DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum The part of the DW trade that is forgotten

But waiting until the day after a heartbreaking loss to bump a 6wk old thread, just to repeat something already said, smells awfully trollish.

I hadn't considered it from that perspective.

I may be the lone remaining Mayfield fan but I don't think we had a QB problem...He was Injured his last year here and if anyone judges him on that, they smoking some bad weed......

J/C. If interested,check out this vid. Yeah DW was the worst trade in NFL history. Can’t argue against this notion. Horrible decision making by our fo. A true franchise killing trade.

I think you have you consider what the conceived problem was. Baker proved he could take a team to the playoffs when he was here. He has proven it this year although he is playing in a very weak division. But I don't think this owner and FO wanted to settle for that. They wanted a QB they felt could bring a SB to Cleveland.

Now people can certainly argue whether watson is such a QB or not. But that was the goal and the reason for the change at the QB position. I'm not convinced watson is that guy. By the end of year two I certainly anticipated seeing better results on the field from him. But thus far that has not transpired. The future however remains to be seen.

Point being is this owner and FO wanted a QB that was on the next level above Baker. So if you thought the problem they were addressing is that Baker stunk and that was the problem, I don't think that's it at all. I think they saw the problem as Baker not being a high enough quality of QB to lead this team to the SB. And I can't say that I disagree with them on that point.

If they wanted to go after a QB they felt was better, fine. IMO, no player is worth 3 first round picks. Has any of these big trades ever panned out for the team giving up that much? Only one I can recall in recent memory is RG3, and that didn't go so well for Washington.

I have certainly never advocated the price they paid for watson. As a matter of fact I think I was one of the most vocal detractors speaking out against the trade on multiple levels which included the price tag.

I liked Baker and wanted to draft him.

Not only all you said, I sensed a bit of a attitude between Baker and Stefanski when the whole shoulder thing came down.

I distinctly remember baker saying he was the only one who would decide if he plays or not...well, my feeling is the coach decides that, and all of that caused friction. When he finally left, things weren't good, and that didn't happen overnight. Something had been brewing for a good while.

I won't claim to know what was going on behind the scenes because I don't. I'll leave that type of pure speculation up to others.

That trade has not killed the franchise. Until the trade is complete, I don't know how it could be judged. We are only 2 years into a 5-year deal. So far Watson has gone 8-4 as the Browns starting QB. That is not terrible. I think many people just have an axe to grind with him because of his off the field issues. Getting rid of Baker was the right move. Quite frankly the Browns should have never drafted Baker. He was not a franchise QB. He will never be a Joe Burrow. The Bengals were in the process of passing the Browns with Baker at the helm and they did what they thought they needed to do. Was it the right decision? Still to be determined. If Watson continues to only play 6 games a year, then yes, the Browns trade will go down as a mistake. If Watson gets healthy and leads the team to winning a Division Title (Browns have not won a Division Title since 1990?) a Conference Championship Game (Again have not appeared in that game since 1990). It will be seen as a decent trade. A Super Bowl appearance will be a successful trade. The Browns have never appeared in a Super Bowl. If the Browns win a Super Bowl, then the Browns will have won the trade. That will not be determined until either the end of the Watson contract or if an injury ends his career. As long as he is playing for Cleveland the trade cannot be seen as a failure it is still to be judged.

Houston beat the Browns in the Wildcard game at Houston. They did what a team that hosts a playoff game is supposed to do. They also beat a Browns team that overachieved and won more games than they dd in the regular season after many devasting injuries. The game turned on the 2 pick sixes. A couple starting tackles and a healthy safety, and that game could have been different.

I could care less about Deshaun’s off field issues. If anything, I believe the guy that those women are a bunch of opportunists. However, that doesn’t take away from the fact that the team that we traded for Deshaun just mopped the floor with us with a rookie and a fraction of the assets that we gave them for Deshaun. Houston won that trade by a huge margin regardless of how anyone looks at it.

Deshaun is injury prone? Houston wins and we lose.

Deshaun is rusty? Houston wins and we lose.

Houston has a great young core and a bunch of our draft picks, while Deshaun struggles to get on the field? Houston wins and we lose.

As it stands right now, we should be the powerhouse and Houston should be rebuilding. However, Houston just blew us out by 31 and are advancing while we are,yet again, headed home. Houston wins and we lose.

Just live with it. This trade is a complete failure for our front office and also shows how much more competent Houston’s fo is than ours.

Just wait until we start losing good players because of Watson’s salary cap hit.


If nothing that I just wrote convinces you, ask yourself if we could undo the trade, would we? It’s a resounding yes.

Do you think Houston wins if the Browns had 2 competent tackles playing Saturday? It would have been a shootout because our defense did not play well. Roster vs roster, I believe the Browns are the better team in 2023. I don't think the Texans would have survived the injuries the Browns sustained and still won. Well see if that is still the case in 2024. They do have an emerging QB that they got because of their record and not from the Watson trade. They should be a hand full, but I expect the Browns to get better also. This team has a very good nucleus to stay competitive for a while. They need to improve their turnovers and stay healthy next year and it will be another fun year and hopefully end better. The sky is not falling as your post try to indicate.

I think it isn't all that much speculation. There was some friction in the building.

Baker overestimated his power and value within the organization, the organization grew tired of it, had an option to move in another direction, and took it.

Hard to argue with the organization’s thinking. Baker is s tough guy to like and rally around.

I don’t think the Watson trade is anywhere close to the worst trade in NFL history even if it doesn’t work. Not even close.

Nor is it franchise killing. Browns just made the playoffs and have most of the core returning next year.

And who cares about Houston. I will make a long term bet with anyone that Stroud will never have another season like this one again. NFL will catch up to him. That’s what the NFL does.

problem with your statement about houston surviving the injuries.. They actually led the league this year of players on IR.

With Watson I keep going back to Character. I think it shows up when a young man gets a huge contract seems to forget how to do his job.

Nothing proves my point more than bringing in Flacco, watching how a PRO does it. No Ego, just does his job.

I recognize that Flacco isn't the answer for us but at this point in his life, but he's the Prototype of the guy we should be looking for... Watson just doesn't fit that mold to me. fact is, neither does Baker.

Stefanski set the Browns back 5 years because of his ego and the stick up his butt about wanting Baker to play like this cerebral QB who also has a stick up his butt, when that's not him at all.

We gave up a #1 overall pick QB, a crap load of draft picks, and an unprecedented amount of money to pacify the coaches ego, so we could be worse.

Baker > Watson > Flacco

the trade doesn't matter

Hurts just got torched by Baker.

Watson makes us a better team. The end

I would love to see Baker with our current team.

This x100. We would be so much further along with baker and all the picks and cap. This just cements that our talent evaluation sucks.

Baker will be shut down immediately on the road by the Lions. Baker can give you a good game or two, but sadly he is not a franchise qb.

I still root for him regardless.

Prp....please check the site's security settings. Jimmy Haslam hacked DC's account!

For me one of the best and in my opinion most accurate posts about the trade.

I think there were other factors like Baker's immaturity and friction and eroded trust between BM and KS. And I also believe DW specifically was a Depo driven thing. when you look at the deep dive on DW Houston stats, it's a wet dream for an analytics guy. But that's 100% speculation on my part.

I was on board when we got Watson, but the whole thing looks terrible now. We ran Baker out of town for playing hurt, gave up all those picks and we are still in QB hell. I am rooting for Baker now. He deserved much, much better.

Lolz.

There were maturity and ego problems with both Baker and Stefanski, and one of them had to go. Stefanski got us to the playoffs 2 of his 4 years here and kept the players focused and motivated until the last game despite most of our starters being crippled. Baker flopped around the league and got into the playoffs by barely sqeaking to the top of the weakest division in the NFL, and won a home game against a team that was in total disarray the last half of the season. I think next season will tell us whether we made the right decision or not, as we'll see who can build on the successes achieved this year.

I like Baker. I have liked him since the 1st Jets game, where he came in and rallied the team to a win.

His last year here, he was hurt. His play reflected that. The year he left was mostly a lost year, as it seemed like he didn't fully recover until he got to the Rams. If he had stayed here, he still would have been out, because his play was not up to his normnal standards.

I would prefer that we still had Baker. People can say a lot of things about him, bujt the fact is that he proiduced at a high level, in a rebuilding year for Tampa, and for a team with a crap run game. He was 10th in passing yards, 12th in passer ratling, and 7th in passing TDS. He had an outstanding season.

We'll see if Watson can produce anything similar here. Heaven help us if he can't, because if he can't, this team will be set back horribly .... because they are married to him for another 3 seasons, at least. (and probably cap implications beyond that, as we have restructured him already.

Based on a choice between BM and KS and based on performance since BM left, I'd take KS. That's based on the reg season performance and the impact on continuity in the FO. At the time I might have chosen differently because of my concerns over KS. Independent of that, knowing we'd move on from BM .... I'd not choose DW then or now based on trade and salary.

Stefanski tired of Baker because Baker caused a split in his locker room. His personality drove Odell Beckham out of Cleveland. QB's should be players that other players rally around and not have divisions with. That was the problem. Baker has the arm talent. I don't think he always sees the field like elite QB's do. But in 2021 the Browns had a team that was talented enough to compete for a Super Bowl and the QB was involved in a team dividing squabble with his main pass catching target. Do you think Joe Burrow argues with Chase? That squabble cost the Browns the 2021 and 2022 seasons. This year was the first year since that the Browns were talented enough to compete for the Super Bowl. Injuries derailed this season. That is alot differnt than squabbles and division.

That assessment is probably true. The one thing that I noticed is our players seem to like DW and want to play for him. It’s just a matter of DW staying on the field.

personally I felt like the divorce between Baker and the team had to happen ... that relationship wasn't coming back

Agreed 110%

Deshaun was a huge problem for Houston and they had to get rid of him. - In steps the Browns to relieve Houston of their problem and to also tack on multiple draft picks to make a one-sided deal even more one sided.

FF a couple years and look at that deal now. Houston has a franchise qb and multiple draft picks of their own and ours.

Houston is already further along in their development than us as they are playing next weekend and we aren’t. Houston killed us in this trade - and I don’t mean that figuratively. They killed this version of the Browns. Look no further than what they did to us last weekend. We aren’t going anywhere considering that we’ll always have to contend with other well developed teams in the afc. - Chalk this up to lack of depth - and chalk that up to lack of high draft picks.

Additionally, while we were courting Deshaun, we were also spitting on and looking to release Baker. And where is he now? Starting for a team that he led to a divisional title and going to the second round of the playoffs. -Just like Houston.

And where are we, sitting at home with even less qb security, less draft capital, and less salary cap space that we had when we traded for Deshaun.

It’ll sure be fun to watch both Houston and Baker play next weekend while our pathetic franchise jet sets on vacation. Great job by our fo. - Not.

If only Dorsey, The Doof, had drafted Josh instead of Baker.

To be fair, Houston got their franchise qb with their own pic because of their crap season in 2022 and Carolina stupidly choosing Bryce Young ahead of them. That would have happened whether we took DW or not, there were others in line to take him. Houston hit on their franchise qb, it had nothing to do with us. It remains to be seen if we hit on ours.

I agree. It's still funny when you think about it it (I did, watching Baker last night).


One QB playing next weekend is the one we should have drafted.

Another is the one we did, but things didn't work out (while many around here acted like his future was on the bench in the NFL).

A third is on his team as a result of a rebuilding franchise, that moved in the bulldozer when they traded their QB to us. And he just happens to be from tOSU... just to add insult to injury lol.

Yes, 24 evil, lying biotches and only watson is the beacon of truth. Not this tired old BS again.

Oh the fables and stories people sell themselves to make things sound better. Tampa Bay fans and their players seem to like and rally around Baker just fine. Never allow facts, or the lack of them in this case stop you though.

Sure enjoyed watching our old QB win a playoff game with his new team last night. Would be great to have a QB like that again.