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Clear understanding of what is going on.

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Are the videos not lining up with the text in that article? There are a bunch where the description makes no sense.


There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.

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Originally Posted by oobernoober
Are the videos not lining up with the text in that article? There are a bunch where the description makes no sense.

The description of the play is listed and the corresponding video is below the description.

For example:

(8:19) 6-B.Mayfield pass deep right intended for 80-J.Landry INTERCEPTED by 24-A.Oruwariye at CLV 45. 24-A.Oruwariye to CLV 35 for 10 yards

Result: Incomplete -- INACCURATE
xEPA: 2.2

EPA Result: -3.7
Yards Missed: 22

Simple run-action two-man route concept where Stefanski schemes Jarvis Landry open on the double-move nod route. The throw sails over Landry's head on what had the potential to be a big play in both completion and yards following an accurate throw.

The video of this play is available below that description.

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Those videos tell the story. Drops and inaccurate throws are killing us. The plays being called should be moving the ball.

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When I looked, the Detroit INT intended for Landry didn't have the right description under the video.

And (I want to give the author the benefit of the doubt here), but I saw more than one video of a ball bounce off a receivers hands, and the text above had it as an inaccurate throw.


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Originally Posted by oobernoober
I keep getting hung up on Keenum being brought in with Stefanski, and how much they paid him to come here. IMO, you don't go and get that guy and pay him so well to think you're stuck with a half-broken starter QB. Conclusion: Baker is healthy enough to play, and expectations of him are lower than if he was fully healthy, but higher than that of his backup (highest(?) paid backup in the league and one who had quite a bit of success on the same team as his HC). To me, that renders much (but not all) of the "but Baker is too banged up" irrelevant.
Fair point... but Stefanski has had a golden opportunity for multiple weeks to sit Baker for a game just for being ineffective and use the excuse that they are giving him a week to heal up... thus avoiding the media storm of Baker being pulled for poor play.... take that week and see how your very expensive back-up does who has had success with you in the past. If Keenum comes in and looks good, give him a second week.... We've seen Keenum 1 time against the Broncos who do not have a bad defense.. we scored 17 points and he didn't look spectacular but he certainly looked efficient...


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DC...I can't disagree with your logic...using Mayfields injury status to sit him. If Stefanski and are looking for Baker to give in to injury and pain...it doesn't look like Baker is gonna say, I CAN'T GO. Baker is not going to voluntarily decide to sit on the bench. The ball is in the Browns court to make that call based on their ability to judge Baker's physical status.




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After hearing from Berry today, I'm wondering if we aren't observing the early part of the never-ending Cleveland Browns narrative, given our pretty regular turnover in front office decision makers and then, the players who preceded them here ... He's not their guy.

I didn't think Andrew Berry exactly had Baker Mayfield's back today with his comments.

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Just a question.

What part of the interview gave you that impression?

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He basically said that that Baker's injuries aren't an excuse for his less-than-stellar play, and that he's healthy enough to play well and win. I think that is demonstrably debatable. He's playing with a completely torn left labrum, a fracture in left upper arm, a bruised knee, a bruised heel, and a pulled groin, and doctors who never played a down get to judge him as healthy enough to play. Healthy for what? IMO, this was a time for the organization to close ranks behind their guy, and instead they threw him under the bus. If I was Baker or his agent, I'd be angry.

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I didn't see / hear that interview. To me it sounds like more CMA (cover my ass) for the front office/coaching than any slight on Baker. I mean it could be taken either way - but the truth is anyone with a pair of eyes can see how beat up Baker is. I'm willing to bet half the QB's in the league wouldn't start witht he same injuries Baker has.... Opinion, but I'll stick to it.

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My boy Quincy should tune in, Gbush too. Ever since the Odell fiasco, well a few days after, they've set their sites on Baker and the O to pound on. Quincy keeps walking this line of “I'm not saying he's bad, but he's bad.”…

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Originally Posted by mgh888
I didn't see / hear that interview. To me it sounds like more CMA (cover my ass) for the front office/coaching than any slight on Baker. I mean it could be taken either way -

Brace yourself - I agree.

Just finished the presser. All things considered I thought it was pretty neutral, and I think it's very hard to tell what Berry is thinking. Hell, Teller was basically telling the fans at the beginning of the year this is his swan song season, and now he's signed to an extension.

Berry may think Baker is trash. He may think Baker is the answer. I felt like I could not tell either way from the presser. Those looking for unequivocal support of Baker as in "Baker is our guy moving forward", if Berry wouldn't do that before the season, why on earth would you expect him to do it now? Just doesn't make any sense.

People will take what they want from it based on what they want to hear, but again, I thought it was pretty neutral. We'll know in the off season what these guys really think. But I do think Berry made one thing perfectly clear. These last 5 games are huge for the players, Baker and everyone else.

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Originally Posted by DCDAWGFAN
... but Stefanski has had a golden opportunity for multiple weeks to sit Baker for a game just for being ineffective and use the excuse that they are giving him a week to heal up... thus avoiding the media storm of Baker being pulled for poor play.... take that week and see how your very expensive back-up does who has had success with you in the past. If Keenum comes in and looks good, give him a second week.... We've seen Keenum 1 time against the Broncos who do not have a bad defense.. we scored 17 points and he didn't look spectacular but he certainly looked efficient...

I believe the issue with this approach, most importantly, would be that Baker, Stefanski, the FO, the medical staff and lastly the locker room would know this was a ruse and Baker was benched due to poor play. That creates doubt and mistrust within the organization. Worrying about a media firestorm is the mistake every other regime would concern themselves with, not this one. They do not allow the media or fan fervor to dictate the moves they make, which is a positive.

Berry laid out the organization's three part approach on evaluating if player is capable of playing and playing at winning level. The Browns are going to give their full support to Baker until he is no longer in the future plans. A starting QB needs full organizational support, otherwise, cut-bait and move on.

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#Browns Andrew Berry said there are 3 things to determine if an injured player can play:

1. Medically cleared & won't hurt themselves further.
2. Medically cleared to allow them to play at a wining level.
3. Player shows in practice they can perform all requirements on game day.

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#Browns Andrew Berry: "Baker's our quarterback. He's healthy enough to win games for us...if he's ready to go he's going to be our starter."

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Not saying you are wrong. I didn't get the same impression.

I thought when he said:

“I think with Baker, especially from a long-term perspective, you really try and take a big picture approach. Really with any player, it is about body of work really over several years and also taking into context the environment or particular individual’s situation. We have seen Baker play a lot of good football here. "

Berry will take a big picture approach and that could leave the door open for any move.

He also said that you can't look at one player for the offensive problems.

IMO Berry was measured in what he said.

I don't think you can say one way or the other what he believes about an extension.

And that is precisely the impression he wanted to leave.

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If anything, I took it as Berry is no closer to making a long-term decision on Baker as he was at the beginning of the season. Didn't he specifically point out that they have him under contract next year and will continue to evaluate?


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Well worth watching this - whether you are a Baker fan or sceptic. 15 minutes of great breakdown.

The receivers being covered at around 7:26 is what I see "often". The double clutch which people blast Baker for (presumably he deserves criticism sometimes too) is explained - the miss to Chubb in the flat is explained.

Just me - I'll put more faith in a 15 minute film breakdown by Kurt Warner than virtually all of the talking heads and "fans".

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true that

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Your not going to win any Brownie points for posting that ..lol

Ski has taken the Baker out of Mayfield and Berry let him do it ...

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I love videos like this. I do think the tone would be a little different if he were to break down the 2nd half.


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I think people hang on to whoever speaks the narrative they wish to hear.


Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.

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Originally Posted by PitDAWG
I think people hang on to whoever speaks the narrative they wish to hear.


You asked for film breakdown ... it's here. So now you come with that snark?


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It's not the all 22 breakdown people were wishing to look at. Would you like for me to find talking heads with the opposite narrative of the film? Because they are certainly out there. People tend to promote the talking heads that agree with what they feel or believe. That's really not snark at all. It's factual. You can see it in every facet of life. This is no different. And as was mentioned, this was one half of the game.


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Not snark, that's fair - but more than a bit dismissive of a pretty well broken down piece of film by a highly qualified individual.


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That would tend to suggest that former QB's are all "highly qualified individuals" with which to break down film. I would love to see him break down the entire game. I'm betting it certainly wouldn't have looked as favorable. As I said, it was only one half of the game. While Mayfield still played poorly in this game it didn't have that "couldn't hit the broad side of a barn" look we got last week nearly as much or as often. Mayfield certainly isn't the only factor in our poor offensive performances over the past three weeks. I think we all pretty much agree on that. Another thing I think we can all agree on. This offense doesn't look any better without OBJ on the field. I'm using that as a reference to yet another excuse we used to see which no longer applies. And yes, while that is snark to a degree, it's also quite truthful.


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This was a close hard fought game against a quality team.

If you are going to win a game like this. You have to make the plays that are there.

The first drive drop by DPJ was critical. We got no points in a game we lost by six. We score a TD there. Different game.

Then the kicker misses.

Njoku drops a first down deep in Raven territory.

Baker has a big gain screen to Hunt. He drops the ball.

Felton drops a first down later in the second half.
=====================================================================

You can not do that in a game like that and win.

You only get so many opportunities.
====================================================================

Who cares about the narrative of talking heads? You want to be a playoff team. Make those plays.

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As I said, Baker wasn't the only problem. But make no mistake, the way he's playing is one of the problems.


Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.

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I think the main intention of Warner's video was to show that there's more that goes into a good/bad throw than the throw itself, and more specifically, to show where other things went wrong in that first half that resulted in 'bad throws'. It wasn't a 'Baker isn't the problem video'... it was a 'hold up, there's more going on here'. The Chubb miss is a good example. That's a route that Chubb nails all the time, but somehow found himself in the wrong spot and Baker went to where he was supposed to be. I don't think he shied away from blaming Mayfield when it was warranted, but he emphasized other areas (many not so obvious, which is what I appreciated) that contributed to 3 points despite 3 takeaways. It was an incomplete breakdown (but one that featured the all22), but it emphasized everything that went into 3 points despite 3 takeaways.

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It wasn't totally lacking in content. But as I also mentioned, I would like to see the entire game breakdown.


Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.

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I like Warner's break down. He is who I think Baker is most similar to at QB. A mesh of Warner, Brees, and Flutie, with the occasional sprinkle of Hoyer.

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bonefish, baker could have played the exact same game and it could have been viewed totally differently. Bakers line was 18/37 for 247 yards. If our receivers would have done their job baker would have been 23/37 for 300+ yards. We would have won the game and no one except the small group who will always criticize would be attacking him.

Now someone said drops should not be considered because everyone has drops. On a macro or global level that is true . But on a micro level, when you zero in on a game it
Affects outcomes greatly. I went back thru Sunday’s game watching the raven offense. If they had any drops I did not see them. What if lamar’s receivers dropped five passes and bakers dropped zero. Lamar’s stat line would have been 13/32 for about 125 yards. And the browns would be winners.

A successful passing attack depends on a lot of things and one of them is guys who are paid to catch the all actually catch the dang ball.

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If our receivers would have done their job baker would have been 23/37 for 300+ yards.

saywhat


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Without going back and checking, 5 drops is in the ballpark of what happened in that game (probably 1-2 high). Drops absolutely accounted for 50 yards (the big one to DPJ in the first half was like 50 yards on its own).

In the same vein, though... Baker fumbling as hilariously as he did directly cost us 3 points (possibly more since that screen play was gonna go for big yards).


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Anyone know who the Browns QB coach is?

IMO it would be money well-spent if the Browns approached someone like Curt Warner to be the Browns QB coach.




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Thanks for posting. That was a very good breakdown of the first half. I wish he would have spent the time to breakdown the second half as well. Please correct me if I'm wrong... Didn't he watch the whole game and said baker wasn't the problem?


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It was far more the fact that he seemed to expect perfection from our WR's than anything else. There are almost at least two or three drops in every NFL games where the ball is thrown almost 40 times. Expecting perfection from one position as an excuse to overlook mistakes from another position is well.....


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Not quite.


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From the way I see it. It is simple.

There are limited opportunities in a game. Sometimes a play is called and the defense is in the right place. The runner is stopped cold. The pass is incomplete or thrown away.

Other times the play call works. There is a play there that can be made. The quarterback has to see it. He has to make the throw accurately and the receiver has to catch it. Or, the blocking is there. The hole is open and the runner needs to see it and hit it.

In tight games you have to make those plays when they are there. It does not matter who blows it.

You make those plays and you win. You don't and you lose.

All this blame game crap doesn't cut it with me. Win the game. Everybody is happy. It all looks good. You want talk about how great the victory was.

Lose and you look to hang it on someone.

The plays are interconnected in many ways from game plan, play call, to proper execution.

The difference between winning and losing is narrow.

The Raven's game is a perfect example. Five drop passes, a quarterback fumble, a missed field goal. You go home a loser.

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Originally Posted by OldColdDawg
I like Warner's break down. He is who I think Baker is most similar to at QB. A mesh of Warner, Brees, and Flutie, with the occasional sprinkle of Hoyer.

Not bad,but you left out Otto Graham,Peyton Manning,and Ken Stabler.And let's blend in some Tom Brady while we're at it.


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