DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum DeShaun Watson II

Hold the horses my man. It’s a huge difference between being intelligent and making smart decisions. There is nothing so far that indicates that Berry is any smarter or more successful then the rest of the NFL GMs. Results don’t lie. Come back when the Browns is a top 4 team then we can talk.

Getting watson gets us alot close to that

Or they simply don't care. I mean if they don't have him figured in for the future plans, I can't see why they would care if they piss Baker off or not

Obviously IMO and FWIW, but this doesn't sound like AB and KS.

...They are building with patience and a long term plan? They're not committing a ton of money to outside free agents and are instead making calculated short term deals that don't have long-term ramifications to fill current needs. They want to draft and develop their guys. It just so happens that the team is good enough that they are unlikely to be able to draft a franchise caliber QB, and while Baker is the guy they have, he wasn't necessarily their choice or the best fit for what they envision.

Berry didn't bring in OBJ. Commitment takes two.

Adapting someone else's roster to fit your vision/plan for the team takes time. Players on the team may want the opportunity to go somewhere that they fit better. Trades can work out for both sides.

Holding onto someone that doesn't want to be here would likely cause more problems than trading them.

You can ease tension and uncertainties by communicating. What's said publicly isn't necessarily what's told to players behind closed doors.

Andrew Berry is the "sheriff." I don't see the gun swinging that you do. He's doing his job.

If a move can help the team, he should look into it.

Unfortunately, you can't just make players come to your team outside of the draft. However you can have conversations with players and possibly convince them that your team is a better situation for them than they had realized.

If true, this kind of stuff runs counter to their behaviors that have allowed them to achieve the success they have in their limited time here. Me no likey.

Excuses and excuses. I don’t have it. So far I see nothing on his CV that indicates future success. If the Browns win their division it’s a first step. Then I will be the first one give him tons of credit.

Well we just released JC Tretter, so...there goes trading him into the deal.

Reading all this back and forth about Watson is kind of worthless since the Browns are going to do what they are going to do. Doesn't matter at this stage anyone's personal opinion is of the guy - it's what the Browns think. That's the first part - the second part and I would be shocked if it doesn't come up in the interview - will the Browns be competing with a scheme that's QB friendly or does Watson have to adjust to a run first scheme that downplays his skill set. You might say that this has no bearing but it doesn't take much smarts to see that Stefanski took a gun slinger Heisman Trophy winner and turned him into a game manager that now they are unhappy with him. Stefanski chased away Diggs in Minnesota (documented) due to his scheme and IMHO he chased away OBJ. The team only has one bonafide top 50 WR on the roster and two TE's that couldn't get more than 40 receptions each. One of the TE's has averaged only 30 receptions per year for the last 5-years. If the Browns and Stefanski are committed to running the offense as they have the last 2-years then IMHO that will be the ultimate deal breaker between the two parties. Watson has a choice of where he will be going all things considered equal, he knows that 2-3 years down the road he will be in the market for either an huge extension or big pay day from some other team. Only a fool would come to a team that is not QB friendly in a league that places such a high commodity on that exact type of player.

If Carolina and New Orleans are the actual competitors, those teams have an automatic leg up on the Browns because those teams will expect Watson to pass often as they continue to build around him. At this point, Stefanski has not shown the willingness to do that in Minnesota or Cleveland. You have to ask yourself, of the so called run first teams - Cleveland, Tennessee, NY Giants, Baltimore, Minnesota, Philadelphia, SFO and Indpls, how many conference championship games have they been too in the last 2 years (2021 - 1 out of 4, 2020 - 0 out of 4)? How many Super Bowls have they been too when compared to the pass friendly teams (answer 0 out of 4)? The Browns can get to the playoffs with a Baker Mayfield. They obviously don't believe they can get to the Super Bowl with Mayfield. They still might not even with Watson but you can rest assured that they will not if Stefanski does to Watson what he did to Cousins in 2019 and Mayfield the last 2-years - making him into a game manager.

There’s the Watson team.

I hope that wasn't the offer - way too much

Finally more pure football.

I have to wonder if Stefanski will simply run tape and show all the missed opportunities baker had in the passing game.

Watson would fit stefanski’s system perfectly, especially since teams have to choose between stacking the box or playing zone.

I’m not sure Watson is a QB who cares about throwing more than handing off anyway. While he is most certainly an elite QB, we have to remember that he had to throw as much as he did or the Texans wasn’t gonna win many games.

With our run game and O line, plus big body TEs, Watson won’t get sacked nearly as many times as he did in Houston. Plus, having that dominate run game makes the execution of the passing game that much easier.

Remember, the one good year baker had, he threw 3800 yards in 2020 even with us being run dominate. Watson can get to 4K easy in Stefanski’s scheme.

Releasing Tretter always seemed to be a move that was going to happen due to age and being in his final year. Leaving Harris on the bench another year doesn't do any more for his development at this time. It was time to pass the torch and save the 8.325M in cap space.

One thing teams negotiating a trade for Watson need to keep on mind. The Texans essentially have to trade him because of his contract. There is no way they can keep him on the roater and not okay him with a $40 million dollar cap hip.

That's why I didn't want to trade for Watson, the asking price versus the talent difference between Waston and Mayfield is just way to much. I was hearing that Houston wanted 3-1sts, Mayfied, Hunt, Ward plus other picks and players on top of it.

My ideal scenario is for Watson to be traded to the Falcons.
They turn around and trade Matt Ryan to us.
We then trade Baker to the Seahawks or Eagles.
We draft our star qb of the future in next year's draft which looks like it is going to be extremely talented and deep at Qb.

My actual ideal ideal scenario is that we keep Baker and he surpasses Brady in number of super bowls won. But that is starting to look like it won't even get a chance going forward..

No matter how you slice it, Bakers time in.Cleveland as its QB is closing
No extension. And the real intrest in Watson. Just put the pieces
Together. In.this part of the NFL fanworld, Baker is regarded
As a franchise QB by some.
But in the eyes of Stefanski and Berry and Haslam
He is looked upon as a QB of a franchise. Huge difference
I think in a indirect way, the emergence of Joe Burrow and
The Bengals has caused the Browns to find a QB who can
Get the Browns to advance past the Bengals.
Berry didnt expect the Bengals to get it turned around this fast
The Steelers arent going to win the North with Trubisky
The Ravens are a playoff team with a healthy roster
So.Berry has to react to what the other North teams are doing

j/c...

Is perhaps Haslam forcing the issue??


It is what it is, but I don't like it.
We're already in a position where we're hard up against the Cap with still having glaring holes and now we're going to not address those holes and eat up the last of our Cap and give up God knows what else to make this move.
I know some folks are excited, but to me this has "Impending Disaster" written ALL OVER IT. If we go this route, we're two years out from blowing it all up again.

Lol.

Thank you! Now, if we can get Cleveland sportswriters to actually report something meaningful, that would be great. SMH

Jack Duffin
@JackDuffin
Replying to
@perrydawg57
You can get Watson down to $9.875m for 2022 so would be okay

https://twitter.com/JackDuffin/status/1503764920734826500

Between this and Milk's last post.... we really don't KNOW a whole lot of what's actually going on. I believe we have a good enough feel for AB and KS to be justified in not taking a lot of these reports at face value.

I said I wouldn’t post about Watson again but a lot has changed yesterday. This is what we know:

He met with the Panthers and Saints yesterday. He will meet with the Browns today. He said no to a meeting with the Seahawks. The Texans rejected the Colts request to meet with him. That’s it.

Schefter says the Falcons are interested. That is interesting because Watson is from Atlanta and it would mean Matt Ryan is available.

Yeah, according to our own DT'er poll, one third of people seem excited about it. If this actually happens it's obviously all a Halslam move.

Larger poll. I'm not sure if these polls really mean much.

In what world do you think it the people on DawgTalkers have any voice in team matters, ever?
Dude, your reading compression sucks. Go back and read what I wrote and what it was responding to.

I'm not registered on Twitter - what are the results of that poll?

Total votes so far: 3,676

For Watson: 52.4%

Against Watson:47.6%

A little over 3500 votes. 52% for.

Here's the problem, you took my comment as being in opposition of your entire post. Anyone who has been reading the Watson threads at all must know I agree with the context of your post. Pointing out that as much as the people supporting the idea of Watson coming tend to yell the loudest, they are in the minority isn't trying to rail against the overall points you made in your post.

Comprehension is a problem some people have. Context is another one.

Polls generally attract people with strong feelings towards the subject matter. Being dead set against it is easy. Those that are for it are probably more conflicted.

Even if you don't think Watson did the alleged things, being seen to "condone" the alleged things is psychologically difficult. Especially when the prevailing narrative is about what a creeper Watson is.

That doesn't make the prevailing sentiment true.

As far as the poll on this board, I didn't vote because the way it is worded is nonsense. I wouldn't trade for Watson "regardless of cost." If the cost is right and our investigation comes up clean, I would.

Lousy polls don't allow for nuance. They mainly allow angry people to feel heard.

I heard the Steelers were not interested in Watson because they were afraid he would use all of their towels.

With the excitement generated by a certain portion of the fan base, this will attract people from both sides. To try and claim the feelings of those wanting Watson here isn't as strong as those who do not want him here I think is a false premise. Just look at our own poll as a guideline. Two thirds of our posters do not want Watson here. Yet when reading the comments it's not even close to being two thirds negative comments. Sure it's a small sample size but it speaks volumes in regards to your premise.

Yes - the "anyone but Baker" crowd are not on the fence no matter what. And it is an anonymous poll I am sure. I bet there are people in favor who have never seen Watson throw a football.

This might be a factor for Watson coming to CLE... everyone knows his suspension will be twice as long if he comes here.

I never said the Pro-Watson crowd had less strong feelings. It's just harder to rationalize them down to a simple yes or no vote. Especially in the current social climate.

It's impossible to encapsulate maybe we should get Watson if.... in a yes or no poll.

I think everything you brought up supports my position. I'm not sure how you managed to twist them to be the opposite.

I had no idea that abusing women was a "current social climate". From a young child I was always taught you never make unwanted advances or force yourself in a sexual way upon women. I know it's convenient to try and blame it on current trends but I'm willing to bet you were taught the same things I was in regards to women while growing up.