DawgTalkers.net Forums The Archives 2018 NFL Season 2018 NFL Draft Josh Allen #2

the same jordan palmer who worked with christian hackenberg?

how's he doing in his starting role with the jets?

Can't make chicken salad out of chicken sh@#(#@(t.

Im right there with you.

Rosen and Mayfield are my guys. I get Darnold. The idea of Allen would leave me baffled.

I'll root for the kid, but I'll hate he pick and really begin to question Dorsey. The rest of his moves so far I've liked, so I really have to hope that these rumors are all smoke and no fire.

But your post really sums up exactly how I feel. Although, forgiving Dorsey or not doesn't matter to me. All that matters to me is making this a stable winning organization. And that starts with the QB position

Agreed Bone. Allen may become a franchise QB but the pick at #1 is risky. I've liked Darnold and Rosen right along but SD is my #1. Rosen's injury history are concerning to me. I like SD at #1 and Chubb or Barkley at #4 but Whomever our FO takes at 4 will be a need and a good player that I really have no problem with.

I know I'm in the minority here, but I don't get it...

Why do we quantify whether or not a QB is worthy of the #1 overall pick? That's the pick we have. If you view him as your franchise QB, it doesn't matter if it's #1, #15 or #22 (okay, 22 is cursed). Is he going to play any better or worse depending on the number? Probably not.



Not picking on you, just making a point... Mahomes pick is viewed as good value. Why? Because most people think (with very limited proof) that he is going to translate to franchise QB. Now, I'm not going to get into comparing and contrasting him and Allen. I think most would agree that they are both viewed as high ceiling, rough around the edges, strong-armed, "gonna take some time" prospects.

Yet- The Chiefs traded their #1 (27), 3rd round and 2018 1st round pick for him. That's at least two impact players, right?

Isn't that just as big, if not a bigger, risk than us taking Allen at #1?

My point is - you draft where you are slated to draft. QBs are almost always over-drafted, it's the nature of the beast. Be thankful you have the opportunity to draft your guy, the draft slot doesn't really matter.

A good question is this...

Who is the better QB prospect. Mahomes or Allen?

We all know Dorsey moved up to take Mahomes. Let's assume for a moment that Mahomes and Allen are equal. The question is would Dorsey have taken Mahomes (or Allen) if he had Darnold, Rosen, and Mayfield as options?

In my mind, this year's QB class is better, at least deeper, than last year's class. If Mahomes were in this class, I don't think he would have been the 2nd QB taken, he would have been 4-5th.

You are spot on.

Bonefish is spot on as well... perception.

Teams between 10 and 20 in the first round are looking from the perspective of "deep class". The Browns? Just pick your guy.

It's almost as if the Browns are starting over with the ammunition they should have been given by the NFL in '99.
"Go ahead and pick your top QB, and grab yourself a high-impact player as well."

The extra scrutiny comes because it's the #1 pick. The best way for the Browns to battle that is to make sure that QB never takes the field in '18. Period.

Continue the build-out with the talent you have. Taylor an offense around Tyrod. Draft Chub and wreak havoc on defense. Take advantage of "deep class" in the RB dept.

If we draft Allen, it just means we've seen enough progress in the instruction he's received the last few months... the tools were never a question. It also means we're willing to take on the burden of development.

One thing we know for sure. It would be a brass-balls move by a new GM and one that will probably dictate his fate within two years.

Allen is being mentioned at for a reason.

I don't think numerous people are projecting him to us because they think he stinks and we are bound to blow the pick.

It's probably because he has the highest ceiling. Along with that he has bust potential.

So, are we wanting the best QB or are we wanting the safest choice? That's the decision.

Again, I am not saying Allen is the best QB, but a lot of people seem to think he will be the best. All of these people running mocks and evaluating players aren't just goofing around and linking us to Allen because it is a big joke on us.

I see what you did there...cleverly done.

I just can't see how we can justify drafting the guy.

I don't see what the analysts who view him as a possible top guy see. I don't see any of it.

I see a tall, athletic player, with a big arm and big hands; who is inaccurate, makes poor decisions, and doesn't produce on the football field. I've seen comparisons to Matthew Stafford, but I watched Matthew Stafford at Georgia. He was a very good QB. You watched him play and said, man, he's an NFL QB. Ben Roethlisberger and Carson Wentz, those guys were really good players. I mean, every field that Big Ben stepped on his final season at Miami (OH), he stood out as probably the best player on the field. At least in terms of impact. Carson Wentz played very well and led his team to championships.

Josh Allen hasn't shown any of that. The guy has yet to impress me. Because, i'm not going to be impressed by a workout. None of it means a thing IMO. I don't care how you look in shorts. Nor do I care how great you did on an IQ test. The only thing that matters is what you can do in a game. And Josh Allen doesn't pass my eye test at all.


So, yup. No idea what could justify this guy being the number 1 pick. If it's gonna be Allen, I'd rather just trade down or something

Lets be honest here Dorsey has a 75 percent chance of getting bashed by Browns fans no matter what he does with the 1st pick. Whichever QB we take has to turn out to be the best of the top 4 guys during his career to keep from having most fans calling for his head to be severed, tared and feathered, and then served to them on a silver platter.

I still believe that will be Allen or Mayfield. If we want a QB who will be average or good then it's Rosen. If we want to draft Kizer 2.0 then we take the turnover machine from USC

Well said, I agree.


Just reading comments, it seems most around here would opt for the safe pick, and that very well could be the way we should go.

I keep reading about player negatives. Turnovers, isn't accurate, isn't committed. With Mayfield the only knock is his height.

As I have said before, if Mayfield was 6'3" there wouldn't be a QB discussion about #1. The only talk would be about who goes after Mayfield. Next in line would be Allen IMO.

I don't think you can go in to a draft trying not to be wrong.

Before Allen took over in 2016 as QB at Wyoming, they were 3-9 in 2014 and 2-10 in 2015. They went 8-6 and 8-5 the next 2 years and a bowl game, I would say that he turned that program around.

But I am sure you will twist that around to be meaningless. Your bias towards Allen is incredibly transparent.

Didn't Wentz play there 2 years ago?

I'm not sure that is exactly true. If the QB he drafts proves to be a good long term QB, I don't think it will matter if one or more of the others have a better career, within reason. If one or more absolutely studs out, and we end up with a league average starter, it may have repercussions. But if the guy he drafts becomes a top 10 QB while another becomes a top 5, I think the fan base will be fine with the choice as long as he captains a winning team. We've been too long in the wilderness.

Wentz played at North Dakota State

I got my guy ... Sammie .... if we pick him i will be happy and root for him and hope me and the rest of Sams army was right ....

If we draft anyone else ... i wont be as happy but wont be upset either ... we all have our favorites but the fact is theres 3 really good picks and then Allen who has a lower floor but also the highest ceiling ... if they draft him it means they saw enough senior bowl week to think his accuracy is from mechanical issues that are being and can be fixed ... i have to hope their right ...

No matter who we pick ... im not going to bitch and moan ... im just gonna root like hell for whoever we pick to be really really good ...

If we do pick Allen ... it will be an EPIC board meltdown and the SHORTEST HONEYMOON EVER ... the pick may be worth it for that alone ... *L*

I actually think Kizer and Allen are a more apt comparison than Kizer and Darnold.

Yeah. We'd have to HIDE Allen for the entire year. And I'm not kidding.

Just a general reply to some stuff in here,

Allen's receivers never got open but Allen sure as hell didnt do them any favors either. 8 yard cross ball goes 30 yards not good. His feet however were everywhere and that can be correctd over time but Rosen and Darnold throw with a great deal of anticipation and accuracy, Mayfield gets the ball out super quick and shows tremendous accuracy,

Since the big ben class, I have 2 QBs rated above Darnold and Rosen and those are Andrew Luck and Derek Carr. Mayfield would be up there as well but his size and maturity worry me, His game on the field is as good as anyones,

This is a hell of a QB class, I would not be surprised if we dont see 9 or 10 starting QBs out of this class over the next 3 or 4 years, hell I think we could see 7 QBs go in the first this year,

Allen's play those two years does not suggest he's the one who "turned around" the program. In 2014, Wyoming hired Craig Bohl who led NDST to 3 straight FCS championship titles. Tough to overlook that...

I saw that as well... and without Gruden's camp, I don't see too much about this from the other quarterbacks.

And I don't think any of us, me included, know how much teams weigh the retention factor. I've read somewhere it's the most important trait some GMs look for, but I agree, it's not the only criterion. I believe it's the trait that got Mahomes drafted by the Chiefs last year.

Who do you think recruited Allen to Wyoming thinking he had the next Carson Wentz.

Why does his play not suggest he was significantly responsible for turning that program around.

Was it all the other NFL bound players in Wyoming?

Well, now I'm curious to see how Wyoming does this upcoming season to see if you're right...

I am comparing the turnovers I believe Darnold will commit to the ones Kizer did commit. Like I said this is my opinion. I may be right I may be wrong. I have not bashed and will not bash anybody who disagree's with me. Down the road we will all find out who's opinion was correct.

Sam Darnold - 90%
Josh Rosen - 8%
The field - 2%

edit: for clarity, these are my estimations.

What confuses me is that people wish to listen to the draft gurus who make a living getting hits on their web sites and ratings on TV over the experts in Vegas putting their money on the line.

These draft sites put new mocks up several times before the draft and people can't grasp the concept that they're doing it for ratings and hits on the internet?

Here's MY odds..

Sam Darnold - 50%
Josh Rosen - 50%
Baker Mayfield - 0%
Josh Allen - 0%
The Rest - 0%

Agreed! I have no horse in this race; that is for those guys making the pick. I do listen to those on this board whose opinions I respect. I may "cherry-pick" those posts, but only sway my opinion slightly...

Yes. It is transparent. I spent March and January watching film on these guys. I have seen Allen play. I'm not impressed.

How could I not be biased? I'm reading all these reports of him coming to the Browns, and I'm baffled. A guy who doesn't make good reads, is inconsistent with his accuracy, and doesn't throw it with anticipation. What the heck is there to like?



As for Wyomings turn around. I didn't see Wyoming before Josh Allen. So I don't know too much about them. I do know that they brought in a coach who won multiple national championships. I reckon that helped improve the play of the team.

As I've said. I've seen small school QBs. They generally dominate against their competition. This guy didn't.

Drafting Josh Allen, IMO, would be a huge mistake. It would be a career killer for Dorsey and Hue Jackson. Most importantly, it would set the Browns back a couple years, as being successful in this league with even mediocre QB play is very difficult

Which is why we WILL NOT draft Allen.

It's Darnold.

We're talking up Allen for a move from 4.