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There is probably a lot of data on injuries that i am unaware of.

The NFLPA has done a lot over the years about limits on practices. Spring through camp.

It has gotten to the point where all the media coverage is not really informative.

I don't pay attention to much till the regular season begins. The big thing is get through camp without injury.

Today these athletes for the most have to stay in shape all year. The off season is recovery and rehab but still they maintain workouts.

Camp is no longer beat each other up like it use to be. It is about learning the installs and execution. They run the plays but full to the ground tackling does not happen that much. It is a long season practices are different.

It is not Browns camp cupcake. It is the rules for all teams.

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j/c: There has been some unwarranted criticism of Kevin Stefanski popping up on this board recently. One of the concerns has been his scheme. Here is an old article that analyzes Stefanski's scheme. It's done by Jake Burns, who I think does a better job of breaking down film than anyone in the business. I'll post the text, but it would be worth your while to see the photos, diagrams, and videos. One note----some of the videos are no longer available. This article is for those of you who like to be educated about the game of football w/out all the agenda crap.

Quote
Breaking Down the Kevin Stefanski Offense Part I: Wide Zone Run
by Jake Burns
Jan 16, 2020
(Photo: David Berding-USA TODAY Sports)

CLEVELAND, Ohio -- Kevin Stefanski took over as the Vikings offensive coordinator in late 2018 upon the firing of John DeFilippo from the same role. The Vikings front office and coaching staff made it clear they weren't getting enough done in the run game to offset, and balance, Kirk Cousins. From the minute he took the role, the Vikings offense changed.

In Stefanski's first two games the Vikings ran for a total of 320 yards - by far their best two-week stretch in the 2018 season. They found the comfort they needed in honing their perimeter rushing attack to let Dalvin Cook become the important factor many knew he could be. The groundwork was laid for the 2019 season.

Then Gary Kubiak arrived and his presence helped Stefanski put his full plan in action.

Stefanski remembered watching Kubiak's offense with the Texans from 2006-2013 and loving the way he married the run and pass, and he mentioned this past year that when he finally got his chance to design and call his own offense, this was the way he wanted to do it.

Vikings coach Mike Zimmer mentioned just how important Kubiak's impression has been on Stefanski dating back years before the two worked together. "I just love Gary's demeanor and the way that he and Kevin [Stefanski] can communicate during the games and also during the week on game plans.” Zimmer continued, "For him to be able to come in and mentor a young coordinator was really important. To me, that’s about talking about your particular scheme and making sure that carries on in the future. I think that part was as important to me as anything.”

The duo worked into action what became one of the league's better offense despite some clear deficiencies up front. But how does it all work? Why is the scheme so quarterback and run game friendly? Well, it starts and ends with the wide (or outside) zone. Some call it a different name, but the teaching is pretty much the same.

Stefanski has been very vocal about his passion for the scheme and it manifested itself fully in 2019. The Vikings prep from day one of install all the way through weekly practices during the season. It was truly their bread and butter. The offense's identity.

Former NFL quarterback Sage Rosenfels played in the system and he noted just how important the scheme is to the offenses success.


“The outside zone [run] is what makes the whole thing happen,” Rosenfels said. “There’s what you call a ‘stretch’ play and as the linemen work down the line, they are trying to cut people off. Center and guard cutting people off as one of them works up to the linebacker. If you can get somebody out of a gap…there can be a big hole there if everyone else gets blocked. It’s about forcing defenses to stay in their gaps…so they have to play the run first. On top of that those plays create great movement from the defense laterally and it basically creates this wall and pass protection off of it…if the defense has all come into their gaps it creates these big spots down the field because everyone is so close to the line of scrimmage.”

The scheme puts pressure on all eleven defenders, and it does so with as much eye manipulation as you can find. The challenge is being able to establish it and run it the right way. The Vikings did just that and it helped result in over 2,000 team rushing yards.

So let's dig in on how the scheme works.

Responsibilities of the Offensive Line (and tight ends)

The outside zone concept is simple enough. When running the outside zone, rather than engage a defender at the snap, offensive linemen are taught to take a step to the play side. This allows them to achieve proper leverage, and, if possible, puts them in position to turn the defender back to the inside. If this proves impossible, the lineman (or tight end) should push their defender toward the play-side sideline.

The responsibilities of each individual lineman depend largely on whether or not they’re covered (a defensive linemen directly across from them, or close to it) at the snap of the ball. If they are covered, the offensive lineman’s job is straightforward – achieve proper leverage and block that defender. If they are not covered, the offensive lineman’s job is less straightforward – they must either help double team one of the defenders before disengaging and getting up to the second level of the defense, or they must go to the second level immediately.

The scheme does exactly what the name indicates: puts pressure on the defense laterally. Whereas the inside zone is about creating vertical movement, wide zone is all about moving laterally to outflank the defense and pin them inside or run them to the sideline letting your ball carrier's vision do the work.

Here's how the scheme is taught and instructed by coaches: Offensive linemen begin the play by stepping laterally to the play side and attempting to reach the outside shoulder of their designated defender. If the lineman is successful in getting to the outside shoulder, he pins the defender inside (rip). If the lineman has not reached the defender by the third step, he switches gears and looks to run the defender all the way to the sideline (run). Often times common sense of alignment tells a lineman he can't reach his defender so he works to create the wall and makes his work pushing the defender wide to create an alley.


The coaching points tend to be:

Short 45 degree lead step
Rip to run on second step by driving back shoulder through defender - this provides for a cutoff scenario
Get stomach up field on third step - this ensures the defender is cut-off from his gap responsibility.
(Photo: X&Olabs.com)

Here is some example play art of what the scheme looks like.


What you will see here is an excellent "rip" from right guard on the 3-technique defensive tackle, and an excellent "run" from right tackle on the box safety and the tight end on the 7-technique to create this massive void for the running back. Look at this alley.



When it hits correctly, it is a thing of beauty as you will see here.


Responsibilities of the Running Back

Just as important to the successful technique and teaching of the offensive line is the teaching and applied vision of the running back. With wide zone it takes a tremendous amount of patience and anticipation to feel where the defense is running and how the scheme is setting up in front of you.

On each rep of the scheme, the back has three read options: bounce, bang, or bend.


Let's look at all three with some examples from the 2019 Vikings.

Bounce Course

The bounce read means exactly how it sounds: bouncing the run outside. The goal of the play-side tackle, or tight end, is to hook the defender and then being able to bounce the ball outside for success. Rarely do these bounce paths hit home runs, but it is the easiest read for the running back and usually means cheap yards and first downs.


The Vikings were able to hit the perimeter plenty using wide zone in 2019 and this was in large part due to tackles who moved well and tight ends who cared about the quality of their blocking. The play-side tight end eats the defensive end’s crash and the full back leads to seal the edge. Cheap and easy yards.



Just enough seal from the in-line tight end to let the running back turn the corner and then the wing tight end helps hook the second level. Again, cheap and easy yards just using effective blocking and speed to turn the corner.



Bang Course


Now, defenses eventually get smart. They get annoyed with those easy outside run in their direction and they themselves start running laterally to push the aiming point and run the back to the sideline. The thought process is about turning the run back inside to the pursuit. The counter to this is running the bang course. The frontside defensive line and linebackers get zealous with poor pursuit down the line and you can make this scheme work beautifully.

The running back is deciding that the defense has taken away the bounce path to the frontside, and your line has decided to push the defense toward the sideline hoping to open up that frontside alley.


Cook, much like Nick Chubb, has that ability to make one cut and accelerate through alleys created in this scheme. When the backside cuts off, or runs their man by, the bang course can open up some big plays for the running game.

The tackle and tight end to the play-side use the wide leverage of the end and linebacker to push them outside. The right guard and center work to reach and wall off the 3-technique and MIKE linebacker. This is textbook blocking and big chunk play on the bang read.



The Vikings got sneaky good at running wide zone out the weakside of the formation under Stefanski last year. Watch here as they use the Saints tendency to slant strong side and it makes for and easy hook by the right guard on the crashing defensive end. Then the right tackle runs the WILL linebacker outside to open up the bang course for a big gain.



Bend Course


Lastly, we have the home run hitter. Defenses get so tired of being reach blocked and gashed, or watch so much film of the wide scheme that they determine they are going to be hyper-aggressive at the point of attack. They aim to beat the offensive line down the line to take away those gaps. When this happens, it has the propensity to open up the cutback, or bend course, that springs these plays out the backside of the run course.

The bend occurs when the first and second read are both stretching and running outside.


The Vikings hit some big plays when the bend course presented itself as more teams tried to push lateral on them. It takes a tremendous amount of discipline from the defense. Once Cook feels the Packers pushing four defenders to seal the edge, he bends it back inside and the tackle, all the way back on the right side, makes the key block. Then it's about open-field athleticism, something Cook and Chubb both have.



(Alex Rollins)
Watch Cook observe his two frontside lineman drive outside, then feel with patience his backside guard and tackle run by as well. He bends it all the way back off the opposite hash to spring this open for an 85-yard touchdown. The bend course takes elite vision and patience to set-up the blocks and explode out the opposite side of the initial run course.



They won't all be home runs on the bend, but it takes just one man missing or one extra downfield block to spring a big play. Cook reads the front side, including the backside guard, run the Lions defensive line outside and bends it back perfectly inside his tackle. The scheme works as it should and the only man who can make the play is the backside corner being aggressive chasing inside. He misses the tackle and it's a touchdown. This is also where you start noticing play-action shot opportunities with aggressive defensive backs playing run game near the box.




Final Thoughts

The wide zone scheme is taking over the NFL and for good reason. Although Stefanski is well-regarded as a leader-of-men and the type of analytically driven mind the Browns wanted, make no mistake they saw an ideal fit with this scheme. It played a key role in Stefanski getting the job, and his offensive success starts and ends with wide zone.

According to Pro Football Focus, the Vikings ran the most outside zone type concepts in the NFL (279 rushes) and were successful on 38.7 percent of the time – 13th in the NFL. The Browns ran similar concepts 181 times (5th most) and were successful 43.6 percent of the time – 6th best in the NFL. The good news: the Browns already have a feel for the scheme and they have the right running back to carry his offensive line within the scheme. They ran a good amount of the scheme from the gun, with some sprinkled in under-center, but they found success with the play. You can see the two different paths here.





What makes Chubb so special is his ability to see the second level almost a beat ahead. Like a gifted point guard in a sense. He confuses linebackers with his ability to press holes and then make those impactful one-cut moves that leave defenders guessing. The fit for the third-year back, who finished second in the league in rushing yards in 2019, is more than ideal.




The difference for the Vikings commitment to the scheme. Above all else, they made it their identity. Something their entire offense built from. It doesn't take a trained eye to notice the commitment from all eleven offensive players, how well-coached the timing and technique is across the line, and just how punishing the Vikings offense was when using their comfortable base play.



(Matt Bowen)
Something you will also notice in 2020 is an uptick in "12" personnel (one running back, two tight ends) and "21" personnel with a true full back (two running backs, one tight end) and even some "22" personnel (two running backs, two tight ends) on occasion. Pro Football Focus tells us the Vikings utilized a lead blocker the 4th most times in the NFL (150 rushes) and were successful 42.7 percent of the time (7th). The Browns utilized a lead blocker the 17th most in the NFL (64 rushes) and were successful 40.6 percent of the time (11th). Another marriage of something the Browns do well with a play-caller who will use it more often. A grand idea indeed.

The commitment also helped the offense build deception off the scheme. It was so drastic that it opened up several options off the scheme down to down. It did wonders for marrying their run/pass looks and helped Cousins find efficient success like never before in his career. They will hope it does the same for Baker Mayfield. More to come on that in Part II.

Don't just take my word for it, take Nick Ferguson's who played safety during the scheme's heavy use in the Broncos title run.

“I played against the scheme, I practiced against the scheme and I coached against the scheme, they give you different things to worry about,” Ferguson said. “They attack you on all three levels, they attack you horizontally and vertically. Watching the Cowboys game I was blown out of my mind how many ways they use Cook. They use him as a decoy, they use him in the screen game, they gave him toss plays. The idea is that they get everyone involved in the offense so you can’t key on one particular player.

“When they think they’ve figured out the run then you go play-pass and throw the ball down field. They give you so many personnel groupings and you think you’re getting the same play with the personnel grouping and they give you something else.”

Stefanski is close with the Quarterback Collective and that group of coaches is heavy on identity football. The likes of Mike and Kyle Shanahan, Sean McVay, Matt LaFleur, Rich Scangarello, and Mike McDaniel among others. Tweaks here and there, but the groups believe in similar principles and aligning their offense to their talent.


The scheme isn’t perfect, as no scheme truly is. It’s at its most successful level when used deceptively. Fall behind by large amounts like we saw from last week’s loss to the 49ers and that deadly deception is gone in predictable pass situations. It’s not the lone ingredient for a successful offense, but it plays a massive role, and that role can, and will, help win plenty of football games at the NFL level.

We won't know how the final product will end with this offense, and we obviously won't know what type of head coach Kevin Stefanski is for a long time into the future. There won't be any promises from me with his ability to lead the franchise as a whole. But I can promise the offense will be coached at a high-quality level, with more attention to detail, and for the first time in a while they will have a real identity.

**For even more detailed resources on the wide zone run play, follow this link to X&O’s Lab.**

https://247sports.com/nfl/cleveland...142274849/Amp/?__twitter_impression=true

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Good read.

We will see the advanced version because we have been running it and we have the OL to do it well.

This will be an interesting year. I like the offense and believe in it. I also believe in Stefanski.

It will be a challenge this year with JB. There are things I am sure KS would like to do and can not with JB.

At the same time as I have mentioned before I believe Hunt and the TE's will be more active in touches. Hunt will be used more in the pass.

Chubb is killer in the wide zone. The scheme suits his best skills.

I am at peace with this season and look forward to seeing certain guys.

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I think we will use Hunt more in the passing game, too. I think the TEs will receive a lot of targets. I see a big year for Njoku.

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Originally Posted by Versatile Dog
I think we will use Hunt more in the passing game, too. I think the TEs will receive a lot of targets. I see a big year for Njoku.
Njoku should should be getting 10 to 12 targets a game.
He is the only target that is a legit match-up problem for
Opposing DCs.

bonefish #1965907 08/29/22 01:02 PM
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I’ve seen places that assume Felton will be more of a WR than a RB (and I agree that’s the place to use him), but I’m also not sure he’s that much of an upgrade over other possibilities at WR.

I can’t get over the fact that we wouldn’t think Cole Beasley or Will Fuller are upgrades


"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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Originally Posted by bonefish
We will see the advanced version because we have been running it and we have the OL to do it well.

I think the advanced version is what they had hoped to run. I don't think they have a QB capable of running the advanced version at this point in time. I believe it will be the run game combined with the short passing game with very little vertical game. You have to play the hand you're dealt.

Quote
Terry Pluto: "Brissett is not a guy who will lead a high-scoring offense. The Browns’ plan should be, 'Get an early lead, then run the ball...chew up the clock...no turnovers...make your field goals...play smart.'"

https://www.cleveland.com/browns/20...zvqw19qNw9hjbTErSaISYuIATW1iHDQBCB0YWpPc

Last edited by PitDAWG; 08/29/22 01:17 PM.

Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.

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I have not read that article or watched the videos, but my concerns with Stefanski are not Xs and Os related. A head coach has to be so much more than an Xs and Os guy. Can he motivate his team? Can he outsmart the opposite sideline? Does he have a pulse on what the team needs and doesn't? Does he know when to press the gas and when to back off?

Those are all ambiguous things but leadership in a lot of ways is very ambiguous. The team needs a leader, not a play caller. Someone who is going to galvanize the team even when you are at a disadvantage.

Can someone point to a single game where you walked away saying to yourself that the Browns won because Stefanski out coached the other side? I can't think of a single time. As a matter of fact the best game under his regime he was in his basement.

He gets Brownie points for having an offense that some like and that he always stays calm. But I just don't get the feeling he's a guy that is going to rally a team.

The first four games this year will tell you all you need to know about him. They should be easy games. If he's a good coach he'll go 3-1.

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There is no one size fits all in terms of motivation. We have seen great coaches who are stoic, who are animated, who are emotional and who are stern. What so many wish to dismiss in their desire to blame Stefanski is that it's far more often a lack of execution than it is the call itself. As if when the players don't catch the ball, a player misses a tackle, a defender blows coverage etc..... somehow that's a Stefanski issue.


Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.

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You don't think he has managed the clock well? All coaches can be questioned on that, but he's done a very good job overall.

Does he hold players accountable? I'd say so. Hell, he kicked Wills off the field the other day for making boneheaded mistakes.

Was he in charge of basically the same roster that went 11-5 after going 6 and 10 the previous year?

Did he do a great job of keeping the team together during Covid? Remember, that was his first year and he somehow pulled it off.

Have guys talked about team unity and the positive vibes during TC?

Has he not been the one the owner and FO put in the eye of hurricane during all the distractions w/Watson? They showed up on the day of the signing and when the suspension was handed down, but otherwise, Stefanski has had to deal w/the media while breaking in three new qbs.

This team has had to deal w/a lot of distractions and Stefanski has never once wilted under the pressure.

We haven't even played a game this year and some media members and some fans are already trying to write his obituary. I think the criticism is misplaced and unfair.

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This is a good point from Vers about clock management. IMO that’s a strength of Stefanski and the staff in general. We are near the top of the NFL when it comes to it IMO


"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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Have the concerns been his scheme, or the manner in which he is employing/utilizing it? There is quite a distinction to be made there.

We know the scheme itself is perfectly sound. It's nothing new or groundbreaking; it's quite proven... but, its effectiveness is determined by those implementing it.



Aside from that, I honestly don't know why people keep saying things like they expect to see something different or more grand than what we've already seen. We've seen this offense with great QB play and we've seen it with poor QB play. The run game has never been anything but consistent. The TE's are the TE's and same for the WR's. We're starting Year 3 of this offense for everyone but the QBs.... it pretty much is what it has always been and that's mostly going to be because the people controlling it are the same. It's their personality that shapes how the scheme is implemented, even when they are being a blind slave to what the numbers say to do on a given down & distance.


Browns is the Browns

... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.

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IMO there are no easy games especially when you are starting a backup quarterback.

Leadership in the NFL is putting players in the position to do well. Have a good scheme and show them how to execute that scheme.

Have good game plans that players can see and buy into. Win.

2020 had to be one of the most difficult seasons of all time. Covid was a nightmare to work around. Losing different starters every week. We played a game where we almost had no receivers.

Stefanski kept the team together and overcame a lot.

When I watch "Building the Browns" I like how he handles things. He seems like a guy you could respect.

No HC calls a perfect game because players are not perfect.


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Originally Posted by Dawgs4Life
This is a good point from Vers about clock management. IMO that’s a strength of Stefanski and the staff in general. We are near the top of the NFL when it comes to it IMO

Agree 100. Night and day from the past. I considered offering my services for free when Huey was in charge.

Stefanski has been nearly flawless. He has long crossed the bridge of understanding the math and progressed to something next-level...

Wish I could remember the game, pretty sure it was actually in 2020. May have been one of those games we almost lost after a big lead... Opponent had crossed into our territory. Stefanski burned a TO after a modest 1st down gain at just under 3:00. At first I was like, WTH?? After the team ran and failed on 2nd down I started nodding my head... After they did it again on third, I started clapping out load.

He used "clock management" as a psychological weapon to induce the other coach into doing what he wanted... or at least that's the way it seemed. We had the ball back and the lead with like 1:57 showing on the clock. Huey would have still been yelling for someone to bring him a calculator.


HERE WE GO BROWNIES! HERE WE GO!!
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I'd say his shoulder is healed and ready for contact



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Wrong shoulder

bonefish #1965995 08/29/22 07:25 PM
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Wrong thread.

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Getting nervous

bonefish #1966083 08/30/22 10:03 AM
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Sweep the leg...

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bonefish #1966613 09/01/22 02:42 PM
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The time of predictions has come.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles...-for-every-nfl-team-ahead-of-2022-season

Not my bag predicting but I do have some ideas about some of these predictions.

Tampa. 12-5 . I don't think so. More like 9 or 10 wins. IMO. They lost key guys on the OL. As fast as Brady reads and gets rid of the ball. A rush up the middle is a problem for him. It comes fast and he can't get away. I also think for the first time Brady becomes human. Age hits not just the body but your will.

Raiders 9-8. I think more like 11 or 12. They have good players on offense and see them being better than 9 wins.


Bills 13-4. Really good team it would be a shock if this team does not win 13. Well coached. Great players at key positions. Top notch defense. Experienced and hungry.

Browns 8-9. Honestly, I really need see a game. I think the Browns defense could be really good despite DT weakness. I know the strength of the OL and run game. So, a great defense and a strong run game can win games. But I have to see Jacoby inside this offense.

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Honestly, I really need see a game.

It really is hard to determine where the Browns are heading in terms of predicting an overall record.

Face it, the Browns pre season didn't tell us much because everyone within the organization was so worried that someone might get injured if our players played in the pre season...consequently many of our key players didn't play much.

The progress of the offense is usually behind the defense at the beginning of the season and given the Browns difficulties at QB, I expect less from the Browns offense than I might in a normal year.

Can Stefanski learn how to call a conservative offensive game that relies heavily on scoring FGs rather than touchdowns..?

Last edited by mac; 09/01/22 03:39 PM.



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No matter who is the quarterback. I do not think that coaches look to rely more on field goals.

Conservative can mean you may alter some kinds of aggressive throws down field. But the plan will be to score touchdowns.

I expect the offense to use more throws to the backs and TE's. That is the main reason Hunt was not going to get traded. It is also the reason they extended Njoku for high dollars.

Cooper IMO will work well with Jacoby. He is a real pro. He will be where he should be when he should be there. It has been reported they are working well together.

JB has experience. He should make plays he is comfortable with. Cooper should give him that comfort.

We can run it. I have no doubt about that. We should be able to keep the box open with seam throws to the TE's. And screens to the backs both inside and outside.

As long as we can keep the defenses honest with some passes downfield. We should be able to run an effective offense. Not explosive but efficient.

bonefish #1966641 09/01/22 04:30 PM
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I think we might line Hunt up in the slot on occasion or motion him out of the backfield and pass him the ball.

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I agree.

I would not be surprised if we see some 2 back looks as well.

From what I have read Felton has been in the slot some. That makes sense. He has good short area quickness and he can catch the ball.

I like Kevin Stefanski. This is his third year. He had a tough year to begin his head coaching experience with covid. That had to be a challenge.

He knows these players now. The OL has experience in the scheme. Cooper is a big add.

I can not think of another secondary as talented and deep as the Browns. Really I don't think there is one. This camp there was heavy emphasis placed on take aways. If our defense can be near the top at that stat. We will do well.

My main concern is not receiver because of our backs and TE's. My main concern is DT. Bryan and Elliott should be ok but damn Togiai and Winfrey are not very good at all. Both need more time.

Overall we should be in the games we play. Lot of close games are decided by field goals. It looks like we got a guy.


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bonefish #1966740 09/01/22 11:16 PM
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I think many get too hung up on who the receiver is rather than what schemes you can run with specific skill sets.

In my opinion, I think what Berry and Stefanski are trying to build is a very versatile offense. Creating an offense efficient enough to run 11-personnel, 12-personnel, and 21-personnel is the correct path to take. Bone and Vers make valid points on using Felton. Combining Felton with either Chubb or Hunt creates a strong 21-personnel scheme. In my opinion with Felton, you don't need to run Chubb and Hunt together. You can keep both fresh and still get versatility using Felton.

I can see why Berry and Stefanski are willing to spend the time to develop Schwartz. Having a receiver like Schwartz, and in my opinion, another receiver like Schwartz creates an offense that is hard to defend. With speed alone, it creates a match-up issue.

I like Cooper, but if you can give me two receivers with speed and can run go-routes and slants, I am all for it. Pay the OL and Watson specialize in the receivers, tight ends, and running backs.

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