Do our coaches even study our opponent to exploit their weaknesses when preparing a game plan? Do they even know our own strengths?
<pictures of the same graphs we seen all year>
This is the main reason we need to oust Freddie. It's been the same story all year. We keep forcing "11" (and usually motion to an empty backfield in the process), and wonder why it doesn't work. Keep forcing that square peg!
The problem with this is our TEs aren't very good at blocking. We have success running with the group after we're behind because teams are content to let us run. When the guys the TEs are supposed to be blocking are dropping into prevent, running for 6 yards isn't that impressive.
Once we're behind, we need big plays. None of our TEs have shown to be big play threats. (RSJ possibly but his have mainly been blown coverages which are less likely against prevent) Our WRs on DBs might be a better matchup blockingwise than TEs on LBs, which says more about how bad the TEs are than how good the WRs are.
Except the same stats have been in close games where we were not behind by much .... and even in this game vs Arizona - the one set of stats are Q 1-3 .... your theory about our TE's not being good is somewhat valid and yes I agree we probably get some bump to stats in games we are behind ... but fact is we run better AND pass better our of big sets and when Baker is under center.
The more things change the more they stay the same.
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
What an interesting concept and question. I would like to know how the scripted stuff is assembled, because his calls seem weird and leave us behind the sticks, which I believe helps to account for some of the picks Baker has had. Not all. But what part, if any, has our OC been playing? If his scripting is successful and we go to double-toothpicks when FK starts calling them, we must address that. Is the differential that we see purely personnel, like pulling Chubb when we have a few yards to get?
Get FK out of the play calling. The shovel pass experiment is DOA. Need some offense!
"Every responsibility implies opportunity, and every opportunity implies responsibility." Otis Allen Glazebrook, 1880
What an interesting concept and question. I would like to know how the scripted stuff is assembled, because his calls seem weird and leave us behind the sticks, which I believe helps to account for some of the picks Baker has had. Not all. But what part, if any, has our OC been playing? If his scripting is successful and we go to double-toothpicks when FK starts calling them, we must address that. Is the differential that we see purely personnel, like pulling Chubb when we have a few yards to get?
Get FK out of the play calling. The shovel pass experiment is DOA. Need some offense!
I was listening to a stat last night on the radio, they stated that on opening possessions, we are like 6th in the league for offense. After that, wellllllll garbage.
So it seems the scripted plays and opening drives are working. Then get lose track of it.
I am under the belief that Monken scripts the first series of plays, and then Freddie gets away with it and calls the game himself.
I have given up on Kitchens. He deciding not to play Njoku was mind blowing. It was the same with them benching Randall for the Steelers game, one of the most important games of the year. Him not letting two of Baker's favorite targets to play, Njoku and Higgins, is bewildering. His attitude after games as if, oh well, there's next week, is tiresome.
I have never been one to want coaches fired, but this guy can't do the job, and I think the players are seeing it.
Just finished driving from Reno to Atlanta. Five days of driving. Damn my butt is tired.
Freddie?
I am far from a "fire the coach" guy. Normally I feel the head coaches that get hired and fired quick is a bad move. Wilks was one year guy. Normally not fair.
This last game against the Cards. Browns gave up 38 points. Hard to win a game giving up 38. This defense has been horrible against the run - again.
Wilks?
Offensively. We have Chubb, Odell, Landry, and Hunt. Not exactly slumming there. Then there is Baker.
Baker stills shows promise. However, for me the most disturbing aspect of his play is: In multiple games he has had the ball late with a chance to win the game. And on those occasions; he has failed.
He has made some great throws but overall he has been inconsistent and unimpressive.
Why?
Going into this season the coaches felt the defense would be the strength of the team. It has not been even when Myles played.
The offense has added Odell and subtracted Perriman and Callaway. They added Hunt. Still had Higgins and others. Lost Njoku at TE. Added guys who filled in.
Special teams got a new coach and overall has been a better unit than last year.
And here we are at 6-8. Why?
Hunt said some guys took plays off against the Cards. That is a bad indictment.
We lost games against poor teams Broncos, Cardinals, and Steelers. Had one signature win against the Ravens. Won a toss up game against the Bills. Won games against weak teams Jets, Bengals, Dolphins, Steelers.
With the talent and the schedule the only comment that can be accurately stated is the Browns have underachieved.
Average coaching and we win nine games.
So where does this leave the Browns? In my humbled opinion they have to evaluate the season and keep all options open.
Freddie right now should not be guaranteed the job. He does not deserve that. Wilks has been in charge of the defense. Freddie and Monken the offense. None of it has worked with the players the Browns have.
Tampa under Arians has scored 416 points the Browns 296. How is that possible? How does TB outscore the Browns by that amount? Any stat that one looks in too; all point to a team poorly coached.
I was behind Freddie. Thought he would do fine. Have some struggles but not what this team has gone through. Malcontent, uncontrolled players. Excessive penalties of the worst kind. Questionable game plans, poor in game adjustments, questionable play calling.
I have tried to look for something done right and see nothing.
Dorsey can not let his ego get in the way here. He has cut bait with players he selected like Corbett. He has to look closely and coldly when evaluating this season under Freddie.
Once the scripted plays are exhausted and you have to call based on game flow/feel Kitchens inexperience shows.
Which flies in the face of what we saw from him last season when he was like a virtuoso conducting an orchestra. There's more to the story, there has to be... but we aren't gonna get it.
Maybe, or Kitchens was getting help last year from others that we don't know about.
Last year, we don't know what help kitchens was getting or who had input.
This year, from what we have been told by Kitchens, hes the man calling the plays and the game plan with input from Monken. Sounds like a duck to me.
So, you think Kitchens was getting that significant level of help, yet somehow Dorsey didn't know about it or utterly failed to account for that??
Decent theory, but it doesn't hold water.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
Once the scripted plays are exhausted and you have to call based on game flow/feel Kitchens inexperience shows.
Which flies in the face of what we saw from him last season when he was like a virtuoso conducting an orchestra. There's more to the story, there has to be... but we aren't gonna get it.
Maybe, or Kitchens was getting help last year from others that we don't know about.
Last year, we don't know what help kitchens was getting or who had input.
This year, from what we have been told by Kitchens, hes the man calling the plays and the game plan with input from Monken. Sounds like a duck to me.
So, you think Kitchens was getting that significant level of help, yet somehow Dorsey didn't know about it or utterly failed to account for that??
Decent theory, but it doesn't hold water.
It may hold a little. I think it was assumed by many of us Haley probably assumed he was going to cash in on Hues failure. Even if that wasn’t true, his contributions put him on Dorseys radar such that he was fed up with him too. In the aftermath of that I don’t see it unreasonable to think everyone else would be in “keep your head down mode”.
"Hey, I'm a reasonable guy. But I've just experienced some very unreasonable things." -Jack Burton
-It looks like the Harvard Boys know what they are doing after all.
Dorsey may have just misread the whole situation. Scouting for players isn't the same as selecting a head coach, and this was Dorsey's first head coaching hire.
From where I see it, Kitchens probably wouldn't have made one of the 3 best head coaches in the organization last year.
1. Gregg Williams 2. Todd Haley 3. Al Saunders 4. Kitchens (?) ... 99. You know who
Once the scripted plays are exhausted and you have to call based on game flow/feel Kitchens inexperience shows.
Which flies in the face of what we saw from him last season when he was like a virtuoso conducting an orchestra. There's more to the story, there has to be... but we aren't gonna get it.
Maybe, or Kitchens was getting help last year from others that we don't know about.
Last year, we don't know what help kitchens was getting or who had input.
This year, from what we have been told by Kitchens, hes the man calling the plays and the game plan with input from Monken. Sounds like a duck to me.
So, you think Kitchens was getting that significant level of help, yet somehow Dorsey didn't know about it or utterly failed to account for that??
Decent theory, but it doesn't hold water.
It may hold a little. I think it was assumed by many of us Haley probably assumed he was going to cash in on Hues failure. Even if that wasn’t true, his contributions put him on Dorseys radar such that he was fed up with him too. In the aftermath of that I don’t see it unreasonable to think everyone else would be in “keep your head down mode”.
I wasn't in the building so I don't know what happened, but I always thought Haley didn't get a fair shot here. The team was young, it was a new offense, and he had a freaking 0-16 head coach who would meddle and then talk about how "he's sitting in this chair now". It's just hard to predict how people will react in such a situation. It's like when Sashi "flubbed" the McCarron deal. Damned if you do, damned if you don't. Some people will toe the line and some people will do what's best for the organization, but in situations like that you don't have the chance to do both.
Also, it's a lot easier to tweak systems that are already in place, especially when others are doing the heavy lifting in terms of team structure, discipline, etc. Being the head guy is a lot different. At the very least, he probably should have hired a guy with significant head coaching experience himself.
If Dorsey is THAT out of touch with what is happening inside his building and what is going on with his coaching staff, then HE *MUST* be fired.
That said, I find it difficult to believe or accept that Dorsey wouldn't know if Kitchens was getting help to that degree.... especially during a game while Freddie was calling plays. It simply doesn't make sense. Dorsey is no-nonsense, experienced, and a former player.... he KNOWS what it takes to do a job and I dont see him getting smoke screened like that.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
I think you're right about that, but I'm also trying not to focus on specific details like that. I'm sure he knows what's going on in the building. There was a report earlier in the year where one of the Browns players was talking about how Dorsey would come walk through the weight room every day and how he would chat and was directly involved with the team. Those are good things.
I still think that he didn't accurately project how Freddie would do as the head guy. That seems pretty fair to say..
If Dorsey is THAT out of touch with what is happening inside his building and what is going on with his coaching staff, then HE *MUST* be fired.
That said, I find it difficult to believe or accept that Dorsey wouldn't know if Kitchens was getting help to that degree.... especially during a game while Freddie was calling plays. It simply doesn't make sense. Dorsey is no-nonsense, experienced, and a former player.... he KNOWS what it takes to do a job and I dont see him getting smoke screened like that.
I agree 100%. Dorsey have have seen something in Kitchens that wasn't there as far as being head coach ..... but I doubt that he didn't know what was going on when Freddie was OC.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
If Dorsey is THAT out of touch with what is happening inside his building and what is going on with his coaching staff, then HE *MUST* be fired.
That said, I find it difficult to believe or accept that Dorsey wouldn't know if Kitchens was getting help to that degree.... especially during a game while Freddie was calling plays. It simply doesn't make sense. Dorsey is no-nonsense, experienced, and a former player.... he KNOWS what it takes to do a job and I dont see him getting smoke screened like that.
Best case scenario that I can put forth is that Dorsey took a chance on Freddie viewing him as being part of a new,younger, innovative wave of coaches while at the same time grossly underestimating the importance of need for discipline and structure.
"Hey, I'm a reasonable guy. But I've just experienced some very unreasonable things." -Jack Burton
-It looks like the Harvard Boys know what they are doing after all.
man.....ugh. then at the end talking about murray vs mayfield. ouch.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
Rex is a wiener but he's right here. Funny, they were shilling for Rex though. Big Texas sized pass on him please. I certainly hope guys are lining up for this gig. I'd be bold and start calling Haslam personally.
Just gallons of gasoline being poured on this thing.
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
Rex is a wiener but he's right here. Funny, they were shilling for Rex though. Big Texas sized pass on him please. I certainly hope guys are lining up for this gig. I'd be bold and start calling Haslam personally.
Just gallons of gasoline being poured on this thing.
Don't worry about people not wanting the job. There are plenty of people who want the job. No need to even think otherwise.
I am excited about where it goes from here. I was one of those who wanted to hire Williams, but when we went with Freddie, it was...OK, and have supported him.
Last weeks game was the final nail. We need to make the change, and we will start that process the Monday after the final game. Actually, the process have begun. I am sure Dorsey and Depo are forming lists now.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn.
That's part of the problem. Dorsey AND Depo are forming lists. It won't be about getting the best coach. It will be a pissing match between the two and they will make it more about beating the other guy.
This starts with the Haslams and the rotten organization they run.
Nothing will ever change with them running the team.
Dorsey is probably one of the better talent evaluators I've seen here. But he is absolutely awful at building a team. He has failed miserably and blew a lot of the trades and draft picks. He has no plan.
Lucky for us he brought us a franchise quarterback, and a great running back. Haslam has to rectify this. Again.
you know, device, season is done but I have often wondered how different we would have been with perryman, peppers and the 17th pick. Our offense last year seemed to flow smoothly and efficiently. This year it just seems clogged up or something.
Full disclosure I was excited as heck when it happened because I thought it would put us in the top tier of afc teams. Like so many others I was wrong!
That's part of the problem. Dorsey AND Depo are forming lists. It won't be about getting the best coach. It will be a pissing match between the two and they will make it more about beating the other guy.
This starts with the Haslams and the rotten organization they run.
Nothing will ever change with them running the team.
The team needs a Team President to keep that in check. With Dorsey having absolute say, noone can do anything despite the majority rule. Perfect example is the coaching hire..Depo and everyone else had Stefanski as the guy and Dorsey went with FK. Need a tie breaker other than Haslam
Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It's perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands. It hopes we've learned something from yesterday. -John Wayne
Dorsey is probably one of the better talent evaluators I've seen here. But he is absolutely awful at building a team. He has failed miserably and blew a lot of the trades and draft picks. He has no plan.
Lucky for us he brought us a franchise quarterback, and a great running back. Haslam has to rectify this. Again.
OK, I've sat on the sidelines and read some of this BS without commenting...but this comment above attempts to paint a picture the author has no clue about.
device...do you really believe that Freddie was Dorsey's top pick for HC of the Browns?
Freddie was given a chance with the hopes he would become the HC some envisioned. That does not mean Freddie was the only choice the Browns were considering.
Honestly, Freddie could still prove to be the type of HC the Browns need to reach the ultimate goal, a Super Bowl victory. Based on the way the season has gone, the odds are "against Freddie", but those decisions are made by those in charge and not by a group of emotional Browns fans.
My take on the selection of Freddie as the Browns HC...the guy the Browns really wanted was not available when Freddie was named HC on Jan 12, 2019.
Freddie was the next best choice available to the Browns management & ownership at that time, Jan 12, 2019. Freddie may have been the "safest" choice with the hope he could become the Browns HC that ownership and management were looking for.
What happens after the end of this season will determine Dorsey's future with the Browns. Dorsey's ability to judge football talent has been good but his ability to judge coaching talent can be questioned....
...but, remember this, it may not have Dorsey alone who was responsible for hiring Freddie.
If the Browns ownership is looking for a "scapegoat", Dorsey is setup to be ownership's fall guy.
JMHO, but I believe the plan that the Browns ownership and management settled on in Jan 2019 was flexible enough to become a two year plan, with an option to get a second bite at the apple after the 2019 season.
Ryan had some interesting comments.. about Freddie and our Defensive coaching.
Typical Bozo stuff..
Kitchens...first off they are miss leading on that comment. I took the comment to mean he was focused on the NOW not the Future.
Baker and Murray what a bunch of bozo's: they are basing that all on one game. Which btw this was his best game he played By far...and very average game played by Baker.
I would hate for us to fire Kitchens...we need some stability here. Everyone especially those Bozo's totally over evaluated the Browns cause they are basing it on Fantasy points not football.
The one thing that confuses me is where is Higgins who was a big reason for Baker's success last year. I get it that he was injured but he's been back for quite a while. Why is he not in there my goodness Hoge a practice player is getting more reps than him.
Cutting Calloway hurt although He was facing a 10 game suspension due to his drug thingy.
Losing Garrett hurt so so much The D is so different without him.
Not having Njoku has also really hurt Baker. Too much was expected just cause we added OBJ...because of his injury he has been a very average WR who has DROPPED more passes then caught it seems.
jmho
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off! Go Browns! CHRIST HAS RISEN! GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
![[Linked Image from i.ibb.co]](https://i.ibb.co/fkjZc8B/Bull-Dawg-Sig-smaller.jpg)
![[Linked Image from i.ibb.co]](https://i.ibb.co/6WV79RV/Browns-Coach-Sig.png)
![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
