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THROW LONG #1945883 05/20/22 10:56 PM
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... If the Browns were the Cowboys' they would have cut Dak Prescoctt in the spring/or summer of ? 2020? Do I have the year right? Maybe 2019, even 2018, about the first year they franchised him.
Screw Continuity


Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
bonefish #1945885 05/20/22 11:28 PM
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Good talk guys, a lot of fresh takes to mull over in this, ‘The Offense’ thread.

What OL position has the biggest question mark? Is it RT, with Conklin trying to overcome his injury?

Or Nick Harris, our new centre - yeah I spelled it the Canadian way - who is competing with the other fella we signed, whose name escapes me?


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lampdogg #1945889 05/21/22 07:23 AM
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Originally Posted by lampdogg
Good talk guys, a lot of fresh takes to mull over in this, ‘The Offense’ thread.

What OL position has the biggest question mark? Is it RT, with Conklin trying to overcome his injury?

Or Nick Harris, our new centre - yeah I spelled it the Canadian way - who is competing with the other fella we signed, whose name escapes me?

The offense has a couple of question marks in my opinion.

WR #2: We did not keep Landry. We have an unproven 3rd round draft choice in Bell, a 3rd round guy from last year who didn't look very good in Schwartz, and a guy who I think was a 6th round pick from the year before Schwartz.

C: We have to see Harris play before we can say if he is good, average, or below that.

LT: I think we need improved play from Wills, our LT this year. It's not a huge deal because he is at least functional. I get what you are saying about Conklin because he was injured so much last year, but he is one of the best RTs in the business, when healthy.

lampdogg #1945905 05/21/22 09:45 AM
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Originally Posted by lampdogg
Good talk guys, a lot of fresh takes to mull over in this, ‘The Offense’ thread.

What OL position has the biggest question mark? Is it RT, with Conklin trying to overcome his injury?

Or Nick Harris, our new centre - yeah I spelled it the Canadian way - who is competing with the other fella we signed, whose name escapes me?

Our WR room is crazy-average right now...just like last year...although we now (finally) have ONE guy who could actually see the field if he were a Bengal...the potential of the room is better than it was last year.

Our TEs are 100% potential...which may turn out actually BETTER than last year.

I think Harris will be better-than-fine...he's been the #1 C in practice pretty-much since he was drafted...they know what they have in him and that was part of moving on from Tretter. I read where he put on some good weight as was needed.

My only concern with Conklin is injury-recovery and future-injuries...with Hubbard (injuries) and Hudson (too raw yet)...the position is shaky.

Wills needs to step it up...hard to say too much with the continued ankle injury throughout all of last year.

Our RBs and Gs are studs...we even have a few backups in both places that are quite good for being backups.

Our QB will likely be quite-good (plus) if Watson can play...and quite-not-good (minus) if Brisset is our starter.

Our K should be a remarkable improvement over...well...anyone since Phil.

WSU Willie #1945913 05/21/22 10:17 AM
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The WR comment, A. it's not average it's less than average, Count:2. Landry would have seen the field, and Higgins and OBJ, to say Amari Cooper would, is a maybe, Cooper is an unknown as a Brown.
3. Harris is not an Average starting Center in the NFL, Harris is an average, short term replacement backup center, and Pocic should be starting in front of him, and that is all Harris has always been, until he proves otherwise, (hasn't yet.)
4. The Rb's and Guards are studs? The Guards are ok, only Kareem Hunt is a stud at Rb and only if he is remarkably healthy in the moment. Chubb is, OK but makes some big plays, but is very (get in front of)-able for any defense, and that means he's stoppable.

5. Our Wback will likely be Wuite BLANK (keyboard troubles) if Watson plays.
A. Watson will be his worst version until about 2 years of learning the Browns schedule and div. and issues so the "likely" thing is the uarterback play will be hit and miss, (with too many misses to end drives).

6. Our Kicker play should be? The kicker is a rookie first year in the NFL drafted hope of a good college kicker. (The same as Austin Siebert was). So most likely Also a hit or miss, well I guess that is all a Kicker could be, unless they are automatic, or absolute #2.


Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
THROW LONG #1945915 05/21/22 10:30 AM
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Like everyone you are entitled to your opinion. Stating so strongly opinions like Chubb is "OK" is virtually impossible to defend. By every metric he is a top - elite RB in the NFL. With better management the year Kitchens was HC he would have won the rushing title. Chubb - as a workhorse and at one time the 'only' weapon the Browns had, is averaging the second most yards per carry in the history of the NFL behind Jamaal Charles and in half as many games he has 36 TDs to Jamaal's 44.

I think you might be on an island, alone on the planet in thinking Chubb is "OK". jmo


The more things change the more they stay the same.
bonefish #1945917 05/21/22 10:37 AM
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"Hmm, yeah, miss a day and you miss a lot... 28 comments on The Offense, this should be a good read."

eek


HERE WE GO BROWNIES! HERE WE GO!!
mgh888 #1945930 05/21/22 11:36 AM
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Originally Posted by mgh888
And I am not angry either. And trying to use that sounds like you are desperate and don't want to stick to the facts.

Disagreeing with Vers......

1. You must be angry.

2. You must live in an alternate reality.

3. You must hate the Browns.

4. This is how you know he has reached the final tipping point in the uni"verse". When all else fails, he will refuse to debate a topic with you directly. Instead he will ignore responding to you while at the same time going around taking cheap shots at you in response to other posters.

5. All the while he'll tell other posters when he believes their posts are fair. You know, because he agrees with them. He'll claim to be the expert on who posts with class and who does not. He will rail on what threads belong in which forums and which do not. He is the self proclaimed expert on all things Dawgtalkers. Just ask hm.


Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.

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PitDAWG #1945932 05/21/22 11:51 AM
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That has nothing to do with the offense.


Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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jfanent #1945934 05/21/22 12:04 PM
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Originally Posted by jfanent
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....that's ignoring the possibility that reports that NFL teams are pissed at Haslam and want to make the team suffer a little for setting a new precedent in signing a fully guaranteed $1/4 Billion contract.

This is probably the worst of the reasons given for why there's been no trade interest for BM. There isn't a team in the league that is going to pass on getting a qb they think would improve the team because of FO sissy fights.

While to a great extent I agree with you I think it may be a one ingredient in the cumulative effect.

In the first place Baker isn't a great QB. I think he would be an upgrade on maybe 10-15 teams but that in and of itself limits the trade possibilities. I think if I were to rank him among NFL starters it would be somewhere the 15-20 range roughly. I don't believe that teams looking to get a new QB actually are looking for what may be seen as a "slight upgrade". I think to make such a move they want a significant upgrade in order to make such a move and investment. I don't think a lot of teams view Baker that way.

The price is in the details and the details are more than just the price. Baker's current contract makes him a one year rental and nothing more. At the current time he is recovering from surgery. I think like many of us they have no real idea how much of Baker's 2021 performance was injury based and how much of it was "Baker". I think they also understand that the Browns are in a no win situation keeping Baker on the roster this season. The team is already trying to defend itself in the watson debacle and adding the Baker drama only adds gasoline to the fire.

So since I think most of us agree that Baker wouldn't be some huge upgrade in many cases, he's still healing from his surgery. His price tag seems ridiculous since most teams understand the Browns keeping him on the roster would be a disaster. I think they are sitting back and waiting for the Browns to either release him or let them know they will pretty much eat his contract to get anything of value in return. I can't say I blame them. This is a situation the Browns have put themselves into and I think they knew that when they signed watson. It was just considered a part of the deal. A portion of the cost. And from strictly an on the field performance standpoint I understand why they did it. I also understand why they want to get the most they can for Baker in this situation. At this point it seems the rest of the league has gained the upper hand.

The NFL has been fighting against these fully guaranteed, long term contracts for a very long time. That's why this contract is the first of its kind. It will cost every NFL team going forward when signing FA, veterans and making any long term deals moving forward with regards to the QB position and probably some other positions on the field. I mean you can minimize that by calling them "sissy fights" all you like but that doesn't change the reality of what transpired here.

Much like yourself I don't think that plays a huge part in the issue of moving Baker. But it certainly is at least some part of why the other 31 teams probably aren't willing to make things easy for the Browns moving forward. People are never happy when you mess with their money.


Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.

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PitDAWG #1945940 05/21/22 01:03 PM
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Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Originally Posted by jfanent
Quote
....that's ignoring the possibility that reports that NFL teams are pissed at Haslam and want to make the team suffer a little for setting a new precedent in signing a fully guaranteed $1/4 Billion contract.

This is probably the worst of the reasons given for why there's been no trade interest for BM. There isn't a team in the league that is going to pass on getting a qb they think would improve the team because of FO sissy fights.

While to a great extent I agree with you I think it may be a one ingredient in the cumulative effect.

I agree with both of you. The "backlash" - if there is one, is not high on any probable reason for the current situation. But given everything else, it is a possible contributing factor. Probable not, but possible.


If Baker was a flat out, clear cut stud - not only would we probably not gone so hard for DW, teams would also not be concerned about what the Browns did or didn't do with DW to acquire him. But given the many many layers to what's going on who really knows? People are crazy enough to suggest the DW lawsuit was dreamed up and initiated by the owner of HOU because they felt so slighted by DW ... but the idea of teams being pissed at the Browns for the first ever fully guaranteed contract is too farfetched?


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bonefish #1945946 05/21/22 01:49 PM
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j/c:

Back to the offense for a moment. I pointed out a few question marks in my previous post, but the most concerning one is the #2 WR spot, simply due to the inexperience of the guys we have. I am also not as high on Cooper as some other people are. He is ultra talented, but he's been kind of a me guy and I have seen him take himself out of games at the end of very close games. I don't think he will bring any leadership qualities to the room.

I do think Watson can elevate others, though. Thus, even though Wills might not be the best LT and Harris is unproven, this Browns line is far, far superior to any line Watson played with in the past. Also, I think Watson's prowess as a qb will help elevate his receivers. I think this offense can be really, really good.

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So if Wills improves because he had an ankle injury most of last season.... If DPJ improves or others on the offense improve, it won't be because they've developed or gotten better, it will be because "watson elevated them"?

Good to know. So what happens if they don't play better? I guess that would be on them then, right?


Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.

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PitDAWG #1945951 05/21/22 02:11 PM
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j/c:

What's exciting is how much more versatile our offense should be w/Watson. We can continue to run 12 and 13 personnel that highlights our great running game. If teams, gear up to stop the run, Watson can run naked boots or RPOs where he will be a dual-threat on the perimeter of a now undermanned defense on the second and third levels of the vertical defense. This should allow for more single coverage on some of our receivers.

We can also now run 11 personnel because Watson can excel in the pocket. He doesn't get intimidated by the rush. He can stand in there and diagnose the coverages and exploit the defense. He is also a threat to run if the Edge rushers get too far upfield.

I think Stefanski is very good and I think he put Baker in a lot of good positions. Now, Stefanski is going to have more options w/his scheme and play calling. I think the Shanahan/Kubiak offense is QB friendly and puts a lot of pressure on defenses, especially w/the utilization of the ZBS. Another thing I always liked about the offense is how it using building blocks when calling plays. It's like a boxer who keeps going to the body, abusing an opponents ribs which leads to the latter dropping his hands a bit and leaving his head exposed for knockout shots. Kyle Shanahan is the best I ever witnessed at doing that and we have a guy who has been schooled well. I think it's very exciting.

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Good post.

I feel the same way. IMO Stefanski will work well DW. I love the offense that has developed in that coaching tree.

There are some OL questions and always concern about OL depth. Conklin is really good but he has been hurt a lot. Wills has the goods but he has to learn to be consistent. He does not take plays off but he loses concentration and then his technique. We shall see about Harris although Berry brought in Pocic and drafted a guy. Bitonio and Teller are real good.

DW is decisive. He reads well and is quick to release. Release the pass. Release and move from the pocket. Don't get stuck thinking or waiting. The overall tempo will be faster and that should help the OL.

We are so fortunate with our run game. I remember the Chubb draft. Sequon Barkley was being interviewed. It was thought he may go number one. He was asked a question about the "others" and who he liked. He never hestitated "Nick Chubb." I knew a little about him because I live in Georgia. So, I started looking at him. Not much just who is this guy? We found out.

Kareem is awesome. He does so much so well. Plays with abandon. Good receiver and blocker. He can smell the endzone.

I wish we would have signed Jarvis. But I am optomistic about the receivers. I like Bryant and the Chief.

IMO the offense has enormous potential. We will be hard to defend. Lot a looks. Lots of options. Motion, RPO's.

We have an excellent offensive coaching staff. O'Shea, Callahan, Mitchell, AVP are all good coaches. They should have a really good time coaching this team.

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bonefish #1946001 05/21/22 07:39 PM
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Nice football post. I agree w/almost all of your points.

I remember evaluating college RBs before the 2018 draft and I had Chubb's teammate a little bit ahead of Nick. Obviously, I was wrong.

I really love Hunt's play on the field. He is all-in. Almost too reckless w/his body. He just throws himself at defenders. I worry about him getting hurt, but that guy is a football
player.

I still don't get the Landry thing, but that ship has sailed so what can we do.

I love our offensive coaching staff. Callahan is the best in the business. Love Stump. AVP looks good, but I'm not exactly sure how much of a role he plays. I didn't want Stefanski hired, but I was wrong. He's a very good coach.

bonefish #1946054 05/22/22 07:46 AM
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Some good posts.

I wanted to add a few things.

- i've also been a fan of what I've seen from Ski and his offense. I think he tailored the offense to be successful with the play calling the last two years. I don't want to get into much more than that, b/c the conversation could get sidetracked. With Watson, the points Vers and Bone have made covered my opinions too regarding his athletic ability, play calling and etc. So i would be just echoing what has already been said.

- Regarding Watson, I expect some rust. On a personal note, I expect him to play well and give us plenty of wow moments, but I also will temper my expectations for this year. This isn't last years team, this isn't last years division or conference. This is a new year, the AFC has brought in many top level to star QBs. The Browns have brought in their dog to this fight. It won't be easy, but you need a top level QB to have a chance in this division and conference. I am looking forward to seeing this team grow. I am looking forward to which players will rise to leadership roles.

(I just accidentally deleted my breakdown of the positions, so this version won't be as thorough, ugh.)

- I'm interested in how DW will affect other team defenses if he resumes playing the way he did in the past. Will defenses play a spy on him all game? Will this take away a man in coverage b/c of his running ability? Will this help the RBs in the running game?

- I'm interested if our offense will be more aggressive or passive like in previous years. Will we be passing to set up the run game or running to set up the passing game? I would expect we will be more aggressive due to our new QB and today's style of the NFL.

- Regarding Hunt, I agree with what both you (Vers/Bone) talked about with him. I want to add another piece to this. He is perfect/great for the second back role, because of his reckless style. Going off memory the past two years (so I could be incorrect), when thrusted into the starting role (b/c of Chubb being out) he's gotten injured or really banged up. He wasn't as effective during those period of times. If memory serves me, two years ago he was playing with a groin injury and last year it was a calf or ankle (?) when in the starting role. As a GM for another team, this would be one of my concerns about offering a trade for him to be lead back. BUT thankfully for the Browns, this role is perfect for him to show the star that he can be as a two-headed monster.

- Our TEs, Chief as we know, has always been "potential". And like most of us think/say, this will be his year. Going off stats (that don't mean much, b/c different team, play style, players, etc), the Texans the past few years with DW and the TEs averaged around 80-90 targets and 700-900 yards. They didn't have the most athletic TEs and certainly no one of Chief's potential. So we will see. I do like Harrison Bryant too. For a positive note, I can see Chief/Bryant having a solid year due to our QB having better ball placement and putting our TEs in position to gain YAC after the catch.

- Adding to that last point, I am expecting a lot more YAC out of our team the next few seasons with DW.

- Our WRs, there's that dang "potential" thing again. We know what we have on paper. I expect we will sign one or two more veterans before the start of the season. Maybe even a camp cut from another team. They will get significant playing time as a #2 or 3 at the very least, based on being a "wiley" veteran and finding holes in the D. For me, I expect to be pleasantly surprised by our WRs. Mostly due to pre/post snap reads, vision either in the pocket or vision downfield while the pocket has broken down from our QB.

- That last sentence just reminded me of a major point. Pressure....in the past we have been one of the worst when the QB has been under pressure. DW has been very good in the past when pressured. If he plays like he has in the past, this should be a huge boost to our offense just in itself.

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Originally Posted by ScottPlayersFacemask
(I just accidentally deleted my breakdown of the positions, so this version won't be as thorough, ugh.)

Agree with the breakdowns on the team and potentially how the Offense will be able to operate.

Just as an FYI for you or anyone else - who probably know, but some may not - if you accidentally delete a chunk of work or text or do something in error while writing on dawgtalk - you can press "Ctrl + Z" and it is an 'undo' function. It will undo your last action, and you can press "Ctrl + Z" multiple times to undo multiple last actions.

Last edited by mgh888; 05/22/22 08:13 AM.

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That was an enjoyable post to read. I'll respond to a few of your points.

--I agree w/you that Stefanski's offense has been good. He did a great job w/Baker when he came here after the latter really struggled in 11 personnel the previous year. We relied on a strong running game early and then mixed in a lot of play action. We also ran boots and nakeds a lot. All of that enabled Baker to not have to throw from the pocket, a place he has always struggled. Many of the calls also limited the amount of field Baker had to read, which is another area where he has struggled. Of course, a lot of credit goes to the OL, who was rated as the best in the business that first year. Last year, teams game planned to keep Baker in the pocket. TJ Watt even made public comments about how that was their game plan. We struggled under those circumstances. I believe that is a big part of the reason why the team was ready to move on reportedly way back in November.

--Regarding Watson. I understand the rust possibility, but I don't think that would be a big problem. I expect him to play well. I am concerned on whether or not he plays, though. There is a lot of external pressure to suspend him and the NFL has been known to allow PR to influence their actions. That is why I used the words "witch hunt" on another thread.

--You brought up the word "spy." I hadn't considered that, but it is a good point. After some thought, I don't think--but do not know--that teams will do that. They do it w/Lamar, but he is a different animal. I think Watson is a pass first QB and will run if he has to or the opportunity is too good to pass up, thus teams probably won't want to take a man out of coverage to spy on him. Good point, though.

--Good points about Hunt and I couldn't agree more. I hope we keep him.

--I'm not sure about the TEs. They can thrive in this offense, but I am unsure about how consistent they are.

--Watson's advanced passing stats tell us that he is substantially more accurate than Baker so in theory, we should have more YAC this year.

--I'm not sure about the WRs. I hope you are right.

--I agree w/you about the pressure comment.

Again, that was a nice football post and I enjoyed reading your comments.

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Just a few words on Njoku. I read where he turned down a $13.5 mil offer. He may end up taking it, but man talk about overpaying. That guy hasn't done anything while here. I don't get you people thinking the guy is a great TE.

He's a waste of money IMO. We must be wanting to pay for something, but it sure hasn't been his performance.


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bonefish #1946064 05/22/22 08:58 AM
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I can't wait for football to start...and the bs stops

Guess what the only stat I care about is Baker is no longer a Brown. And DW is its just there never was a similar situation where a team gave up so much and a big possibility it was for Nothing...until Watson plays and full fills his contract I will be nervous over the situation.


Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
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CHRIST HAS RISEN!

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The success of the offense will hinge on the production of the WRS this year
If your offense doesn't have a game changer at that position then it can really
Hold a offense back.
Right now the Browns don't have that at WR.
Look at the playoff teams and SB teams from 2021.
Most of them had better WR groups than the Browns have right now

eotab #1946070 05/22/22 10:17 AM
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Every year each team turns over about a third of it's roster.

That is a lot of turnover. Every year each team changes a lot especially when you change the starting quarterback.

Until it is known "if" or "how long" DW will be suspended. We really do not know how the Browns will play.

How will Jacoby Brissett play with this offense? Can we win with Jacoby?

I don't know. I have never seen the guy play. Even if I did that does not answer how he will do with this team in this offense.

What I do know is the overall talent level of the team is good.

Overall I really like the coaching staff. I am glad that the staff has stayed in place. IMO it is really important to have coaching and FO continuity.

We have never had that and in many ways it is foreign ground. Berry has constructed this team to fit this staff. The players acquired and how they are coached are taylored to this staff. This is the first time in memory where close to the entire team was built by this FO and staff. There are only a few guys remaining from past regimes.

We have good players and we have a staff that has been together. That helps. But until we have some more questions answered.

I have no clue how the Browns will do at this time.


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The key to what we do with Brissett has little to do with the O and everything to do with the D. We can win with Brissett if we don't get in to shoot-outs. If we can hold teams to around 23 points or less, we will have a good chance to win. If we hold them to under 20, we will win. If we have to score 28 or more, it might be a tough go.

Obviously the team has to structure the O in a way that gives Brissett a good chance to execute, but I think we will.


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Ballpeen #1946099 05/22/22 12:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Ballpeen
Just a few words on Njoku. . I don't get you people thinking the guy is a great TE.
I Don't get you guys thinking he is not a great tight end, it's annoying to read, I think anyone must be blind to not see it. It's in every catch he makes.
Njoku is a top 7 TE in the entire NFL, and if the Browns, knew how to use him, more often than way too sparingly.


Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
eotab #1946105 05/22/22 12:56 PM
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I can't wait for the Browns to win enough and make the playoffs again because they are doing the right and correct things, unfortunately I believe those things include keeping a team together and building a veteran group that stays together and includes top offensive scorers.


Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
Ballpeen #1946106 05/22/22 12:58 PM
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I don't know a thing about Brissett other than what others have said.

He must be decent just from his numbers. Obviously, he is not a starter. He was considered to be one at one point.

But he must be good enough to hold a job. If he can be good enough to not turn the ball over and really suck. We should still win some games with him.

That is the luxury of a good OL and a great run game. Just make the play that is there. If not throw it away. Punt. Let the defense work.

I think the defense will be good. I am begining to think Clowney has a deal in place but will not execute the deal till he can avoid mandatory mini camps.

Clowney takes care of his body. He stays in shape. He will be ready. I believe we will sign a tackle or, at least I am hopeful. But Clowney or a Robert Quinn are still key.

This is a strange year.

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Originally Posted by eotab
Guess what the only stat I care about is Baker is no longer a Brown.

Oh contraire tab. Baker is most certainly still a Brown.


Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.

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Some often overlook that a key element to holding teams to 23 or less, as you put it, is having an offense that can consistently stay on the field. No matter how good your defense is, it cannot keep your offense from laying an egg and giving the game away because the defense doesn't take the field when you are on offense. Just last year the Browns lost that one game where Greedy Williaims iirc. intercepted the pass to give the Browns the ball back (raiders), with the lead and the opponent having no time outs and less than 3 minutes to play.


Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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Quote
I don't know a thing about Brissett other than what others have said.

He must be decent just from his numbers. Obviously, he is not a starter. He was considered to be one at one point.

But he must be good enough to hold a job. If he can be good enough to not turn the ball over and really suck. We should still win some games with him.

Like you, I don't know a ton about Brissett. I did a little research.

Jacoby has some strengths. He has good size. I think he is 6'4" and between 220--230 lbs. He has a strong arm. He makes some very good plays. Apparently, he is pretty good at reading coverages. He also makes some great plays.

On the negative side, his completion percentage is pretty bad. His yards per attempt are not very good. He is said to make some head-scratching plays. He can make great throws and then confounding ones. While he can read coverages adequately, it takes him too long to do so.

I looked at several sites and even checked out his scouting report when he came out of college. I got a lot of good stuff from a Colts' writer who was doing a scouting report of Miami when they were getting to play one another and Brissett was going to be the starting qb. My biggest takeaway is that the dude said he was a great backup, but you wouldn't want him as your starter.

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Played for Belichick. He seems to be a bright guy.

I don't think he needs to do much really. We don't need him to be exceptional. "Do your job."

Make the plays that are there to be made. Don't turn it over. Hand it off. Use checkdowns. The offense is quarterback friendly.

It is about getting the ball out on time.

If he can play 500 ball or better. We should be fine.

DW is very good. He will be ready to go. IMO rust is not a factor.

It makes me laugh when I read projections by people. There is no way to project DW with this team in this offense against our schedule.

All these people trying to be gypsy fortune tellers.

I have patience. I will wait and see.

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Originally Posted by jfanent
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....that's ignoring the possibility that reports that NFL teams are pissed at Haslam and want to make the team suffer a little for setting a new precedent in signing a fully guaranteed $1/4 Billion contract.

This is probably the worst of the reasons given for why there's been no trade interest for BM. There isn't a team in the league that is going to pass on getting a qb they think would improve the team because of FO sissy fights.

Exactly.

A team looking to upgrade their QB is not going to do so because the Ravens owner and front office don't want anyone taking Baker off of our hands? Easy for Baltimore to say that, they aren't interested in Baker. Any GM who passes on a chance to upgrade the most important position on the team over something like that doesn't deserve to keep his job.


How does a league celebrating its 100th season only recognize the 53 most recent championships?

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How is the offense going to score points if Baker Mayfield is not the quarterback. ( The Browns excused him from mandatory minicamp.)
Neither DeShaun Watson, nor whoever emerges from Josh Dobbs or Jacoby Brissett, will have shown they can yet lead scoring drives.
So Where are the points going to come from?


Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
THROW LONG #1949907 06/10/22 06:12 PM
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Originally Posted by THROW LONG
So Where are the points going to come from?

Cade "Velveeta" York.

Milk Man #1949909 06/10/22 06:30 PM
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How/why would that be or is the kickers' nickname.
How is that a better nickname than CaPTain CADE! MAN!! would be for that kicker?
frown and that won't work because the Browns don't try kicks because their analytics ruin their chances by going for 4th downs, and let their team know they are going on 4th downs, so the team underachieves on 3rd downs,(because they don't treat it like the final down or punt anymore, because they know the analytics will go for it on the 4th down,) which alters the analytics in a negative way. So.
Who is going to score points?


Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
THROW LONG #1949912 06/10/22 06:44 PM
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Originally Posted by THROW LONG
How/why would that be or is the kickers' nickname.
How is that a better nickname than CaPTain CADE! MAN!! would be for that kicker?

How about "Queso" Cade?

https://www.wafb.com/2021/09/22/lsu-kicker-cade-york-signs-endorsement-deal-with-velveeta/

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Originally Posted by Versatile Dog
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I don't know a thing about Brissett other than what others have said.

He must be decent just from his numbers. Obviously, he is not a starter. He was considered to be one at one point.

But he must be good enough to hold a job. If he can be good enough to not turn the ball over and really suck. We should still win some games with him.

Like you, I don't know a ton about Brissett. I did a little research.

Jacoby has some strengths. He has good size. I think he is 6'4" and between 220--230 lbs. He has a strong arm. He makes some very good plays. Apparently, he is pretty good at reading coverages. He also makes some great plays.

On the negative side, his completion percentage is pretty bad. His yards per attempt are not very good. He is said to make some head-scratching plays. He can make great throws and then confounding ones. While he can read coverages adequately, it takes him too long to do so.

I looked at several sites and even checked out his scouting report when he came out of college. I got a lot of good stuff from a Colts' writer who was doing a scouting report of Miami when they were getting to play one another and Brissett was going to be the starting qb. My biggest takeaway is that the dude said he was a great backup, but you wouldn't want him as your starter.

Nice analysis.

I have friends who are Colts fans. Their take is Brissett tried too hard to convince everyone he is the starter. Here in Cleveland, his role is the backup. He may relax more. They compare Brissett to a Walmart version of Lamar Jackson. As you said, he reads coverages and has a strong accurate arm when things are going right.

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Jacoby Brissett is not a good QB. He's going to make Baker look like Justin Herbert.

cfrs15 #1949948 06/11/22 12:48 AM
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Originally Posted by cfrs15
Jacoby Brissett is not a good QB. He's going to make Baker look like Justin Herbert.

I don't disagree. I agree Baker is a much more starting QB than Brissett. If I was paying the tab for a backup QB, I much prefer Brissett over Baker. That by no means Brissett is better. It simply means Brissett is a better value as a backup.

cfrs15 #1949953 06/11/22 02:34 AM
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Originally Posted by cfrs15
Jacoby Brissett is not a good QB. He's going to make Baker look like Justin Herbert.

Doesn't matter. Jacoby is the starter for the next 2 years minimum.

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