Having a daughter with special needs (who I secretly hope will get involved with Special Olympics so I can train her :)), I love that Baker supports this.
Baker seems like a genuine, real, down to earth guy. Couldn't be happier with a guy like him representing the team I root for.
I hope you get the opportunity as well, Rish.
Might be worth bidding on those Baker Mayfield cleats once they go to auction!
One of the things I love about this board is how accepting we all are of other people's opinions and how consistent we when evaluating character traits.
What an HONEST and SAD reflection on what we’ve turned ourselves into ...
I'm cool with Baker not wanting to hug Hue. Not cool with how he handled the post-game presser. Keep your feelings to yourself, and/or to your locker room.
However, I do think Cleveland needs this type of personality to finally get over this QB hump. We need a guy who gives no damns about what people think. We've seen Kizer, Kessler, Weeden, Anderson, Frye, Hoyer, McCoy, and others get caught up with the off the field stuff, and allowed media to affect their mental state. Playing the one position that has been essentially cursed since 99, you need someone with a strong head. Baker has that.
Glad we have him, glad we've gotten a few wins. Let's hope he matures though, and not becomes a distraction on unnecessary BS.
Sidenote. We so live in a pick and choose society. I think its a little funny how some guys get praised for these type of comments, and others get ridiculed. Some guys people say well thats just how he is, and some guys get he needs to shut his mouth and just play football. That's life I guess.
Minus the we need this type of personality i could not agree more ... and i can live with the personality ... i would take 100 guys with bakes tude over 100 dudes that don’t HATE losing ...
One of the problems I had with Hue was how he “handled” things in the press and how he basically “threw” people under the bus ... saying things that didnt need to be said ...
It was one of my big problems with Hue ... and i think most agree ...
IF u agree with what i said above ... please explain to me how what Hue did was wrong (and it was) yet now its OK to do the same thing to Hue and Bake has gone a lot further out out of his way to do it ...
Honest question bro ... thats what Bake did .... look at the DEATAILS bro ...
1. Hue tries to hug bake ..
2. Bake shakes his hand and is cold .. no problem so far ..
3. HUE DOES NOTHING MORE ...
4. Pundits “attack” what Bake did ...
5. In defending himself Bake TRASHES hue ... He threw Hue under the bus to defend himself against “attacks” not from Hue that were about Bake being inmature and needing to grow up and to understand the difference between college and the pros ...
Hue did nuttin to deserve this what so ever ..
HOW DID BAKE NOT THROW HUE UNDER THE BUS HERE? ...
HOW DID BAKE NOT THROW HUE UNDER THE BUS HERE? ...
He did.
But Baker threw Hue under the bus after being unfairly criticized by the media for doing nothing more then shaking Hue's hand.
Hue on the other hand threw people under the bus to make it look like things weren't his fault without being prompted by the media. He also did it underhandedly by leaking things to the media while still the HC, both directly and indirectly, and then by going out of the way to have his little "It wasn't my fault" tour after he was fired.
One of the problems I had with Hue was how he “handled” things in the press and how he basically “threw” people under the bus ... saying things that didnt need to be said ...
It was one of my big problems with Hue ... and i think most agree ...
IF u agree with what i said above ... please explain to me how what Hue did was wrong (and it was) yet now its OK to do the same thing to Hue and Bake has gone a lot further out out of his way to do it ...
Honest question bro ... thats what Bake did .... look at the DEATAILS bro ...
1. Hue tries to hug bake ..
2. Bake shakes his hand and is cold .. no problem so far ..
3. HUE DOES NOTHING MORE ...
4. Pundits “attack” what Bake did ...
5. In defending himself Bake TRASHES hue ... He threw Hue under the bus to defend himself against “attacks” not from Hue that were about Bake being inmature and needing to grow up and to understand the difference between college and the pros ...
Hue did nuttin to deserve this what so ever ..
HOW DID BAKE NOT THROW HUE UNDER THE BUS HERE? ...
Please explain .. cause i don’t get it ....
Almost anyone ... Haus? ... help me out here ...
I appreciate the call-out but as you know, I'm no fan of Hue and I'm probably biased because of that.
My opinion is that Hue was incompetent, probably even historically incompetent by NFL head coaching standards. Why am I bringing this up? We're talking about Baker's behavior (hold that thought).. we should be focused on that. I like taking taking a broader view of things, or looking at the big picture if you will.
Most of us have worked with someone who is not fit for their job. Maybe it was a bad hiring decision, or they got promoted based on factors other than their performance. Whatever the case may be, working with people like this on a day to day basis can be extremely challenging. It wears on you. You're forced into a position between respecting the chain of command and doing what's best for the company or organization. When these two things are routinely out of sync, people can do strange things.
This is the pattern that I see wherever Hue goes, Cincy maybe being the exception (we'll see how things transpire there.) It explains why Oakland parted ways despite an apparently respectable first season. It explains his dealings with Sashi Brown, Todd Haley, Baker Mayfield. It explains why he hasn't held a job more than 3-4 years in his 30+ year coaching career.
I don't know Hue personally so I don't really know what the guy is like. It's obvious he worked the media his entire time here, leaking things to MKC and others. He threw the players, coaches, and front office under the bus in a number of different ways. Even his brief statement upon (re)joining the Bengals mentioned how talented the Bengals are, in what I suppose was a subtle dig at the Browns.
It's funny how that team hasn't won since... teams can win without talent (we've seen expansion teams that were far more depleted than the 2017 Browns consistently win at least 2-3 games), which makes you wonder whether it's worse to have a team without great talent or have a team with Hue Jackson leading them.
Ahh shoot, this was supposed to be about Baker. Sorry my friend, I'm trying to get over this Hue frustration, but it is set in deeper than I had realized.
- I too think Baker handled the attempted hug thing well. Shake the guy's hand, say nice game, and move on. That's a perfectly reasonable, probably even ideal way to handle it.
- Press conference is borderline. I liked it. I think he was speaking for a lot of people in the locker room who don't have the job security that Baker is afforded by being the #1 overall pick and a promising rookie QB. Hue has self-promoted for years through his allies in the media. It was about time somebody stood up and called things as they really are.
Granted this was still a bit unprofessional so I understand how others may see it differently. There's something to be said for just letting things go, don't give any more motivation for future opponents, and that sort of thing.
- He probably should have stayed off Instagram.. there was no reason to keep going on and on, the talking heads are going to make stupid arguments on TV. It's what they do. Time would be better spent in the playbook than correcting Damien Woody and calling Hue fake. I'm not too worried about it though, especially when Hue bolted to the Bengals 2 weeks after being fired. This is a division rival that we still had two games left against! You can say all the stuff about having the right to work-- true-- as long as you acknowledge that he'll be paid by the Browns for a long time to come and is essentially working for free due to the offset.
Had he gone back to the Bengals in the off-season-- which would not have affected his pay or his future career prospects (they'd actually be better, given the Bengals recent performance) then I think the players would have understood. But for the players to have Hue as a head coach, then a few weeks later he's standing on the Bengals sideline as an opponent just seems odd. That's about the best I can explain it.
I think Rivers is a great comparison. He's emotional and ultra-competitive. People see his on-field behavior and think he's a jerk. On the field, he probably is. It gives him that emotional edge to compete at the highest level. Off the field, he's actually very religious, very involved in the community, and all around, just a good dude.
Baker just wears his emotions on his sleeve. That's the complete opposite of being fake. I think he's as real as it comes. His emotions drive him to play better and he needs a chip on his shoulder to fuel those emotions. I'm absolutely fine with that. I'd rather have one of those guys, than a 100 guys that act calm and collected, but play with no passion.
We've always complained about having guys play for us that just looked like they were collecting paychecks. Now we have a guy that actually looks like he cares for the team as much as the fans do, and that's a problem? Until he slaps a pen out of a kids hand, blows off charity work, or commits a felony, I'm just fine with him being a "jerk". He's our jerk, and he wins freaking football games.
I'm guessing that those of you calling me out for saying Baker is fake did not take the time to watch this video. I'll give you another chance. You can also read the comments after the video and may take note that a lot of people saw the same "fake" act that I did.
You're taking one of a man's worst moments and using it against him. Funny how you don't do that to Hue with all his idiotic decisions, the constant hiring and firing of coaches (you know, the ones who actually have to feed their families, and don't have a guaranteed 8-figure contract to fall back on), saying the players aren't good enough in any number of ways.
Let's do it with you. You've started a fight in every thread you've entered for the last five years, then complain when people lash out and don't give you any respect.
Two can play that game. Fake... lol
You once got suspended because you tried to intimidate someone in the Politics section by saying you were across the street with a scoped rifle. Then you have the audacity to complain that it's not fair when you get suspended.
Refs might delete this post but you all know it's true.
Wait a minute, you said this is not a football thread. How can I (the reader) interpret this as anything other than an emotional agenda driven rant with that ending?
Using Youtube comments to bolster your argument isn't a good look. They are an excellent source of humor, though.
That said, Baker did look a bit phony in that video. I've not seen anything fake from him since becoming a Brown. In fact, I think his honesty may hurt him at times.
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul. - John Muir
Hue definetly was way less provoked with what Sashi did by nixing a trade ...
After all thats NOT NEAR AS BAD as someone in the press (NOT HUE ... hue went after the guy that DIRECTLY went after Hue) provoking Bake to go after Hue ...
SASHI opened the door for Hue to go after Sashi ...
THE PRESS opened the door for Bake to go after Hue ...
All u did was TRY and JUSTIFY your hypocrisy ...
JUST ADMIT IT ... at least i can respect that ... heck ... i just VOLUNTEERED i was a hypocrite on this very subject ..
I read the first line so far Haus ... we disagree on a lot of that .. BUT u don’t play games .. I RESPECT u for that weather we agree or disagree ... hence, why u were one of the posters i specifically called out to reply ... i know we disagree and i knew you’d think about it and give an honest answer ...
Let me go read the rest .. HOPE U DON’T PROVE ME WRONG ... *LOL* ...
My 2 cents. I will preface this by saying Baker was not my first choice for QB and time will tell if he becomes a great QB, or settles into mediocre or even God forbid a bust. Remember after his first season, some posters would have given up 3 first round picks for RGIII.
I have felt Hue had 2 sides, one he showed to the open public and media and the other those working close to him see. I have no other evidence or type of confirmation than anyone else on the board. It is just how I have read him since the middle of last year.
Saying that, I think Baker took sufficient jabs in the initial PC after the Bengal game. In fact I think he was justified other than saying Hue "left" Cleveland, which he really didn't , Hue was fired.
I also like an athlete that speaks the truth, but to continue on especially on social media is a bit low class. No judgment of Baker because I certainly don't want anyone defining me at my current age by my actions in my mid twenties.
Anyway, lets just move on and hopefully enjoy continued success with Baker at the helm.
I read the first line so far Haus ... we disagree on a lot of that .. BUT u don’t play games .. I RESPECT u for that weather we agree or disagree ... hence, why u were one of the posters i specifically called out to reply ... i know we disagree and i knew you’d think about it and give an honest answer ...
Let me go read the rest .. HOPE U DON’T PROVE ME WRONG ... *LOL* ...
I know you like these over-the-top criticisms of Hue. Just admit it.
As far as the other stuff, yes it is true. I would not make something like that up. Now whether or not it's appropriate to drudge up stuff like that from the past is another question.. ahh well.
[quote=DiamDawg]nd Bake has gone a lot further out out of his way to do it ... I like taking taking a broader view of things, or looking at the big picture if you will.
One of the reasons your an enjoyable read is because of that ... i get caught up in the details the “day to day “ type stuff and am guilty of not looking at the big picture enough ...
I always look for positives when i do somerthing .. .one of like two positives from my time in the CESS POOL (there were 339 negatives for the 2 or 3 positives ... the ledger was very lopsided .. *L*) was the fact i learned that about U ... i had no clue how smart u were ... none ...
Quote:
Ahh shoot, this was supposed to be about Baker. Sorry my friend, I'm trying to get over this Hue frustration, but it is set in deeper than I had realized.
...
I’m reading along thinking ... well he’s making a great case for why he don’t like Hue AGAIN .. and then this ... *L* ... i do the same dang thing all the time ..
Glad i could help with the venting ... its a proccess ... u still have a ways to go ..
Quote:
- I too think Baker handled the attempted hug thing well. Shake the guy's hand, say nice game, and move on. That's a perfectly reasonable, probably even ideal way to handle it.
Quote:
- Press conference is borderline. I liked it. I think he was speaking for a lot of people in the locker room who don't have the job security that Baker is afforded by being the #1 overall pick and a promising rookie QB. Hue has self-promoted for years through his allies in the media. It was about time somebody stood up and called things as they really are.
No probs wth that ... didn’t like it .. thought he should have been way more mature and said things differently .. but i’m Fine with it ..
What i did learn .. thats who bake is ... we know we can TRUST Bake in that he showed to me its more important for him to be honeast and say what he feels than to be liked ... what he said was no where’s near PC or nice ...
I learned he has an EDGE ... and I LOVE that in its QB ...
I’m gonna hear things from Bake that i dont like ... TOUGH NUGGIES DIAM ... *L* ... end of the day .. i can 100% live with that ...
It also helps he has a CHARITABLE HEART and i’m Not worried about him beating his girl, getting busted for partying ... thats not the vibe i get from dude ... THOSE things are important to me ...
Quote:
Granted this was still a bit unprofessional so I understand how others may see it differently. There's something to be said for just letting things go, don't give any more motivation for future opponents, and that sort of thing.
Agree .. no probs wth folks that see a pattern and it leads them down this path .. BAKES PAST actions open that door for them to go down ... like Vers .. i dont agree with Vers but i 100% understand how he got there ... BAKE OPENED that door, Vers was just the one to go through it and point it out ... Vers ain’t gonna like this but its true .. he’s a lightning rod ... sorry bro but in that regard your exactly like Trump .. no matter what u say, with some folks it’s ON ... u could say the skies blue and its 50/50 weather arch or a few other troll u .. anything more “controversial” that that and its ON ... sad but true ...
Quote:
- He probably should have stayed off Instagram.. there was no reason to keep going on and on, the talking heads are going to make stupid arguments on TV.
Thats where the INMATURITY really shinede through for me .. that’s when he BECAME HUE and none of the “haters” will aknowledge it no matter HOW TRUE IT IS ...
It sounds like we actually agree ... well that don’t answer my question ... *L* ..
I guess when the only answer is to call yourself a hypocrite in todays world i’ll Just get a bunch of justification and finger pointing ... guess thats on me for asking a bad question ...
Thanks for responding and trying Haus ... appreciate it sir ...
Hue was throwing people under the bus long before the Sashi/trade incident. Any time something happened he made it look like it was some else to blame. The dude was so worried about making himself look good so he could keep his job that he failed to do his job.
Baker gave his reason why he didn't get all gooey with Hue after the game but some members in the media didn't agree with it and attacked him, that's when threw Hue under the bus.
Baker was provoked/Hue did it without any provocation, because that's who he is.
I don't have a problem with what Baker said until he responded to Damien Woody's comments. That I don't agree with but the reason for how Baker did it and the reason why Hue did it are entirely different. Baker did it in anger after being attacked, Hue does it because that is who he is.
I'm not worried about "Baker, the person". He's young, still a bit immature, but in no way appears "fake" to me. The talk about Jackson over the last week is pushing the envelope, but maybe not in a bad way. We, as fans, have a tendency to breath too much life into what the media says when 90% is speculation.
We don't know what took place behind the scenes that last few weeks Hue was here. Looking back and recollecting, I remember players being a bit taken by Hue insisting the offense needed attention, proclaiming he was the man to do it, and then doing nothing. I also remember talk of a lot of closed door secret meetings the week following. Almost as if he was working to create a consensus to alienate Haley, rather than just doing what he said he was going to do. Obviously there is a whole body of work when it comes to "Hue, behind the scenes", and I don't believe any of us were privy to it. We were privy to the media tour, however. People made a big deal of that as well, I don't think Hue did or said anything terrible. He did seem to try his best to escape blame for what went down and point fingers elsewhere. I think that's what rubbed most players the wrong way. The whole thing made no sense to me - he knew he had a job in Cincy well before the door ever smacked his a$$ in Cleveland, no need to go tell the world, show after show, "it wasn't my fault".
Baker became the mouthpiece for many in the locker room, and make no mistake, if that's not the way others felt, he wouldn't have said it. He's not stupid. There are many different personalities of leadership - this is one of them. Everywhere he has been, teammates have embraced him as a leader. Hue said as much when he was blown away by "the pied piper" show.
I'm not going to say this kind of media interaction isn't walking a fine line because it is. Putting things in retrospect though, Hue is gone and he went to a division rival a week before one of two meetings remaining with them - he is the enemy. Not because he's Hue, just because.
Do I sit here a few days later and wish Baker would have hugged Hue and then thrown down some politically correct comments when asked by the media? Not at all, tired of our PC universe... say what you feel, be who you are. This team has been laughed at, kicked when they're down and all but written off as an NFL team. Baker has embraced the challenge of being a part of the turnaround since before he was drafted and he's not going to be anyone but himself while he makes strides to do just that.
I'll take that over the last 20 years of misery any day. Baker the football player looks just fine, Baker the person will always be a work in progress... as we all are. Hate to think what people would say about me if I lived my life under a microscope and you could pull a couple mishaps or soundbytes from my life.
I'll just say that young guys are brash in general. I know I was and I still am to some degree. I think perception on that varies from person to person. What some see as cocky others see as arrogant. Much like you, I had character concerns about Baker before the draft. I also pointed out the same things you did before he was drafted as those concerns. I mean not having enough sense to understand that a flag won't plant in turf was concerning. lmao
What I came to realize is that his incident with the cops was very early on. He had been removed from that incident for some time. And even at that it wasn't some violent incident. There was nothing severely egregious in his background. Would I prefer someone with a little more poise and grace in some situations? Yes I would. In todays society it seems bombastic behavior and over the top reactions are more rewarded than poise and class.
But it is what it is. I still see nothing that would warrant me having a problem liking Baker as a person or the Browns QB. I don't really know him as a person and I don't see it as being fair or an accurate gauge for me to draw conclusions of what type of person he is based on the snap shots of his life we see in the media. When looking at the most negative events in his life without looking at his charity work and the positive things he's done, it skews the view heavily in one direction. I can't use that alone as a gauge to evaluate an individual.
So yeah, I wish he would keep his mouth shut. I think he's confusing maturity with "being who he is". But as I said earlier, young people mature at different rates at different ages. I look back at some of the things I said and did when I was younger and cringe sometimes. lol
Of course nobody signed me to a multi million dollar contract to be the face of a corporation worth a billion plus dollars. But I digress.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
I have a hypothetical. Suppose it was a guy like OBJ, Dez Bryant, Cam Newton, Colin Kaepernick, or TO who had made similar comments like Baker's. Wonder what the reaction would be? Would we say anyone of those guys are just "being who he is? Would we applaud their competitive nature? Or would we call him a "distraction," a "troublemaker," a "selfish, me-type player," or a "locker room cancer?"
When players act the same way but are on other teams, our fans slam them. When it's one of our own, especially when they're playing well, they applaud it. It's the nature of the beast.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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