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So I remember Eve telling us QAnon was nothing.
Care to rescind that comment, Eve? No, it's a 12 year old boy bogeyman in the heads of liberals.
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I also think these companies are acting as monopolies and this won't help any current/future lawsuits against them.
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Lou Dobbs @ LouDobbsTonight Looks like Parler has a pretty strong antitrust, anti-competitive case against Google, Apple and Amazon. Tech oligarchs ban Parler in what appears to be close coordination with Twitter and Facebook in their ban of the President.
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Why does apple get to decide what is free speech and what is not? Why does apple get to decide?
Seems like apple doesn't like people being able to speak their mind? Gotta shut down opposing opinions?
I don't know. Think of Google and Apple as privately-owned Christian Bakeries... and Parler is the gay-themed wedding cake they've just been asked to bake. The key here is: privately owned. This isn't a 1A issue, arch. 1A specifically forbids the gov't from suppressing the free expression of its citizens. This is not that situation. In fact, it's the very reason bakeries can turn away business that they don't want to take money for. The courts upheld it in the case of bakeries, and they'd rule the same way in this instance- for the very same set of reasons. "My bakery, my cakes." "My platform, my terms of use." Direct correlation. In some ways, we get fooled into thinking of services like Google and apple as public utilities, because they appear to operate that way: always on, always there... like lights or water service- but they aren't. If the consumer breaches/violates the terms of service, the provider reserves the right to suspend the consumer's use of the product/service. Another parallel: getting suspended from Dawgtalkers for breaking the 'rules of the pound.' In a nutshell, that's why they can, and it's also why they did. All these platforms are making what they believe to be sound business decisions. Maybe they are sound decisions, maybe they aren't. That remains to be seen. But to be sure- they have entire teams of folks who weigh risk/reward questions like this, and advise admin what to do based on the continued maximization of profit. They each deemed that continued support of clientele like this was potentially damaging to the bottom line, and set their policy accordingly. It's not a coincidence that FB, Instagram and Twitter have frozen even the POTUS' accounts. They have made the same calculus- and decided that they don't want their brand to be associated with what happened this week or the speech that flows from these clients.
"too many notes, not enough music-"
#GMStong
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Right. These are private companies and can do whatever they want, unless you're for big government controlling private business.
On a side note, its amazing how easily and openly this attack on the Capitol was organized on these platforms.
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I’m biased, but I don’t know how to argue against your analogy. It’s obviously a bigger scale than the gay hating bakery, but it’s logically the same.
Wise words spoken by sages
From SkyTel to BlackBerry pagers
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I’m biased, but I don’t know how to argue against your analogy. It’s obviously a bigger scale than the gay hating bakery, but it’s logically the same. True the bakery issue was a crime against humanity by a homophobic bakery owner. . And this is about protecting our constitution from a lying racist tyrant pos potus.
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." Thomas Jefferson.
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I'm more concerned with how the political left has become a creepy crazy cult, which demands everyone join or else. Nobody wants you to join. You can't seem to see that we don't care what you believe as long as you aren't hurting the country or others. You can chase unicorns all you want, just take the fascists with you and keep them away from us.
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I’m biased, but I don’t know how to argue against your analogy. It’s obviously a bigger scale than the gay hating bakery, but it’s logically the same. The analogy is perfect and exact. That is why you are having a hard time arguing against it. Whether FB, Twitter and other tech / social media giants need to be more accountable and transparent and regulated? Interesting ... Elizabeth Warren (for 1) has been saying that for years. It means government interference and regulations - something many say they don't want - ever - until it negatively affects them.
The more things change the more they stay the same.
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I'm more concerned with how the political left has become a creepy crazy cult, which demands everyone join or else. So to be clear -- you spam the board over and over with crazy, proven lies and falsehoods.... the same lies and falsehoods that Trump used to incite a group of radical idiots to occupy the capitol building, running around saying it's a Revolution, waving Confederate Flags etc .... Despite the courts, the Republicans and the Vice President all saying that the premise is faulty, there is no evidence and they are lies. And it's everyone else that's the creepy cult? Others have said it - stay safe and get some help.
The more things change the more they stay the same.
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Last edited by OldColdDawg; 01/10/21 10:22 AM.
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Well DUH. Pence is part of the Deep State. He didn't do what King Trump commanded, dude was supposed to fall on his sword. At this point hanging is too good for Pence in Trump's eyes. . . . many a true word spoken in jest right?
The more things change the more they stay the same.
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The fact is, the right to free speech does not include private businesses. Much like the baker and baking a cake, they can decide who to business with and who not to. When joining any social media site, you agree to terms of service. If they feel you have broken those terms of service, they have every right to ban you from their platform.
Now you may disagree with this, but the words that Trump and his closest allies, just like the ones at his January 6th rally before the invasion and takeover of the Capital building, are seen as inciting a riot. They are seen as a direct cause to insurrection and an attempted coup to overthrow our election results.
As such, helping allow him to further that message would be aiding and abetting in his further advocating of criminal activity. And all one really has to do is read the constitution and what it says about freedom of speech to see that it does not include your right to post on social media.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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So I remember Eve telling us QAnon was nothing.
Care to rescind that comment, Eve? No, it's a 12 year old boy bogeyman in the heads of liberals. GA man faces federal charges after threatening to shoot Pelosi on live TV ATLANTA — A Georgia man is one of at least 16 people facing federal charges in connection with Wednesday’s attack on the Capitol, according to the Atlanta Journal-Constitution. Cleveland Grover Meredith, originally of Hiawassee, has been charged with threatening House Speaker Nancy Pelosi in text messages he sent after the attack. Federal charging documents show that he texted he was thinking about “putting a bullet in (Pelosi’s) noggin on live TV.” Meredith also faces weapons charges after he texted a friend he was headed to Washington with armor-piercing ammo. According to a report filed by federal agents, Meredith intended on attending the planned Trump protest on Jan. 6 but had car trouble on the way. Meredith headed to Washington anyway, where FBI agents found him at a hotel room on Jan. 7. Meredith told agents he had two firearms in his vehicle. Agents found a Glock 19, nine millimeter pistol, an assault rifle and hundreds of rounds of ammunition in a trailer attached to his truck. Meredith did not registration to have any firearms in Washington. Meredith showed agents the string of text messages in which he made the threats. At one point, a family member told Meredith he was worried about him. Meredith said he was “just having fun” and that he had “been on the radar for awhile and they now (sic) I am harmless.” “I predict that within 12 days, many in our country will die,” he wrote in one text. Meredith also admitted to agents he participated in a protest outside Georgia governor Brian Kemp’s home. Meredith was charged with transmitting a threat in interstate commerce, possession of an unregistered firearm and unlawful possession of ammunition, according to court records. On his LinkedIn profile, Meredith is listed as the co-owner of Car-Nutz Car Wash LLC in Smyrna. In 2018, Meredith erected a billboard on Cobb Parkway in Acworth advertising the QAnon conspiracy theory, according to the AJC. QAnon subscribers believe that there is a secret cabal of pedophiles within the government and Hollywood elites and that President Donald Trump is fighting a holy war against them.
Meredith told The AJC at the time that he had put up the QAnon billboard because he was “a patriot among the millions who love this country.”https://www.wsbtv.com/news/politics/geor...LMDCLT3LNGE5BI/This guy is one of many who appear to be much older than 12.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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So I remember Eve telling us QAnon was nothing.
Care to rescind that comment, Eve? No, it's a 12 year old boy bogeyman in the heads of liberals. GA man faces federal charges after threatening to shoot Pelosi on live TV ATLANTA — A Georgia man is one of at least 16 people facing federal charges in connection with Wednesday’s attack on the Capitol, according to the Atlanta Journal-Constitution. Cleveland Grover Meredith, originally of Hiawassee, has been charged with threatening House Speaker Nancy Pelosi in text messages he sent after the attack. Federal charging documents show that he texted he was thinking about “putting a bullet in (Pelosi’s) noggin on live TV.” Meredith also faces weapons charges after he texted a friend he was headed to Washington with armor-piercing ammo. According to a report filed by federal agents, Meredith intended on attending the planned Trump protest on Jan. 6 but had car trouble on the way. Meredith headed to Washington anyway, where FBI agents found him at a hotel room on Jan. 7. Meredith told agents he had two firearms in his vehicle. Agents found a Glock 19, nine millimeter pistol, an assault rifle and hundreds of rounds of ammunition in a trailer attached to his truck. Meredith did not registration to have any firearms in Washington. Meredith showed agents the string of text messages in which he made the threats. At one point, a family member told Meredith he was worried about him. Meredith said he was “just having fun” and that he had “been on the radar for awhile and they now (sic) I am harmless.” “I predict that within 12 days, many in our country will die,” he wrote in one text. Meredith also admitted to agents he participated in a protest outside Georgia governor Brian Kemp’s home. Meredith was charged with transmitting a threat in interstate commerce, possession of an unregistered firearm and unlawful possession of ammunition, according to court records. On his LinkedIn profile, Meredith is listed as the co-owner of Car-Nutz Car Wash LLC in Smyrna. In 2018, Meredith erected a billboard on Cobb Parkway in Acworth advertising the QAnon conspiracy theory, according to the AJC. QAnon subscribers believe that there is a secret cabal of pedophiles within the government and Hollywood elites and that President Donald Trump is fighting a holy war against them.
Meredith told The AJC at the time that he had put up the QAnon billboard because he was “a patriot among the millions who love this country.”https://www.wsbtv.com/news/politics/geor...LMDCLT3LNGE5BI/This guy is one of many who appear to be much older than 12. A lot of people believe in aliens, too.
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Only aliens aren't real. What you are in is denial.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Any person who willfully incites or urges another to engage in a riot, and such inciting or urging is a contributing cause of a riot in which there is property damage in excess of fifteen hundred dollars ($1,500) or serious bodily injury, shall be punished as a Class F felon.
Legal definition.
Once out of office trump should be arrested and charged.
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I get it. I really do.
But what I don't get is why, in the case of the bakery, some people demanded they go against their PRIVATE business rights, and demanded that they should've baked the cake.
Yet now we are being told by those same people, private business can do what the hell they want.
See, I don't get that. And I'm not trying to be rude. I just don't get it.
And we're talking about a bakery of, what, 3? 10 employees? Go get your cake somewhere else, maybe a block over. Yet SOME demanded that this particular bakery go against their desire.
What we're talking about now is the internet moguls banning some, and not others. And that's fine with some.
So, demand that some small bakery do something it doesn't want to, and that's fine, but demand that the 2 or 3 companies that hold sway over pretty much all internet communication do something they don't like, is not allowable?
If private businesses can do as they see fit, why are so many shut down?
I get it. I really do. The only problem I see is this: Politics. If a business doesn't do what the mainstream wants, they get persecuted. If another business does what they want by silencing dissenting opinions, those that disliked a private business doing what it sees fit, defend a business doing as IT sees fit, as long as it goes along with the views of a certain side.
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Both cases have nothing to do with your views being discriminated against, but it has everything to do with "right and wrong" and being able to discern the difference. Almost nobody dislikes Trumpians more than me, but I don't hate the people themselves, I hate what they stand for, do, and say. Again, it's a matter of right and wrong, morality, and decency. I would never tell somebody to starve you, or beat you, or deny you basic human needs... As a matter of fact I would fight for you if they tried to deny you that. I would also fight for you if your freedom of speech were actually being stripped away. But not allowing a group that regularly post lies, ferments hate, and threatens violence to use a digital platform is not that. You are here posting as a user, and if you posted almost anything found on those forums in detail, you would probably catch a ban. Even with Refs that are just like you in their views. Hate speech is hate speech, and Trump is getting you all called out for it. You take care to try and not abuse that here, why would you expect other platforms to put up with it when it could cost them in the long run? The Parler CEO made his bed, now he can lay in it.
Last edited by OldColdDawg; 01/10/21 05:25 PM.
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Well, that's all well and good I guess. Glad you would fight for me to be able to eat.
But my question was why was it okay for 1 side to argue/fight against the baker saying he/they don't have the right to not serve a customer based on that customers beliefs, BUT, it's okay for other businesses to discriminate based on beliefs.
I know, you don't have an answer to a question that simple.
It's politics. One side can't, yet another can. I find that odd.
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I think this was settled in 1965.
Unfortunately, we haven't yet added sexual orientation and gender identity to the 1965 Civil Rights act, yet.
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I think this was settled in 1965.
Unfortunately, we haven't yet added sexual orientation and gender identity to the 1965 Civil Rights act, yet. So, everything was settled in 1965, except sexual orientation. So, it's NOT okay for a bakery to deny someone a cake due to sex. orientation, but it IS okay for a private business to deny opposing points of view. Do I have that right? If opposing points of view are not valid for the baker, but they ARE okay for a different company to deny/shut off.........wait..........what? Oh, politics. One side can do what the hell they want, but a different side can't oppose something they don't agree with. Got it. I think.
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Well, that's all well and good I guess. Glad you would fight for me to be able to eat.
But my question was why was it okay for 1 side to argue/fight against the baker saying he/they don't have the right to not serve a customer based on that customers beliefs, BUT, it's okay for other businesses to discriminate based on beliefs.
I know, you don't have an answer to a question that simple.
It's politics. One side can't, yet another can. I find that odd. Probably for the same reason those on the right think it is fine for the baker to refuse service to a gay couple but not for social media to deny service to those they support. But I will tell you what the biggest difference is. Because despite your assertion, there certainly are differences. Actually a huge difference here. And that difference is from both sides. In the instance of the baker it was about what many felt was discrimination from both sides in a legal sense. Those on the left feel that the gay community deserves the same protection against discrimination as people have based on their color or their religion. Those on the right feel their religious freedom gives them the right to discriminate and withhold services based on their moral/religious beliefs. This was more about challenging the law and getting it settled in court. Nobody was storming the Capital building trying to violently overturn a law, our election results or threatening to kill members of the House, the senate or the vice president over it. I hope this helps clear up your question.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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What part of this are you having trouble with arch? Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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It actually does. Thank you.
Not sure where where the capital issue came into this though.
Baker CAN'T discriminate, but other private businesses can?
In case you aren't weren't aware, I despised what happened at the capital. My posts on that issue verify that.
Just don't ever say Grape Soda, nor drink it. It's apparently a racist thing.
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Not sure why I am going to waste my time because most people are going to defend their preconceived notions without considering alternative thoughts but I am going to share my thoughts on this.
Regarding the baker, I don't believe that they should have the right to refuse to bake a cake because of sexual orientation. That is flagrant discrimination. I do believe that they have the right to refuse to decorate the cake with 2 grooms on it. It is their right ot say "we don't offer that particular decoration. Here are the ones that we do offer. Alternatively, you can decorate it yourself once it is in your possession or you can choose another bakery that does decorate cakes in that manner.
I looked at his when is was actively happening and thought about the complete other end of the spectrum. What if this was a jewish bakery with the owner having a concentration camp serial number tattooed on their arm and instead of being gay, the couple trying to buy the cake were nazis and wanted the cake decorated with swastikas . The same answer would apply. They should not have the right to refuse to bake the cake but they should have the right to refuse to decorate it as requested.
Now for the "banning of alternate opinions". That is actually not what is happening. What is being banned is inappropriate language which has always been banned. Most sites including this one ban profanity because it is considered inappropriate. In this particular case, the inappropriate language that is being banned is that which incites violence. That is why trump has been banned. Parler is being removed from play stores because they fail to moderate their site in such a fashion that prevents posts that incite violence.
If alternate opinions were being banned then both Matt Gaetz and Jim Jordan would both be banned but they are not. And not matter how ridiculous I think those 2 guys are, I fully support their right to express whatever warped opinioms they want to express as long as they do so in a manner that falls within the rules of appropriateness.
Am I perfect? No
Am I trying to be a better person?
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Just don't ever say Grape Soda, nor drink it. It's apparently a racist thing.
Does that mean Radar O'Riley was a racist?
Am I perfect? No
Am I trying to be a better person?
Also no
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My point was that the reason these measures are being taken is that these social media sites do not want to contribute to the further lawless actions that happened at the Capital. Giving them a free platform and easy access to planning another such event would not be the proper thing to do. And that's what they would be doing.
There were no such circumstances involved in your attempted comparison of the baker and the gay couple. It was just another example of the stark contrast between the two events.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Not sure why I am going to waste my time because most people are going to defend their preconceived notions without considering alternative thoughts but I am going to share my thoughts on this.
Regarding the baker, I don't believe that they should have the right to refuse to bake a cake because of sexual orientation. That is flagrant discrimination. I do believe that they have the right to refuse to decorate the cake with 2 grooms on it. It is their right ot say "we don't offer that particular decoration. Here are the ones that we do offer. Alternatively, you can decorate it yourself once it is in your possession or you can choose another bakery that does decorate cakes in that manner.
I looked at his when is was actively happening and thought about the complete other end of the spectrum. What if this was a jewish bakery with the owner having a concentration camp serial number tattooed on their arm and instead of being gay, the couple trying to buy the cake were nazis and wanted the cake decorated with swastikas . The same answer would apply. They should not have the right to refuse to bake the cake but they should have the right to refuse to decorate it as requested.
Now for the "banning of alternate opinions". That is actually not what is happening. What is being banned is inappropriate language which has always been banned. Most sites including this one ban profanity because it is considered inappropriate. In this particular case, the inappropriate language that is being banned is that which incites violence. That is why trump has been banned. Parler is being removed from play stores because they fail to moderate their site in such a fashion that prevents posts that incite violence.
If alternate opinions were being banned then both Matt Gaetz and Jim Jordan would both be banned but they are not. And not matter how ridiculous I think those 2 guys are, I fully support their right to express whatever warped opinioms they want to express as long as they do so in a manner that falls within the rules of appropriateness. Thank you. This did not fall on deaf ears, at least here. Right with you, up until here: "Now for the "banning of alternate opinions". That is actually not what is happening. What is being banned is inappropriate language which has always been banned. Most sites including this one ban profanity because it is considered inappropriate. In this particular case, the inappropriate language that is being banned is that which incites violence. That is why trump has been banned. Parler is being removed from play stores because they fail to moderate their site in such a fashion that prevents posts that incite violence. If alternate opinions were being banned then both Matt Gaetz and Jim Jordan would both be banned but they are not. And not matter how ridiculous I think those 2 guys are, I fully support their right to express whatever warped opinioms they want to express as long as they do so in a manner that falls within the rules of appropriateness". I don't think it's about 'words', it's about concepts, thoughts, ideas.
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I don't think it's about 'words', it's about concepts, thoughts, ideas. It's about whether a business wishes to actively work in aid and abetting domestic terrorists groups into attempting yet another coup against The United states Government.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Websites/Apps/business decide what conduct is acceptable on their property. The end.
They could ban you for posting pictures of bunnies if they wanted to.
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Thanks for taking time to appreciate my thughts. I specifically said most people because I thought you would be one of the 2 or 3 who might actually read it and give consideration to it.
As for where we disagree, I can understand why you feel that way. I feel that it is a fine line that is being walked. My understanding in regards to Parler is that if they were to put in an algorithmic system to prevent posts that call for violence then they would be allowed back in the play stores.
Now if Parler were to to that and still not be allowed on platforms, then I would agree with you.
Am I perfect? No
Am I trying to be a better person?
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Websites/Apps/business decide what conduct is acceptable on their property. The end.
They could ban you for posting pictures of bunnies if they wanted to. I can hardly believe that I am going to say this but, good point Eve.
Am I perfect? No
Am I trying to be a better person?
Also no
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,858 |
Websites/Apps/business decide what conduct is acceptable on their property. The end.
They could ban you for posting pictures of bunnies if they wanted to. And that goes along with my thoughts on the bakery issue. Baking a cake is not deemed inappropriate by the bakery, they bake cakes every day. They way they wanted it decorated was, so they should not be forced to decorate in said manner.
Am I perfect? No
Am I trying to be a better person?
Also no
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 5,577
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 5,577 |
Websites/Apps/business decide what conduct is acceptable on their property. The end.
They could ban you for posting pictures of bunnies if they wanted to. That bottom line.
SaintDawg™
Football, baseball, basketball, wine, women, walleye
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 16,241
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 16,241 |
This latest death of the officer who committed suicide.
Something wrong there. If he was doing his job and survived why suicide?
Something will come out.
The Maryland governor's call for National Guard was delayed two hours.
Something is wrong in this whole deal. I can not believe that trained security professionals at this level could be this unprepared.
To many wrong things in this picture.
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Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 16,038
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 16,038 |
Just one example of our tax dollars at work. Sending our local police across country to riot in DC? Is this the deep state the lunatic right keep talking about?  https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/seattle-...ory?id=75148057
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." Thomas Jefferson.
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DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Palus Politicus Riots, Antifa, Mayhem, Destruction
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