DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Josh Gordon Released

While the Hue and Dorsey bashing on this thread is rather silly, I don't see all that much of it around here.

Versatile, take a trip outside our neighborhood and go skim the Josh Gordon thread in the Watercooler on the OBR. There are a LOT more Gordon honks over there trashing Hue and most especially Dorsey and those weed hatin' meanies in the NFL League Office.

Really folks, DawgTaklers.net is a pretty sane and sensible Browns forum as such things go. The culture is a lot more toxic and stupid in other places.

The rumors are saying quite a few teams are interested but what does that mean? A conditional 7th?

The Kendricks fiasco has us looking very “Browns”. Announcing we’re cutting Josh AND then trying to trade him looks even worse. I want to stay positive but this team keeps finding new ways to look like morons.

Maybe I’m wrong. Maybe this is how a changed front office acts when they’re done with all the drama (Hendricks & Gordon) and poor play (Coleman). Cut and move on. But I can’t help wonder if there were better ways to do this.

Nah, won't be going back to the Watercooler. That place is full of ignorant loud-mouths. This board is far superior to that cesspool .

J/C

As one of the posters who vehemently defended the decision to keep Gordon, and supported all efforts to do so, I must admit feeling a sense of relief that this is finally happening. Dorsey is ripping off the band-aid: It'll still momentarily, but in the long run it will avoid the hassle.

Gordon's talent is undeniable, but the returns just haven't matched the talent. We've spent the last four years in awe of his 2013 season, but in the entire time since that phenomenal breakout, Gordon has given the Browns less than 350 yards receiving.

It sounds like enough was enough. Although he didn't put a foot wrong in terms of substance issues (So far, that's what is being reported) what becomes a more serious issue is that he was late to meetings, injured in promotion and the Browns felt he wasn't attacking his injury treatments and recovery the way he should. For all of Gordon's off the field issues, it's an even greater issue if he's not working hard or not fighting to put no foot wrong in his return to the field.

I am a little frustrated that the WR position feels like it has gone from a position of strength to a position of weakness. Landry, Higgins and Callaway aren't exactly defined - and in spite of their issues, Gordon and Coleman felt at least somewhat comfortable as depth. Ratley and Willies are rookies who don't feel ready to step up in the event of injury.

I wish Josh all the best. I want to see him have success and get his life in order. It's just a damn shame it couldn't happen in Cleveland.

We can say this: Nobody can ever say the Browns didn't give him a fair chance to be the receiver we know he can be. He has been with the team since 2012. Enough was enough.

I support Dorsey fully in this move. I do, however, hope that a trade can be worked out prior to his release. Getting something, anything, would be nice.

Why is that moronic? It's being widely reported there are as many as five teams sniffing around for a potential trade. Letting teams know that it's now or never to make an offer is a really smart move.

It also smacks of wanting to help Gordon. It hasn't been explicitly stated, but I get the feeling the Browns are willing to release Gordon if there isn't a trade opportunity that 1) Doesn't return great value and, 2) Isn't what Gordon wants.

So, for example, I feel like Dorsey would rather release Gordon than trade him for a 7th if Gordon isn't comfortable for him.

Everyone in Berea likes Gordon. All of them want what is best for him and don't want to see him flush is life down the crapper. It just seems the teams doesn't want to deal with it anymore: Doesn't mean they don't care.

I feel like the statement says one thing and one thing only: "Pony up now, or we'll do what is right by Josh."

I dunno about that, seems to me like they'd take a couple pirogies for him now.

Looks more like enough is enough to me.

And I advocated for him to be here as much as any Gordon fan.

I agree, it adds a sense of "now or never". Josh's contract is extremely team friendly for the next two years (this season plus RFA). I think that is worth a draft pick vs. negotiating with him on the open market. If he screws up on the current contract (again) - so what?

Someone will think they can do better than the Browns did with him.

J/C

Not entirely on topic, but I also think the team wants to use Hollywood Higgins more.

He's a consistent example of a guy who does things the right way. Incredible player but dropped in the draft because he lacked athleticism. He was the last of the receivers drafted, but got a reputation for his hard work and his high character. He ended up on the practice squad, but the Browns brought him back in because he earned that opportunity. In year two, that translated to an impressive leap. This year he came back bigger, faster and more defined in his overall abilities. He very quickly earnt first team reps after, by many accounts, solidifying himself as Baker Mayfield's top target, combining to consistently annihilate the second team. He put together a great camp and preseason. In week one, he had an awesome 38 yard catch.

I think the team wants to get him out there a little more. He's flashed talent this year, and going with the hot is the reasonable thing to do.

I'm a big fan of Higgins, and it seems he's earned the opportunity to show what he can do.

Mary Kay Cabot was on WTAM's pre-game show this morning and she said she didn't feel it was about the tardiness or the hamstring, but that she felt it was about Gordon's affect when he met with team doctors. It sounds like the team doctors saying "he wasn't himself" might be understating his behavior yesterday in Berea.

j/c

I'm sick of the apologists. I'm sick of people blaming this FO for Josh being a screw up. FINALLY Haslam put someone in charge of this team that had the guts to put an end to the Josh Gordon saga.

I'm sure they told Josh no more BS. Be a man, be on time and be available to play. Josh couldn't do it. At some point you have to expect him to be accountable.

What people seem to forget is that it wasn't Dorsey whose been kissing Josh's azz for years. Even Dorsey gave him chances, but it only goes so far.

Maybe now the Browns can be a football team and not a daytime soap opera.

Why should we "do right " by Josh? He's done nothing but screw us since he got here. I'm not saying you trading for nothing to a worse team but you take the best offer that you get unless it's in the division or if they're dead set on trading him to the NFC.

Because Dorsey earns a paycheck from the Browns, not from Gordon. While it may be admirable to care if Josh’s trade location is good with his plans, Dorsey’s job is to improve the Browns. If he can get a better pick from Oakland (crappy team, no vets and in a legal pot state) versus the Pats (SB contender, strict locker room and smaller town), then it’s his job to get that better return.

As you put it, if he’d rather cut him then send him somewhere he doesn’t want to go is moronic. No GM’s do that in any sport. If we can get a better return, get the better return, especially for a guy that’s crapped on you for the past four years. Cutting him so he can sign with an AFC north team so Josh can be more comfortable is stupid.

If Josh is being an ass with his 9th 2nd chance, screw him and his need to be comfortable. We are in one business, improve the Browns.

As for my original statement, I would think putting Josh on the trade market BEFORE announcing his release would have been a smarter decision. To me, it’s the optics of the situation. If you announce you’re putting him on the trade block because it’s better for his future and it’s not working out here, that seems better than announcing you’re done with his antics, concern of his mental state, ticked he might have hurt himself off the field and then say an hour later that you now realize a trade might be better for you, it looks like you don’t know what you’re doing.

Because doing the right thing is important. Nobody wants to see the kid ruin his life, or worse. He's done nothing but screw us over, so screwing him over for some nothing draft selection isn't value - it's petty revenge.

The long-term returns are worth it. Cleveland isn't exactly a hot destination for free agents. At the very least, the Browns can help themselves by creating a player-friendly environment in which players are treated as more than assets, and their health and safety is placed at a higher priority than some crappy draft pick.

I'm not saying turn down a first or anything, but Dorsey has made it clear that he's willing to release Josh if the offer isn't right. I respect that, and I'll bet there are plenty of players in the league who feel that way too.

The way I see it, Kendricks served us no purpose once he pled guilty. It is a safe bet that the Browns are not going to make a deep run into the playoffs so, going under the assumption that best case scenario he plays this full season, he more than likely will be in prison next year at this time. I know he only signed for one year but there was always the thought that they might work out a long term deal if both sides where happy at the end of this season. Now we know he is not signing a long term deal anywhere and is merely a one year rental with no option. I would think at some point this season he will get suspended by the NFL. He gets the right to appeal that suspension and could probably drag that out most of the season but I just don't see the sense wasting a roster spot on him when we have younger guys whom could use the experience.

Bitter fan here, I'm so annoyed by him and his attitude towards the Browns over his career, that I hope he gets traded to a team that hurts him professionally and financially. Meaning a team that plays in a state with high tax rates and a bad quarterback. I know Cleveland in NFL purgatory but how about the Bills???

so, it looks like a trade will occur ... what do we get? a 7th most likely

To each his own.

I get it that you're value above all, but Dorsey has a reputation of wanting to do right by guys. He cares about players, and part of that is sensitivity to difficult off-field situations. Undoubtedly, it has something to do with joining Kansas City following Jevon Belcher's murder-suicide.

Some people see the players as assets. Some see them as human beings, and want them to have success. As an example: Dorsey supported Gordon taking time away when many throttled him for the decision and demanded Gordon be released. Wasn't much value for the team losing their star receiver for camp, but it was the right thing to do for Gordon.

You don't have to agree with it. It's pretty gross not to. But it is what it is. I get the feeling you're one of those guys who'd release a player who annoyed you after free agency signings have started, and pretend there is value there.

The "screw him" mentality is fine until players don't return your call in free agency. Dorsey gives a damn, and players return his calls.

And we'll be lucky to get it. A guy whose been available to play 11 games since 2013. One strike away from a lifetime ban.

Trading him to the highest bidder would NEVER be considered "petty revenge". If Dorsey took a lesser offer to send him to the Bills when they could have taken a better offer with the 49ers, sure, that would be petty. The best offer is the best for your team, it has nothing to do with the player you're trading. This is a business and wins are the measurement.

Also, no free agent is going to say to themselves, "signing with the Giants would be great, but if I ever find myself in a situation where I'm on my last chance with the Giants because I've pissed them off with my drug use, inability to play, injuring myself off the field, getting DUI's, having issues with my child support and general lack of consistent attitude, I don't think the Giants will have my back as much as the Browns will. They'll do right by me better by releasing me instead of trading me. Yeah, I'll sign with the Browns if that ever happens."

Trading Josh for the best deal is fair for everyone. Fair is all you can ask. I don't think we need to release him so he can properly pick the best team for him to flourish. It's not petty, it's business and fair. We've already supported Josh when most teams would have fined him or sent him to the CFL. We aren't the bad guys here.

Seems a lot to type when "I don't like a football player I've never met so I hope Dorsey is equally as terrible a person as I am" would suffice.

Again, you're talking about a human being.

Like I said, it is what it is. Kick your feet and throw a tantrum. Our GM just isn't like you. He's a good person. Thankfully.

It's odd that fans have trouble figuring out that the NFL is a business and not a day care facility. As a business you can only go so far to try to help an employee. The Browns have gone WAY beyond that point.

Yes, that's what my posts have clearly suggested. The NFL is not a business but a day care facility. Well picked up, as usual.

Right, I'm a terrible and bad person for suggesting we trade a player to the highest bidder, something that EVERY other team does in EVERY sport. And I'm not throwing a tantrum. I've supported Josh as a person at every turn. I'm only advocating getting as much value as possible instead of cutting him for nothing. If you want to make this a personal attack against me, go right ahead. I'm not going to continue talking to you if you just want to insult me because you can't explain why bending over backwards to help Josh helps us too. I've been on this board for a long time and I don't insult people.

Forgot the j/c

Don't be so emotional. lmao

Pretty thin skin for a guy who just literally cracked a joke about Gordon's off-field issues, including that of his children. Nice way to show you've "supported Gordon as a person at every turn."

I don't know - Where I come from, we just don't joke about another man's kids. America is a little foreign at times.

That was a little harsh on my part, however, so I apologize. I'm Australian and it's 2:27am. I could be in bed with my girlfriend but I'm currently freezing my ass off for this damn football team. I'm a little grumpy.

I just don't think your logic holds up. Sure, YOU want maximum value, but I was responding to the claim that Dorsey is only doing this because he's a moron. I simply suggested that it could clearly correlate to a desire to do what is right by Gordon rather than it just being because Dorsey doesn't know what he's doing.

Heck if I know. Heck if any of us know. Just a suggestion.

The FOX sideline reporter said that she spoke with several players and they all said that it was the right decision, and it was time.

Good riddance and goodbye. Shoulda released this guy at least two years ago, maybe longer. Better late than never.

Build a team with a real culture and winning attitude, where players can count on the men next to them.

I'm OK with them getting rid of a problem child, I just wish they would have decided to wait until he could have been show cased more so they could have possibly gotten something decent in return. Right now I don't expect anybody to give up more then a late rnd pick.

I don't know about that. I'd be 100% in to it, but it wouldn't work.

I don't think we will release him on Monday. I have been hearing 3-4 teams are interested. I think I would spend a few days exploring trade possibilities.


Seems we could get something for the guy.

Gordon didnt have a problem catching a TD in week 1.

We cut him for zero reason.

If he blew a test, fine.

But all that happened is he was late and acting weird.

This is a BS reason. There has to be more to the story,

I think it depends on what we think we know. If we think he cannot pass a drug test ( and with all the hullabaloo this week end I find it hard to believe that the NFL will not be knocking on his door first thing in the AM) we may just cut him. I am still unde the assumption that passing a drug test woud be part of the physical he would have to pass for another team. Am I wrong on this?

I think there is more to the story. A team doesn't stick with a guy for 6 years and then cut him for being late. They definitely have a good reason.

j/c:

The players said it was time for him to go. Keeping the guy around would have been a mistake for such a young team. We gave the guy so many chances, but he always let us down. And Callaway actually played better than Josh did in his last 6 games.

https://sports.yahoo.com/john-lynch-says-49ers-already-192635084.html

John Lynch says 49ers already have called Browns about Josh Gordon

Matt Maiocco
NBC Sports BayArea•Sep 16, 2018, 3:26 PM

SANTA CLARA -- San Francisco 49ers general manager John Lynch made a phone call to the Cleveland Browns to express some level of interest in wide receiver Josh Gordon, Lynch told NBC Sports Bay Area on Sunday.

Lynch said the 49ers are going through their standard due diligence to determine whether to pursue a trade for Gordon, whom the Browns announced Saturday would be released in the coming days.

Gordon is signed through this season with a base salary of $790,000. The Browns reportedly are entertaining trade offers for Gordon, who has played in just 11 games since his breakout 2013 season.

Gordon showed up Saturday at the Browns facility with a hamstring injury. He told the team he sustained the injury during a promotional shoot, which was not a team event, Pro Football Talk reported, citing a league source.

There is a lot for the 49ers to consider, including how much Gordon can be relied upon. Coach Kyle Shanahan served as Cleveland's offensive coordinator in 2014.

Gordon has a season-long suspension reduced to 10 games because of a violation of the league's policy on substances of abuse in 2014. He was suspended for the final game of the season for skipping a walk-through one day before a game against the Baltimore Ravens.

Gordon was suspended for the entire 2015 season. He also was suspended for the first four games of 2016, and entered an in-patient rehabilitation facility. After missing two full seasons, he finally was reinstated for the final five games of last season.

In 41 career NFL games since entering the NFL in 2012, Gordon has caught 180 passes for 3,106 yards and 16 touchdowns. In 2013, he appeared in 14 games and caught 87 passes for a league-leading 1,646 yards and nine TDs.

Unfortunately, Jimmy G has started red hot against the Lions. After his uneven performance in week one, I was hoping he'd stink up week two, which might force Lynch to make a big play for Gordon.

I think Callaway is a nice replacement.


That was a darn nice catch under good coverage. The kid has great hands. He is only going to get better with some seasoning.

the players always know ... thanks for that info, i hadn't heard that

Done. And done. Good Canadian stuff has been stocked.