DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Browns Players - Booms and Busts.

He won't be folded in until Dec. 4th.

I don't want to assume anything till it happens. Watson has to behave himself and clearly he has a problem, the counselling has to have a positive impact and as I understand it - someone has to sign off that Watson shows remorse and has self helped. That's just for him to play this year. Folks talking about having our FQB for the next 10 years ... I think it's one month at a time and keep your fingers crossed.

And no foul on the play. A win is a win, but a few things jump out that no one is talking about. 1) Our defense couldn't hold a 13-point lead - again. As well as our defense played overall, IMO - it's all lost because we couldn't hold that lead against what is an inferior team. 2) We are not going to win many games throwing for under 150 yards. Whether its Stefanski or Brissett, under 150 won't win us many games. 3) Finally, the Browns got some breaks in a game. The roughing the passer and the no-call on the intentional grounding allowed the Browns to sneak out a victory that they had just given away. I'm happy with the win (York is a stud) but I also know that if the refs made the right calls, we'd be talking about a loss instead of a win. 4) Game Busts: Njoku, 1 target and a catch for 7-yds at 13M plus avg per year player doesn't cut it. DT play, I cannot tell you the number of times I saw Elliott get blown of the ball by the Panthers o-line. 1 assist for the entire game is bust playmaking. 5) Wills is going to grade out bad again.

Kudos:
Bryant, completely out played the 13M man. The Browns need to get him more involved.
JOK, played a solid game and was all over the field
Garrett, for 3 quarters he was a beast (even if it was against a rookie LT), need to find out why he disappears in the 4th
Chubb and Hunt, there's a reason they are considered the best RB tandem in the league. They didn't disappoint.
York, if 1 game is any indication, the Browns have their kicker problems answered for the next 10-years.

Not when you're paying him an average salary of over 13M per season. He's not a dang rookie, he's been in the league 5-years now and we're still waiting on consistent top tier TE performance. When is he going to produce like a top tier TE like he's being paid for? Teams don't pay TE's over 13M per season for just their blocking ability and neither should the Browns.

Maybe, but is that a bad thing. I look at it like, well, Bitonio also blocked, and Bitonio couldn't get any targets because his position is ineligible, but he is not a bad player.
So, Njoku can be a boom, with having gotten only one, and he will get more. And it's not only about the previous game.

Blocking counts very little IMO. Just put in another lineman.

I am not saying Njoke was a bust, you do have to get targets. I just wouldn't tout blocking. If he couldn't do that and not get open, that would be a bust.

I think the big question for Njoku yesterday was what was he asked to do? If he was told to block on 95% of the plays, him getting open would have been bad. I suspect he was given yeoman's work to do and it did it well.

Come on man, really? You are truthfully going to state that against the Panthers he was told to block 95% of the plays? Like Ballpeen stated, "Blocking counts very little IMO. Just put in another lineman." Joe Haeg is only making 2.1M to be a blocker - we're paying Njoku over 13M per year average to block when we could use Haeg. Edit - Actually it's an AAV 14.187M per year (according to the ProFootball Network) for Njoku to block.

Highest Paid TE's
1. Waller - AAV 17M - Week 1, 6 targets - 4 receptions - 79 yards
2. Kittle - AAV 15M - Week 1, injured did not play
3. Kelce - AAV 14.313M - Week 1, 9 targets - 8 receptions - 121 yards - 1 TD
4. Goedert - AAV 14.25M - Week 1, 4 targets - 3 receptions - 60 yards
5. Njoku - AAV 14.187M - Week 1, 1 target - 1 reception - 7 yards

The only pass that JB nails is the 10 yard bullet with the receiver facing him sitting in a zone. He must have done that 5 times yesterday. Low and outside fastball with a lot of mustard.

Come on man, really?

I did not he WAS told to do anything. I don't know what his assignments were for each play but please be my guest and e plain in play and assignment in detail. I will be in awe of your brilliance. Or you can act like I said something I didn't so you can toss rancor.

Come on man, really?

That's a good observation - throws threading the needle or trying to put air on the ball to get over a defender and drop it into the receiver were bad. But it's week 1. We'll see what comes together over the next 3-4 weeks and we could see improvement.

Same thing with Njoku - for all the back and forth on Njoku after week 1 .... I am pretty certain that if he has 5 catches for 35 yards after week 5 everyone will agree that is not what you expect from your $13M Tight End. Great that his blocking was good - but not what wee are paying $13M for. But also not his fault if he was not asked to make the splash plays we have seen from him in the past. . . . wait 3-4 weeks and we can re-evaluate.

1. if he was blocking, he was told to block... what TE in their right mind is going to give up an opportunity to get into a route and catch a ball? They're not. So, if he was blocking, he was told to block.

2. the folly of the above statement is that it changes the defense. If you trot out another lineman and take out your only TE, the defense gets to sub, and they now know that there is, for certain, one less route runner. Then, there is the part where they have likely brought in one more bigger body instead of trying to cover that TE with a Linebacker or a Safety. "Blocking" may count very little (it doesn't), but personnel matters a LOT. Even if that TE never runs a route, especially with an athletic one like Njoku, the defense MUST respect the potential and account for it. That keeps one more smaller body out there and it also makes the defense respect the middle yardage rather than creeping everyone up.

j/c...

I like how (bust) Anthony Schwartz actually caught a pass... and then immediately fell to the ground, as if in shock.

I liked the catch and I liked the end around and the motion - the end around when he actually ran the ball, you got to see a glimpse of his speed. I understand why that has to be attractive to the FO, he looked blazing fast - it's just a case of: Can he catch? How can you utilize him and have him be impactful (in a positive way).

I've been very critical of Schwartz. Hopefully, that catch will build some confidence and he will be a contributor this year.

The problem with the end around is he immediately sought the sideline to avoid contact.

Barring some huge turnaround as the season moves on he's not long for this team beyond this year in my opinion.

Imagine if the team had resigned Landry. Landry and Cooper make a nice 1-2 punch.

Cooper takes off to many plays, he's a lazy ass bum

DPJ will be a number one because of lazy ass Cooper

Are you letting a dollar amount influence your judgement of play on the field?
If so Why?

You want a new signature? How about, "The voice of reason against the voice of reason."

Are you talking about Schwartz? I'm not letting anything influence me - I'm hoping a guy who has underperformed so far in his career "gets it" and somehow rewards the faith that the FO has put in him. I've criticized him for bad play - I'll mention the flash of potential when I see it.

While I agree - I also don't think Landry wanted to be here. I can't imagine the Browns offered less than he signed for - maybe I am wrong there. IDK.

* Edit: Just looked it up - Landry is on one year, $3M. Browns are $30M under the cap based on this web site: https://overthecap.com/salary-cap-space
Hard to believe the Browns FO wouldn't realize we are a better team paying Landry $4-5M for 1 season.

Is this something you noticed in the game?

I haven’t heard the narrative of Cooper being lazy. I’ve heard the narrative of him not doing well on the road or in the cold weather though. I saw a few clips of him toasting the CB but no pass went his way.

I agree. That said, it is also important to get that tackle out in to a route now and again and actually toss him the ball to keep the pass possibility alive.

Let me put it this way, I would rather the TE be an offensive weapon as a receiver rather than as a blocker. This isn't just about Njoke. It is about any team in any league. I also understand this is just my opinion.

Exactly and when you're paying a guy an AAV of 14.187M you would think that you'd get excellence.

Myles Garrett was a beast in that game though I think he appeared to slack of a bit in the 4th quarter but none the less, he had the highest PFF Grade for any player at 94.4 so I'm obviously wrong. He should be recognized for his effort and was obviously instrumental in the Browns win on Sunday.

If we are going to hand out kudos, we also need to point out weaknesses' if this team is going to get any better.

Njoku on the other hand didn't fare as well. In fact, of the 56 TE positions Graded for TE's last week he graded out at 37th out of 56 with an offensive grade of 56.1. The 5th highest paid TE in the league at an AVV of 14.187M went out an delivered a 56.1 grade for his money. Let's not kid ourselves, there's posters on this forum that have said he had a good game. When I say Njoku is a bust IMHO, I say it because his play for the last 5 years and 1 game proves he is a bust. I really get tired of hearing the same BS every game that he has potential and he's going to break out. Well, against Carolina he did exactly what he's done for the last 5 years and that's grossly underperform, even without Hooper here to blame it on.

Highest Paid TE's
1. Waller - AAV 17M - PFF Grade 69.2 - 14th
2. Kittle - AAV 15M - Week 1, injured did not play
3. Kelce - AAV 14.313M - PFF Grade 91.9 - 1st
4. Goedert - AAV 14.25M - PFF Grade 58.6 - 29th
5. Njoku - AAV 14.187M - PFF Grade 56.1 - 37th

As a side note, Wills continued his struggles against Carolina as he graded out 60th out of 64 OT's rated with a PFF Offensive Grade of 51.7.

Making sweeping declarations after week 1 is a fool's errand. Baker's 47.0 PFF grade would make him a mega bust by your logic there as it was worse than Njoku and Wills. Wills was lined up across from pro bowl pass rusher Brian Burns (who he held to a comparable 53.5 grade.) Shaq Thompson is a good coverage LB. How did Ekwonu grade against Myles? (It was a 41.2) Opponents make a difference.

We had a run heavy gameplan that didn't involve Njoku very much. We had a lead for most of the game. KC slings the ball everywhere, all the time with Mahomes. Vegas was behind all game. Kelce and Waller got more opportunities in the passing game than Njoku (7+ to 1 targets.) Goedert graded similarly (with 4 targets) going against the likes of Derrick Barnes/Rookie Malcolm Rodriguez at LB and the team he was going against also had a starting safety (T. walker) get ejected during the game.

Please read the post. This wasn't about Njoku just in game 1 - it's the same production he has given since he's been a Brown. The same thing with Wills. Wills graded out his first year as being replaceable and his 2nd year just barely as a backup. Now, in game 1 against what most consider an inferior foe, he posts an offensive grade again in the replaceable tier. Ekwonu is a rookie playing his first NFL game against what many consider the best DE in the NFL. Wills is in year 3, the year the Browns must decide if they are going to exercise his 5th year option and he's still performing at the replaceable level.

For Njoku, in 2021, 19.4% of his total catches for the entire year happened in a single week. 31.4% of his total yards gained for the entire year occurred in that same week. The rest of the year just like the previous 4, he was missing in action. This kind of performance is nothing new to Njoku - it falls directly in line with his 5-year history. His PFF offensive grade for the game was his production level for all his snaps on the field which was 89% of the offensive snaps taken. The PFF grading system evaluates every player on every play during a football game, that's blocking and pass catching. That's an AAV 14.187M per year for a player that for 89% of the snaps graded out at an offensive PFF Grade of 56.1 which is tiered as replaceable (tiers posted by Vers).

I don' t care what Baker, Ekwonu, or Thompson graded in the game. What I care about is the Browns are paying a guy an AVV 14.187M that was supposedly held back previously by Hooper that just gave his team a replaceable performance when he's making top 5 money for the position but still playing at 37th level.

I have to ask. Was he doing what he was assigned to do? In this run heavy O and with the RT position injuries, did the play calling require he stay in to block? I don't object to calling out a player when he isn't doing what he's assigned to do. ie.... If his job was to run a route and catch the ball. If he isn't getting open on his routes and or is dropping the ball, that's on the player. However, if he is getting open and the QB isn't throwing him the ball, that's on the QB. If the passes he is targeted with are off target, that's on the QB. If he's asked to stay in and block, he doesn't have the option to catch a pass at all. That's not on him.

You seem to be basing your opinion solely on statistics while taking nothing else into account. How can he catch passes not thrown to him? How can he catch passes when he is staying in to block? As far as the frustration level of his numbers not adding up to his salary I understand that. The how and why that happens is often times more complicated than you seem to make it sound. What I don't understand is using nothing but a stat sheet in assigning blame as to why that happened against the Panthers. Stats are a useful tool when combined with what happened on the field. They aren't worth crap when you use them alone to reach a conclusion.

They paid him to pair him with a QB of Watson's quality, not to pair him with Jacoby Brissett. Sadly his usage rate with Brissett (and a backup OT) will be lower than it should be with Watson. Pair someone with a meh QB and don't have them run a bunch of routes, and they won't put up stats.

When he's used, as in your 31.4% of last years production week, he can be effective.

On Njoku - let's review after week 4.

The PFF grading system grades the player on every play. In this case, if Njoku was to stay in and help pass block - he was graded on it. If his job was to run block, he was graded on it. If he was a receiver on the play - he was graded on it. Don't become confused that his PFF grade was based on his 1 catch on 1 target. He was on the field for 89% of the offensive plays and he was graded on every single one of those plays whether he was running a route or blocking. The totality of all those plays on the field gave him his grade which was 56.1. Like I said, this is not new news for Njoku's production. He's been doing the exact same thing for 5-years now. Yes, I posted his one productive game last year with his receiver stats and lack of production in the other games, but the PFF Offensive Grade is for every play he was on the field. When you have a player that you're paying AVV 14.187M at top 5 for his position, you should expect to have a complete player. 56.1 is in the replaceable tier of the PFF scale and graded every play he was in the game (blocking and receiving).

Yes it was Rishuz, Had a friend down at the game and he was texting me how Cooper wasn't running hard at all so I started paying attention whenever he was able to view.

His dad is a Cowboys fan and said he did the same thing there, and a guy at work is a Raiders fan and said the same thing. He'll play good one game then take a game off.

That's very disappointing, I hope he doesn't continue that behavior.

He's a 4 time pro bowler so he must be doing something good ! lol

Hopefully I'm wrong

Amari Cooper should have had 125+ rec yards and 1 or 2 TDs in the game if Brissett could have got him the ball.

Brissett is so so bad.

You expected anything different????????????????????????????????????

I only expected him to be so bad.