DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum ANALYTICS...had enough yet ?

analytics no team that had as many injuries as us went to the playoffs.
this was straight out of the nfl network.
sorry guys analytics is here to stay.

After looking at this team all season, your problem is... Depo?


He is so far down the list of (potential) issues right now.

And a mediocre team that turned into an 11-5 season last year was also using analytics when they accomplished that. Face it, the injuries and many factors went into what we saw this season. If you're going to blame analytics for what we saw this season then you're going to have to give analytics credit for what we did last season. Same people, same system, different results.

LMAO

Tougher schedule too but we were in every game except for Arizona and New England. We all know we lost a lot of close games so with some solid additions and hopefully a return to good health those games can be won.

Our QB was injured early in the season... Injuries to other key players, Covid and as mentioned, a tougher schedule.... I guess I don't see blaming Analytics!

I would blame injuries first and foremost, then I would blame lousy play calling, lack of WR consistency/play making ability, COVID, tougher schedule, bad refs, bad luck, bad special teams all before I would blame the analytics guys. What would the real difference be with the roster had we scrapped them going into 2021?

Oh no…...here we go. Please don’t start off 2022 this way.

This is an insane post.

Folks, I don't see where mac is placing full blame on analytics or dismissing other factors such as injuries, strength of schedule, and just poor coaching/play, he's just starting a conversation about the increased role analytics is playing.

I get that analytics is here to stay, as it should be... but as we have discussed before, analytics in a vacuum without football knowledge application, is useless.

I don't think any of us really know how analytics is being used or what decisions it is influencing and how it is influencing them.. we just don't know and we probably never will. Neither this organization, nor any other, is likely to come out and tell us how, exactly, they are using analytics.

Would seem to me that if we are following analytics, Chubb would be on the field almost all the time and (especially this year) he would have been the focal point of every game plan, we would run a ton of play-action when we throw, we would very rarely go empty backfield... because those are our most successful options, that's what analytics should tell us to do more of..... but we don't do any of those things...

Maybe it all stems back to Baker's injury because our success last year was stretch run, play action off the stretch run, then the roll out throws.. and maybe Mayfields injuries have prevented him from executing those play actions and designed roll outs because they have been all but non-existent, choosing to park Mayfield in the pocket against a defense that is stopping the run on it's way to rushing the QB.. it hasn't worked.

And if Mayfields strengths aren't available, then I would think analytics would say to get him off the field...

Wow mac, I never thought of you as a blame the science kind of guy. The analytics is not the problem, but maybe how the coaches use the facts/math is misunderstood or misapplied. Either way, it's not the analytics department.

It sure didn't read that way to me.

IIRC, mac was trying to lead some weird crusade vs DePo either last offseason or the one before. If I have this wrong, please correct me.

You are not wrong. This one is my favorite....

"Depodesta and his analytics department answer to no-one..they virtually work in secret and the amount of influence over the Browns football operation remains an unknown."

#SecretLairSanDiego

Well, here we are again. Looking for the elephant (read: scapegoat) in the room that will explain how everything went wrong.
That elephant is not analytics.

There may be problems with how we apply the information concerning the upcoming opponent.

There may be problems with how directly it affects game-day playcalling.

Those are human problems.

The idea that Depo pulls all the strings and we have puppets at every level playing slave to algorithms is ridiculous.

With that said, there are some real corrections on the horizon in how we, and other teams, apply analytics to the game. This frenzy to "go" on fourth down is one of them. We have years of data (that will continue to influence decisions) that is all predicated on opponents not expecting teams to go for it on fourth down. That is no longer true. Will the analytics change? You bet! But it will take a while for the numbers to bear witness... and take a while for those that are dead-set on following the numbers to quit being a slave to them.

Think about this: If you flip a coin and it comes up heads nine times in a row... what are the odds of heads the tenth time?? Analytics says 1/1024 chance. Is that true??
Absolutely not. It is always a 50/50 proposition. That coin can come up heads from now 'til the end of the universe. But who would bet tails? Nearly everybody... over and over... for as long as it keeps coming up heads. That's a simple example of analytics meeting human nature.

I think the simple "laws of the universe" have thwarted our best laid plans for much of the season. And that may be a tip of the cap to a place where we are "over-using" the numbers. We seem like a team that has adopted certain philosophies because the numbers are extreme. It's a commitment that says "no matter what, over time, this is the right decision", based on mathematical models. The problem is, the universe keeps saying "heads again!" It happens, usually at the worst possible time, but it is not the cause of the problem. There are too many layers to the actual problems to blame analytics.

The most surprising thing, to me, is that with all the numbers and the ever-growing team of humans that uses them to project and plot, our team looks tremendously predictable on both sides of the ball. Is it because we're arrogant in the face of adversity? Drunk on the analytics that dictates a certain outcome that simply hasn't come to pass? I'm not sure. But I'm not about to blame the humans creating the models and will continue to blame the humans consuming them.

Just my .02

If the choice is Analytics or Bullying, I choose bullying. It's football!

Analyze that!

I wonder how many of you "that claim" to know so much about the Browns use of analytics would care to provide a source for your opinions?

Let me hear it boys...

Tell us how much or, if any of Stefanski's offensive game plan(s) are being scrutinized and reviewed by the analytics department? Does anyone belivieve of you really believe that Stefanski is making his own decisions concerning his offensive game plan(s) or is Stefanski is being required to submit his game plan to the analytics department for review, before it is finalized ?

Last season with the COVID Crisis, I believe Browns fans witnessed an example of Stefanski's offensive talent when he accepted the position of OC and before the analytics department was doubled in size..after the Browns 2020 12-6 season/playoff record.

Then as all Browns fans witnessed...everything concerning the Browns offense "CHANGED".

The return of the Mac is out for analytics.

[social:tweet][/social]

Same.... I don't care about someone's 'football experience'.... I care if they can contribute to winning... anyone who doesn't think utilizing analytics which is a fancy word for stats and trends is fooling themselves...

Rumors are Dr. Evil’s Depo’s moneyball department, demanded the team change their breakfast from Wheaties to Cornflakes this year due to the data. I agree with you, they’ve gone too far even controlling their nutrition!

I feel 'analytics' has become a catch phrase. Every coach, and every GM, constantly analyzes. From 7th grade up to the pros. What does this person do well, what does that person do well - who can we use the best/most.

Nope.

LOL! So you throw out unsubstantiated claims one after another, and then when we don't believe you, it's on us to disprove said unsubstantiated claims? Lol, that's too hilarious.

YOU are making more claims about the Browns use of analytics than anyone else on Dawgtalkers.

We just have a workable catchphrase for it now.
And it's being worked to death.

Really??

You're the one making the claims. It seems you are the one that is claiming you know so much about the Browns inner workings of analytics. Where's your source?

He called DePodesta’s lawyer.

...CFRS...

Depodesta's lawyer...?...that would by YOU, right...the defender of everything Depodesta...he can do no wrong in your eyes because he knows analytics!

But, in the 2016 lead up to draft, Depo DID SCREW UP...BIG TIME... by refusing to even interview Dak Prescott just before the Senior Bowl game. DEPO was simply ASSUMING that "the guy" driving a white 2016 Cadillac Escalade in Starkville, Mississippi...HE MUST BE GUILTY OF SOMETHING and unworthy of consideration by the Cleveland Browns new leader of the ANALYTICS DEPARTMENT.

Depo might have made a common mistake made by some folks like Depos, that he knew Dak Prescott WAS GUILTY, before Prescott even faced his accusers in a court of law.

With the superior knowledge of the Browns analytics Chief, Paul DePodesta, the Browns assumed that Precott was guilty of something and unworthy to even be considered in the 2016 draft...Depo and his gang of Browns selected Cody Kessler as their pick to lead the Browns to the playoffs and a potential Super Bowl.

Just one example Depodesta's football knowledge and how much he is doing to make the Browns the most ANALYTICAL team in the NFL.

Source?

Mac you are barking up a weird and speculative alley. As for Dak? He went in the 4th round - using him as a pick to bash Depo? Then the same thing applies to every other FO in the NFL with the exception of the Cowboys. I don't think you are making the argument you think you are making with these claims that seem based 100% on opinion.

you have lost it my friend. Depo had nothing, zip, zero, zilch to do with who got picked in the drafts.

He did talk to Dak's lawyer.

Also, if you want to bring up 2016.....you started an 8 page thread about how the FO screwed up by not pursuing Jared Goff.

Correct, but he did plan the Capitol riots as well as releasing the Covid-19 virus on the world.