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POWER RANKINGS:


11. Cleveland Browns (2-1)

Week 3 ranking: 17

Team QBR: 62.6
QBR rank: 8th

Through three games, Jacoby Brissett is probably the biggest surprise on the Browns, and maybe one of the biggest surprise performers in the NFL. He ranks ninth in QBR (62.6), ahead of Justin Herbert, Matthew Stafford and Aaron Rodgers, among others. He has completed 66.3% of his passes and thrown four touchdowns with only one interception. The running game has been prolific, but Cleveland ranks fifth in offensive efficiency because of its quarterback as well. If Brissett can maintain this level of play, the Browns should be firmly in the playoff mix once Deshaun Watson returns from suspension in Week 13. -- Jake Trotter


HERE WE GO BROWNIES! HERE WE GO!!
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LOL...I'm assuming that wasn't a compliment.

I just don't think Jones is very good.

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It was a friendly jab. LOL

I am not positive about this, but I believe Hoyer has lost his last 9 starts.


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Kevin Stefanski not ruling Jadeveon Clowney out for Browns vs. Falcons: Quick hits
Updated: Sep. 26, 2022, 2:57 p.m.|Published: Sep. 26, 2022, 2:30 p.m.




By Dan Labbe, cleveland.com

BEREA, Ohio -- Browns head coach Kevin Stefanski wouldn’t rule out defensive end Jadeveon Clowney for Sunday’s road game in Atlanta. Clowney missed Thursday night’s win over the Steelers with an ankle injury suffered in the Browns’ Week 2 loss to the Jets.

He also didn’t offer much on linebacker Jeremiah Owusu-Koramoah (groin) or defensive tackle Taven Bryan (hamstring), both injured during Thursday night’s win.


“I have to get to Wednesday to see where everybody is,” Stefanski said.

Clowney was not out at practice on Monday but did walk through the locker room when it was open to media later.

Safety Ronnie Harrison Jr. was on the practice field after a hamstring injury suffered pregame kept him out of Thursday’s game, while left guard Joel Bitonio was on the side during Monday’s bonus practice nursing a biceps injury. He played through the injury Thursday and will likely do the same again this week.


Third-year linebacker Jacob Phillips will take over the MIKE duties from Anthony Walker Jr., whose season ended due to a torn quad tendon against the Steelers.

“Jacob is a very competitive young man. Played well in the last ball game. We are going to need him to continue to ascend, get better and those type of things,” Stefanski said. “He is definitely somebody who is excited about the opportunity.”

Sports betting comes to Ohio on Jan. 1, 2023: Your questions answered
Not so special

Last week was difficult for the Browns’ special teams. Kicker Cade York missed extra points against the Jets and Steelers. The Browns fell victim to a fake punt against the Jets and had a punt deflected by the Steelers. The Jets recovered an onside kick and the Steelers came dangerously close. Meanwhile, the return game has fallen flat.

“We need to get better in a bunch of different areas on our football team,” Stefanski said. “There are certainly things that we feel like we can clean up. That is part of what today was, really. We had a couple of special teams periods out there working on some things. A lot of it always goes back to technique and fundamentals.”


The Browns already made a change last week, keeping Demetric Felton Jr. inactive and using Chester Rogers as punt returner. Felton had been handling punts while rookie Jerome Ford handled kickoff return.

“Wanted to give Chester an opportunity as the punt returner there,” Stefanski said. “That was for that week. We will see if that is the direction we go this week. Demetric is a good football player. He is going to make a bunch of plays for us this season.”

Jack Conklin looked good Thursday night

Thursday night marked the return of right tackle Jack Conklin, who played for the first time since Nov. 28 last season.

“I thought he played well. It looked like the old Jack to me,” Stefanski said. “He was playing very physical. He has looked good in practice. I mentioned to you guys, he is stronger than I think he has ever been. He worked so hard this whole offseason. Good to see him out there.”

Conklin was held out of the first two games of the season, a game-time decision both weeks.


“I appreciate the team letting me get my health back to where I can come out tonight at full strength,” he said after Thursday’s game. “I felt great and comfortable out there. Could not be happier with how the team played. Great team win.”

https://www.cleveland.com/browns/20...ut-for-browns-vs-falcons-quick-hits.html


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Conklin's name has not drawn much attention.

He is a very good player when healthy. I have seen him handle Watt. He is excellent in the run. A hard nose physical player.

He has not been able to stay healthy and that has been a problem. I sure hope he can play this season at a high level. It is important.

Pocic, Teller and Biltonio have played well together. Wills can look good on one play and bad on the next. Overall the OL line is asset.

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j/c...

Glad it is nothing worse. I'll be surprised if he plays this Sunday.


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Love it Myles. We need you. Go out there and wreak havoc.

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Still trying to figure out how he fit in that Porsche.


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Scary pictures!

I’m just glad he was healthy enough to stand up even if he wobbled at the end of the video.

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j/c:

First, and foremost: I'm thankful that both passengers will be OK. Seatbelts/airbags/crumple zone technology saves lives.
Big fan of science/innovation/progress in my daily life.

Next:
1. I've been in a 2x bus rollover.
2. I was the driver of an airborne 35 MPH sports car 4-wheel splat-plant in a farmer's field (got the scarred lower lip and implant as proof).
3. I was in the passenger seat of a mid-70's-era Fiat Spyder that face-planted into a tree at about 25 MPH. A tree that is still living. The Fiat is not.

That s# jolts a person's body with G forces no human being is designed to withstand, and which no professional football player could generate upon another on game day.
You don't come back from something like this car wreck in a matter of days/weekor2.

I'm telling you all, right here/right now: Myles got his ass rocked with this accident. We should all wish him well for a full recovery, but we should also prepare ourselves for (best-case scenario): a couple/some games missed, and a few games of "Post-CoVid Myles" production even after his return. At the very least.

Car wrecks are not natural occurrences. They take a real toll. And as much as we fans may see our Browns players as larger-than-life/larger-than-us... they really are just chunks of 98.6 like you and me, when it comes to things like this.

To speak only for myself, I expect to see Myles at full strength next year, and not sooner.


.02,
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Well said Clem. I expect him to miss some time … especially with how severe that accident looked


"First down inside the 10. A score here likely puts us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. DPJ is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Hunt are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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I agree. Even if he says he wants to play, I would probably sit him this week.

As I and others who have experienced something similar, it a pretty big shock on the system. You don't start to feel that shock until the next day. Unlike a hit in football, the best way I can describe it is you start to feel the discomfort from the inside out when you get rocked to the core. Myles and friend are going to be feeling it today. That will last a few days for sure. Maybe longer.


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Put that helmet on and your pads and get back in there.

We don't want no stinking puscatores.

You had your seat belt on. So, you rolled over a few times. Big deal. Hell not much different than an amusement park ride.

ouch I bumped my elbow!

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Originally Posted by Milk Man
Still trying to figure out how he fit in that Porsche.


Looks ready to go on Sunday.

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I hope the Browns follow the advice of the doctors who are involved in caring for injuries Myles suffered in the accident.

Protecting Myles from his own ego should be a top priority. If the doctors caring for Myles believe he needs more time to recuperate from his injuries, so be it.

Myles needs to take as long as needed before returning to the football field..imo.




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I hope the Browns follow the advice of the doctors who are involved in caring for injuries Myles suffered in the accident.

I was under the impression that the medical staff determines the injury status of the players. Are you saying that coaches play players even if the the medical staff deems that player as "out?"


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I think what he's saying is Depo will make the final call.

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rofl


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Originally Posted by FATE
[Linked Image from media.wkyc.com]

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[Linked Image from media.wkyc.com]

As a passenger in a similar accident I can probably account for what happened.

1. can we assume the vehicle was going pretty fast, that car just cruising its going fast.

2. for some reason they had decided to pull over on the shoulder.

3. It looked like grass all the way with very little change in the ground being level - so instead of jamming on the breaks they simply slowed down to a reasonable speed when going off the round in what appeared to be nice level ground.

4. Like an instant a ravine appears instead of nice level grass and the car dropped severely and rolled. In my case the car ended up upside down and the gas tank was on fire. No explosion cause it was just filled. Myles case there was no fire and I don't know in what position was his vehicle when he stopped his roll.

Thank goodness like in my experience there was no injury thanks to an Angel keeping an eye on Myles.
jmhassessment of what happened. No proof just an educated guess.


Draft day Friday a coming weapon for O or D just make it good. Watson a QB hopefully with good character if not we might be screwed.
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He's healthy. Good for him. Keep it up.

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j/c...


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Maybe JT's ability to teach is helping a bit...

Being healthy is a big factor in the performance of every player. Once the opponent knows a player is not 100%, they will focus on exploiting that player's injury.

Another point I will bring up...I just went back and did some review of Wills blocking against the Steelers and I noticed the Browns were doing some chipping on Wills side...I wonder how they grade the "WIN RATE" when that player is getting some assistance from chipping...?




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Originally Posted by bonefish
Put that helmet on and your pads and get back in there.

We don't want no stinking puscatores.

You had your seat belt on. So, you rolled over a few times. Big deal. Hell not much different than an amusement park ride.

ouch I bumped my elbow!

Wow! Just wow!


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I thought that area looked semi-familiar. Sharon Twp responded, that's just down the road from me.

I hope everything was extremely minor.
Thank God for well-built cars, I reckon!


Browns is the Browns

... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.

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I guess I should have put it in purple.

Damn just kidding

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Miles stated/ reported he swerved to miss a deer. Your take on accident doesn't help. Personally, I hope Miles buys an SUV with good safety features. Go Browns!!!


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Originally Posted by mac

Maybe JT's ability to teach is helping a bit...

Being healthy is a big factor in the performance of every player. Once the opponent knows a player is not 100%, they will focus on exploiting that player's injury.

Another point I will bring up...I just went back and did some review of Wills blocking against the Steelers and I noticed the Browns were doing some chipping on Wills side...I wonder how they grade the "WIN RATE" when that player is getting some assistance from chipping...?


I'd be interested in how they came up with the rate also. When you look at Wills PFF Grades through the first 3-weeks, it's hard to believe he's the 2nd best in the NFL with his pass block win rate with such a poor PFF Grades.

Wills - Through 3-weeks PFF Grade:

Total Offense - Ranked 57th out of 70 rated - 56.7 Grade
Run Blocking - Ranked 60th out of 70 rated - 51.3 Grade
Pass Blocking - Ranked 50th out of 70 rated - 59.6 Grade

Top 5 OT PFF Grades through 3-weeks:

Total Offense
1. Thomas - NYG - 90.1
2. Tunsil - HOU - 84.8
3. Slater - LAC - 84.0
4. Williams - SFO - 79.5
5. Sewell - DET - 78.9

Run Blocking:
1. Fleming - DEN - 90.4
2. Thomas - NYG - 90.2
3. Slater - LAC - 88.0
4. Sewell - DET - 86.0
5. Cosmi - WAS - 82.8

Pass Blocking:
1. Hurst - NOS - 89.6
2. Humphries - ARI - 87.3
3. Tunsil - HOU - 87.0
4. Johnson - PHI - 85.0
5. Leno - WAS - 83.8

As you can see, Wills is nowhere near the top 5 PFF Graded OT's much less the 2nd best. Could you tell us where the stat you're using is derived from?

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Pass block win rate as I understand it is based on whether or not a pass blocker gives his qb time for 2.5 seconds or not. 2.5 seconds or more is a win. Less than 2.5 seconds is a loss. As the article mentioned, having a qb who doesn't hold the ball as long as another is important. I have said for decades that when most fans watch a game, they can't distinguish between 4 seconds and 2 seconds. They see the qb get hit or not. It's on the OL if the qb gets hit. No praise for the OL if he doesn't. I took the liberty of looking up JB's time to throw rate this year. It's 2.8 seconds. That's too high. I can't recall exactly, but that is probably around 20th in the league. However, in 2020, Baker held the ball longer than any qb n the league. It was something like 3.04 seconds. Way, way too high.

I've been watching Wills closely this year because it is a big year for him. He is an enigma in that he makes some outstanding blocks and then has some really poor plays. He is rather inconsistent. We can win w/him and he is not nearly as bad as a poster or two make him out to be. On the other hand, I wouldn't say he is the 2nd best pass blocking LT in the league. He has talent. He has to work on maintaining a consistent high level of effort and concentration in order to reach his potential.

Last edited by Versatile Dog; 09/28/22 05:58 PM.

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So, if a lineman gets help to block his man...such as a CHIP BLOCK by a teammate...this stat (win percentage) doesn't account for that sort of double team block...?

As I said, Joe Thomas' pointers might be helping Wills and as everyone knows, any player who is not being hampered by an injury should perform at a higher level. Wills dealt with ankle injuries the entire season last year.

Hope he continues to improve and stays healthy...but this stat is rather meaningless if it doesn't take double team/chip blocks into consideration.

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Originally Posted by Rishuz
I think what he's saying is Depo will make the final call.

We all know he like Depo, statistically speaking. wink


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I remember an interview with Joe Thomas in the off-season, and he said Wills has to play with greater consistency. I’m not gonna bother trying to find a link, you all just have to trust me. smile

I took it - and this is just my interpretation- as JT saying ‘gotta focus, work harder to develop the consistency needed to perform at a high level’.

Last edited by lampdogg; 09/28/22 07:42 PM.

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Originally Posted by bonefish
Put that helmet on and your pads and get back in there.

We don't want no stinking puscatores.

You had your seat belt on. So, you rolled over a few times. Big deal. Hell not much different than an amusement park ride.

ouch I bumped my elbow!

Oh, snaaaap ! I totally missed this-

rofl rofl rofl


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Originally Posted by lampdogg
I remember an interview with Joe Thomas in the off-season, and he said Wills has to play with greater consistency. I’m not gonna bother trying to find a link, you all just have to trust me. smile

I took it - and this is just my interpretation- as JT saying ‘gotta focus, work harder to develop the consistency needed to perform at a high level’.


lamp...I remember several stories that touched on how Joe Thomas was helping Wills, emphasizing focus and consistency.

After the season Wills went through, dealing with injury and not being able to play up to your own expectations..it had to take a toll on Wills confidence. Getting help from Joe Thomas had to be a boost to Wills confidence. Hopefully Wills will continue to improve and stay healthy.




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Hope he continues to improve and stays healthy...but this stat is rather meaningless if it doesn't take double team/chip blocks into consideration.

Do you have a link that confirms this claim? Please don't reply w/a question to deflect. I don't know the answer, but I would like to see confirmation of your claim because I find it a little surprising considering how deeply these Next Gen stats dig into the game.


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Originally Posted by Versatile Dog
Hope he continues to improve and stays healthy...but this stat is rather meaningless if it doesn't take double team/chip blocks into consideration.


Do you have a link that confirms this claim? Please don't reply w/a question to deflect. I don't know the answer, but I would like to see confirmation of your claim because I find it a little surprising considering how deeply these Next Gen stats dig into the game.[/quote]


vers...you are the board member who posted the info...you tell everyone how they grade double team and chip block help such as the help that Wills received in the Steelers game...let us know why you have an answer...thanks, mac

Last edited by mac; 09/29/22 07:23 AM.



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Just as I figured.


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Okay, I looked it up since mac ducked yet another question. Here is an article from 2018. I omitted the charts that listed the grades for the individual players because they are not relevant to what we are discussing. However, feel free to check out the link. Looks like mac's claim was incorrect. Also, consider how many improvements they made in just one year while reading the article. Then consider if the grading evaluation has evolved or not since that time? Some of us respect analytics. Others do not and would rather rely on built-in biases.

Quote
We created better pass-rusher and pass-blocker stats: How they work

As a unit, the Rams' Pass Block Win Rate went from 35 percent in 2016 (30th in the league) to 55 percent in 2017 (second in the league). Chris Williams/Icon Sportswire
Oct 5, 2018
Brian Burke
ESPN Analytics

ESPN Analytics is pleased to present a revolutionary new way of measuring the pass-block and pass-rush performance of individual NFL players. Read the abbreviated explanation on how they work, or skip to the full details on why they matter and what they can tell us. And see what's new for 2019.

OK, what is this exactly?
Our new Pass Block Win Rate metric tells us the rate at which linemen can sustain their blocks for 2.5 seconds or longer. Likewise, our Pass Rush Win Rate metric tells us how often a pass-rusher is able to beat his block within 2.5 seconds. Our model of pass blocking harnesses player tracking data from NFL Next Gen Stats.


So, what can these stats help show?
Now we finally have objective individual stats for linemen for their most critical tasks -- defending and attacking the passer. We can also know who is blocking whom on every snap, who was double-teamed, who got pressure from the edges and who got pressure by collapsing the pocket. The end result is that we can assess individual performance and team-level performance in the trenches separate and apart from the performance of the quarterback, receivers and secondary.

How do they work?
It's actually pretty simple -- there's no fancy machine learning involved. Our model uses the location, proximity and orientation of each player relative to every other player throughout a play to determine who is blocking whom. When a pass-rusher beats his block, we can tell which blocker allowed the pressure. And just as importantly, we know how long after the snap it occurred.


Why are they better than stats?
Metrics like QB pressures and time in pocket might be useful, but they can be misleading. A QB pressure can occur for several reasons other than unreliable pass protection, such as good coverage, poor route-running or missed reads by the quarterback. Our win rate metric isolates line play from those other factors. Also, time in pocket metrics don't know the difference between a quick read and release by the quarterback and ineffective pass protection. If a passer throws at 1.8 seconds after the snap, does that mean he only had 1.8 seconds to throw, or did he execute his read quickly? Our metrics know the difference.

Where could these stats lead?

You might find these metrics appear on various ESPN shows and in our articles. When you see Pass Block Win Rate (PBWR) or Pass Rush Win Rate (PRWR) powered by Next Gen Stats, these metrics are what we're referring to. These stats offer a novel way of understanding what drives the success or failure of pass offenses and defenses. We can now objectively assess individual player performance quickly and accurately, at a scale and scope not possible before. We can marry our metrics to other advanced metrics such as expected points and win probability to directly measure the effect individual performance has on team success.

What's new in 2019 for PBWR and PRWR?
Our pass-blocking and pass-rushing metrics have been in use for more than a full season now, and we've learned a tremendous amount since we rolled out the initial version. This was one of the first major projects using player tracking in football, and much of our efforts are quite experimental. Although we were thrilled with the initial results from our metrics, we've made a number of significant improvements for 2019:

Improved handling of double-teams: We corrected a number of false positive rush-wins when a rusher beats one lineman in the double-team but not the other. Additionally, we were previously tallying only double-teams between two offensive linemen. Now we tally double-teams regardless of the position combination, so running backs and tight ends count too.

Improved handling of unusual pocket geometries: In an effort to capture when a rusher is able to collapse a pocket, we analyzed pocket geometry throughout each pass play. But our logic was often fooled whenever the pocket became "convex" (bending away from QB instead of around him), making it appear the rusher has caved the pocket when he hasn't. We've fixed this.

Corrected occasional false positive rush wins: Our algorithm depends on proximity and orientation to determine who is blocking whom. So when a blocker is slow to engage immediately after the snap, it can look like a rusher is unblocked. Similarly, if there is about to be a double-team and the nearer blocker is slow to engage, it could appear as though the rusher has instantly beaten the block from the more distant blocker. This also was fixed.

Significantly improved identification of which players are truly blocking and rushing: Our original logic merely defined rushers as defenders who crossed the line of scrimmage and defined blockers as offensive players who did not cross the line of scrimmage. This was acceptable for the vast majority of rushers and blockers, but wasn't very accurate for tight ends, backs and linebackers. The new logic is adapted from our latest player tracking project and is much more accurate. Block-and-go-type releases by tight ends and backs who do not cross the line of scrimmage are no longer counted against them as pass-block losses (and no longer count as pass-rush wins for the defender who is released).

Team-level PBWR and PRWR summary calculations now use the same logic as the individual-level metrics: We previously used a slightly different way of calculating the rates for teams than for individuals, but our improvements this year help lessen the need for different methods.


We can expect the improvements to cause PBWR numbers to increase and PRWR numbers to decrease as a whole. Double-team rate numbers will increase. The bottom line is that overall accuracy is substantially improved.

All the details on PBWR and PRWR
What they can do
Finally, an objective, meaningful stat for individual linemen and pass-rushers. Blocking and beating blocks are at the heart of football, but are among the most overlooked aspects of the sport. Pass Block Win Rate and Pass Rush Win Rate can tell us which linemen are having the biggest effect on their team's fortunes, and which are holding their team back. We can also now catalog every block on every pass play. We know who blocked whom and how long that block was sustained, which is the key to our metrics' effectiveness.


https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id...g-stats-analytics-explainer-faq-how-work


"They tried to bury us. They didn't know we were seeds." -----Mexican Proverb
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