DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Palus Politicus Georgia Election Investigation Into Trump

I'd argue that the most ridiculous part of that post was the end where he said Trump is doing all this for the American people.

Trump has only ever been about himself.

As plain as day...

As an aside, I join your enclave on Thursday this week. I'm changing my DT location to "Ooberville"

I think the entire selling mugs that say "Never Surrender" on them is hilarious. It would be akin to making Nixon mugs that say, "I Am not a Crook" on them. But it's just something amusing and ironic in passing.

Believe me I am not focused on his mug.

I know all he is guilty of not just the 91 felonies.

He failed his oath of office from the day he swore to defend the constitution and the people of this country.

His actions during covid cost thousands of lives. Jan 6th was indefensible.

From what I have seen, I would certainly thing that he is guilty of the majority of the charges which he incurred. However, it would be hypocritical for me to advocate the validity of the system to someone like Day, while also pre-determining that he is found so through the system we have in place.

I won't argue at all when it comes to him sticking to his oath, his down-play of COVID, and January 6th, but focusing on that - and things like the mugshot - I think dilutes the focus from where it needs to be, at least in terms of these specific charges.

Come on man.

I have no doubt it's trump, landing in Atlanta. In 2020. Not last week.

He's getting off Airforce 1, by the way. And he has the Presidential motorcade, by the way. Ex presidents don't fly on AF1, or get the presidential limo.

I also have no doubt it was live. In 2020. In fact, it's what the link shows.

What we do know is that it was four separate grand juries who looked at the evidence and concluded there was enough evidence to bring him up on criminal charges. A total of 91 criminal charges. And through all of that they try to blame everything from Biden to politics to election interference for that rather than the person who was indicted on those charges for the position he put himself in.

Facts.

Here you go Marjorie blue suit?

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...ld-trump-georgia-indictment/70700695007/

Giuliani loses defamation lawsuit from two Georgia election workers

A federal judge has determined Rudy Giuliani forfeits the defamation lawsuit from two Georgia election workers against him, a decision that could lead to significant penalties for the former Donald Trump attorney.

In court in recent weeks, Giuliani said he could no longer contest that he made false and defamatory statements about Ruby Freeman and Shaye Moss – who are only one group of plaintiffs suing him for defamation related to his work for Trump after the 2020 election.

Giuliani said he struggled to maintain his own access to his electronic records – partly because of the cost – and didn’t adequately respond to subpoenas for information from Moss and Freeman as the case moved forward.

“Perhaps he has made the calculation that his overall litigation risks are minimized by not complying with his discovery obligations in this case,” Judge Beryl Howell of the US District Court in Washington, DC, wrote Wednesday. “Whatever the reason, obligations are case specific and withholding required discovery in this case has consequences.”

The judge, in ruling Wednesday against Giuliani, noted that the election workers could try to show his false claims about the 2020 election were intended, in some part, to enrich himself, an argument that may come up at the damages trial. Moss and Freeman are asking for unspecified damages after they say they suffered emotional and reputational harm, as well as having their safety put in danger, after Giuliani singled them out when he made false claims of ballot tampering in Georgia after the 2020 election.

A trial to determine the amount of damages for which Giuliani will be held liable will be set for later this year or early 2024, Howell said on Wednesday.

The damages could amount to thousands if not millions of dollars.

Giuliani has already been sanctioned almost $90,000 for Freeman and Moss’ attorneys’ fees in the case, and Howell says the former New York mayor may be saddled with additional similar sanctions.

Giuliani has been struggling financially, buried under 2020 election legal proceedings, a new criminal case against him in Georgia related to efforts to overturn the election and other matters. He has pleaded not guilty to the criminal charges in Georgia and has been released from jail on bond.

In a statement, Moss and Freeman expressed gratitude for Howell’s ruling.

“What we went through after the 2020 election was a living nightmare,” the pair said. “Rudy Giuliani helped unleash a wave of hatred and threats we never could have imagined. It cost us our sense of security and our freedom to go about our lives. Nothing can restore all we lost, but today’s ruling is yet another neutral finding that has confirmed what we have known all along: that there was never any truth to any of the accusations about us and that we did nothing wrong.”

The pair concluded, “The fight to rebuild our reputations and to repair the damage to our lives is not over.”

Ted Goodman, a political adviser to Giuliani, said in a statement that Howell’s decision was “a prime example of the weaponization of our justice system, where the process is the punishment.” Goodman added that Giuliani was “wrongly accused” of failing to preserve his own records and that he wanted Howell’s decision to be reversed.

‘A cloak of victimization’

Giuliani had only turned over fewer than 200 relevant documents, a single page of communications, a few legal responses, a “sliver” of needed financial documents and “blobs of indecipherable data,” Howell wrote.

Giuliani had claimed that the FBI seizure of his electronic devices years ago had complicated his ability to access his records and that he had struggled under pricey legal fees. But Howell said he could have taken steps at an earlier point to keep his records in case litigation arose in the future.

The judge also noted that while Giuliani complained to the court that he was buried in litigation costs, he was able to get Trump’s reimbursement for his electronic legal debts, listed his Manhattan co-op apartment for $6.5 million and traveled on a private plane to report to jail for processing in Fulton County, Georgia, last week.

Howell noted that Giuliani’s decades of experience as a lawyer, including as the top federal prosecutor in Manhattan, underscored his “lackluster preservation efforts.”

“Giuliani has submitted declarations with concessions turned slippery on scrutiny and excuses designed to shroud the insufficiency of his discovery compliance. The bottom line is that Giuliani has refused to comply with his discovery obligations and thwarted plaintiffs Ruby Freeman and Wandrea’ ArShaye Moss’s procedural rights to obtain any meaningful discovery in this case,” Howell wrote in a 57-page opinion ruling.

“Donning a cloak of victimization may play well on a public stage to certain audiences, but in a court of law, this performance has served only to subvert the normal process of discovery in a straightforward defamation case, with the concomitant necessity of repeated court intervention.”

Defamatory statements about election workers

Late last month, Giuliani conceded that he made defamatory statements about Freeman and Moss – who are but one of several groups suing Giuliani for defamation related to his work for Trump after the 2020 election – and that he didn’t contest their accusations that he had smeared them after the 2020 election.

Giuliani’s statements about them, which Freeman and Moss say are false, included calling them ballot-stuffing criminal conspirators. Giuliani also drew attention to a video of them after the election, which was first posted by the Trump campaign and showed part of a security tape of ballot counting in Atlanta. On social media, his podcast and other broadcasts, Giuliani said the video showed suitcases filled with ballots, when it did not capture anything but normal ballot processing, according to the defamation lawsuit and a state investigation.

Georgia election officials have debunked Giuliani’s accusations of fraud during the ballot counting.

The mother-daughter duo has been candid about how their lives were impacted by Trump and Giuliani’s claims that they were guilty of election fraud.

“There is nowhere I feel safe. Nowhere. Do you know how it feels to have the president of the United States target you?” Freeman said last year in video testimony to the House select committee that investigated the events surrounding the January 6, 2021, riot at the US Capitol.

Moss said her privacy was destroyed when she learned that Giuliani had accused her mother, Freeman, of passing some kind of USB drive to her like “vials of cocaine or heroin” as part of an elaborate vote-stealing scheme, she said. In reality, the object in question was a ginger mint. In his controversial call when he asked Georgia Secretary of State Brad Raffensperger to find votes to help him overturn his 2020 loss, Trump attacked Moss 18 times, and the former president called Freeman a “professional vote scammer” and a “hustler.”

“I felt horrible. I felt like it was all my fault,” Moss said during her testimony last year. “I just felt like it was, it was my fault for putting my family in this situation.”

She added that she and her mother were afraid to go outside or to the supermarket after getting threats “wishing death upon me, telling me that, you know, I’ll be in jail with my mother and saying things like – ‘Be glad it’s 2020 and not 1920.’”

During Giuliani’s disinformation campaign about the vote in Georgia, the FBI recommended Freeman leave her home for her own safety, according to the lawsuit.

https://www.cnn.com/2023/08/30/politics/rudy-giuliani-georgia-election-workers/index.html

Republican response?

As Trump and Republicans target Georgia’s Fani Willis for retribution, the state’s governor opts out

ATLANTA (AP) — Some Republicans in Washington and Georgia began attacking Fulton County District Attorney Fani Willis immediately after she announced the Aug. 14 indictment of former President Donald Trump for conspiring to overturn the 2020 presidential election results. But others, including Gov. Brian Kemp, have been conspicuous in their unwillingness to pile on.

Kemp, who had previously survived scathing attacks from Trump over his refusal to endorse the former president’s false claims about the election, declined to comment on the indictment of Trump and 18 others at a conservative political conference hosted by radio host and Kemp ally Erick Erickson.

Noting that he had been called before a special grand jury to testify during the investigation, Kemp stated forcefully that Democratic President Joe Biden was the rightful winner of Georgia’s 16 electoral votes and said swinging the spotlight to Trump’s legal troubles would be a mistake.

“Democrats want us to be focused on things like this, so we’re not focused on Joe Biden’s record,” Kemp told Erickson on Aug. 18.

Trump, meanwhile, has kept up a withering assault on both Willis and Kemp.

“Governor Kemp of Georgia is fighting hard against the impeachment of the crooked, incompetent & highly partisan D.A. of Fulton County, Fani Willis, who has allowed murder and other violent crime to MASSIVELY ESCALATE,” the former president wrote Aug. 21 on his Truth Social platform. “Crime in Atlanta is WORST IN NATION. She should be impeached for many reasons, not just the Witch Hunt (I did nothing wrong!)”

There’s little evidence to support Trump’s claim that crime is escalating — the number of homicides has fallen sharply in Atlanta this year.

Other Georgia Republicans didn’t hesitate to assail Willis, with some joining Trump in the call to impeach the Atlanta-based prosecutor.

“Fani Willis should be ashamed of herself and she’s going to lose her job,” said Republican U.S. Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene of Georgia. “We’ll make sure of that.”

Greene spoke to reporters last Thursday outside the Fulton County Jail, shortly before Trump arrived by motorcade to submit to booking and a mug shot. That same day, House Republicans in Washington announced their own investigation of Willis.

By then, a few GOP lawmakers in Georgia were calling for a special session to impeach and remove Willis or defund her office. Others proposed amending the state constitution to let Kemp pardon Trump.

Both are longshot prospects.

Georgia’s General Assembly hasn’t impeached anyone in more than 50 years, and with Republicans holding less than the required two-thirds state Senate majority to convict Willis, they would have to persuade Democrats.

Colton Moore, a Republican state senator whose purist brand of conservatism wins him few allies, launched a petition for lawmakers to call themselves into special session, requiring signatures by three-fifths of both houses. That too would require some Democratic support.

Georgia voters amended the state constitution to shift pardon power from the governor to a parole board in the 1940s after a governor was accused of selling pardons. It would take a two-thirds vote of both houses to put a measure before voters to change that status, again requiring Democratic support.

And it’s not clear Kemp would pardon Trump even if he had that power. Kemp and Trump were on bad terms even before Kemp spurned Trump’s calls to overturn Georgia’s 2020 presidential election. And relations grew icier after Trump recruited former Sen. David Perdue for an embarrassingly unsuccessful Republican primary challenge to Kemp’s reelection in 2022. Kemp, like some other Republican governors, now openly argues that his party needs to move on from Trump.

At least one other top Georgia Republican, state House Speaker Jon Burns, is siding with Kemp in opposing a special session. In a letter to fellow Republicans, he squelched talk of a special session, writing that he wants to look toward “a positive vision that prepares for the bright future our children and grandchildren deserve.”

“All those charged are innocent until proven guilty, and I am certain both sides will ensure this matter is exhaustively considered through the courts,” Burns wrote, saying he wouldn’t comment further.

Burns’ comments drew the scorn of Amy Kremer, a suburban Atlanta Republican activist who helped organize the Jan. 6 “Stop the Steal” rally in Washington that spawned the assault on the U.S. Capitol.

“We need to flip these corrupt RINO seats to true conservatives who will actually work and fight for the people,” Kremer wrote on social media. “So embarrassing.”

Looking for other options to go after Willis, some Georgia Republicans are coalescing around a plan to seek her removal by a new state prosecutorial oversight commission that begins work on Oct. 1.

The Prosecuting Attorneys Qualifications Commission was created with the aim of disciplining or removing wayward prosecutors. Republicans fought hard for the law because they said some Democratic prosecutors were incompetent or coddling criminals, improperly refusing to prosecute whole categories of crimes, including marijuana possession.

Democrats retorted that Republicans were the ones politicizing prosecutions, and some viewed the law as Republican retribution against Willis. She criticized the measure as a racist attack after voters elected 14 nonwhite DAs in the state.

The law lets the commission sanction prosecutors for “willful misconduct in office” or “undue bias or prejudice against the accused or in favor of persons with interests adverse to the accused.” It’s unclear how the commission will interpret those terms, because it hasn’t created rules yet.

Kemp, Burns and Republican Lt. Gov. Burt Jones name the commission’s five-member investigative panel to examine complaints. They also name a three-member hearing panel that decides on charges filed by the investigative panel.

Some district attorneys, not including Willis, are already suing to overturn the law. Barring court intervention, people can begin filing complaints on Oct. 1 for alleged misconduct occurring after July 1.

Such complaints could relieve political pressure on Georgia Republicans.

“District Attorney Fani Willis has demonstrated that she is nothing more than a liberal activist attempting to bend the law to fit a narrative that she has spent an egregious amount of taxpayer resources to craft,” state Sen. Jason Anivitarte wrote on social media, encouraging people to bring complaints.

But if the commission’s first act is to pursue Willis, critics say that will prove that it’s nothing but a political tool to enforce GOP rule in Georgia.

DeKalb County District Attorney Sherry Boston, a Democrat and plaintiff in the suit challenging the law, told The Associated Press Monday that using the commission against Willis would confirm that it’s what its opponents warned it would be — “an assault on prosecutorial independence and the latest attempt to subvert democracy in Georgia.”

https://apnews.com/article/donald-t...15kPZaCmTW5iLWLShdvKmsNirBIHloPhv3oTVyzg

Falsified records of worth.

https://www.cnn.com/2023/08/30/politics/donald-trump-wealth-new-york/index.html

Gee, what a surprise. Not.

I would think a lot of folks like him inflate their net worth as a way of bragging. Is what makes this so bad the fact that he used the inflated worth to borrow money from banks? I'm not sure but isn't that illegal?

DonT know if it's illegal. I do believe banks do their own research on values. I know when I bought my truck, with the value being 45,000, and with me putting 4 g down, they tried to jack the interest rate up. I bought it for 35,000. I explained that I could turn around the day after I bought it and put 10 to 12 grand in my pocket in a week.

Go try to buy a house. The bank will know what it's worth.

Last sentence is correct "most of the time."....HUMAN GREED, Trump a master, but loan officers/ bank officials- do you remember our housing bubble when THOUSANDS of bankers and money experts LIED about values.....GREED and human nature don't change----it's why audits are needed. Trump's biggest con artist ever.

It looks like they didn't do a very good job when investigating trump's actual worth. On the surface it would once again seem as though the wealthy and famous doesn't get near the scrutiny that most regular folks do in many cases.

Gov. Kemp says special session to remove DA Willis from election investigation will not happen

Gov. Brian Kemp is telling several far-right Georgia lawmakers to lay off the calls to impeach Fulton County District Attorney Fani Willis.

Georgia Sen. Colton Moore has led a charge via a letter to Kemp requesting a special legislative session to impeach Willis after a grand jury handed up an indictment against former President Trump and 18 of his allies in the state and beyond alleging a conspiracy to overturn the 2020 election here in Georgia.

During a news conference Thursday, Kemp said, despite his personal feelings about the investigation, he does not have the authority to call a special session.

“We have a law in the state of Georgia that clearly outlines the legal steps that can be taken if constituents believe their local prosecutors are violating their oath by engaging in unethical or illegal behavior,” Kemp said.

Kemp said, up to now, he has not seen any evidence that warrants any action by the prosecuting attorneys oversight commission.

The governor said not only does he believe calling a special session to remove Willis from the investigation would be unfeasible, but he also said it would likely be unconstitutional.

“As long as I am governor, we’re going to follow the law and the Constitution, regardless of who it helps or harms politically,” Kemp said.

The move comes one day after Georgia House Speaker Jon Burns sent a letter to his caucus saying he too was not supportive of the move nor was there any legal precedence for them to impeach her.

The letter states in part, that “we continue to have a few members of the General Assembly making misleading or false claims about the General Assembly’s lawful powers regarding an ongoing criminal case before our Judiciary.”

Burns called it an unfortunate part of modern politics, saying that “theatrics sometimes garner more attention than genuine human needs.”

Additionally, the Speaker said efforts to defund Willis’ office directly would both interfere with the criminal justice system in Georgia at large but have impacts across the state.

“Regardless of your views of this case, removing this funding would also have the unintended consequence of causing a delay or complete lack of prosecution of other serious offenses, like murder, rape, armed robbery, gang prosecution, battery, etc.,” Burns said in part.

https://news.yahoo.com/gov-kemp-says-special-session-150652315.html

It appears that as of now an attempt to interfere with the justice system by politicians has been averted. Justice is to be handled in the court system.

It’s illegal. Where you been? You do know just about everything trump has ever done was illegal right?

Still not sure if it's illegal but comparing the way a bank treats a guy like you and me to how they treat guys like Trump is just silly.

Judge ruled yesterday that the Ga trial will be televised and live streamed. Thats a good thing. The feds need to do the same

What Is Accounting Fraud? Definition and Examples

Accounting fraud is the intentional manipulation of financial statements to create a false appearance of corporate financial health. Furthermore, it involves an employee, accountant, or the organization itself misleading investors and shareholders. A company can falsify its financial statements by overstating its revenue, not recording expenses, and misstating assets and liabilities.

Key Takeaways

Accounting fraud is the illegal alteration of a company's financial statements in order to manipulate a company's apparent health or to hide profits or losses.
Overstating revenue, failing to record expenses, and misstating assets and liabilities are all ways to commit accounting fraud.
The Enron scandal is one of the most famous examples of accounting fraud in history.

https://www.investopedia.com/ask/answers/032715/what-accounting-fraud.asp

A further explanation follows what I quoted.

.

That will be some must see TV.

It should be required. Especially for dumass trump supporters.

Trump pushes back on allegations he inflated net worth, claims he was defamed

Former President Trump denied allegations from the New York attorney general that he significantly inflated his net worth, saying he was “defamed” by the state and claiming election interference.

New York Attorney General Letitia James (D) accused Trump of inflating his worth by $2.2 billion in court documents Wednesday. The claim is part of the state’s business fraud suit against Trump, the Trump Organization and two of his children.

In a Truth Social post Thursday, Trump said he was “targeted” and given “no constitutional rights” in the investigation.

“THE THING I HAVE IS A GREAT CASE BASED ON PHENOMENAL NUMBERS THAT SHOW A NET WORTH BILLIONS OF DOLLARS MORE THAN SHE VICIOUSLY & FALSELY CLAIMED, VERY LITTLE DEBT, BIG CASH, A POWERFUL DISCLAIMER CLAUSE, PAID OFF LOANS, NO DEFAULTS, “HAPPY” BANKS, GREAT ASSETS,” Trump said.

“I WAS DEFAMED BY NYS – ELECTION INTERFERENCE!”

The lawsuit seeks a $250 million fine and to bar Trump and his children from running businesses in New York in the future.

Specifically, James said Trump’s company changed the value of its assets in order to pay a lower tax rate and receive better insurance rates.

The civil suit is scheduled to go to trial Oct. 8.

https://thehill.com/regulation/cour...iLuZykLgf_g0az_PGuQ1zZkhSytPdkZPAyUUz9cM

Is it ever going to get to the point he will feel the need to make up more BS excuses? These are getting pretty old and worn out. But hey, I guess as long as he can get his minions to keep believing them, what difference does it make, right?

So, it's illegal right?

wonder what he could get for that?

I have no idea. Thus far it's only in civil court but who knows where that might lead moving forward.

I get how a higher net worth could lead to better insurance rate... but I don't get the lower tax rate.... Pit do you have insight into how that works out?

We should have a PP Zoom watch party.

Saw Jamie Raskins is trying to get Jared Kushner investigated for his 2 Billion dollar Saudi bail out after Khashoggi got killed and they swept it under the rug. That whole thing stinks like hell. Somebody tell me how much Hunter made again… I’m sure it was’t 2-3 billion while daddy was in office.

Come on Pit,,, tell me that you don't get it. He's saying, "Never Surrender a fifth time"

No I don't. I've never been in that high of a tax bracket to learn how any of that works or does not work as the case may be.

I do however find it rather odd that out of everything that has been posted about trump defrauding banks to acquire loans that's the one thing that stands out to you.

Another crime from a list of many.

What I think I read, was that while trump was inflating the value to the the banks, he was turning around and reporting a significantly deflated value on the same properties.

If true, then this deflated reporting to the IRS is what would lead to less taxes

That makes sense. And from what was found during the investigation seems to be that what he reported on his wealth to the IRS was far more accurate than what he reported to banks in order to secure loans.

You are missing the point entirely. Kushner set this up during his time on Trumps staff.

It's the piece I didn't understand.... if he's proven to defraud banks to acquire better loan terms and insurance rates then I 100% support punishing him for those... have no idea what the punishment is for those crimes, but that's major business fraud which I think should be prosecuted...

reason I asked about the lower tax rate was because I can't figure out how claiming to have a higher net worth would cause a lower tax rate... tax rates have nothing to do with net worth, it's more about your income and deductions...

Gotcha... that makes sense to me... thanks Jester...

It's no different than appraised value on a home v tax assessed value. Assessed value is almost always less than appraised value.

So trump valued his properties far above the appraised values to banks in order to secure loans. What would you call that?