Posted by Mike Florio on July 29, 2022, 10:54 AM EDT link
After the three-day Deshaun Watson hearing ended four weeks ago yesterday, I predicted that we’d have a decision from Judge Sue L. Robinson during the week of July 25. I’ve got one more day to be not incorrect. It looks like I will be. Incorrect, that is.
Rob Maaddi of the Associated Press reports that the waiting game will continue into next week, with no decision coming today.
So when can a decision be expected? It’s been 29 days since the hearing ended. It’s been 17 days since the parties submitted written briefs. The Collective Bargaining Agreement contains no specific timetable for issuing a decision. However, it requires that a decision be issued “as soon as practicable following the conclusion of the hearing.”
That’s a potentially broad standard. What is, or isn’t, practicable? It depends on the case.
In this one, she’ll need to prepare a written ruling that explains what the evidence was, what the evidence wasn’t, what she believed the facts to be, and how the Personal Conduct Policy applies to those facts. It will need to be clear and understandable, especially if she imposes a suspension that falls far short of the one-year ban the league has requested. The average person will need to be able to read (if they so choose) the document and to understand why she decided whatever she decides.
Whatever the decision, it’s reportedly not coming today. Which implies that Judge Robinson has told the league and/or the NFL Players Association that a decision isn’t coming today. Which suggests that she’s keenly aware of the fact that folks would like to know what’s going to happen.
Obviously we're well into the "read too much into everything" phase, but I took this tweet to mean that the NFL/NFLPA ongoing negotiations theory is not true.
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
I can understand why some of my fellow posters feel the way they do about DW and that's fine. Everyone is entitled to his or her opinion and I respect that. If Deshaun leads us to a Super Bowl victory, and I hope he does, I don't think too many of my fellow Browns fans will be thinking about what he did or didn't do. JMO
Obviously we're well into the "read too much into everything" phase, but I took this tweet to mean that the NFL/NFLPA ongoing negotiations theory is not true.
Maybe.
peen and 05 can correct me if I am wrong, but it seems likely the former judge would want the parties to settle. Perhaps the two sides are just really far, far apart on what would be an acceptable suspension? Of course, I'm just guessing. No one knows jack.
AP sources: No decision in Watson discipline case this week
ROB MAADDI, AP Pro Football Writer July 29, 2022, Updated: July 29, 2022 10:02 a.m. link
The wait for a decision on potential discipline for Cleveland Browns quarterback Deshaun Watson following accusations of sexual misconduct will continue into another week.
Two people with knowledge of the situation told The Associated Press that retired judge Sue L. Robinson is not issuing a ruling Friday on Watson’s disciplinary hearing that concluded a month ago. They spoke to the AP on condition of anonymity because the discussions are private.
Watson was accused of sexual harassment and assault by 24 massage therapists and has settled 20 of the civil lawsuits. Two separate Texas grand juries declined to indict Watson on criminal complaints stemming from the allegations.
Watson, who played for four seasons with Houston before being traded to Cleveland in March, has been practicing with the Browns while Robinson has spent weeks trying to determine whether the three-time Pro Bowl quarterback violated the NFL’s personal conduct policy and whether to impose discipline.
The league argued for an indefinite suspension of at least one year during a three-day hearing in Delaware last month. The NFL Players’ Association pushed for no punishment, though a person familiar with Watson’s defense told the AP in June that a suspension is expected and the goal is to have Watson play this season.
Both sides submitted post-hearing briefs by July 12 and hoped for a decision before training camp opened this week. Robinson is carefully considering the case and isn’t held to a deadline.
If Robinson, who was jointly appointed by the league and the players’ union, imposes any punishment, either side can appeal. In that case, NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell or his designee “will issue a written decision that will constitute full, final and complete disposition of the dispute,” per terms of Article 46 in the collective bargaining agreement.
Jacoby Brissett would replace Watson as Cleveland's starter during a suspension.
“With Deshaun, I know there is that uncertainty, like we talked about (Wednesday), but we can only control what we can control," Browns coach Kevin Stefanski said Thursday. "I think that is what he has done a very nice job of. So much of that in football is there is a lot of volume to what we are doing right now when it comes to football, so there are a lot of meetings, there is a lot of install and there is a lot of workout, walkthrough and practice. He has really thrown himself into that.”
AP Sports Writer Tom Withers contributed to this report.
I'd argue you did bring Florio into it when you disputed what he originally reported. More importantly, though, all we have are snippets and interpretations. Even the whole "26 women can't be liars" isn't even a fact. By the rules you seem want to have in place, we have exactly 0 pieces of information from which to rationally discuss the Watson situation.
A first hand account by a victim is considered as evidence. Repeating an account second hand is hearsay.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
Had the two sides have been able to reach a settlement that would have taken place well before now. I think it's much the way Vers describes it. The two sides are nowhere close. They were never close because if they were it would have been a done deal. Let's face it, all of this being in the press day in and day out isn't good for anyone.
They knew they weren't close going into the hearing. So did Robinson. There was and is no real chance for any settlement and hasn't been for some time now. All there is left to do is wait.
I actually expected a decision late today so as to help bury the outcome in the week-end news cycle where less press is out there. Where people are busy and do not follow the news as much. The reason being no matter which way this all goes down it won't be pretty. Over half of the population are women and while not all women will think the same way, there will certainly be a big outcry if they go easy on watson.
About 15% of the population are minorities and they also don't all think the same. But you'll hear an outcry from many of them if the suspension on watson is harsh. It's pretty much a lose/lose proposition either way it goes.
But the more I read the less I expect that decision to come today. I still however wouldn't be surprised if it does.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
I think that's fair speculation. In my experience, I've never come across a judge who did not prefer a settlement vs a ruling. They may hint at leverage sometimes by indicating where one side's argument seems to be falling short to hopefully level set the negotiations. Like you said, I don't know if that has been done in this case or not.
Blue ostriches on crack float on milkshakes between the sidewalk titans of gurglefitz. --YTown
If Deshaun leads us to a Super Bowl victory, and I hope he does, I don't think too many of my fellow Browns fans will be thinking about what he did or didn't do. JMO
That is fine if some people want to feel that way. However, many fans may have become Browns fans, in the good old days not just because the Browns were good, but because unlike the college game, the NFL teams kept their players longer than 4 years, or 2-3 productive years. And when the Browns, act like they don't care about the players who suit up, or recently just suited up for their team, and act that way consistently, then I don't think the Browns, in those times, reflect the best of the 32 NFL franchises, in fact I can't think of any, let alone 3 other NFL franchises that so consistently don't seem to have their own players backs, instead of the next outside prospect And maybe it doesn't mean anything to them maybe it doesn't matter to the team. The team represents the city, and the state, and there's always something to that.
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
I can understand why some of my fellow posters feel the way they do about DW and that's fine. Everyone is entitled to his or her opinion and I respect that. If Deshaun leads us to a Super Bowl victory, and I hope he does, I don't think too many of my fellow Browns fans will be thinking about what he did or didn't do. JMO
I'm a father to 2 girls. I would never leave them alone in the same room at Watson. I won't be watching the Browns until he is gone either. The man did not prove himself innocent. He just paid them enough money to shut them up and then there are all the ones the Texan paid off. That's over 50 women that had to be paid shut up money. Only 4 were will to say to hell with the money we want you in court. I get it though since it's very hard to prove one way or another but to put it into context ... if you leave Walmart and just 5 people say you stole something then chances are you are going to jail. I'm just saying.
I don't believe it's ok to put a sexual predator on a pedestal and say he is a great man just because he can throw a football. I can't support a team that allows this kind of behavior to be OK so I am done until he is off the team. It's not about the wins or losses it's about having pride in something that represents home. Yeah I want to win but not at any cost.
You can't fix stupid but you can destroy ignorance. When you destroy ignorance you remove the justifications for evil. If you want to destroy evil then educate our people. Hate is a tool of the stupid to deal with what they can't understand.
Poor ladies as really they need to be named if they want. Proving they are survivors not victims. They need to band together like the other women did in the Cosby case. Really DW facing 2-9 game suspension is a slap on the list there. Needs to be suspended for a year or two. Just saying. But so far it seems for now, the criminal aspect of the case seems to be put on t he backburner.
Had the two sides have been able to reach a settlement that would have taken place well before now. I think it's much the way Vers describes it. The two sides are nowhere close. They were never close because if they were it would have been a done deal. Let's face it, all of this being in the press day in and day out isn't good for anyone.
They knew they weren't close going into the hearing. So did Robinson. There was and is no real chance for any settlement and hasn't been for some time now. All there is left to do is wait.
I actually expected a decision late today so as to help bury the outcome in the week-end news cycle where less press is out there. Where people are busy and do not follow the news as much. The reason being no matter which way this all goes down it won't be pretty. Over half of the population are women and while not all women will think the same way, there will certainly be a big outcry if they go easy on watson.
About 15% of the population are minorities and they also don't all think the same. But you'll hear an outcry from many of them if the suspension on watson is harsh. It's pretty much a lose/lose proposition either way it goes.
But the more I read the less I expect that decision to come today. I still however wouldn't be surprised if it does.
The sport news cycle might be highest on weekends. The best time to bury it is during preseason when there is game action. The very best is once the season starts, or just before.
Actually, the idea of burying the news pertained to newspapers. Saturday was the lowest readership day, so you wanted a release on Friday afternoon. With todays loss of newspapers to round the clock news cycles on several networks, not to mention all of the social platforms, I am not sure there is a thing as burying the news any longer.
One thing to remember, this situation impacts us Browns fans and a few ex-Browns fans. While it is top of the mind for us fans, it isn't the same around the country. I don't think people care all that much. I know I wasn't paying all that much attention to the situations with other players when they ran afoul of the NFL conduct policy.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn.
I can understand why some of my fellow posters feel the way they do about DW and that's fine. Everyone is entitled to his or her opinion and I respect that. If Deshaun leads us to a Super Bowl victory, and I hope he does, I don't think too many of my fellow Browns fans will be thinking about what he did or didn't do. JMO
I suppose that is correct. sadly, we seem to, as a whole, consider his W/L record over his personal conduct record..
I'll cheer him on as a Browns fan because I cheer for the Browns, not one player over another. No matter what however, I think this kid has a bad record of conduct... Nothing can change it.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.” Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe." Damanshot
I can understand why some of my fellow posters feel the way they do about DW and that's fine. Everyone is entitled to his or her opinion and I respect that. If Deshaun leads us to a Super Bowl victory, and I hope he does, I don't think too many of my fellow Browns fans will be thinking about what he did or didn't do. JMO
I suppose that is correct. sadly, we seem to, as a whole, consider his W/L record over his personal conduct record..
I'll cheer him on as a Browns fan because I cheer for the Browns, not one player over another. No matter what however, I think this kid has a bad record of conduct... Nothing can change it.
I am only speaking for myself.
I don't believe in condemning a man w/out the burden of proof. I don't believe in he had to "prove his innocence" that was stated earlier on this page. I do not think I am omniscient and know all the facts of the case. I rely on the legal system to sort out legal issues. I do not believe in the mob mentality and find the Court of Public Opinion to be fickle and narrow-minded. I think it is wrong to say a man is a bad person w/out proof and it's unfortunate that so many people assume one's guilt and that man's name will be tarnished forever by those who are unworthy to decide guilt and innocence. I don't know if Watson is guilty or innocent, but I refuse to assign guilt to a man who has not even been charged w/a crime, nevermind convicted of one.
I have no problem w/others if they don't want to root for the Browns for any reason. However, I do not like the trolls who don't like the team and come on here and trash the team and its fans repeatedly. Everyone has a choice to make, but to purposely make others miserable is not a good characteristic.
Those who criticize Watson and his past 'off the field behavior' should not be labeled as "trolls" just because their opinions concerning Watson are different than your own !
I can understand why some of my fellow posters feel the way they do about DW and that's fine. Everyone is entitled to his or her opinion and I respect that. If Deshaun leads us to a Super Bowl victory, and I hope he does, I don't think too many of my fellow Browns fans will be thinking about what he did or didn't do. JMO
I suppose that is correct. sadly, we seem to, as a whole, consider his W/L record over his personal conduct record..
I'll cheer him on as a Browns fan because I cheer for the Browns, not one player over another. No matter what however, I think this kid has a bad record of conduct... Nothing can change it.
I am only speaking for myself.
I don't believe in condemning a man w/out the burden of proof. I don't believe in he had to "prove his innocence" that was stated earlier on this page. I do not think I am omniscient and know all the facts of the case. I rely on the legal system to sort out legal issues. I do not believe in the mob mentality and find the Court of Public Opinion to be fickle and narrow-minded. I think it is wrong to say a man is a bad person w/out proof and it's unfortunate that so many people assume one's guilt and that man's name will be tarnished forever by those who are unworthy to decide guilt and innocence. I don't know if Watson is guilty or innocent, but I refuse to assign guilt to a man who has not even been charged w/a crime, nevermind convicted of one.
I have no problem w/others if they don't want to root for the Browns for any reason. However, I do not like the trolls who don't like the team and come on here and trash the team and its fans repeatedly. Everyone has a choice to make, but to purposely make others miserable is not a good characteristic.
This is a comical thread. The bullcrap self-righteous defense of the poor millionaire QB, framed, when all he was trying to do was support a few score of young female massage therapists. Have some self-respect and just say I'll root for anyone with a pulse no matter how despicable if it helps my team win.
Those who criticize Watson and his past 'off the field behavior' should not be labeled as "trolls" just because their opinions concerning Watson are different than your own !
Keep that in mind...jmo
I agree, but it goes much beyond that.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn.
This was part of a larger article, but I was able to find clips of this fairly important data.
Quote
This graph represents a QB’s ability to overcome the expectations they’ve created. Quarterbacks such as Deshaun Watson and Drew Brees — who are not great decision-makers — can still produce at effective clips by overcoming their decision-making and executing above their expectation. The ability to execute is likely the most important QB metric because how well a QB executes — the X-axis of the above graph — better predicts next year's EPA(R value of 0.46) than EPA itself (0.43).
I can understand why some of my fellow posters feel the way they do about DW and that's fine. Everyone is entitled to his or her opinion and I respect that. If Deshaun leads us to a Super Bowl victory, and I hope he does, I don't think too many of my fellow Browns fans will be thinking about what he did or didn't do. JMO
I suppose that is correct. sadly, we seem to, as a whole, consider his W/L record over his personal conduct record..
I'll cheer him on as a Browns fan because I cheer for the Browns, not one player over another. No matter what however, I think this kid has a bad record of conduct... Nothing can change it.
I am only speaking for myself.
I don't believe in condemning a man w/out the burden of proof. I don't believe in he had to "prove his innocence" that was stated earlier on this page. I do not think I am omniscient and know all the facts of the case. I rely on the legal system to sort out legal issues. I do not believe in the mob mentality and find the Court of Public Opinion to be fickle and narrow-minded. I think it is wrong to say a man is a bad person w/out proof and it's unfortunate that so many people assume one's guilt and that man's name will be tarnished forever by those who are unworthy to decide guilt and innocence. I don't know if Watson is guilty or innocent, but I refuse to assign guilt to a man who has not even been charged w/a crime, nevermind convicted of one.
I have no problem w/others if they don't want to root for the Browns for any reason. However, I do not like the trolls who don't like the team and come on here and trash the team and its fans repeatedly. Everyone has a choice to make, but to purposely make others miserable is not a good characteristic.
With all that you said while standing on your soapbox preaching your holier than thou campaign for Watson, you have no problem attacking the integrity of the lawyer or what is now 30 women claiming sexual misconduct and abuse. You claim to not be omniscient yet have no problem discounting 20 of the settled cases due to legal mumbo jumbo of an NDA attached to a settlement that conveniently admits no quilt while forking over untold millions for their silence. All this while posting discrimination claims against the NFL for not lowering the hammer on the Texans for settling enabling claims using the exact same settlement mumbo jumbo that Watson is trying to pass off as proof of innocence.
To be candid, for a person who claims to not believe in mob mentality and finds the Court of Public opinion fickle and narrow-minded, you are doing the exact same wrong thing to the lawyer and his 30 plus clients by questioning their motives and are fine with tarnishing them forever with the character assassination of said individuals to fit your narrative. You're no more worthy to decide guilt or innocence than the monkey at the zoo. If you really cared about the guilt or innocence of Watson, you would be campaigning for his day in court where he would have to take the stand and answer all 30 plus alleged claims in front of a jury of his peers in a civil setting. Instead, the mob mentality of admitting no quilt while forking over millions with an NDA while maintaining your character assassination of the plaintiffs while ignoring any suggestion that Watson violated the NFL PCP is your campaign. Narrow-minded and fickle - look in the mirror!
Good morning, steve. Glad to see you in such a good mood.
I'm in a good mood too. We are going from Baker [ranked 32nd or 33rd] in QB Execution Relative to Decision to Watson who is ranked 3rd overall for the time period of 2019--2021. It's great being a Browns fan!
Good morning, steve. Glad to see you in such a good mood.
I'm in a good mood too. We are going from Baker [ranked 32nd or 33rd] in QB Execution Relative to Decision to Watson who is ranked 3rd overall for the time period of 2019--2021. It's great being a Browns fan!
Is that for his career or just last season?
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.” Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe." Damanshot
Good morning, steve. Glad to see you in such a good mood.
I'm in a good mood too. We are going from Baker [ranked 32nd or 33rd] in QB Execution Relative to Decision to Watson who is ranked 3rd overall for the time period of 2019--2021. It's great being a Browns fan!
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