a 2018 AFC North title if you're planning on starting a rookie QB.


He's blowing smoke.

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I'm with you, cfrs. I'm (very) cautiously optimistic about the Dorsey hire... and what he saying about the roster and previously-picked players is more right than wrong, but that doesn't mean he has to come out and say that.

At the end of the day, I won't judge him at all on his on-camera demeanor, but I was expecting more professionalism (not sure if that's the right word here).


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If you haven't noticed, within the past week John Dorsey, Hue Jackson, and Gregg Williams have all thrown the players under the bus. Can't blame them, that's what great leaders do!

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Originally Posted By: BDU

It means a veteran QB, of that I'm certain. You don't promise a 2018 AFC North title if you're planning on starting a rookie QB.


I actually agree with you that I believe that they'll bring in a veteran QB. With Kizer being a rookie this year, we should have a veteran QB on the roster now. Another mistake by the former FO.

However, I haven't and didn't see Dorsey "promise" a 2018 AFC championship?


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Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
Originally Posted By: BDU

It means a veteran QB, of that I'm certain. You don't promise a 2018 AFC North title if you're planning on starting a rookie QB.


I actually agree with you that I believe that they'll bring in a veteran QB. With Kizer being a rookie this year, we should have a veteran QB on the roster now. Another mistake by the former FO.

However, I haven't and didn't see Dorsey "promise" a 2018 AFC championship?


Ugh. You're such a headache. I can't imagine anyone on this planet actually enjoying your company.

I apologize. He didn't specifically promise an AFC North title. He said it was his total objective and anything less is unacceptable.

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So since I was correct, that makes me the headache? lol


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You're nitpicking and you know it lol.

That's also a promise if we view it through the girlfriend/wife rule.

Her - "Can you get milk on the way home?"
You - "Getting milk will be my total objective. Anything less than getting milk is unacceptable."

You think "I never promised I'd get milk" is working when you get home without milk? Nah. She's going to be pissed. rofl

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I don't believe I was nit picking at all. And I wasn't derogatory in my comment.

And since I'm not someones wife or girlfriend, I don't believe your example applies. I mean maybe you are, but I don't think so.


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J/C

Setting a division title as a goal and promising it will happen are 2 different things. I don't see how that's hard for some to understand.


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All those bashing this guy need to go back and look at what they have been saying about the players we've been drafting for the last couple years.

Trading down to take players in lower rounds is what has been happening. The players we've passed on are legit players, most that we have drafted are "potential" good players. Sashi had a chance to draft to very good QBs, and passed on both for sub par players.

What he said is dead on. I like some of the players we have, but none are difference makers. Even our better players started out not so good. Rookies come into this league every year and make impact. Many are players we could have had. Instead "value" was taken over skill.

The trading down to acquire more picks is a strategy that can help build a team, but then doing it two years in a row while passing on very good players can lengthen the process.

Read thru the threads after the drafts the last two years. Many defending Sashi were the same complaining about who he did draft.

Passing on both Wentz and Watson did, and probably should have gotten anybody fired. Especially from a team that has not had a good QB in decades.


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Originally Posted By: BDU
Originally Posted By: cfrs15
"The players stink. Also, we should win the AFC North in 2018."

Quote:
"I'm the eternal optimistic," Dorsey said Thursday during an appearance on WKNR 850-AM, via Cleveland.com's Mary Kay Cabot. "I believe we have to be competitive in the AFC North and my total objective going into the '18 season is to win the AFC North. Anything else to me is unacceptable."


http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000...ign=Twitter_atn

What players is he going to win with?

I think John Dorsey is/was a good hire (especially considering the circumstances), but he should probably stop talking.


It means a veteran QB, of that I'm certain. You don't promise a 2018 AFC North title if you're planning on starting a rookie QB.


He didn't promise to win the division, he said the objective is to win. Opposed to Sashi, where the objective was to lose. We now have a front office that cares about winning.


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I will say this:

With the way this painful season is unfolding, we should be able to add 3-4 real impact players in the draft. We will likely have 4 picks in the top 40 picks, and 2 in the top 10. (as long as Houston doesn't screw things up by winning games)

I suspect that we will also add a couple of free agents, maybe even really high dollar players.

We sure better make a huge step forward next year.


Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.

John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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That's why the change to JD was made. If we don't do it now with all the high picks and cap space we never will. rolleyes

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Kudos to him for telling it like it is and speaking out! I like it!

Last edited by tastybrownies; 12/15/17 10:38 PM.

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