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Can't say that "I didn't try to tell you", but:

Elijah Moore's skipping the voluntary OTA's has generated recent criticism over his absence at OTAs. Jay Crawford of The Ultimate Cleveland Sports Show doesn’t put too much stock in attendance for the voluntary workouts. However, he does not believe Moore is making the right decision by skipping out, especially with new offensive coordinator Ken Dorsey installing his system.

“I have had many conversations with coaches and general managers who have been in the room when [roster cuts] are discussed. What always comes up for roster spots 42 to 53 is effort. And he doesn’t get to check that box right now,” Crawford said, referring to Moore. “He’s not doing himself any favors. As an organization, I’m sure the Browns are looking at it and saying, ‘interesting choice.’ If I’m Elijah Moore and I’m making daily decisions on my future, the one decision I don’t have to think about is being there. If you’re not present, you’re absent.”

OTAs are optional, and multiple key players were absent for the first workouts from May 21-23. That included Myles Garrett, Joel Bitonio, and some other notable veterans. However, most of those guys have built up strong resumes. Moore needs as much work as possible to maintain his role within the offense.

“You set an example by showing up,” Crawford said.

The Browns traded for Moore last offseason, bringing him over from the New York Jets. He’ll face some additional competition for reps this season. The Browns brought in Jerry Jeudy via a trade in March. In addition, former third-round picks David Bell and Cedric Tillman could earn larger roles.

Moore is entering a contract year with the Browns. Last season, he recorded career highs with 59 catches for 640 yards, but his debut season in Cleveland still left something to be desired.

https://heavy.com/sports/nfl/clevel...A9NacJCQUYspTQXMH92tksIAevxZk50tfi0v0ZP0


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He is at OTAs this week


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Oh he is?
Good. Sounds like heavy.com and Steve aren’t giving us good information.


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Browns News: Elijah Moore to Participate in OTAs Phase 2
According to Cabot, Moore is officially back practicing with the Browns. The 24-year-old was in attendance when the second phase of OTAs began on Tuesday and "will probably be here the whole week."

The news of Moore's return comes just a few days after the wideout fired back at those questioning his absence. "Outwork everyone!" he posted on X (formerly Twitter) on Sunday afternoon, telling everyone to ignore the haters in a less-than-PG way.
After an abysmal 2023 performance, it's encouraging to see Moore participating in voluntary workouts in hopes of a bounce-back showing this fall.

The Browns acquired Moore from the New York Jets last year in hopes that he could excel in the WR2 role behind Amari Cooper. While the ex-Mississippi product was far from the NFL's worst receiver last year, the fact that he only recorded 59 receptions, 640 receiving yards, and two touchdowns in 17 games left much to be desired.
Getting Moore back on track isn't only important for the Browns' aspirations, but it's also crucial for his contract goals. The Sunrise, FL native is playing in the last year of his rookie deal and could receive a major extension "at some point during the season" if he can successfully prove himself, per Cabot.

The details around a future deal will be determined by Moore's ability to separate himself from the pack. Last year's WR group (outside of Cooper) failed to meet expectations, leading to the Browns acquiring Jerry Jeudy from the Denver Broncos and signing him to a three-year, $58 million extension before even playing a game for the franchise.

If Moore can't prove that he has a higher ceiling than Jeudy, why would the Browns also sign him to a big-money deal?

That's without mentioning how the fourth-year WR must also edge out the likes of Cedric Tillman, David Bell, and rookie Jamari Thrash, who'll look to cement themselves as NFL wideouts.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nf...ond-week/ar-BB1nd7qZ?ocid=BingNewsSearch


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Originally Posted by steve0255
Can't say that "I didn't try to tell you", but:

Elijah Moore's skipping the voluntary OTA's has generated recent criticism over his absence at OTAs. Jay Crawford of The Ultimate Cleveland Sports Show doesn’t put too much stock in attendance for the voluntary workouts. However, he does not believe Moore is making the right decision by skipping out, especially with new offensive coordinator Ken Dorsey installing his system.

“I have had many conversations with coaches and general managers who have been in the room when [roster cuts] are discussed. What always comes up for roster spots 42 to 53 is effort. And he doesn’t get to check that box right now,” Crawford said, referring to Moore. “He’s not doing himself any favors. As an organization, I’m sure the Browns are looking at it and saying, ‘interesting choice.’ If I’m Elijah Moore and I’m making daily decisions on my future, the one decision I don’t have to think about is being there. If you’re not present, you’re absent.”

OTAs are optional, and multiple key players were absent for the first workouts from May 21-23. That included Myles Garrett, Joel Bitonio, and some other notable veterans. However, most of those guys have built up strong resumes. Moore needs as much work as possible to maintain his role within the offense.

“You set an example by showing up,” Crawford said.

The Browns traded for Moore last offseason, bringing him over from the New York Jets. He’ll face some additional competition for reps this season. The Browns brought in Jerry Jeudy via a trade in March. In addition, former third-round picks David Bell and Cedric Tillman could earn larger roles.

Moore is entering a contract year with the Browns. Last season, he recorded career highs with 59 catches for 640 yards, but his debut season in Cleveland still left something to be desired.

https://heavy.com/sports/nfl/clevel...A9NacJCQUYspTQXMH92tksIAevxZk50tfi0v0ZP0

LOLZ


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Originally Posted by steve0255
“I have had many conversations with coaches and general managers who have been in the room when [roster cuts] are discussed. What always comes up for roster spots 42 to 53 is effort. And he doesn’t get to check that box right now,” Crawford said, referring to Moore. “He’s not doing himself any favors. As an organization, I’m sure the Browns are looking at it and saying, ‘interesting choice.’ If I’m Elijah Moore and I’m making daily decisions on my future, the one decision I don’t have to think about is being there. If you’re not present, you’re absent.”

The problem with this line of thinking is that teams are very limited in how much effort they can allow players to expend at the early portion of OTAs. Players can literally put in more work on their own, and Moore appears to be one of the guys that does so.

That's not to say that there aren't benefits to attending OTAs, but I don't think non-attendance in any way indicates a lack of effort, especially if one is putting in more work elsewhere.


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“[Moore] attended organized team activities No. 4 on Tuesday, and will probably be here the whole week,” Cabot wrote. “Like many Browns veterans, he’s popped in and out of the voluntary offseason program — which the NFLPA seeks to abolish as soon as next year — and also has an extensive workout program of his own, like most do.”

Browns See More Upside With Elijah Moore

Moore recorded career highs with 59 catches for 640 yards, but his debut season in Cleveland still left something to be desired. The Browns see Moore taking another step next season, especially with Deshaun Watson expected to be under center for the entire season.

“Just look at the numbers. He has a career year and I think that was for a reason. I feel really strongly about him the player. As you know, when you’re moving different quarterbacks in there, that can affect it,” Browns head coach Kevin Stefanski said in February. “You look at the Jets game where Amari (Cooper’s) out and Elijah went right to the focal point and was making plays up and down the field before he got hurt. So I know what he’s capable of, and after a career year, we anticipate him even getting better.”

https://heavy.com/sports/nfl/cleveland-browns/elijah-moore-otas-social-media-outburst/

They do cover all of their bases.


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I think the questions that linger though discounted as unimportant but in hindsight are important consist of:

I see nothing where anyone questioned or are questioning Moore's workouts but he's no Garrett or Bitonio with established longevity being able to skip voluntary OTA's.

All things aside, such as numerous QB's etc, Moore's production last year was improved from the Jets a little but nowhere close to expectations. In raw numbers it might have been his best year but 17 games with 12 starts for 640 yards and 2 TD's is not as productive of a year as 2021 when he played in only 11 games with 6 starts for 538 yards and 5 TD's.

IMHO, Moore's lack of anticipated production solidified the need to get a real #2 WR thus the Jeudy acquisition. If you lost your #2 spot in the offseason, wouldn't voluntary OTA's with a new scheme and OC thus become a PRIORITY?

There's a new offensive scheme being introduced with a new OC combined with the facts that your starting QB is returning from a 11-game injury, and you have been basically replaced as the #2 receiver - wouldn't you think attendance would be mandatory on your part?

There's still that elephant in the room where after only 6 games in 2022, Jets' Elijah Moore requested trade amid a reduced role. If his role is reduced again, which is highly likely with Jeudy on-board, do we see Moore 2.0 in 2024?

My hope is that Moore is ultra productive and a good teammate. IMHO, it's vital that he improves dramatically in 2024 for the Browns offense. I only posted the articles because they were news. Positive or negative, news is still news and can warrant discussion. Moore can silence a lot of the naysayers by his actions. As of now though, his first action was not in his best interest IMHO.


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I think the questions that linger though discounted as unimportant but in hindsight are important consist of:

I see nothing where anyone questioned or are questioning Moore's workouts but he's no Garrett or Bitonio with established longevity being able to skip voluntary OTA's.

All things aside, such as numerous QB's etc, Moore's production last year was improved from the Jets a little but nowhere close to expectations. In raw numbers it might have been his best year but 17 games with 12 starts for 640 yards and 2 TD's is not as productive of a year as 2021 when he played in only 11 games with 6 starts for 538 yards and 5 TD's.

IMHO, Moore's lack of anticipated production solidified the need to get a real #2 WR thus the Jeudy acquisition. If you lost your #2 spot in the offseason, wouldn't voluntary OTA's with a new scheme and OC thus become a PRIORITY?

There's a new offensive scheme being introduced with a new OC combined with the facts that your starting QB is returning from a 11-game injury, and you have been basically replaced as the #2 receiver - wouldn't you think attendance would be mandatory on your part?

There's still that elephant in the room where after only 6 games in 2022, Jets' Elijah Moore requested trade amid a reduced role. If his role is reduced again, which is highly likely with Jeudy on-board, do we see Moore 2.0 in 2024?

My hope is that Moore is ultra productive and a good teammate. IMHO, it's vital that he improves dramatically in 2024 for the Browns offense. I only posted the articles because they were news. Positive or negative, news is still news and can warrant discussion. Moore can silence a lot of the naysayers by his actions. As of now though, his first action was not in his best interest IMHO.


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If you search hard enough for reasons to question someone you can find them. Making mountains out of mole hills is as old as the sun. Of course one could look at both sides of the information to find balance but that's not what I'm seeing from your posts.


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j/c...



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Originally Posted by FATE
j/c...


I can't say I didn't try to tell you!


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The issue with Moore isn’t that he missed voluntary workouts. The issue is he’s just not that good. No amount of voluntary workouts will change that.

The Browns liked him pre draft and decided to roll the dice that it was the Jets and not Moore that was the issue. The truth was somewhere in the middle. And one of Moore’s biggest issues is he’s small and plays even smaller. I don’t expect him with the team next year.


LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
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Another great episode. It's easy to root for this kid. It also seems easier and easier to see how strong this organization is. As a rookie or vet, it's now a blessing to be a Cleveland Brown. My first look at defensive line coach Jacques Cesaire, I think players will respond to him well.



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I love watching pieces like that.

Pre-draft I did not know much about Hall other than seeing his name as a guy who we may draft.

Once I started watching him; I was like OK. I like this dude.

We drafted Perion Winfrey to play 3 tech. He had skills but was a head case. Hall is perfect for Schwartz's 3 tech role.

He will be an up field 3 tech penetrator. He has that explosive first step. He is a good place to succeed.

I am glad we drafted him.

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Originally Posted by steve0255
All things aside, such as numerous QB's etc, Moore's production last year was improved from the Jets a little but nowhere close to expectations. In raw numbers it might have been his best year but 17 games with 12 starts for 640 yards and 2 TD's is not as productive of a year as 2021 when he played in only 11 games with 6 starts for 538 yards and 5 TD's.

IMHO, Moore's lack of anticipated production solidified the need to get a real #2 WR thus the Jeudy acquisition. If you lost your #2 spot in the offseason, wouldn't voluntary OTA's with a new scheme and OC thus become a PRIORITY?

Putting all things aside is rather convenient. Playing with a mangled OL, an injured starting QB, a thrown into the fire on short notice rookie QB, a not very good journeyman QB, and an old QB fresh off his couch would seem to be things that would have a negative effect on a receiver's production. In football, production at any position is highly impacted by other people.

If they were actually doing game speed reps of the new scheme, it'd be beneficial. If they're doing babystep basics to acclimate new players, time can probably be better spent elsewhere. Perhaps the team even agreed he was ahead of the pack, and it was a waste of time for him to go through intro to the Browns week. Maybe O'Shea wanted more hands on time with the young WRs.

You seem to want to put things in a vacuum, but it doesn't actually work that simply.


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Originally Posted by Bull_Dawg
.... and an old QB fresh off his couch would seem to be things that would have a negative effect on a receiver's production. In football, production at any position is highly impacted by other people.

If they were actually doing game speed reps of the new scheme, it'd be beneficial. If they're doing babystep basics to acclimate new players, time can probably be better spent elsewhere. Perhaps the team even agreed he was ahead of the pack, and it was a waste of time for him to go through intro to the Browns week. Maybe O'Shea wanted more hands on time with the young WRs.

You seem to want to put things in a vacuum, but it doesn't actually work that simply.

Moore was (ahem) more familiar with Flacco than any of the other passcatchers were. By your logic, he should've pulled ahead of the pack in terms of targets and yardage, but I don't remember that really happening. It was the same guys making plays as before (Cooper and Njoku). Moore had a big game vs the Jets, but I honestly don't really remember him doing much else.


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Originally Posted by Bull_Dawg
Originally Posted by steve0255
All things aside, such as numerous QB's etc, Moore's production last year was improved from the Jets a little but nowhere close to expectations. In raw numbers it might have been his best year but 17 games with 12 starts for 640 yards and 2 TD's is not as productive of a year as 2021 when he played in only 11 games with 6 starts for 538 yards and 5 TD's.

IMHO, Moore's lack of anticipated production solidified the need to get a real #2 WR thus the Jeudy acquisition. If you lost your #2 spot in the offseason, wouldn't voluntary OTA's with a new scheme and OC thus become a PRIORITY?

Putting all things aside is rather convenient. Playing with a mangled OL, an injured starting QB, a thrown into the fire on short notice rookie QB, a not very good journeyman QB, and an old QB fresh off his couch would seem to be things that would have a negative effect on a receiver's production. In football, production at any position is highly impacted by other people.

If they were actually doing game speed reps of the new scheme, it'd be beneficial. If they're doing babystep basics to acclimate new players, time can probably be better spent elsewhere. Perhaps the team even agreed he was ahead of the pack, and it was a waste of time for him to go through intro to the Browns week. Maybe O'Shea wanted more hands on time with the young WRs.

You seem to want to put things in a vacuum, but it doesn't actually work that simply.

Interesting take and thanks for the personal update. I appreciate you for that! I do have this question for you though, no one would question your statements of a mangled OL, an injured starting QB, thrown into the fire on short notice rookie QB, a not very good journeyman QB, and an old QB fresh off his couch would be things that would have a negative effect on a receiver's production. That said, why didn't it effect Copper and Njoku who had Pro Bowl seasons with the exact same variables in place? The other question would be that the old QB fresh off his couch who came to the Browns with little to no knowledge of the team dynamics had 1 receiver that he spent the last 2 years with to relate too. Wouldn't you think that Flacco would immediately be looking toward the person he had 2 years' experience with instead of the unknown?

Like I previously said, "My hope is that Moore is ultra productive and a good teammate. IMHO, it's vital that he improves dramatically in 2024 for the Browns offense. I only posted the articles because they were news. Positive or negative, news is still news and can warrant discussion." It also wasn't my statements but those of Cabot that said Moore had "an abysmal 2023 performance" and Jay Crawford that said, "his debut season in Cleveland still left something to be desired."


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I think you're digging a little to deep for an answer that's on the surface.

First, they played two games together with the Jets in 2022. There's not some deep rapport.

Second, how does Cooper and Njoku's success equal Moores failure?

Flacco did look to Moore straight out of the gate. 4/83 on 12 targets in the first game. I don't remember the game enough to explain the low conversion rate but Flacco was barely over 50% on the day and Moore was very efficient with his opportunities the rest of the season.

In the next four, the duo of of Coop and Njoku weren't just good, they were elite:

Combined vs Jax ~ 13/168/2

Combined vs Chicago ~ 14/213/2

Combined vs Houston ~ 17/309/3

Njoku vs Jets (Cooper out) ~ 6/134... and in that game Moore caught 5 of 6 targets for 61 and a TD.


Seems like a strange argument to paint Moore as a failure because of elite success by Coop and Chief. Only so many balls to go around, and this isn't a participation trophy league where the coach and QB tries to keep everyone involved. Flacco was putting up huge numbers and we were winning.


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Winston has a future in sales....



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And it may end up being sooner than he thinks. I would strongly suggest people heavily review the products he endorses.


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Originally Posted by MemphisBrownie
Winston has a future in sales....





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Originally Posted by oobernoober
Originally Posted by Bull_Dawg
.... and an old QB fresh off his couch would seem to be things that would have a negative effect on a receiver's production. In football, production at any position is highly impacted by other people.

If they were actually doing game speed reps of the new scheme, it'd be beneficial. If they're doing babystep basics to acclimate new players, time can probably be better spent elsewhere. Perhaps the team even agreed he was ahead of the pack, and it was a waste of time for him to go through intro to the Browns week. Maybe O'Shea wanted more hands on time with the young WRs.

You seem to want to put things in a vacuum, but it doesn't actually work that simply.

Moore was (ahem) more familiar with Flacco than any of the other passcatchers were. By your logic, he should've pulled ahead of the pack in terms of targets and yardage, but I don't remember that really happening. It was the same guys making plays as before (Cooper and Njoku). Moore had a big game vs the Jets, but I honestly don't really remember him doing much else.

I'm not sure what you think my logic was. It seems more like you're applying your own logic to the situation. I made no mention of familiarity. It (my "logic") was more a case of its easier for any player to do his job if he's playing with better players. If the OL protects longer, the WR has longer to get open. If the QB can find the open receiver and get the ball to him, the receiver has a better chance of making more receptions. Familiarity is great. Yet, some players are just better than others.

Teams generally design plays to get the ball to their best players. Njoku and Cooper were ours on offense for most of last season. When the OL isn't holding up long enough to get past the early reads, you better hope those early reads are working. Fortunately for us, Njoku and Cooper were working pretty well there for a bit.


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I think you touched on the obvious which I hadn't see anyone do before that. Both Njoku and Cooper are the highest in the pecking order. They will always get the most looks. As such they should always have the best stats. It's pretty basic math. And with all that said, even with the revolving door the Browns had at QB Moore set career highs in catches and yardage in 2023.


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Originally Posted by FATE
I think you're digging a little to deep for an answer that's on the surface.

First, they played two games together with the Jets in 2022. There's not some deep rapport.

Second, how does Cooper and Njoku's success equal Moores failure?

Flacco did look to Moore straight out of the gate. 4/83 on 12 targets in the first game. I don't remember the game enough to explain the low conversion rate but Flacco was barely over 50% on the day and Moore was very efficient with his opportunities the rest of the season.

In the next four, the duo of of Coop and Njoku weren't just good, they were elite:

Combined vs Jax ~ 13/168/2

Combined vs Chicago ~ 14/213/2

Combined vs Houston ~ 17/309/3

Njoku vs Jets (Cooper out) ~ 6/134... and in that game Moore caught 5 of 6 targets for 61 and a TD.


Seems like a strange argument to paint Moore as a failure because of elite success by Coop and Chief. Only so many balls to go around, and this isn't a participation trophy league where the coach and QB tries to keep everyone involved. Flacco was putting up huge numbers and we were winning.

Again, I only posted the articles where the writers and/or sportswriters were the ones who evaluated Moore's performance in 2023. I was only looking for a civil discussion as to the reason why. I had that fear of low production when he was traded for in the first place. Using the excuse of OL, QB, and other issues as an excuse for that performance that seems to have only affected him since the Browns played the 12 Personnel more often than not. JMHO, but I think that failure to meet expectations was a major reason for the acquisition of Jeudy. So, let's be clear, I'm not painting Moore as anything, especially not a failure - not my article, but obviously something doesn't add up and skipping the early OTA's surely isn't going to help. Being it's a contract year also causes me concern because if he isn't targeted often in 2024 that contract won't come and like it or not, he has a history.


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Whose expectations yours or the sport-writer?

You answered your concern when you stated the Browns played mostly in 12-personnel. You are not getting high receiving yardage when the offense is running the ball 30 plays a game.

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For someone that isn't grinding an ax, you seem to cut some rather fine distinctions. Just saying.


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Fair enough assessment. I shared the same concerns from the beginning. I think you're reaching a bit with the "only affected him" approach though.

As far as last year: I'm not going to judge him based on the over-expectations-success of others. But still, not a very impressive debut season.

As far as OTAs: I'm not going to judge anyone based on this charade of "voluntary" participation. The only time that impressed me either way is when star players choose to participate when they really don't need to. Which, ironically, many refer to as 'dumb'. 😆

So glad the voluntary OTA bs is likely coming to an end after this season.


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It sounded like you were trying to give Moore the benefit of the doubt due to our Oline and QB situations when those were (at least) equally applicable to all of our pass catchers. You referred to Flacco as the 'old QB off the couch' as a negative even though he had a pretty solid run. I agree with you on the premise that QB play impacts WR production, but in order to apply that to Moore's season, you have to ignore the stellar seasons that Cooper and Njoku had.

I brought up Moore's previous time with Flacco because you would assume that would translate to more looks his way (at least initially), but for some reason that didn't translate to overall production.

While it's true that other positions' play will impact the WRs' numbers, in this case it didn't seem to impact all of our WRs the same. Cooper and Njoku shines while Moore, Bell, etc remained largely invisible.

edit: I want to clarify... I am of the opinion that Moore was a bit of a disappointment last season. I think he was fairly invisible most of the season, especially considering the stories about how we were building up a subset of plays for him. Maybe my early-season expectations were wrong... please show me if you think that's the case. I just don't see it the same way as you... I see a player that wasn't able to get much going out of the gate and then continued to not really show much even when Flacco came in and steadied the QB position.

Last edited by oobernoober; 05/30/24 05:17 PM. Reason: explain argument

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Yet Moore as the third option set career records in passes caught and receiving yardage.


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This is my first time listening to Winston interviewed/press conference. He's really impressive, great press conference, I'd vote for him if he ran for President. He's a positive for the QB room.

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J/C

Amari Cooper is still not at OTAs. Cooper is also in a contract year. Cooper was also traded to the Browns from his previous team. It's also a new offense for Amari.

Yet, some people seem to want to spread a fabricated narrative around only Moore for the same things.

If those are a big deal, is there a reason only one of them is being called out?


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Originally Posted by mulliganvi
I'd vote for him if he ran for President.

Considering the options I would at the very least have to consider him.


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Originally Posted by oobernoober
It sounded like you were trying to give Moore the benefit of the doubt due to our Oline and QB situations when those were (at least) equally applicable to all of our pass catchers. You referred to Flacco as the 'old QB off the couch' as a negative even though he had a pretty solid run. I agree with you on the premise that QB play impacts WR production, but in order to apply that to Moore's season, you have to ignore the stellar seasons that Cooper and Njoku had.

I brought up Moore's previous time with Flacco because you would assume that would translate to more looks his way (at least initially), but for some reason that didn't translate to overall production.

While it's true that other positions' play will impact the WRs' numbers, in this case it didn't seem to impact all of our WRs the same. Cooper and Njoku shines while Moore, Bell, etc remained largely invisible.

edit: I want to clarify... I am of the opinion that Moore was a bit of a disappointment last season. I think he was fairly invisible most of the season, especially considering the stories about how we were building up a subset of plays for him. Maybe my early-season expectations were wrong... please show me if you think that's the case. I just don't see it the same way as you... I see a player that wasn't able to get much going out of the gate and then continued to not really show much even when Flacco came in and steadied the QB position.

I think Moore was always the, at best, 3rd option. When your OL is struggling, it's hard to get to the 3rd option.

When you have to make quick decisions, they will invariably favor primary options. The numbers would seem to bear that out.

Flacco played well at times. Yet, the fact that he is old and was off the couch depressed his ceiling with us. Deep shots are less reliant on precision timing than other routes. As Flacco didn't have a ton of chemistry in this offense he kind of had to either see things before he could throw them or throw it and hope for the best. Having to wait to see if the early options will get open make it less likely to reach options later in the progression. Arm fatigue also seemed to catch up to Joe.

I don't know that your early expectations were wrong, but I don't think we really ran the offense we expected to much at all last season. We were trying to figure out a way to make a hamstrung offense work all season, and unfortunately it had to be simplified which limits opportunities for more complementary players.


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Originally Posted by mulliganvi
This is my first time listening to Winston interviewed/press conference. He's really impressive, great press conference, I'd vote for him if he ran for President. He's a positive for the QB room.

I've been impressed as well. He's come a long way after a rocky start to his career.


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Originally Posted by Bull_Dawg
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Amari Cooper is still not at OTAs. Cooper is also in a contract year. Cooper was also traded to the Browns from his previous team. It's also a new offense for Amari.

Yet, some people seem to want to spread a fabricated narrative around only Moore for the same things.

If those are a big deal, is there a reason only one of them is being called out?

Great point.


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Originally Posted by Bull_Dawg
I think Moore was always the, at best, 3rd option.

I'd be surprised if that was what Berry was thinking when they made the trade to bring him over. That's me trying to read tea leaves, so FWIW.

All in all, I do understand what you're saying and I appreciate the response.


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Njoku is a TE. So in regards to the WR's did you think Moore was brought over to unseat Cooper as the Browns #1 WR?


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Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Njoku is a TE. So in regards to the WR's did you think Moore was brought over to unseat Cooper as the Browns #1 WR?

Surely that question is a trick question since Moore was clearly brought over as the clear #2 at the time. However, I would be negligent to not think that there might have been an underlying motive. Moore was (is) still sitting on his rookie deal. If the expectations were to play a lot of 12-personnel, which they did, and have two 1,000 plus yard receivers - that obviously failed to meet expectations. The underlying motive might have been to sign Moore to a new deal which would be considerably cheaper than resigning Cooper who already makes 20M per season. Fast forward to this off season and the Browns trade for Jeudy and immediately sign him to a 3-year extension on his rookie contract at 17.5M APY. Unless Moore has a Pro Bowl season, I would expect that not only will he be gone in 2025 but very likely to be replaced by one of the other younger players by mid-season. Cooper then has a chance to stay on but figuring his cost may be higher than 27M plus per season, that may be cost prohibitive for the Browns going forward.

Not confident that the wallet is big enough for a 27M Cooper, 14M Njoku, and a 17.5M Jeudy (58.5M) APY on the roster but we'll see.


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Every time the Browns sign high priced FA's we hear that exact same thing. For some reason I think it will work out the same way it's worked out every time before.


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