DawgTalkers.net Forums The Archives 2020 NFL Season 2020 NFL Draft Triston Wirfs/Mekhi Becton

My problem is that most had him penciled in at either RT or G until the combine. His game film didn't create that impression. I'm more of a guy who goes by a players performance in game time situations than projections from the combine and the label "athletic freak".

Of the two RT's that some project transferring to LT, more people saw Wills making that move than Wirfs based on game tape. I'll go with that.

I have found that taking the word of one expert among many only suits to skew one's view in one extreme direction.

I’d be good with Wirfs or Thomas

Watch, Wills and Becton will be left at 10

And that's fine. But how many NCAA coaches do you see who don't strongly endorse their players before the draft? I've watched year in and year out, top NCAA coaches, some of them former NFL HC's who have talked up everything from their QB, to their DL. From their LB's to their RB's. From their CB's to their OL players.

Now I can't say whether that's because they are emotionally invested in those players, whether they want to boost their own ego, whether they are far better coaches than evaluators, whether they misjudge how the player will translate at the next level or if they just want to give the kids they coach the best opportunity for the future. I have no idea.

But I see this every year and pretty much exclude their HC or position coach when evaluating a player. It's definitely a skewed view from a bias source which by and large turns out to be wrong.

Except Ferentz is his coach. Not someone who is scouting him. He was his coach. He has a stake in all this.



I've got nothing against Wirfs. I'd be happy to draft him at 10. He's the third guy on my board behind Wills and Thomas. That hasn't changed.

I'm just saying, Wirfs has things he has to work on. Especially in pass blocking. But i don't see why he can't do it.



He'll be drafted to be a tackle. If he can't be a tackle, he'll be a guard (and a great one). But he'll be drafted to be a tackle, and whatever team takes him will do their damnest to make him one before making him a guard. He won't be drafted with "guard" in mind. I just don't see that happening.

Any of those three at 10 sounds great to me. After that, we better get on the phone with Jason Peters or something. Start going into plan B and looking at someone else.

And I just wanted to add. I'm not trying to knock your process. Each of us have their own and whatever works for you is fine.

But I would have to ask you this. If you had a kid who work his ass off for you, who did a great job for you, wouldn't you do your best to promote him and reward him for all of his hard work and dedication?

All I'm trying to do here is explain why we see this differently. I didn't want you to get the impression that I'm trying to take you to task or argue with you about it.

Scouting NFL draft's best tackles: Finding best fits for Giants, Jets

JORDAN RAANAN AND RICH CIMINI
7:22 AM ET14 Minute Read
First-round OL prospect displays his strength by pushing a truck
First-round OL prospect displays his strength by pushing a truckFormer Louisville offensive tackle Mekhi Becton pushes a truck in preparation of the 2020 NFL draft.
If there ever were a good time to find the right fit at offensive tackle at the top of the NFL draft, this is the year.


Four highly rated tackles -- Louisville's Mekhi Becton, Georgia's Andrew Thomas, Alabama's Jedrick Wills Jr. and Iowa's Tristan Wirfs -- are expected to be selected within the first 15 picks on April 23. The surprising part is that the order in which they will be picked varies depending on the team and individual.

ESPN talked with 11 evaluators (scouts, executives, coaches and analysts) and tabulated their rankings for the top four, with each first-place vote worth four points, a second-place vote worth three points and so on.

As the chart shows, Becton was our top-ranked tackle, edging Wills for first in total points with 32 and in first-place votes (5-4). The voting highlights how widely opinions vary when assessing the tackles at the top of this draft class.

For the teams at the top of the draft, beginning with the New York Giants at No. 4, there are options.

"What do you need the most out of that pick if it's going to be a tackle?" SEC Network analyst and former Auburn offensive lineman Cole Cubelic explained. "You tell me that and then you can answer that question of [how do you rank the tackles]."

The Giants aren't the Cleveland Browns, who have the No. 10 pick and need a left tackle ASAP. They aren't the Arizona Cardinals, who are at No. 8 and looking to fill a hole on the right side.

The Giants are in position to draft a tackle, start him on the right side or as a swing tackle, and then contemplate a move to the left side when Nate Solder (who turned 32 over the weekend) is gone. That leaves everybody on the table if the Giants don't trade down.

The New York Jets also have options. They are leaning toward offensive tackle with their first-round pick (No. 11 overall) even though they added four linemen in free agency.

It has been a long time since the Jets used a high pick on a lineman -- 2006, when they drafted D'Brickashaw Ferguson and Nick Mangold in the first round. Since 2007, they have made 21 picks in the top 50 overall, and not one was an offensive lineman. Every other team has taken at least two linemen in the top 50 over that span, according to Elias Sports Bureau research.

That could change with this year's options.

1. Mekhi Becton, Louisville

Mekhi Becton's 2020 NFL draft profile
Mekhi Becton's 2020 NFL draft profile
Check out highlights of former Louisville offensive lineman Mekhi Becton, who'll be someone to look out for in the upcoming draft.

What he would bring: Becton is a mountain of a man with capabilities above and beyond the other top tackles. The LeBron James of offensive tackles is how one evaluator described Becton physically. His ability to reach-block and drive defenders to the sideline is special. He can move, play with power and finish. He's the ultimate upside prospect after one standout season. After a mediocre 2018, Becton worked himself into shape and played like a top-10 pick under a new coach in 2019. If he keeps trending in this direction, someone might be getting a Hall of Fame-type player.

Giants fit: Becton could start at right tackle and eventually shift to become quarterback Daniel Jones' personal, long-term blindside protector. Becton played on both sides at Louisville. General manager Dave Gettleman has already said you could make the argument the No. 4 pick should have "gold jacket" potential. In that case, if the Giants don't trade back, Becton is the best option. He's the tackle who could produce greatness given his physical gifts. But Becton also comes with the most risk, which diminishes the chances he will be the Giants' pick.

Jets fit: The Jets would be nuts if they pass on Becton, who should be the No. 1 tackle on general manager Joe Douglas' draft board. What separates Becton from the rest is he can play left and right tackle, and his ceiling is higher than any of the other tackles in the draft. If they want to keep him at left tackle, where he played his final two seasons at Louisville, they could move recently signed George Fant to right tackle. Despite his size, Becton has the athletic ability to play in an outside zone scheme. He also can get to the perimeter on wide-receiver screens, a staple in coach Adam Gase's offense.

They said what?!

"Nobody can do what he does. They really can't. Where I had him a year [ago] was fourth or fifth round -- maybe take a chance on the guy. ... Now he does things on tape that nobody else can do. Physically they can't do." -- NFL scout

"He's an outlier because he brings that old-school size like Orlando Pace, Jonathan Ogden, Lincoln Kennedy with the new-school athletic skills of your 305 and 310 guy (his weight). And he's doing it at [6-foot-7], 360. We've never seen that before. There is nobody who really does that. Not even Trent Brown, who is almost 6-10, 400 pounds, moves like that." -- Duke Manyweather, Becton's trainer and an offensive line scouting and development consultant

"He's a human excavator. Has uncoachable traits, like his length, being 6-7, being 360 and being able to move the way he does. He has more flaws than Wirfs, Thomas or Wills, but he's raw." -- Cubelic

"It's ridiculous how good he can be. You don't have many people on this planet that are that big, that strong and that fast. ... We don't love his character. Just some lazy stuff, nothing major." -- NFL scout

"Trying to get around him is like orbiting the sun ... I believe he's going to get better. I don't believe he has reached his ceiling." -- Brian Baldinger, ex-NFL lineman and NFL Network analyst


The entire article is on page 8 of the top 4 oline thread.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nf...ort/5159705002/

Report: Former Louisville football star Mekhi Becton had drug test flagged at NFL Combine

Thank you for posting that. I think if you take that article as a whole, it's kinda hard to just state he is "lazy." The worst quote was something about Just some lazy stuff. Nothing major. However, there were a lot of glowing reports, too.

For the record, in the beginning I had no idea how to rank them. I started studying them and Thomas was my top guy. However, they all have flaws and I am not so sure if they are as great as folks are making them out to be.

Right now, I really have no idea which guy will do well, be okay, or fail.

I think Thomas has the least bust-rate, but he has some issues w/footwork in pass pro. He might end up being just average.

The others have some really good attributes, but some big question marks. They all probably have a higher ceiling and a lower floor than Thomas.

Thus, I really don't know who we should pick if all four are available. I don't think all four will be, obviously. However, I'm just trying to point out that it's hard to say at this point in time.

My biggest concern with Becton is his weight. 368 is too much, I don't care how tall you are. Most guys don't slim down from their age 21 weight either. He might weigh 398lbs 5 years from now.

Vers, I think you hit the nail on the head. Thomas seems to be the safe pick. I think all these guys are gonna be good. I believe the offense system fit is where the we and other teams will have certain players in mind.

To you and tab: P-Dawg re-posted the article that mentions the "lazy" comment. It's about 7 posts up form your last post, bone.

I think the article should be read in entirety.

As an organization, he doesn't work for the Browns yet. They owe him nothing. Fair or unfair doesn't matter.

If there's rumors of one guy being lazy, even if you can't really verify it, it's still information to keep in mind.

I mean, two years ago, didn't Alonzo develop a feeling about Josh Rosen just on the basis of how his girlfriend (or ex-girlfriend) talked about him at the airport?


And guess what, so far, it's good that we steered clear of Rosen (my top guy in that draft)

I was the poster (or a poster) that mentioned his potential laziness based on that article (reposted earlier on this page). Not only was there the quote from the unnamed scout at the end, but also the little tidbit about him working himself into shape for 2019 season after a mediocre 2018. That sounds, to me, like a guy that was meh, and then got his act together for his contract year for the big payday. The wording in the article was that he had a mediocre 2018, then worked himself into shape and had a good 2019. That jumped out to me more than the quote from the scout.

In one of the threads there were tweets by Joe Tomas about Becton. I respect Joe's evaluations but don't always agree with the interpretation.

One of the observations Joe made was that Becton gets tired. This didn't seem to bother Joe but it bothers me. Is it because he is lazy and doesn't train hard enough? Is it because of his size?

Whatever the reason o-linemen shouldn't be getting tired. To me, this is the red flag

Film should ALWAYS be the 80%.

The Combine, private workouts, interviews, pro days, etc... are all just to confirm whether what you saw on film will translate to the next level and to make comparisons against the other guys in the class that might look as good on film.

If it isn't on film before you draft them, it isn't going to magically show up there after you draft them no matter how much they crush a workout.

I want to say I wasn't defending Becton. I just wanted to see the quote in context.

I'm at the point where I'm done evaluating or debating which OT is the best or worst. It's just too hard to tell given the unknowns of making the jump from college to the NFL for offensive linemen and I really don't have the desire to go crazy researching these guys. I just hope the Browns get it right, because they really do need a LT.

And don't think I was criticizing you. I replied to your post because I thought it was the most relevant to what I was going to say.

That's an awfully big man to play every down on O. Not saying it can't be done. If you're looking at 360# plus, there are very few players that big, if any, in the entire NFL. As an interior OL you move less. At LT you're on an island and have to move around more than any other OL position. At RT you at least get some help from a TE sometimes to lessen your movement.

Huge guys on D are in a rotation. They may play a lot of snaps but they get plays off. So I'm not sure I would blame the fact he gets tired on him being lazy. And maybe the fact he gets tired is where the lazy comment comes from.

But expecting a guy his size to play every down on O for 16 games a season is something I would certainly consider. And as has been mentioned, it's highly unlikely he loses weight as he ages. More likely than not he'll gain.

I didn't think you were criticizing me.

Btw---I hope you are staying safe in that tough environment. I've been praying for you, even though I'm not a religious guy.

I don't think many people would consider me religious but I appreciate the prayers.

FWIW, Dan Shonka from Ourlads was on 92.3 today, and he said Tristan Wirfs will be a Pro Bowl guard in the NFL.

G or RT is where most had him projected before the combine. Then suddenly, that all went out the window. You know how the combine overrides game film evaluation and all.

I'm reading smoke about this bunch planning to trade down to get Cleveland.

Ridiculous if they do.

Take the top tackle at 10!

How simple can it be???

What if the top 4 are all taken by #10. Not out of the realm of possibility.

NYG - check
LAC - check
CAR - check
ARZ - check
JAC - check

That would certainly increase the odds of Simmons falling into our laps and I am all for that. However, I could see 4 OTs go before us and Simmons as well. Looking at DTs, then i suppose, orrrrrr a trade back.

Chargers need a QB
Arizona is going for a WR
NYG who knows
JAX Who Knows
Carolina would not pass on Simmons

If we want Simmons we will need to trade up to #7 ... JMHO

Miami can take a tackle too if they don’t take Tua.

It truly is that simple.

Looking at draft sites, projections, etc., there are 4 OTs that show up as top 10 talent. Not all projections have all 4. But who says our front office sees all 4 as worthy of a top 10 pick? Or even 3? Maybe it is only 2 and those 2 could be gone by the time we are on the clock.

Just because Becton has a lot of fans on this board does not mean our FO thinks highly of him. Maybe the fact that Wirfs played RT in college, and was projected as a G in the NFL until recently, means our front office does not want to invest a top 10 pick on him and hope he can be a LT.

A team below us that is really jonesing for an OT could jump us to make sure they get one.

As Hammer says, it is possible that all 4 of them go in the top 9. LT is a premium position, and if these guys are seen as all that, you just never know. You just can't write off that possibility, not until pick #10 is on the clock.

CLE who knows