DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Jarvis

In a pass happy league, Jarvis has alot of catches in his career.
Reminds of those past Browns LBers that had alot of tackles but still at the end of
The day, was a average LBer.
He is a volume catcher. Great. What he isnt, is a end zone threat. And thats what
The Browns offense is lacking. A WR that put fear in DBs.
Yeah he had a couple 1000 yd seasons. But that is very reachable number these
Days for a WR...unless you play for the Lions, Browns, Ravens,Jets,
His leadership attachment is a bit overated.
It certainly didnt help glue together a,fractured locker room last year.
And if your #2,WR is considered the leader, the catalyst of the locker room
Then your team has serious issues.
Jarvis is a pros pro. He shows up.plays hard. But a difference maker. No
The demand for him in free agency is minimal.

How would you interpret that comment in regards to the chance of us bringing him back?

I know you didn'task me, but i am here, so i will give my opinion.

I think it means we like Jarvis and think he still has some gas in the tank, and we have made our offer and are going to stick to it..we aren't going to jack it upwards just to get him signed.

I’d say the ship has sailed.

It's hard to judge demeanor, intent, etc, from a tweeted piece of his comments. On the surface, "wherever he ends up" doesn't sound very promising.

Here's the full statement regarding Landry:

"I thought Jarvis was productive for us last year, and he did battle through a few injuries and tough it out and got back as quickly as possible. I think everybody knows our affinity for Jarvis the person and Jarvis the competitor. I think he will have a successful season wherever he ends up next year."

I think Berry is very straight forward with players. He'll state intentions, they'll express their point of view, he'll adjust accordingly. Jarvis stating he'd like to dip his toes in the FA waters was probably met with a "that's fine, but here's where we stand"... and an offer. With the disclaimer being if we have to play the waiting game, the offer likely won't change.

Straight forward, no nonsense, let the chips fall where they may. I would think most players appreciate that posture.

I think the Browns have a couple of problems here. First, considering the market, signing a WR at the low end is going to be very difficult. With Kirk getting a 37M deal at 18M per season, the bar has been pushed up whether it's deserved or not. The second issue is due to the lateness of the FA season and the fact that AB has a well-documented history of handing out 1-year deals, the unknown surrounding Watson's availability to play combined with Stefanski's scheme that will be deployed without Watson is giving huge caution to WR's who may be available. You have to ask yourself, if you were offered a 1-year deal at WR where your prove it season would be dependent on Brissett being your future meal ticket are you going to sign that deal? Most likely not and you're going to want a multi year deal to insure you get to be a Watson receiver.

I don't know how likely it is that Watson gets suspended this year. I guess it's low, but you do bring up a good point. Some receivers might hesitate at a 1 year deal.

I am not sure where i heard it, but I think the deal we have offered for Landry is for 2 years. He wouldn't be on a prove it deal, but if we are willing to go 2 years with him, we might with someone else if Landry goes elsewhere.

To add to my previous point, I hope Landry makes his move soon. I wouldn't want to get in to a situation like we had with Schwartz a few years ago and be forced to move on because plan B is about to be lost while we wait. I don't think Berry is going to lose out on plan B waiting around for Landry to make a decision.

I think, but do not know, that Berry and Browns want Jarvis back. I think that Berry is making it known that he has a monetary amount that he's comfortable with and that Jarvis might not be comfortable with. I think Berry is acknowledging that he believes Jarvis is still a good player and valuable member to any team and he believes Jarvis will sign somewhere else, but he is still leaving the door open in case Landry does want to return. Summary: I feel the odds of Jarvis playing w/us next year are now slim. That makes me sad.

I think they were slim from the start. And I mean the start. It was an over-priced contract before it was ever signed. That was part of the bed we made with a tear-down and 1-31. Part of that pricetag was to tell the league we were ready to play some football... and create any kind of impetus for other players to want to sign here. That contract made 2022 a restructure or walk proposition. This is playing out just about the way it was always meant to, with little sprinkles of hope to tide us over until the inevitable comes to pass.

I think it means that Berry has a very firm number on the table and this is the public "take it or leave it".
It's akin to every time he's said a player "has earned the right to test free agency"... that has been the statement that says they aren't coming back here for what they think they can get elsewhere.

Yes, but I think he is going about it in a nice way and being honorable. I think highly of Berry. Didn't like the hire, but I change my opinion if a guy proves me wrong. Berry is intelligent, well-spoken, fair, and a good talent evaluator for the most part.

Yes, the question and answer to it is very subjective. There really isn't a right/wrong answer to it b/c we are on the outside looking in.

My view/guesses
Are similar to yours. We lost a good one with Tretter.

Offensive
Definitely agree with Watson.
Chubb? Not by words, but by doing
Maybe Bitonio?

Defensive
I've read articles about Garrett becoming a leader and what he's done as a leader. (If it's effective or not is another story). I do see your point about being a different kind of cat. That's easy to see. What dang game was that, maybe the Packers? I think it was a 3rd and long play late in the game. Where Garrett/Clowney were doing their damnnest to try to sack the QB, while the QB was running for his life, he got off a beautiful pass. The next thing u see is Clowney slamming the ground with his fist, while Garrett has a big smile on his face and giving the QB a slap on the butt, fist bump or something for the throw. Basically giving him a tip of the cap on beating them.

Walker was a leader at the previous stop
JJIII was supposedly another leader at his previous stop

Those are the ones I'm thinking. I wonder if GM has any inside information on it.

But as for leaders, there isn't a set number of how many you need. It just depends on the style and effectiveness of the leader. Not saying we do or not, just different opinions on what we have/need.

I like your post. We don't totally agree on things, but that is the beauty of good discussion. Thanks, I appreciate conversations like the one we just had.

jc -

I love Jarvis, but I love guys with his outward competitive fire. He also appears to be extremely intelligent, and I like that as well. I think what he brought to the team goes beyond the numbers - on the field or the dollars off. I disagree with Memphis and others who think he was overpaid. Without Jarvis, the team does not make the playoffs in 2020, in my opinion.

When I watch Jarvis I see an extremely competitive, skilled wide receiver who I think would bring more to a team than most guys already on teams. Apparently the league does not agree with me so what do I know. But I don't get caught up in numbers or dollars. I just go by what I see.

I hope in some way we can bring him back. I think if we do and we have a successful season, Jarvis will be a big reason why.

Jarvis's numbers have declined every year the last 4 yrs.
What speed and shiftiness he may have once is gone.
He didnt even break 600 yds last year.
The Browns can draft a WR in RD 2 like Watson and get that much
Production.for less dollars.
Nobody in the league is in a hurry to add Landry to.their team.

It will all depend on the Saints offer. IMO Jarvis wants to be here, but we wont (and shouldn’t) budge from a lower price tag.

I think this is very shortsighted. Landry was hurt most of last year. How do we really know if his speed and shiftiness is gone?

And in no way, shape, or form can you just "replace" Landry in the second round like a snap of the fingers. There's so much more that goes into being a player than what's on paper.

Landry was injured practically all season long last year. He had a badly injured QB throwing to him. Circumstances matter.

I like Landry, but at what point does being hurt/injured start to be considered the norm instead of the exception. He doesn't miss games, but he's been hampered fairly often during his time here. He's had a lot of catches during his career, which is a good thing. In some ways, it's also a bad thing because, while not 30 yet, he has a lot of mileage with a physical play style. He's a good player, but he seems like a candidate for letting go a year too soon rather than a year too late. If the price is right, it'd be great to have him in the building. He's probably not someone we'll be building the offense around, though.

All players get hurt. The tough ones stay on the field. Landry played in 110 straight games before covid took him out of the lineup in 2020.

Last year I watched his injuries affect his play... well, combined with the dark cloud, internal politics and the departure of his wonder twin. But he would be the last guy on the roster I would complain about "injuries", dude would jog out there with a hand missing.

2 years ago Landry really played at a high level.
I think.he peaked then. Since then his ypc catch has dropped
His TD numbers have dropped.
He hasnt had a catch over 50 yds in 2 years.
That tells me has lost a gear and he cant separate
Ok he was injuried last year. Its the nature of the position.
Rookie NFL WRs are so.much farther ahead coming into the league.
It's not hard for rookie WR to come in and put up Landrys 2021 numbers.
Well unless your name is Anthony Schwartz. .

I don't question his toughness, just how much tread is left on the tires. I don't doubt that he'd run out there one-handed, but the question is how effective will he be. He's never been a height/weight/speed guy, and his legs have started to go, it appears. I don't think he has been right since the hip surgery. I somewhat worry that compensating for old/lingering injuries will continue to lead to other injuries.

I get it bro, sorry to sound so snarky. You're right. He'll also hit 30 this season.

I think Landry can still produce at a Pro Bowl level if he can get fully healthy. Don't think he's been over 90% healthy the last two years. Could be wrong, but I'd put money on him at 100% going into the season.