DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Palus Politicus Kevin McCarthy ousted as Speaker of the House

https://www.cnn.com/politics/live-n...hy-house-speakership-10-03-23/index.html

35 min ago
Republicans considering quitting bipartisan group after Democrats voted to oust McCarthy
From CNN's Melanie Zanona

Republicans on the bipartisan Problem Solvers Caucus are considering quitting the group “en masse” after Democratic members voted to oust Kevin McCarthy as speaker, a GOP member said.

The potential blow-up of the group is just the latest sign of the fallout and fury following the historic removal of the speaker.

Some context: Centrist Democrats on the Problem Solvers Caucus informed their Republican colleagues in the group that they would not be saving McCarthy earlier Tuesday, according to multiple sources.

It was one of McCarthy’s last potential lines of defense to try to keep his position.

One GOP member told CNN that the Democratic members of the bipartisan group "only want problem solvers to work when they are in majority.”


Republican presidential candidates weighed in Tuesday on the historic vote to remove Rep. Kevin McCarthy as Speaker of the House of Representatives.

The vote to vacate was 216-210 with eight Republicans supporting the motion to remove the California lawmaker from the speakership.

No House speaker has ever before been ousted through the passage of a resolution to remove them.

The fight over the speakership marks a major escalation in tensions for a House GOP conference that has been mired in infighting — and it comes just days after McCarthy successfully engineered a last-minute bipartisan effort to avert a government shutdown.

LMAO

As I’ve always said, the ultimate problem with the republicans and their voters is that they don’t even like each other, never mind the rest of the US.

there is what, 3-4 distinct factions within the GOP? And every single time when the chips are on the table, they take turns C-blocking each other and self-destructing. I mean, this is embarrassing. The GOP has proven since the 200’s Bush era that they have no idea how to govern, only point fingers. They’re so busy criticizing the Dems for the policies that get passed despite not having much of any policy ideas of their own. They say no such much, they just said no to each other just to prove a point.

I’m not sure what that point is, because I’m not sure they know the point of all of this either. Just block and obstruct until…..what exactly?

All that, and there’s still McCarthy, a slim ball through and through. Literally, can not be trusted for anything. What is a man worth if he can’t be trusted at his word? His values are literally more fluid than a member of the LGBT. Oh yea, another group of people republican voters hate and isolate from.

I can’t imagine being a republican official or republican voter. That’s a lot of individuals and groups of people they have to hate and isolate from at the same time. A self-fulfilling prophecy, like they actively want the end times to come.

I mean Gaetz led the charge to oust this dude, yet didn’t want the gavel himself. Republicans aren’t even on some Game of Thrones stuff. They’re being self-destructive just for craps and giggles. What’s Gaetz gonna do if it ends up being a Speaker worse than the guy he got ousted?

This crap has been going on since the Obama era. Obama wasn’t the most divisive president in history; his election win was the most socially and politically divisive event in conservative America. It’s been nothing but nonstop grievances and regressive ideologies coming from the right since 2009. In now in 2023, it’s reached a point where their grievances have them in a political civil war for various reasons, but one big one including a guy who swore up and down Obama was a foreign born Muslim.

I’ll take that foreign born Muslim over the trash that Republican voters are putting in DC. at least he knew how to lead, and was well respected amongst the majority of people. This garbage we got today in the Republican Party is such an embarrassment to witness. These clowns got voted in by conservative Americans NOT because of their policies, but because they despised the same groups of people the voters did. I’m tired of pretending like conservatives and republican voters are just a bunch of misled victims.

Y’all put this trash in DC, not liberals and democratic voters. Why should we listen to a bunch of people who not only want to segregate themselves from other groups of people, but can’t even get along amongst their own? That’s an ideology that does nothing good for me.

Let me preface what I'm going to say by putting this down first....

None of this is possible without GOP being the dumpster fire it is right now. None of this is possible without McCarthy somehow being regarded as a turd by literally everyone he works with (not an easy thing), but yet somehow being pushed to the front of the Speakership line.

But something I feel that's lost in the noise is the fact that those GOP hardliners (Gaetz and co.) would not have been able to oust KM without a unanimous vote from Dems. This historic black eye on the House (and the ensuing chaos) is as much on Dems as it is on the wackadoos (if not moreso).


Honestly... what am I missing here?

My surmise is that the Dems are 1) Being consistent with their previous voting record and 2) They definitely smell blood in the water.

To the first point, to my recollection, they never voted for McCarthy to begin with during the 15 votes to make him speaker. I suppose this just essentially makes it the "16th time" that they voted against him. I doubt - especially given his about-face on the budget agreement - that they felt more inclined to vote for him this time around, for anything other than making Gaetz look like an idiot.

To the second point, I think they are just honestly content to sit back and watch the Republican majority in the House self-cannibalize in hopes that it'll make it that much easier for them to take the House back in 2024. I also think they expect a third front to open in the Republican civil war with Senate Republican majority starting to air its own frustrations with the conduct of the House Republicans.

I think McCarthy's biggest blunder is that he pissed everyone off. Had he stuck to the budget deal, and Gaetz filed his motion, I think the Dems may have opted to try to keep him in place - at least enough Dems would have done so, I think. Had he appeased the MAGA faction and let the Government shut down, Gaetz would not have filed the motion. He somehow managed to screw himself on both fronts.

It's truly the perfect storm.

As I watched the news unfold something occurred to me....

First Gaetz claim was that he hated McCarthy had worked with the Democrats to pass a temporary budget to avoid a government shut down. So to punish him for working with the democrats, Gaetz in turn worked with the Democrats to oust McCarthy. It seems Gaetz doesn't really care about working with the Democrats as long it's to achieve the goals he is after.

Secondly, out of 222 Republican members of the house, it only took a gang of 8 to put their party in chaos. And from the statements I've seen by many of their members, they're not happy about that.

Dems night have saved him after he put the appropriations bill through in a bipartisan vote. But then he went on the Sunday shows lying about it being Dems fault and Dems BAd Blah blah blah… They were his only hope to hold onto his speakership. So basically, he’s stupid.

Then the Dems just voted no WITHOUT HAVING ENOUGH VOTES TO OUST McCarthy and let the GOP choose his fate. Why should dems do anything to help them look like they can actually govern with a majority, when they can’t show that on their own? I think they chose the no vote to also put heat on the extremist right. As of yesterday, the GOPers were threatening to remove Gaetz too. This and removing any other hardcore extremists would be a huge bonus for Dems and the country. I 100% support what they’ve done. This is a GOPer mess, they need to sort it. And until GOPers start working with Dems again instead of playing hateful partisan grievance politics while getting nothing accomplished, why the hell would they want to perpetuate that?

And now, it’s popcorn time. Time to see if the GOPers can find their new speaker, agree on them without hogtying them, and get back to governing. My bet is, they will need Dems to get a speaker that’s not a lead around by the nose by Trump. Else the war inside their caucus will continue throughout this congressional term, which bodes well for a power flip in the house. It will even hurt their chances of taking the Senate. As far as I’m concerned, Hakeem Jeffries played this masterfully. Step in and help to keep the government running, then back off and let them implode with the infighting. He did the right thing for America in both instances.

Meanwhile, GOPers had all the voting voices they needed to get their agenda into play, but they can’t get on the same page long enough to do that. They are too busy Making America Great Again by undermining democracy here and around the world. LMAO. What a laughingstock.

And for anyone blaming Dems, maybe you should get your house in order before pointing fingers at ours.

Stop. This isn’t on the Dems whatsoever

....it is mostly on the GOP, I agree. No blame for Dems is a bit much, though. I guess if you're focused on this particular vote to the exclusion of everything else, sure, but both parties have helped things to get to this point over their "careers."

Sure, over the last 50 years, both parties put us here. BIG DEAL. The current problem is GOPers. They are lost in wackadoodle-land and can’t get right for the sake of the country. They need to purge this extreme right MAGA trash from their caucus. But they can’t while their base worships Trump. This is what lying, hiding, and propping up a traitorous lunatic criminal authoritarian would-be dictator instead of embracing America’s essence of democracy and melting pot. This ain’t your Granddad’s America GOPers, it’s your new reality. And YOU created it.

This vote in and of itself, no. The Dems aren't responsible to help a Republican remain Speaker of The House. The question is was that a wise decision? I guess we'll figure that part out when we see who the new Speaker of the House is and what exactly the ramifications of their decision brings. There's a lot of talk about Gym Jordan floating around right now. Two popular sayings come to mind. "Be careful what you wish for" and "better the devil you know than the devil you don't".

Those two sayings may never come into play here or they may come back to haunt the Dems.

That’s a great centrist take, PIT. Some hand wringing with a lot of hemming and hawing, a sprinkle of shucky-darns, and circle back to hoping kumbaya will fix it all. SMH.

You're so laughable. Reality seems to escape you. The GOP controls the House. NO democrat under that scenario will be the Speaker of the House. AOC won't be the new Speaker. So the only question left remaining is just how bad will the new speaker be? If you end up with some MAGA as speaker, then tell me how my comments are moderate. Sometimes common sense escapes you because your extremism won't allow common sense to enter into the equation.

Ummm no. Blaming other for your own failure does not work here. The only chance McCarthy had to save his position was to be nice to dems after the deal was done on Saturday. On Sunday morning he was back to trashing the dems.

Not the smartest tool in the shed.

The Dems voted to oust him, so yes, they are responsible too.

Can you name any time the Dems have voted FOR a Republican to be named speaker of the house? Can you ever name a time a republican has voted FOR a Dem to be speaker of the house?

It doesn't matter. They voted to oust him. They did not have to vote that way, but they chose to. Typical libtards trying to avoid owning their actions.

Not what I'm trying to say at all. There are like a hundred different things that, had they gone even slightly differently, would've prevented this from happening. It's just kinda weird that the last thing that happened really isn't getting all that much discussion. This was a strategic move by the Democrats (vs rampant incompetence on the other stuff).

So facts don't matter to you. Thanks for that!

Apparently they don't matter to you either. Because a bunch of lemming libtards voted to oust him.

I'll add you to the list of which I have asked this question. Can you name any point in time in the recent past that you can point to where a Dem EVER submitted a yes vote for a GOP speaker of the House or that a member of the GOP has EVER submitted a yes vote for the Dem Speaker? I mean i thought I would address this question towards someone that actually cares about facts this time.

I think using strategy would be something they were doing that differs from what's normal to get an advantage. I don't consider doing the exact same thing you've always done a strategic move. Depending on how things end up they may look back at this vote and wished they had used some strategy however. Only time will tell.

It doesn't matter. They either voted to oust him or they didn't. If you don't like that he was ousted then don't complain when you vote to oust him. Why do I have to keep explaining simple concepts to you.

I think they were playing the Vegas odds on this one. I think they looked back and saw it took 15 votes to get McCarthy in, who was the only person who could even sniff getting both the traditionals and the MAGA wing to vote for him. The only other person who I think can even come close to that is Scalise, but to your point, if they end up with someone like Jordan, without any drama, then yes, I think they will regret it, as unlikely as that scenario could be (crossing my own fingers). Sadly, off the top of my head, I can't think of one Republican who'd actually vy for the spot that would be better than McCarthy, and McCarthy was beyond horrific.

I'm guessing they placed their bet on the likelihood that the R side will look like a circus, and it will devolve into a Govt shutdown on 11/17, and that they'll piss off just a ton of the moderate voters, which I think is probably the odds favorite, but not the guarantee, to your point.

Side note - 11/17 is the Friday before Thanksgiving. I may end up getting mandatory time off the week of Thanksgiving, without having to take leave. Thanks Matt Gaetz!

11/17 is my birthday. lol

And you may be correct that they considered all of those things. I just think it would have been nearly impossible for any of the dems to have voted for a GOP speaker since it's something they've never done. Maybe under some extreme or rare circumstances. But to date I've never seen such circumstances exist before. If anything I would think they considered the only main thing that really matters to them. And that is this.....

Can you imagine how much of a negative it would be for their primary election when their opponent would be able to center their campaign around them endorsing a GOP member to be the speaker of the House of Representatives? It would be like committing political suicide.

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/us...fight-over-their-next-leader-2023-10-04/

Never in my life did I think I'd cheer this hard for Scalise.

LOL...think of it more as cheering against Jordan. It is less painful. Still excrutiating, but less painful.

My point about "the devil you know" is beginning to come into focus.

What you consider strategic I would just call common sense and Karma.

McCarthy is universally despised. On top of that, we’re talking about a Republican Party who openly brags about being as partisan as possible and refusing to reach across the isle to get policies past. The Dems simply voted how they should. Visa versa, the republicans would vote the same damn way. There’s no scenario where the republicans aren’t giddy at the chance to see Pelosi voted out, so they wouldn’t bail her out either. And that wouldn’t be on republicans, that would be on Pelosi and the Dems 100%.

McCarthy is the sole reason this has happened. He cut deals with members of his own party and then never delivered on those terms. He didn’t cut deals with the dems and then the dems decided to oust him. He screwed over his own party, and his own party kicked him out. Matt Gaetz isn’t a democrat. The freedom caucus members arent democrats.

Stop trying to lump in the dems for the Republican Party’s own failure. They (also read: you since you vote GOP) wanted to block and demonize anything the dems tried to do. This is the super majority you Republican voters asked for. So I don’t wanna hear crap about what the Dems are or aren’t doing from the conservative voters who voted this Republican trash into office in the first place. Y’all have full control of the House.

Conservatives always wanna talk about accountability and responsibility until it’s actually time to do so. Then all of a sudden, but the Dems….

Typical communist strategy.

Folks, not matter who is elected, people are going to die. Nobody should be happy about that.

This is all on the GOP. McCarthy needed their help to stop the shutdown on Saturday.,. he got the help. Then turned around on Sunday and trashed the Dems. I don't blame them one bit for voting him out., He did this to himself by lying.l

I’m trying to figure out how the speaker of the house being ousted for being a lying back stabbing scumbag amongst his own is somehow the Dems fault.

If anything, I can certainly make a rock solid argument that this is exactly how government should work. If the majority party isn’t happy with their speakers performance- or lack thereof- then they have the constitutional power to call a vote to remove the majority speaker and elect a new one. From a matter of public and political perspective, it’s an embarrassment. But the system itself is working as intended.

Maybe the Republican voters can answer the question as to why they continuously pick horrible leaders and are so divided amongst themselves.

Bonus points for not using the words ‘democrats’ ‘the left’ and ‘liberals’.

So dad decides to leave a loaded gun lying on the table and winds up taking the bullet.

I think it is rare to have the squad and the MAGAs in agreement

Both parties have subfactions. That's nothing new.

Biden - Does that count aas "democrats"?

Okay then, umm, illegal immigrants
Yay! bonus points for me

Who changed the rules to require only 1 memeber of congress to challenge the speakership?
Republicans

Who raised the vote to oust the speaker?
Republicans

Who holds the majority in congress?
Republicans

Who's fault is it?
Democrats

I guess they both have in common that they don't like being lied to.

You could cut the irony of this with a knife. Dear misguided Eve, the opposition party NEVER votes to pick or in this case save a speaker. This is the first time in US history a speaker was removed this way, and a MAGA GOPer filed it and FORCED the vote. Dems just saved him from a shut down, then he lashed out at them for helping. The only thing they could have done in this situation was vote yes or present to save him. But why should they? GOPers can’t govern because they are simply inept at it. But you do you and point fingers and sling libtard around. Maybe one day you and MGT will uncover your Trumpian utopia. I suggest looking in the waste bin of history, if it’s not already there it will be soon. But don’t worry, hate racism and fascism never completely die, so somebody will still want to hear your uneducated commentary again at some point.

It doesn’t matter who they make Speaker, I won’t like them. Hell, MGT put Trump’s name in the hat. He can’t do any more harm there than he did as POTUS.

I never knew you got skeared so easily. Are you sure you’re not a GOPer?