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Preacher and teacher. I don't really care what traitors have to say.


Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.

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Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
There are two sides to that coin. I see you would rather ignore the other side of it.


Read this very slowly. We were talking about why people vote republican, not why they weren't.

What's difficult to ignore is the side you take, which is posting something, anything, to satisfy your incessant need to get the last word in on every post in this forum and feel like you've won something.


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Sadly, that's really all your side has when they wish to ignore something. This is a thread about "General Election News". Your argument is that only your side of the discussion is on the table.

When you can't attack the message, attack the messenger.

I just don't care. I've never seen such a disgraceful human being as president. Nothing even close. So I will speak out against it openly and often. Refusing to openly discuss anything but your side isn't doing you any favors.

So those of you who want to use the LWR moniker, you go right ahead. It will not change anything and only emulates the person you are supporting for president. Making a feeble attempt to act like a fourth grader in the school yard. And that's actually an insult to fourth graders.


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All anyone has to do is look at your reply to my post to see how irrelevant it was. Jester made a post about why people vote republican, I responded to that. You responded to me with Trump bashing, and I don't even like the guy and I'm not voting for him.


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Trump bashing?

Quote:
Yet Trump has not shown himself to be a conservative nor has his life displayed conservative values. IMO this is why many actual conservatives who promote conservative values are speaking out against Trump and are voting Biden.

I've never seen conservatives nor Republicans in the numbers I've seen this year speak out and promote voting Democratic in the presidential election like this before. I believe there are many who recognize just how much Trump actually hurts the conservative brand.


Hmmm..

Those are things that are factual and are happening. It's odd how you see facts as bashing. As I said, it's odd how you label things in a negative light that do not go along with the things you want to see or address.

Yes, why people do or don't vote for certain things is certainly relative to the thread. And yet you still refuse to address it.


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You win.


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Originally Posted By: jfanent
Originally Posted By: Jester
I think one of the things that confuses a lot of people on the "if you vote for trump you are a racist" front is that not all people who vote for trump are racist etc, but "all" racists vote for trump - I put "all" in quotes because I am sure it isn't actually every single one.

Since so many racist vote for trump the lines get blurred and people start feeling that if you vote for trump you must be racist.

My feeling is that for the majority of people who are Republican it is bacause they are passionate about a single issue but that issue varies for the individual. I see those reasons as:

1, Abortion - there are some people so anti-abortion that they will vote Republican no matter what.

2, 2nd Amendment people - There is a real fear that Dems will "take away your guns"

3, CEO's - The Republican Party give big companies such an benefit in corporate tax breaks but more so with deregulation, particularly reduction in environmental protections.

4, Racism - If you don't like blacks or latinos you vote republican.

5, Family tradition - My dad was Republican, his dad was Republican so I am Republican, I have always voted Republican so I am going to keep doing so. It feels like a lot of farmer's fall into this category.

6, The economy does better with a Republican President. While there is a lot of evidence that this is not true, many people believe this and vote Republican for this reason.

Now I am sure this is not a completely inclusive list for why people vote Republican but to me, it seems as if most Republicans get so passionate about 1 or 2 of these that they become devout in there allegiance to the Republican party. JMO

Note that this does not apply people who vote Republican some time and Democrat at other times.




Though you did not put it in your list, this post is precisely why people will vote republican. Every item in your list indicates a fault in one's thinking, as if there's no rational purpose to vote republican. Do you realize how insulting this is? You're more apt to provoke a rebellious response/action than to persuade someone to consider the other side. At least you actually considered why someone might vote that way other than saying they're ignorant, racist or sexist.

To simplify to the extreme, people are voting republican because of strong conservative beliefs (and rightly or wrongly) are fearful of a liberal government. You didn't mention that at all.



How does my list indicate a "fault in one's thinking" except for the racist point?
There is nothing wrong with being against abortion.
Being so passionate about something is a good thing.

As for "people are voting republican because of strong conservative beliefs"
Is not being Pro-life a strong conservative belief?
Is not being Pro-2nd Amendment not a strong conservative belief?

How is that insulting?

As for fear of a liberal government, sure, add that to the the list.
I did say and I quote "I am sure this is not a completely inclusive list for why people vote Republican"
I mean I did this as a 5 minute message board post not a dissertation for my Ph.D




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Quote:
I mean I did this as a 5 minute message board post not a dissertation for my Ph.D


I'll keep it brief then. I see a negative slant to every item on your list, as if that line of thought was faulty. I think what I'm trying to say is that there are legit reasons why people would vote Republican, and the other side doesn't acknowledge them. To satisfy LWL, I'm sure it goes the other way also. But this thread is talking about a blue wave, and what drew my interest here were all of the Trump signs 88 and I saw on our drives. I'm not at all gung ho with politics as I once was, and I pretty much stay out of discussions here.


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Take the racist reason out which is clearly a negative. Then the only only other negative is the comment about CEO's and that is not a negative in whole, just the added comment about environmental regulations.

All the others are perfectly reasonable reasons to vote Republican. In fact, I have voted Republican many times in my life because of the abortion issue.

I don't have a problem with Republican ideas in general. I have a problem with trump. I think that he is a racist, misogynist, and all around vile person. He is using his office for his personal benefit rather than the benefit of the people. Anything he does that benefits the people is because it either puts money in his pocket or he thinks it will help him get elected.

I think that trump is trying to weaponize the courts and the justice department and is trying to disrupt our electoral process to create an authoritarian regime than he runs.

I am very middle of the road and actually I have tended to lean Republican. I have never had any issue with Republicans until trump was elected. My issues with the current Republicans is the way they cow down in fear of trump. They hated him pre-election now they bow down and kiss his butt. Have a spine. You are supposed to be the leaders of this country.

The impeachment process was the last straw for me. Should trump have been impeached? Arguable. Should he have been removed from office for what he was impeached for doing? Unclear. And that is my issue with Republicans. Had they done there jobs and held a true impeachment trial rather than the farce they trotted out there then I would at least have some respect left for them regardless of how they ultimately voted on the impeachment. But they failed to do their jobs and I find that abhorrent. Did the Dems do their job? Yes. Did they do it well? Absolutely not. I don't think the Dems could have done a worse job in the impeachment process if they tried.


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Originally Posted By: Jester
I think that trump is trying to weaponize the courts and the justice department and is trying to disrupt our electoral process to create an authoritarian regime than he runs.


Can you expand on this? What would it take for this to happen? And how can Trump make it happen and what is he doing to make it happen?

Quote:
Had they done there jobs and held a true impeachment trial rather than the farce they trotted out there then I would at least have some respect left for them regardless of how they ultimately voted on the impeachment. But they failed to do their jobs and I find that abhorrent.


What does this part mean? How did the Republicans fail to do their jobs? I watched about 50% of the impeachment hearings. The Dems were embarrassing to say the least. Unprepared, unprofessional, and appeared to have no credibility at all. Schiff was actually the most impressive, and I don't think that was a good thing. I thought he was going to cry a couple of times he hates Trump so much. I thought just the opposite of the Republicans. They appeared to have their crap together.

My questions are sincere. Can you expand on the points I made above?


LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
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On my phone so forgive if the answers are a little short. I can expand on them tomorrow.

1, weaponizing the courts. Trump and McConnell are fast tracking judges into lifetime positions. Many of these have been considered poorly qualified if not downright unqualified by many legal societies. These judges will owe trump.

2, weaponizing the justice department. I don't have time to list everything but if you cannot see the ws barr and trump conspire then you arent paying attention.

3, repubes not doing there job in the impeachment. How does the senate have a trial without witnesses? Look at what lindsey graham said about that when clinton was impeached. And then to assist trump blocking release of evidence in the form of emails and paperwork? To me that makes them co-conspiritors. The reason I said it was unclear whether he should be removed from office is that e don't kkow the whole story. Heck not even half because of the blocking of evidence.

They should have questioned witness and reviewed the evidence then come to a conclusion. Instead they turned a blind eye.

And don't get me started on jim jordan during the house proceedings


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And don't get me started on gym jordan during the house proceedings



Fixed the only thing in your post that required help.

Everything else: plainly put, and spot on.


"too many notes, not enough music-"

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Originally Posted By: jfanent
and what drew my interest here were all of the Trump signs 88 and I saw on our drives. I'm not at all gung ho with politics as I once was, and I pretty much stay out of discussions here.


It probably doesn't mean much, but, in the last 2 weeks, I've been from here to Hudson Michigan.....66 north to 20-A west, to 127 north.

From here to Columbus also. 109 south to 65 in Ottawa, to about 10 miles of country road (Slabtown, then Bluelick), to 75 south to Lima. 117 out of Lima, to s.r. 33, to I 270, to 70, and also through Columbus on 670. And of course, back home obviously.

This weekend, drove down to Indian Lake, which is just off 117.

For the most part, yes, rural Ohio. Oddly enough, coming home today, I counted signs. Not the NUMBER of signs, as some people have 5+ on their property. But property wise, the trump signs outnumbered the biden signs a good 20-1.

Like I said - probably doesn't mean much.

I did see 958 boats in a trump parade on Indian Lake. What's that mean? Probably not much.

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Quote:
I think what I'm trying to say is that there are legit reasons why people would vote Republican,


I agree. Here are my opinions on legitimate reasons why some of us are going to vote Republican in the near future.

--Lower taxes vs higher taxes that Dems would force on us.

--Smaller national government rather than the European social-style democracy.

--Gun laws. I don't need to explain.

--Personal freedom, such as school choices over heavy-handed government issued mandates in our schools.

--The economy is generally stronger when Republicans are in office.

--Things like wealth distribution and reparations for blacks are a big turn-off for most hard-working Americans.

--Dems want to dictate the equality of outcomes when it comes to racial groups. Giving people something for doing nothing while taxing those that educate themselves and work hard is a turnoff for many.

--Republicans are pro-life.

--Republicans believe in a market-based economy. When large and small businesses are thriving, the people are, too.

--Work ethic over handouts.

--Obeying the law instead of breaking the law.

--High morals over decadent behavior.

--Folks are against making DC and Puerto Rico states, which would certainly ruin the balance of power that we currently have.

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Quote:
I did see 958 boats in a trump parade on Indian Lake.


That didn't allow for very much water...
Indian Lake's not very big-


"too many notes, not enough music-"

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Originally Posted By: Clemdawg
Quote:
I did see 958 boats in a trump parade on Indian Lake.


That didn't allow for very much water...
Indian Lake's not very big-


958, 957, 956...there'll be lots of open water soon.


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Celebrating devastating acts. Awesome!

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Merely an observation on a 'law and order' crowd who took social distancing to heart...


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Responsible boaters check weather conditions.

Obviously many of these individuals cared more about supporting a fascist rather than respecting mother nature.

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More name-calling and labeling by the left.

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Feel free to refute my claims with factual proof that Trump doesn't engage in fascist behavior.

I'll be waiting.

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Originally Posted By: Clemdawg
Quote:
I did see 958 boats in a trump parade on Indian Lake.


That didn't allow for very much water...
Indian Lake's not very big-


Not sure I'm following you here.

INdian Lake is the second largest inland lake in Ohio, at some 5104 acres. That's pretty much 8 square miles. It IS a shallow lake, no doubt. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_Lake_(Ohio)

Maybe I just don't understand what you're saying, but as far as lakes in Ohio, it's the 2nd largest.





Regardless, it was cool to watch 958 boats participate.


A couple of weeks ago I/we were at Devil's lake in Michigan. 1,330 acres of lake. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Devils_Lake_(Michigan)#Lenawee_County

And each morning, a group of stand up sea doo/ski doo/ whatever else the stand up things are called, would ride around the lake. No politics, just 25-35 people on their stand ups (no sit downs allowed) that was also cool to see.

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Originally Posted By: RocketOptimist
Responsible boaters check weather conditions.

Obviously many of these individuals cared more about supporting a fascist rather than respecting mother nature.


What, exactly, do you know about boating, and waves, and weather, and wakes, etc.

Probably everything, right?

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He probably played a video game that involved boats.

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Alaska Native Elders would come talk to the students on a weekly basis about being smart when going boating to hunt.

Nice try. You and Vers swung and missed once again. Try and aim for the strike zone next time.

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....or Battleship.


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He saw a lake once.

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I think this is the thread that mentions signs. I brought this up before when jfan talked about Trump signs, but I'll talk about it again w/more details.

I had my surgery in early August in Savannah, GA. My wife and son went w/me. My daughter couldn't get away from her business. My son paid for a rental house on the intercoastal waterway for us to stay after I got out of the hospital so I wouldn't have to be in the car traveling back to Columbia, SC.

He drove separately from my wife and I and brought his dog and our two dogs w/him. Our dogs are used to being in a fenced yard. This yard was not fenced. We kept them tethered and they didn't like it because they were not used to it. Well, the first night there, my wife went to bed before my son and I. He wheeled me out to an outdoor pavilion by the water and asked if we should let the dogs out. I said yes. That was a mistake. They caught a scent and took off. It was all my fault.

We woke my wife and we used a combination of vehicles and on foot searching tactics. While we were searching, we noticed the abundant number of Trump signs in yards. These are large, expensive homes on the waterway. My wife was on foot and calling for our dogs [who always come immediately when called] when she met a woman at the end of the street. The lady put out a message on the local neighborhood Facebook page about our dogs and pleaded for folks to help.

Dawgs, the response was immediate and huge. These people came together. Golf carts, four-wheelers, and even boats were used to help search for the dogs from outsiders. These Trump supporters were perhaps the most caring and compassionate folks I have met ever. Over 12 hours later, we got a call from a guy who lived 2.2 miles away and was on the other side of the waterway that he spotted dogs that matched the descriptions of our dogs on his dock. They were barking at his dog...LOL.

We drove there and were reunited w/our dogs. It was one of the happiest moments of our lives. I tried to give them money, but they refused.

We were driving back to the rental when we saw one couple about to launch their boat. We recognized them from riding around in their golf cart and searching for our pups. We let them know what was happening and we talked a bit. Delightful people.

I wrote 3 families cards after we returned home. I thanked them for their help while telling them how impressed we all were w/the community. Yeah, they had Trump signs in their yards, but these are damn fine people. They help one another and even outsiders like us.

Afterwards, one of the ladies went on Facebook and talked to my wife about how many other people were involved in the search for our pups. She spoke of how they stick together and invited us to her house if we wanted to return.

These are good people. They aren't rioting. They are not looting. They are not protesting. They are not blocking traffic. They are not beating people up. They are not asking for handouts. They are good citizens and I despise labels like Fascists, Nazis, and Racists when talking about Trump supporters such as those fine folks in Georgia.

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Originally Posted By: RocketOptimist
Alaska Native Elders would come talk to the students on a weekly basis about being smart when going boating to hunt.

Nice try. You and Vers swung and missed once again. Try and aim for the strike zone next time.


I'm not talking about alaskan natives. I'm talking about wea...........know what, you aren't worth it.

I've been on Lake Michigan in 6+ foot swells, no problem. A lot of fun, really. I've been on Lake Michigan when she was angry............not fun at all.

I've been on Lake Erie where, when I started out, I was trucking along at 30 mph...........and just that quick, I was down to about 5 mph, because Lake Erie can get nasty, quick.

I was in a 23 ft. power boat, bow rider.

Do you know what a wake is? Do you know what waves do to pontoon boats? Do you? Or do you need the Alaskan native elders to tell you and your students, on a weekly basis, .................uh, go back to your books, and then come tell us how smart you are again.

Dude, you didn't even get up to bat before you struck out.



Why do alaskan native students have to be reminded weekly about how to safely boat? Do they hunt on pontoons?

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I am not a huge boater. Not even close to being an expert. However, I can back up some of what you say because we used to boat on Lake Erie a lot and we always knew that it was dangerous because the wakes were so much closer together than other bodies of water.

You best have your blank together when boating there.

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Originally Posted By: Versatile Dog
I think this is the thread that mentions signs. I brought this up before when jfan talked about Trump signs, but I'll talk about it again w/more details.

I had my surgery in early August in Savannah, GA. My wife and son went w/me. My daughter couldn't get away from her business. My son paid for a rental house on the intercoastal waterway for us to stay after I got out of the hospital so I wouldn't have to be in the car traveling back to Columbia, SC.

He drove separately from my wife and I and brought his dog and our two dogs w/him. Our dogs are used to being in a fenced yard. This yard was not fenced. We kept them tethered and they didn't like it because they were not used to it. Well, the first night there, my wife went to bed before my son and I. He wheeled me out to an outdoor pavilion by the water and asked if we should let the dogs out. I said yes. That was a mistake. They caught a scent and took off. It was all my fault.

We woke my wife and we used a combination of vehicles and on foot searching tactics. While we were searching, we noticed the abundant number of Trump signs in yards. These are large, expensive homes on the waterway. My wife was on foot and calling for our dogs [who always come immediately when called] when she met a woman at the end of the street. The lady put out a message on the local neighborhood Facebook page about our dogs and pleaded for folks to help.

Dawgs, the response was immediate and huge. These people came together. Golf carts, four-wheelers, and even boats were used to help search for the dogs from outsiders. These Trump supporters were perhaps the most caring and compassionate folks I have met ever. Over 12 hours later, we got a call from a guy who lived 2.2 miles away and was on the other side of the waterway that he spotted dogs that matched the descriptions of our dogs on his dock. They were barking at his dog...LOL.

We drove there and were reunited w/our dogs. It was one of the happiest moments of our lives. I tried to give them money, but they refused.

We were driving back to the rental when we saw one couple about to launch their boat. We recognized them from riding around in their golf cart and searching for our pups. We let them know what was happening and we talked a bit. Delightful people.

I wrote 3 families cards after we returned home. I thanked them for their help while telling them how impressed we all were w/the community. Yeah, they had Trump signs in their yards, but these are damn fine people. They help one another and even outsiders like us.

Afterwards, one of the ladies went on Facebook and talked to my wife about how many other people were involved in the search for our pups. She spoke of how they stick together and invited us to her house if we wanted to return.

These are good people. They aren't rioting. They are not looting. They are not protesting. They are not blocking traffic. They are not beating people up. They are not asking for handouts. They are good citizens and I despise labels like Fascists, Nazis, and Racists when talking about Trump supporters such as those fine folks in Georgia.


Anecdotally a couple of my uncles are generally really nice guys too. Warm. Friendly. Helpful. Neighborly. trump voters.
They’re also bigots.
Garbage traits like that tend to hide under the surface. Hidden away from general public interactions. But like cancer, it’s inside. Rotting them.
Just saying.


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So, you're saying I'm a bigot? And a racist? Because I voted for trump?

If so, it speaks a lot more about you, than me.

I thought you fancied yourself about being from the party of openness, and acceptance. I was wrong. YOu're not open or accepting to anyone that votes different than you.

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Originally Posted By: archbolddawg
So, you're saying I'm a bigot? And a racist? Because I voted for trump?

If so, it speaks a lot more about you, than me.

I thought you fancied yourself about being from the party of openness, and acceptance. I was wrong. YOu're not open or accepting to anyone that votes different than you.


Intolerance to someone with a different opinion is the literal definition 0f a bigot. So irony that Portland is calling someone a bigot.

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Originally Posted By: archbolddawg
So, you're saying I'm a bigot? And a racist? Because I voted for trump?

If so, it speaks a lot more about you, than me.

I thought you fancied yourself about being from the party of openness, and acceptance. I was wrong. YOu're not open or accepting to anyone that votes different than you.


No. I’m not saying that. It was in response to Vers saying he met some people in his recent travels. trump voters. All nice and pleasant and such. Merely reminding him that bigotry hides under the surface of otherwise ‘nice’ people.

As to bigotry. No. I’ll never accept that in my circle. I love my uncles for the blood that runs through them but the racist/bigot part of them disgusts me.

Last edited by PortlandDawg; 09/07/20 10:37 PM.

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Originally Posted By: EveDawg
Originally Posted By: archbolddawg
So, you're saying I'm a bigot? And a racist? Because I voted for trump?

If so, it speaks a lot more about you, than me.

I thought you fancied yourself about being from the party of openness, and acceptance. I was wrong. YOu're not open or accepting to anyone that votes different than you.


Intolerance to someone with a different opinion is the literal definition 0f a bigot. So irony that Portland is calling someone a bigot.


Intolerance of my racist uncles is being on the right side of humanity. It’s not bigotry.


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You'll never accept that. Cool. So, point blank, you consider me a bigot?

Many of the liberal posters call me a racist because I voted for trump over hillary. And that is the bottom line for them.........I voted for trump over hillary, so I'm a racist, sexist.............I won't go any further. Serves no damn purpose.

But, do YOU consider me a bigot:? Or a racist?




If so, you ....well, I'll just say you don't know me.

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We’re are you getting that from?
I’ve never even referred to you in this thread until you misconstrued my post to Vers.


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Originally Posted By: PortlandDawg
Originally Posted By: EveDawg
Originally Posted By: archbolddawg
So, you're saying I'm a bigot? And a racist? Because I voted for trump?

If so, it speaks a lot more about you, than me.

I thought you fancied yourself about being from the party of openness, and acceptance. I was wrong. YOu're not open or accepting to anyone that votes different than you.


Intolerance to someone with a different opinion is the literal definition 0f a bigot. So irony that Portland is calling someone a bigot.


Intolerance of my racist uncles is being on the right side of humanity. It’s not bigotry.


It is bigotry. Textbook definition.

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I don’t think you’re a bigot. Or racist.
I think you openly vote for one though.
Does that change how I view you? Yes. Do I think you’re a bad guy? No.


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So you won't answer my point blank question to you.

Thanks.

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