|
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 42,413 Likes: 501
Legend
|
OP
Legend
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 42,413 Likes: 501 |
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499 Likes: 906
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499 Likes: 906 |
Wasn't this already posted in the prior thread?
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,132 Likes: 394
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,132 Likes: 394 |
This whole thread will be an echo of the last one.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499 Likes: 906
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499 Likes: 906 |
They refuse to stop piling on. The other thread was locked before most are, probably because I proved some were talking out their butt...........so, let's lock it and start a new one where we can all bash Hue...............even though he is gone.
I'm serious when I say this...........there are some very shady characters on this board.
Good night.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 42,413 Likes: 501
Legend
|
OP
Legend
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 42,413 Likes: 501 |
This whole thread will be an echo of the last one. Our head coach was just fired. There will definitely be more news to come out within the next several days. The article I posted is just the most recent news and many haven't commented on it.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,224
Dawg Talker
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,224 |
J/C
That interview was "out there"
Felt that he was auditioning for future roles - i guess thats why he is distancing himself from the train wreck where he played a part (and he absolutely did). He was in full damage control and everybody copped it.
Seemed like a nice guy, but he clearly has accountability and revisionist history issues. "I get it....thats on me".
Thing is, i don't think he did get it....or accept truly that it was on him. Those soundbites are like when a toddler says "sorry" but don't know what they are apologizing for. Thats why you see all these independent 'no dog in this race' media types dog piling him as a lot of what he said was completely spurious. The Wentz thing....just wow. The Offense being better under him with worse players was also debunked.
Man i was pulling for this guy this year but we saw something we hadn't in his first 2 years....the team roll over. That was probably the beginning of his end.
Be interested to see what role he lands in professional football after this debacle. You have to think that at a minimum teams would hold him to account for his record and some of his behaviours in all this mess even if he doesn't hold himself at all responsible for it.
Looking forward to Haleys riposte. LOL
Onward. Next Coach up!
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 2,136 Likes: 7
Dawg Talker
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 2,136 Likes: 7 |
Seemed like a nice guy, but he clearly has accountability and revisionist history issues. "I get it....thats on me".
Thing is, i don't think he did get it....or accept truly that it was on him.
Onward. Next Coach up!
I agree, you bring up some good points. Just to play devil's advocate, I can see why Hue might feel slighted and distance himself. He never really had a team to try to win with. I mean, we beat the Steelers (wk 1) and the Raiders minus the refs. We beat the Saints minus the kicker (which is on Dorsey to get a kicker that can make kicks not hue). So those are clearly just bad Cleveland style luck. I mean, if he's 4-4 at this point even with the loss to the Steelers (which would look less bad without 2 missed kicks), there's no way he's fired. Then on top of that, I'm not sure who you blame for the rest of the failures. Like are dropped passes the coaches' fault or the GM for not getting WRs that don't drop the ball? Our stop-gap QB Tyrod was atrocious so we had to throw Baker to the wolves which was never Hue's plan (nor should it have been). our GM traded Gordon away, and even though that was probably a lost cause, in which case, he sould've been moved during the offseason, again, not Hue's fault. Then Higgins gets hurt, Willies steps in an makes plays and in true Browns fashion, breaks his collarbone in practice! I mean, this stuff would derail any coach. I know people say these kinds of things happen to every team, but they really don't, not like they do in Cleveland. I want to say, I HATED Hue as a coach years 1-2. His clock management was terrible and play calling head scratching at times, but this year he seemed much improved. The team really fell apart around him. Kinda reminds me of a Jeff Fisher situation, where even though Fisher wasn't AWFUL, it was also clear he wasn't the guy to take you to a SB. Hue was pretty much the necessary fall guy for a proper rebuild.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,244 Likes: 535
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,244 Likes: 535 |
I can agree with what you say.
If that's all it is, then Hue should still be here.
My main concern is the report of him and Haley trying to undermine each other and the childish bs around that.
If the coaching staff was toxic/dysfunctional.
Because if that's the case then you have to make change happen.
No Craps Given
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 18,204
~ Legend
|
~ Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 18,204 |
I'm learning a lot about excuse making watching Hue's publicity tour. This fool is just hurting whatever of a reputation he had.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 18,204
~ Legend
|
~ Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 18,204 |
Mad respect for Sashi cutting the phone lines while Hue ranted how he could lead the browns to a super bowl with mccarron and doing it his way.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 18,086 Likes: 1484
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 18,086 Likes: 1484 |
Mad respect for Sashi cutting the phone lines while Hue ranted how he could lead the browns to a super bowl with mccarron and doing it his way. Sashi died so we can live.
At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 38,997 Likes: 885
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 38,997 Likes: 885 |
In reading the interview, I thought Hue conducted himself well.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 18,086 Likes: 1484
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 18,086 Likes: 1484 |
j/c:
DMS= Twitter direct messages that are not public.
At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 38,997 Likes: 885
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 38,997 Likes: 885 |
j/c:
DMS= Twitter direct messages that are not public. I don't know about any of that. I do know that while he was here is was OK to voice an opinion on why he should not be coach. I did on many occasions. Now that he is gone I see no real purpose to discuss him much unless the purpose is to pile on him or the posters who liked him as head coach. But hey, that's JMO.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 72,718 Likes: 572
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 72,718 Likes: 572 |
Also, Hue will be doing the ESPN carwash today ... sports center, first take, etc.
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 18,086 Likes: 1484
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 18,086 Likes: 1484 |
There is plenty of reason to keep discussing him. If you don't want to, fine by me.
At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 10,962 Likes: 121
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 10,962 Likes: 121 |
probably to Cinci. Wouldn't surprise me. A second thread for more of the same? Just seems odd to me.
"Every responsibility implies opportunity, and every opportunity implies responsibility." Otis Allen Glazebrook, 1880
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 18,086 Likes: 1484
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 18,086 Likes: 1484 |
At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 16,195
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 16,195 |
#GMSTRONG
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 18,086 Likes: 1484
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 18,086 Likes: 1484 |
j/c:
Yup. And at the press conference, it didn't sound like that was going to change.
At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,983 Likes: 16
Dawg Talker
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,983 Likes: 16 |
Apparently the same story coming from so many different people isn't enough sometimes. Hue is obviously dishonest to some extent. How much so is hard to tell, but he isn't right about everything, which apparently he is trying to convey. It's obvious to me why he was fired after week 8 and not at the bye or end of season.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 8,974
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 8,974 |
J/C
I don't know if I ever recall a HC being fired and then giving an interview about it. . . . that's kinda just Hue. Always about him.
He was classy in the interview for thanking the fans and saying he wanted to win and was sorry he couldn't do that. I believe him there. I believe he wanted to win. Who doesn't? I just don't think he knew how to.
I think he is trying to save face, and tried to play a victim a little bit as well, as he does often. "discord" was not a harsh word when you tried to get your OC fired or at least take away his responsibilities.
JMO
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 8,974
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 8,974 |
I do believe that having the opportunity finish it out (myself) would've been best. of course you do, Hue. Everyone loves flea flickers from the end zone. "We had a lot of football left, were 2-5-1 with a rookie QB, left tackle, already played Pittsburgh twice, beat Baltimore, and could have easily been 3-4-1 if the first down isn't taken back (in Oakland). The fact that we played four ovetime games says that we were a better football team. In my mind, if we fix the offense - it's a totally different story. So I do believe the move was premature. But I think a part of the problem again went back to the first two years.'' Of course absolutely nothing was your fault. You didn't decide to change the line the Friday before opening day. You didn't decide that Baker was not going to get ANY reps, and you didn't decide that Baker was better than TT and insisted TT play no matter what. . . . "People for some reason thought that I couldn't run an offense and that I needed to hire an OC. Yes, the entire league and fanbase. "You look at our numbers with me calling the offense with less talent. Our numbers this year were the same or worse than our numbers last year with better players on offense. That's just false. but I felt they wanted me to focus on coaching the whole team and let someone else call the plays.''
Usually the HC coaches the whole team. Maybe you should have stepped down as HC and remained as OC if that's what you wanted. "What people don't know is that I recommended John Dorsey as the guy for the job because of his skillset in talent acquisition. Sure you did Hue. It's why I chose Greg Williams as well Gregg was already on the staff. "I gave it time to correct itself, and after that didn't happen I brought things up that needed to be corrected. After those things continued to go uncorrected, as a head coach, ahhhhh, once again, tell the world your position Hue! lol. I think you should have said "as a former head coach" pal. The problem again was there's this perception that all of a sudden, I somehow forget how to run and offense, develop QB's, or coach a football team. I don't think you ever did. But this was the perception and stigma placed on the coaches that come before me in Cleveland. They were good coaches before they came to Cleveland - and they have remained good coaches after leaving Cleveland.'' None of which have been a succesfull head coach as of yet. Some guys are just better OC/DC. Its not a knock on them. Just the way it is. "If you're going to go out, you always go out betting on yourself. I knew that I would've taken our same system and turned the offense around. I highly doubt that, based on the play calls you had last year - and the way your team ended and turned out in OAK. rebuild, or a reset. The faster you move on from people, the longer it could take from the next person to turn it into their vision. I believe the constant changes only compound the difficulties for the next person to have the time and patience to be successful. I strongly believe that I did a lot of work in a short time of laying the foundation for turning the place around. It's unfortunate that they took the approach they did the first two years because those were two years that I couldn't get back from a record and value stand point. Ahhhh, so if we start winning, it was because of the work YOU did. Gotcha. I see how that works out for you. I'm the same coach from three years ago. I don't think that's an endorsement, Hue....
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 72,718 Likes: 572
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 72,718 Likes: 572 |
I wonder if Haley will speak soon?
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,528 Likes: 6
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,528 Likes: 6 |
Just a general reply to a few things.
Hue loved goff and rightly so. he liked wentz but saw him as a mid first talent, flacco type. He also loved mahomes but the browns couldn't be quiet and word leaked chiefs n Dorsey jumped us. This is why Dorsey was very demanding of everyone to b3 draft silent.
Hue was right Sashi buthcherd a fantastic ol for no reason. He took a 3rd round receiver at 15 overall. I had a 2nd on Higgins late 3rd o, coleman.
Hue did help get Dorsey here, hell he stayed with hue while he was I,terviewing.
Haley was a total ass because he thought hue was tryi,g to play up to the camera. Doesn't matter, Hue was the coach. Not a fan of hue but Haley was wrong.
It didn't work for hue, I am glad he is gone but I wish him the best.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 320
2nd String
|
2nd String
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 320 |
I feel Haslam needs to go but this isn't going to happen. He has done only one smart thing since he has become owner and that was to hire Dorsey. I was excited when he hired Hue but quickly became skeptical after watching and listening to Hue. Hue was in over his head as a head coach as was Sashi as a GM. The hiring of John Dorsey is the best thing to happen to the Browns since their return in 1999. Even Haslam is not dumb enough to fire Dorsey. My concern is if Haslam refuses to let Dorsey hire the next coach, a coach that will answer to Dorsey instead of Haslam, Dorsey may resign as GM. Hue's firing was way over due. His record alone proves this. I hope Haslam can learn from his mistakes and let Dorsey run the Browns.
I just want a winner. We need players who can be part of the solution not part of the problem.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 14,981 Likes: 1373
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 14,981 Likes: 1373 |
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 15,341 Likes: 98
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 15,341 Likes: 98 |
Come on man the Raiders have thrown in the towel since we played them
John 3:16 Jesus said "For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life."
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 2,307 Likes: 2
Dawg Talker
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 2,307 Likes: 2 |
Come on man the Raiders have thrown in the towel since we played them Gruden should learn from Hue, the best way to keep your job is to blame it on the lack of talent. He just has to put it all on Reggie McKenzie, and he will be safe.
Last edited by rastanplan; 11/02/18 10:15 AM.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,475 Likes: 136
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,475 Likes: 136 |
Thank you cfrs...I missed the first time if it was posted...and didn't wish to go over the first thread.
Vers..you are funny sometimes...lol Sometimes change is good.
I can't remember seeing Hue Jackson smile so much - the frustration for him is over at least. He looked comfortable even though he was a bit surprised. Always a gentleman, and possibly TOO NICE might have been some of his undoing.
Dorsey evidently didn't like Hue at the helm from the get go, understandable for a new GM not to like the inheritance of the HC especially when they were 1-31. But HASLAM who gets a lot of crap thrown at him was the one in Hue's corner and insisted that he stayed. But eventually Dorsey won out. And so much for my thought process that Haley was forced on Hue by Dorsey, evidently that was not the case.
In the end pure and simple we did not win...We competed but game after game we LOST! That falls on Hue Jackson and unfortunately is his MO from his term here...he was in the end a LOSER.
Very likable guy and he kept the team together in a hard time but those hard times are over and the fact is his production was LOSSES.
I think with the system we have, Hue will get another shot somewhere, he probably is the most experienced minority HC out there and Haslam will give him a good reference I'm sure.
But Dorsey has earned the right to steer this ship in HIS DIRECTION. So although he worked well with HUE he was not impressed with HUE and his HC term here. Can't argue with that and somebody being 3-36-1 just is not good anyway you look at it regardless of Talent or not. The talent wasn't in the realm of an Expansion team - we just had a ton of young talent and they just didn't know how to win. THAT was so key and I think Hue was too laid back regarding those losses. We played too many times to NOT TO LOSE and in almost all occasions we LOST. We had to play to win and we just didn't do so.
I think Williams might turn this thing around. Kitchen seems to know what he's doing and quite frankly I never complain about play calling and believe that its about the execution which is relied on the OC anyhow. But Haley in my mind was the worst play caller that I can remember, and I'm talking about in the realm of maybe Maurice Carthon. Of pitching it to the FB fame.
Hue too nice, he thought, he talked but he was too nice and he should have taken over the play calling. Instead he was too nice and guess what? He has no job now. Obviously if we beat the Steelers and broke the what 25/26 in a row away game loss streak. Hue would still be here. We again were in the game but ended up out coached especially on the O side to make the game turn into a laugher.
jmho
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off! Go Browns! CHRIST HAS RISEN! GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 18,086 Likes: 1484
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 18,086 Likes: 1484 |
j/c:
I think Hue has an account on here.
At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 18,086 Likes: 1484
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 18,086 Likes: 1484 |
At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 18,086 Likes: 1484
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 18,086 Likes: 1484 |
At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 42,413 Likes: 501
Legend
|
OP
Legend
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 42,413 Likes: 501 |
Who’s idea was it to put Hue in front of a camera so soon after being fired?
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 8,974
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 8,974 |
Who’s idea was it to put Hue in front of a camera so soon after being fired? Hues. He is a good man and you can tell, but he is absolutely an egomaniac
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 957 Likes: 105
All Pro
|
All Pro
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 957 Likes: 105 |
12, just so I am clear. When hue was hired he was considered a hot item. The bengals tried to keep him by offering him hc when Lewis retired. Most fans liked the hiring of chud. Farmer was being chased by more than the browns. Dorsey is considered a good hire. If they do not have success that does not mean they were a bad hire at the time. Hindsight is 20/20. So 12, what did you think of Jackson as a hire 3 years ago??
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 6,445
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 6,445 |
Hue is just making it more and more obvious that we had to cut ties with the guy.
Bad coach, worse leader - everything is everybody else's fault and he can do no wrong.
I'd be shocked if he ever got a head coaching gig in the NFL again. Come to think of it, most teams probably wouldn't even touch him as an OC although he probably has enough connections to at least get one of those jobs.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 42,413 Likes: 501
Legend
|
OP
Legend
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 42,413 Likes: 501 |
I honestly don’t see how anyone could credibly hire him as a coordinator. An head coach with a loose grip on their job has to worry about him undermining them. Last time Hue got fired he went to the Bengals and was a secondary assistant and special teams coach, then running backs coach, and then offensive coordinator. The most likely scenario, in my mind, is that he goes back to the Bengals, but their offense is so successful right now that they can’t make him the offensive coordinator. I’d guess they make him some sort of offensive consultant or something along those lines.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 2,307 Likes: 2
Dawg Talker
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 2,307 Likes: 2 |
I honestly don’t see how anyone could credibly hire him as a coordinator. An head coach with a loose grip on their job has to worry about him undermining them. Last time Hue got fired he went to the Bengals and was a secondary assistant and special teams coach, then running backs coach, and then offensive coordinator. The most likely scenario, in my mind, is that he goes back to the Bengals, but their offense is so successful right now that they can’t make him the offensive coordinator. I’d guess they make him some sort of offensive consultant or something along those lines. He will get a job at Notre Dame... has the hunchback...
Last edited by rastanplan; 11/02/18 12:34 PM.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 72,718 Likes: 572
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 72,718 Likes: 572 |
He'll probably be hired as a QB coach or OC at Cincinnati or one of his buddies
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
|
|
|
DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Browns fire Hue Jackson Part Two
|
|