DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum 2022 Browns Free Agency Signings/News

At 18mil with 1 year left, nobody is going to give a 1st or 2nd.

Yeah, I read it as Browns...

I was wondering about the same thing. $18M is a pretty sizable chunk of change.

Well, he was a Brown at one point.

That's a possibility as well, I suppose.

Unfortunately,

That does not apply in this case ... the 18.9M is all dead cap in 2022 unless we can trade him.

If he was seen as a viable starter, one who is at least above average, then someone would be willing to take that 18M salary. It seems that he is not seen to be that.

Ok, so let's say the Browns draft a WR or 2 as you say in the 2nd and 3rd rounds. Who's the two starting DT's? Who's the starting DE? Who's the new starting LB? Berry has said multiple times that they evaluate every player and position and look for upgrades. Wasn't Anthony Schwartz a 3rd round draft pick last year? Realistically, would another 3rd round pick be an upgrade to the WR group?

The Browns had about 16 defensive tackles that could realistically start as recently as August of 2021, I'm sure a few of them are left, they should be plenty fine in the defensive tackle and defensive end department.

It's not the 18.9M contract that's stopping teams from trading for Mayfield, it's the Browns unrealistic asking price of a 1st round pick.

Stop it.

FWIW, I heard that the one year left on the Jimmy Garapolo contract was around a $27 million cap hit.

I didn't include Detroit because I think I remember them saying how much they like their backup and they're likely stuck with Goff. He has a 31m cap hit if he stays on the team and 41m if cut (of course he could be a June 1 cut, but Baker's salary would bring them right back up to 39m with the split dead cap). I think he stays on the team for the year and gets cut in the offseason next year when they only have 10m in dead cap. I have seen a couple talking heads bring up Detroit though.

Seriously, they have gone defense, defense, more defense, and add on defense to no avail for many years and many tries.
Realistically, whomever they draft in the 2nd or 3rd round on the d line,
Are they going to be better than JOK, or Jordan Elliott, or John Hughes, or Larry Ogunjobi,

They have talent developing in players like Sheldon Day and Ifeadi Odinigbo, plus, you ask who is the new starting linebacker?
Really? They have about 6-10 starting caliber linebackers ,how many do they put on the field? 2, maybe 3.
They have Phillips, and Takk McKinley, and they guy everybody loved but I didn't who sat on the PS most of 2021, but was active in 2020 the De.
They still have Malcolm Smith, had Mack Wilson but traded, but they got the linebacker that replace Mack Wilson, in the Mack Wilson Trade some new player.
They have Anthony Walker back, and Sione Taki Taki is another year better,

On offense, the Browns have needs, and they have taken years, along with the NFL taking years to prove that offenseive effectiveness is what wins in the NFL, including the passing game, including passing to 'good' wide receivers.

The Browns need wide receviers, and the sooner they stop putting Wide Receiver at the 6th place to bottom of the list 12th place, even behind Kicker, the sooner they'll climb out of the basement of the AFC North.

So seriously, you talk about the developing talent at DT - where the heck were they last year. The stats don't lie - the Browns DT's in 2021 where at the bottom of the league in run defense and non existent in the pass rush. The guys you mention were backups to the guys that posted those weak numbers. If the Browns are going to go that route, then they are not upgrading the DT position. At DE, Clowney surprised last year with the type of year that he had. Let's candid, Clowney's production greatly enhanced what Garrett was able to do on the field. Without Clowney (and backups filling in at DT as you suggest) it can be safely said that Garrett's numbers will plunge. Poor D-line play equals huge pressure on the LB's for the run & the LB's and CB's against the pass. The upgrade at MLB was specifically pointed at stopping the run and having the quickness to go sideline to sideline - the Browns do not have that at this time.

I totally agree with the WR analysis. Resigning Landry and counting on Peoples-Jones is not upgrading the WR group. I fully expect Njoku to disappoint - IMHO it was a horrible deal to franchise him. I think they missed the boat in FA, they passed on numerous upgrades and had additional moves that they could have and should have made to solidify the position. That is unless of course they could have participated in the WR market because IMHO, WR's didn't give Cleveland a thought due to the Stefanski scheme and his history of pass play reduction. Posters here will say that it was all Baker's fault, in Minnesota it was because they had Cook, in 2022 it'll be interesting to see who gets the blame when Watson's numbers get reduced by 20% to 30% his normal production level.

To back up my claims - in 2021 PFF Ranked the Browns DT's as follows:

Jackson - Grade 44.4 - rank 99 out of 110 players ranked
Elliott - Grade 41.6 - rank 103 out of 110 players ranked
McDowell - Grade 46.5 - rank 93 out of 110 players ranked

To think that these guys backups in 2021 will be an upgrade in 2022 is just to plain funny to address.

So, the Browns don't have a 1st round pick and only 1 second round pick. Where do you use it when you have 3 DT's ranked in the bottom 15% of the league or do you use it at WR to replace Landry and DPJ who were ranked in the bottom 20% of the league. Don't say we have 3rd round picks - we got Schwartz with a 3rd rounder last year - how's that worked out?

j/c...

Again the point is---

Upgrading the defense won't translate into wins, when the offense is terrible. (The same story for 25 years, it's like the big bad wolf, except the little pigs keep building houses of sticks and straw over and over and over again.)

Except for the 3 times in 25 years they invested in Wide Receiver as a priority, they made the playoffs 1.5 years later. And almost in 2007.

I just want to take a minute to thank you for your contributions in these threads. Guys like you and Grateful are the heartbeat of this place. It's great to have a one-stop Browns News aggregator, and Dutiful Dawgs like you guys make it particularly content-rich.

Thank you.


Greg Newsome is a fresh breath. On the field, he's 100%. On the camera, he represents Our Tribe well.

I find it funny that now that we have Watson, WR is a top priority because the Browns haven't invested in WR as a priority in 25 years. Mayfield played a year and a half without a #1 WR - then through his own post season admission, Mayfield ended up playing 3/4 of the year with a #2 WR that said he was unable to perform up to expectations due to his injuries. Now it's an issue for our new QB? I find it funny that 90% of the top teams in this league have coaches that build their offenses to the skill sets of their players while the Browns have a coach that's in the other 10% that expects players to adjust to the scheme that's in place without exception.

Look, if you're going to run a scheme where 17 - 20 points should be enough to win then you must have a defense that's built to allow less than 17 - 20 points per game. I am totally on-board with your WR needs and it appeared to be priority heading into the off season. The Defensive Line was also appeared to be a priority heading into the off season. The question now is if those positions cannot be upgraded due to the unplanned upgrade at QB, which positions are the lessor evil to not upgrade?

Maybe with Watson and an upgraded WR set the Browns will become a 27 - 30 point per game team (of course the scheme would have to change to score that many points of which I have my doubts). However, going pat with your current backups or even less talented players than what you had in 2021 on the D-line at 3 out of the 4 positions with no upgrade at Inside LB will certainly mean the defense will "NOT" be allowing less than the 17 - 20 points per game goal. Pick your poison - neither is an ideal situation. The ball is in Berry's court and IMHO, I don't like what's happening in its totality but there's still a lot of off-season to go but I wonder who the scape goat will be in 2022 if things go south because one or both of the needs weren't addressed with upgrades - time will tell.

"Browns have a coach that's in the other 10% that expects players to adjust to the scheme that's in place without exception."

Honestly, I do not think believe that.

Stefanski will begin his third year as a head coach. His first year with the Browns he developed the offense around the skills of the players.

Chubb, Hunt and the OL were heartbeat of the offense and rightfully so. They were the strength of the offense.

Baker was given a to do list to improve his footwork. It was determined based upon Baker's skill set to run a play action pass attack because of the skills and strength of the run game. It also allowed Baker space to provide downfield vision. The playaction rolls to the left and right were fitted to Baker. He is good throwing off movement. He is not good in the pocket reading defenses.

2021 in many ways has to be thrown out. It was a mess with injuries and other issues off and on the field.
Stefanski made errors as well so it is not like he gets a free pass. When you have an quarterback limited by inury. You have your hands tied. Third and ten draw plays are not normal.

I have stated this before and will so again. Coaches learn from experience like we all do. KS is not the same today as he was as a OC with the Vikings.

The 2022 offense will not be the same.

We'll have to agree to disagree - I don't expect changes in the offense with Stefanski calling the plays. Even if you disregard 2021 (the Browns obviously haven't by laying all the blame on Mayfield), Stefanski's trend is to diminish the pass and focus on the run. I expect the same scheme in 2022 - he hasn't shown me the ability to adjust and definitely doesn't build to the skill sets of his players.

Let's see what he does with a QB that he had some input on the choice of. How collaborative was the process of setting up the weekly play sheet between Stefanski and Baker? If Baker told Stefanski these are the plays I like, then failed to execute those plays, whose fault is it?

Hopefully we'll be able to stay healthier this season. That alone would help a lot.

I don't think you can fairly say the Browns haven't invested in wide receivers. I hope I am not missing your point or taking you out of context. But when they signed Landry to a mega deal and then traded for OBJ, those were enormous investments. Hooper was, too. They didn't pan out so well, of course. Sometimes I wonder why Baker, who had two terrific seasons here and two bad ones, could never seem to "gel" with the receivers he had. Landry was injured last year, OBJ the year before. I don't think it is fair to blame all of this on Baker, because if he had just shut it down and had surgery early last season, we'd all still think he was our QB of the future. I am as conflicted about it all as any Browns fan. But they HAVE invested in wide receivers.

I think that's to be seen. This year will tell a lot. I agree that Baker seemed to be throttled by Stefanski, maybe deservedly so if you agree he felt Baker's limitations in the pocket were a major factor to do so. But I lean toward your view since some of Stefanski's ideas of empty backfield inside the 10, never seeing Chubb and Hunt together even as a confusion factor, his seemingly incomprehensible sitting of Chubb to conserve his touches in critical times late and his offensive protection scheme for the second Steelers game seem to illustrate your point.

I'm hoping his eyes and experience are through a wider lens this year - he needs a better feel for the game as it progresses and a less steadfast analytics approach or he will be another possible bust.

Funny to think about but in 2020 when he was COY he patted Zac Taylor on the back after beating the Bengals and I said to myself unless you continue to grow Zac will pass you up with his QB being healthy.

A top QB - we have one - so Stefanski needs to make sure we uses that skill set.

...and Stefanski is 4-0 vs the bengals.

and now, a comedy break:

I don’t disagree with Nick Karns in that tweet. It’s just the morality of the move is so controversial. I am of the opinion that he’s going to majorly help our team and we want a winning franchise, so it’s the move to make. I’m just hoping it doesn’t crash and burn.

🥶

After an off season of major deals and Mayfield bashing, I find it interesting that the same questions honest people have had that have watched the actual play results from the coaching scheme of Stefanski is front and center at the initial press conference introducing the Browns new QB. IMHO, Stefanski dodged the question and though I believe there might be some type of minor adjustments - I fully expect Stefanski to continue to run the same basic scheme he has run the last 3-years. With a totally decimated WR room, it has to make you wonder why no FA WR has considered coming to Cleveland. If not for the trade of Cooper, the Browns wouldn't have addressed the situation at all - so much so that the rumor of consideration is being given to resigning Landry or an injured OBJ who at best won't be available until mid-season.

https://www.cleveland.com/browns/20...tefanskis-offense-to-evolve-in-2022.html

First, Jakeem Grant, a WR, put pen to paper and signed here already. Second, how do you know what people considered? Third, if we're believing rumors, Landry and OBJ, both FA WRs, are considering returning. Will Fuller, who many have linked to us, is still available. Finally, we've got the draft to go where we can still address WR, and do it on much cheaper contracts.

"Stefanski's trend is to diminish the pass and focus on the run. I expect the same scheme in 2022 - he hasn't shown me the ability to adjust and definitely doesn't build to the skill sets of his players."


The sample size is way to small to speak about trends.

He has been a head coach two years. Those years were different for many reasons.

This years team will feature a vastly different quarterback as well as a different receivers room.

So I will wait and see.

j/c:

I hope Stefanski doesn't change too much. I did not like the hire, but I love his scheme. He learned from the Shanahan/Kubiak school of superior scheme and play calling. He will be able to expand on it now that he isn't hamstrung by such a limited qb, but I do not want to go to 11 personal as our base package. Mix it in, but 12 and 13 personnel works, especially w/the running backs we have.

Agree 100% -- we've seen some concerns with regards to play calling in specific games. But overall you'd have to say the sample size for knowing what KS can and will do is way to small. Just like Baker played to a high level from the half way point *the previous season ... so did Stefanski's offense. There were not many complaints overall with how things were set up then. And this year - not only was Baker throwing with one wing, we had major injuries week to week across the OL, the WR was dinged up significantly, RB's also - lest we forget 3rd string RB burst onto the scene due to necessity .. we even had some issues at TE at times. What we saw in 2021 to my mind does not resemble what a Stefanski offense is/will be. He's better than that. It doesn't excuse or erase some of the head scratching stuff like leaving rookie 3rd string RT 1 on 1 with the best pass rusher in the game, passing 3 times in a row to lose a must win game when we had been running at 7.8 yards per carry, getting cute, going for it on 4th down way too many times when you consistently come up short. But I look at those as specific game issues, not a trend in the scheme. I believe/hope that KS will adjust to the talent now available.

Grant is only a PR/KR

Sort of on the same timetable as Baker's injury huh? Of course no mention of how having a QB with a bum shoulder would influence your play calling. Odd how that happens on a regular basis here.