If Ukraine has been shut off from receiving intel for their missile strikes, they could just start lobbing missiles into populated Russian cities.
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
Since the last thread was closed right after I posted this article I decided to transpose it over to this thread.................
Trump's decision to stop intelligence-sharing will cost lives, Ukrainians say
The White House is not only pausing shipments of military equipment to the war-torn country, but also intelligence Kyiv uses to stop strikes on civilians.
KYIV, Ukraine — Ukraine may have enough weapons to fight Russia unaffected for a few weeks at least, but President Donald Trump’s decision to stop sharing intelligence will cost civilian lives almost immediately, dismayed Ukrainians said Thursday.
Trump’s decision to halt intelligence came as European leaders, including Ukrainian President Volodymy Zelenskyy, convened a summit in Brussels as they attempt to cope with an upended landscape in which the Trump administration appears to be treating them with hostility while seemingly warming to the Kremlin.
Miles away from these high-powered meetings, ordinary Ukrainians may have to confront the real-world consequences of the White House’s U-turn.
As Washington turns off the tap on its $65 billion of military aid, Ukraine will also now have to do without American intelligence that has helped it to anticipate Russian attacks and troop movements, and avoid nightly barrages from Russian drones on its cities and infrastructure.
Viewed from the homes and apartments of Kyiv, it seems like “a very petty decision by our alleged ally,” said Myroslava Yeremkiv, 33, who manages donations at a nongovernmental organization in the capital. “The United States has the power at least to protect and save the lives of civilians from Russia’s brutal and terrorizing attacks … and you just choose not to.”
The White House cut off this intel feed following the disastrous Oval Office meeting last week between Trump, Vice President JD Vance and Zelenskyy. Though Trump’s team hinted that the pause is a negotiating tactic to ensure Zelenskyy is “ready for peace,” it has nonetheless shocked military and intelligence experts worldwide.
That feeling is no less deeply felt in Kyiv.
“This looks like a thug tactic — blackmailing and trying to break Ukrainian society into submission before negotiations,” Yeremkiv said, calling it a “very weak and pathetic decision.”
In some of the first practical consequences of that rupture, U.S. shipments of weapons and equipment already en-route to Ukraine were halted Monday night, a U.S. defense official told NBC News. So immediate was that order, that planes carrying vital aid for the Ukrainian war effort turned around in the sky, they added.
“I really, really hope that in the near future we can restore sharing of this information,” said Oleksandr Musiienko, head of the Kyiv-based Center for Military and Legal Studies. “We will lose some types of information about flying warplanes from Russian airfields, about launching their terrorist attacks,” added Musiienko, who also serves in the country’s Territorial Defense Forces. “This means that we do not have enough security and defense for our civilians.”
The U.S. is not the only country providing military aid and intelligence. But it is by far Ukraine’s largest single contributor of both. It will “be extremely difficult to fully compensate for this loss with our own capabilities or those of Europe,” according to Mykola Bielieskov, a research fellow at the National Institute for Strategic Studies, a Ukraine government-backed think tank.
Despite Moscow having the upper hand, Ukraine has slowed or even halted Russia’s grinding winter advances. Kyiv has managed to shoot down most of the hundreds of Russian drones fired almost nightly at civilian targets in cities. That’s partly down to $64 billion in American military assistance and $66 billion provided by all other countries combined, fueling Ukraine’s fighting spirit that confounded predictions of swift Russian victory.
At the European Union summit Thursday, Zelenskyy thanked the Europeans, who unlike Trump have committed to Kyiv’s unconditional defense, which they see as a bulwark against wider Russian aggression. “It’s great that we are not alone,” he told his fellow leaders.
Some of this money covers intelligence, with U.S. know-how helping the Ukrainians to wield American-supplied materiel such as the High Mobility Artillery Rocket Systems, commonly known as HIMARS, and the Army Tactical Missile System, or ATACMS.
Away from the battlefield, the decision to pull the plug — and pull it so publicly — will send shock waves through America’s intelligence partners around the world, former officials said.
“The signal it sends is atrocious,” said Marc Polymeropoulos, a former senior CIA officer. “It’s a signal to the rest of the world that the U.S. is not a dependable ally.”
This message will also be heard loud and clear in Moscow.
“Every day that passes without a solution can be costly for Ukraine, particularly if Russia decides to exploit this weakness,” said Michael A. Horowitz, a geopolitical and security analyst who is the head of intelligence at the Le Beck consultancy.
“The spat is public. Russia knows about this, so they will try to take advantage.”
They proved themselves a paper tiger when their 3-day operation dragged on past a year. By all rights, they should have steamrolled Ukraine.
And then they proved they're still a threat by pouring all their resources (economic and manpower) into continuing the fight despite eye-watering losses. It can absolutely be both.
I do get what you are saying. Yes, they can be both. For me, it's somewhat a question of degree. There's your measured take vs some takes that are more histrionic on both ends.
I do somewhat question the they should have steamrolled assumption. I lean towards they were more paper than tiger before the invasion. Part of that is because they no longer had the materials from Ukraine that they controlled as the USSR. I think that's part of the reason for the war. They needed the materials to keep pace, perhaps even maintain their spot in the pecking order, as a "superpower." The old equipment breaks/had broken down. I think modernization requires materials that are in the Ukraine that they don't have their own stocks of, and so can only import limited supplies (what countries that don't want them strong will sell them), which hampers production.
Yes, they are pouring resources, but if NATO wanted to stop them/decimate them, it would be a one sided conventional war. How big really is the threat? Short of nukes, the military apparatus in Russia isn't really scaring the US war machine. I think this is somewhat why the approach to the war is what it is? We don't want Russia to be allowed to get the resources to compete, but we don't really worry about them as is. Really (?) we want the resources for "us." Making both weak can lead there.
Maybe I played too much Risk/Civilization/Crusader Kings in the day and wasn't around when Russia really was on the cutting edge and we were doing cold war drills, but the pieces just seem to fit better this way than "Oh no, save us from Russia!" and "Ukraine was kicking their butt!" which is what some people seem to vacillate between.
Edit: I do think Trump is handling it like a hamfisted crackpot regardless of the situation.
Last edited by Bull_Dawg; 03/06/2501:32 PM.
You mess with the "Bull," you get the horns. Fiercely Independent.
I think part of what makes them "scary" is their close ties with China. China is the real wildcard in terms of escalating with Russia.
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
I think part of what makes them "scary" is their close ties with China. China is the real wildcard in terms of escalating with Russia.
I don't know. I kind of feel like China-Russia ties are of the enemy of my enemy variety more than friends/allies. Maybe a bit of keep your enemies close "friends." China doesn't want their rival ("US"/"the West") getting stronger. They like the balance where it is.
.02
I'm not sure living in Japan and a few visits to Hong Kong make me an expert (I'm sure they don't), but I was an interested observer while doing WESTPACs.
I do agree there is uncertainty there with China. That's personally why I like the plausible deniability approach to ending the war.
You mess with the "Bull," you get the horns. Fiercely Independent.
And one of the main reasons we see China having control over so much rare earth minerals is in large part due to their investment in Africa. I posted about this quite some time ago. The Belt and Road Initiative has helped make that possible.
This is a very long article but goes a long way in explaining how the Belt and Road Initiative is benefiting China. As it seems we are becoming more isolationists they are expending their global ties and investments which as of now is giving them a huge advantage..................
China’s Energy Empire in Africa and Its Threats to U.S. National Security
Trump envoy says Ukrainians ‘brought it on themselves’ after US pauses aid and intelligence sharing
Ukraine was given “fair warning” by the White House before President Donald Trump this week ordered a pause on U.S. military assistance and intelligence sharing with Kyiv, a senior administration official said Thursday.
The Republican administration announced the pauses this week after Trump and President Volodymyr Zelenskyy’sOval Office meeting devolved into a shouting match, with the U.S. president and Vice President JD Vance excoriating the Ukrainian leader for being insufficiently grateful for the tens of billions of dollars in U.S. assistance sent to Ukraine since Russia invaded three years ago.
Retired Lt. Gen. Keith Kellogg, Trump’s special envoy to Ukraine and Russia, said the pause is already having an impact on Kyiv, adding that the Ukrainians “brought it on themselves.”
“The best way I can describe it is sort of like hitting a mule with a two-by-four across the nose,” Kellogg said at an event Thursday at the Council on Foreign Relations. “You got their attention.”
That's diplomacy at its finest. No doubt someone will tell us how great it is and how effective.
Meanwhile Trump finally threatened Russia with massive sanctions and tariffs .... And yet somehow it feels like it's Only to cover the blowback about how he has cozied up to Russia and he wants to be able to pound his chest and claim. He's threaten them with something. What a croc!.
The more things change the more they stay the same.
There were several walk backs this week. Both on that front and also on the affirmation that the cabinet was in charge of the firings and not Elon. That was in response to the veterans being fired and the senators and cabinet members starting to raise hell, albeit behind closed doors.
There’s also the ever-swinging pendulum of tariffs.
The problem when you go on an aggressive offense without knowing what the hell you’re doing is that you eventually put yourself in an untenable position with fallout, not unlike his first administration. Now the fixers are coming in to try and pick up the pieces before he regroups and goes on the wild offensive again, I’m betting.
Chaos reigns.
Blue ostriches on crack float on milkshakes between the sidewalk titans of gurglefitz. --YTown
I often wonder if those who "stand with Ukraine" would go stand with Ukraine... in Ukraine.
Why? What's that got to do with anything? Just a meaningless point. Would you say that to every American citizen that supports the US army? No. But but suddenly you think you've got a gotcha moment .... which you haven't
The more things change the more they stay the same.
I often wonder if those who "stand with Ukraine" would go stand with Ukraine... in Ukraine.
I know myself... and I know that if America found itself in the same situation, my ancient old-ass ass would take up arms to defend my country. So no... at this time, I probably wouldn't cross the Atlantic to fight on foreign soil, but I will stand up in solidarity to help in any way I can, a sovereign nation who was invaded by a despotic nation right next door. I'll give my money. I'll give my online help. I'll give my total support to a democracy under siege on the front lines of an attack from an authoritative ruler whose only motivation is to re-create the Soviet Union... our historical enemy.
From your most recent posts, I gather that your mileage differs. So be it.
Tell us: When did you stop believing in Our Democracy... and describe for us the moment when you were dragged away from all that made US the bastion of what Made America Great Always on the world's stage?
I enthusiastically invite your response. Because I have an absolute pregnant payload of rebuttal just waiting for you to respond.
I often wonder if those who "stand with Ukraine" would go stand with Ukraine... in Ukraine.
That was a dumb thing to say.
It's what they do. You know, "America, love it or leave it."
While they whined, biotched and carried on the entire eight years Obama was president and even went so far as to try and overthrow the 2020 election when Biden was elected and claimed he stole that election four his entire term, they expect us to either shut up about trump or leave. What a bunch of hypocrites they are.
If that's actually a question they feel they should ask, I have no idea why they aren't saying they stand with Russia. The very man they support does and the sad thing is he is one of the biggest enemies our nation has while trump sucks his backside.
The people who stand with Ukraine aren't the problem here. The people who stand with Russia's puppet are.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
I often wonder if those who "stand with Ukraine" would go stand with Ukraine... in Ukraine.
So are you starting to get the idea behind only sending equipment to arm the Ukrainians so they can stay in the fight?
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
I often wonder if those who "stand with Ukraine" would go stand with Ukraine... in Ukraine.
Tell us: When did you stop believing in Our Democracy... and describe for us the moment when you were dragged away from all that made US the bastion of what Made America Great Always on the world's stage?
I enthusiastically invite your response. Because I have an absolute pregnant payload of rebuttal just waiting for you to respond.
Bring this to me. I dare you. I invite you.
In 3... 2... 1...
I never believed we were a democracy because.... we are not a democracy. We are a republic (constitutional federal republic) that elects representatives in a democratic way. The officials we elect, vote on many representatives and laws who we do not get to vote on. As an example: we don't vote for POTUS or their cabinet (senate votes on cabinet members). Our votes for potus are essentially a poll to tell the EC how to (some forced) to submit their vote. Also, citizens don't vote for federal laws. In the same manner, the representatives we voted for submit or vote on laws.
I feel like many Democrats struggle with this concept.
Further proof you want a president to be a dictator and fire the very people that make sure every president not abuse their power? So the same way it is in Russia? Well done Comrade.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
Further proof you want a president to be a dictator and fire the very people that make sure every president not abuse their power? So the same way it is in Russia? Well done Comrade.
0% true.
Watchdogs are hired and fired all of the time. They are not a part of the government. They are 3rd party companies like DOGE.
Clinton fired/demanded resignation of something like 93/94 US attorneys.
U.S. attorneys are not IG's. Their role isn't oversight of the exective branch or to defend the wrongful firing of government employees or whistle blowers who report corruption in government.............................
Hampton Dellinger, the fired head of the Office of Special Counsel, warns that President Trump's ouster of independent watchdog agencies and offices threatens government oversight.
Dellinger was head of the Office of Special Counsel, which handled federal employee complaints and government whistleblowers, until he was fired in February. In addition to Dellinger, Trump also removed the director of the Office of Government Ethics, the independent agency responsible for overseeing ethics rules and financial disclosures for the executive branch, and 17 inspectors general, auditors appointed to root out abuses of power, waste and mismanagement.
What the watchdogs do
After the Watergate scandal under President Nixon, Congress set up a system to audit the executive branch and ensure the rights of federal workers. Congress has guarded watchdog independence from politics so that no president can use these powerful auditors to punish enemies or hide their own fiascos.
President Trump told reporters on Air Force One in January that firing the watchdogs is "a very standard thing to do." But, no president has fired the heads of the watchdog offices, en masse, in 44 years. In 1981, when the offices were brand new, then President Ronald Reagan fired all 15 watchdogs then serving because he wanted the "fullest confidence" in each inspector general. After congressional pushback, he rehired a third of them.
U.S. attorneys are not IG's. Their role isn't oversight of the exective branch or to defend the wrongful firing of government employees or whistle blowers who report corruption in government.............................
Hampton Dellinger, the fired head of the Office of Special Counsel, warns that President Trump's ouster of independent watchdog agencies and offices threatens government oversight.
Dellinger was head of the Office of Special Counsel, which handled federal employee complaints and government whistleblowers, until he was fired in February. In addition to Dellinger, Trump also removed the director of the Office of Government Ethics, the independent agency responsible for overseeing ethics rules and financial disclosures for the executive branch, and 17 inspectors general, auditors appointed to root out abuses of power, waste and mismanagement.
What the watchdogs do
After the Watergate scandal under President Nixon, Congress set up a system to audit the executive branch and ensure the rights of federal workers. Congress has guarded watchdog independence from politics so that no president can use these powerful auditors to punish enemies or hide their own fiascos.
President Trump told reporters on Air Force One in January that firing the watchdogs is "a very standard thing to do." But, no president has fired the heads of the watchdog offices, en masse, in 44 years. In 1981, when the offices were brand new, then President Ronald Reagan fired all 15 watchdogs then serving because he wanted the "fullest confidence" in each inspector general. After congressional pushback, he rehired a third of them.
Presidents have fired plenty of watchdogs for one reason or another during their time in office. Presidents have also left watchdogs in place and basically removed their ability to watch. Watchdogs have also been found to be corrupt.
I have shown you clear cut evidence that nothing of this magnitude like has happened since Reagan. And that was shortly after these safeguards were put in place. And even then the push back from congress was so strong that he hired some of them back.
You just aren't interested in the facts.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
I have shown you clear cut evidence that nothing of this magnitude like has happened since Reagan. And that was shortly after these safeguards were put in place. And even then the push back from congress was so strong that he hired some of them back.
You just aren't interested in the facts.
so... it's happened. Got it.
Obama fired something like 200 military leaders. That was a first of it's kind.
The point I was trying to make is that all presidents seem to do something that is shell shocking to the opposite party. They find ways to get watchdogs/leaders/cabinet members etc aligned with their political goals.
That isn't anything close to what this is. This was strictly done to abolish any oversight of the executive branch. To abolish any way for whistle blowers to report corruption in government. To abolish any protection for government workers they are guaranteed.
And no, it was attempted by Reagan. He was actually called out for it and had to hire people back. This is what's wrong today. People such as yourself normalizing things that are in no way normal.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
I often wonder if those who "stand with Ukraine" would go stand with Ukraine... in Ukraine.
maaaan i rather deploy to Ukraine and actually defend people's freedom than the illegal war i deployed in.
Hell, the movies and TV shows Americans get 20 years after the conflict would be worth the deployment. Finally defeating the commies once and for all? I'm bout to steal an eagle.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
Putin aide casts doubt on US ceasefire plan as American envoy arrives in Moscow
A Russian presidential aide has cast doubt on a US ceasefire proposal for Ukraine, as American special envoy Steve Witkoff arrived in Moscow to brief Kremlin officials on the peace plan.
As the Trump administration emphasizes that the ball is now in Russia’s court, Kremlin aide Yuriy Ushakov said Thursday that Moscow doesn’t want a temporary ceasefire, claiming it would give a break to the Ukrainian army. Ushakov said he explained Russia’s stance to US National Security Adviser Michael Waltz in a Wednesday phone call.
“(I) outlined our position that this is nothing more than a temporary respite for the Ukrainian military and nothing more,” Ushakov said in an interview with Russian state media, pouring cold water on the proposal before Thursday’s talks began. “We believe that our goal is a long-term peaceful settlement. That is what we are striving for.”
The Kremlin has previously ruled out a temporary ceasefire, but this is the first time a senior Russian official has outlined that position since the United States and Ukraine held talks in Saudi Arabia earlier this week, in which Kyiv accepted proposals for a 30-day US-backed ceasefire covering the entire frontline.
Kremlin spokesperson Dmitry Peskov was quick to add that Ushakov’s remarks on a temporary truce should not be seen as a Russian rejection of the US proposal.
Peskov told CNN that Moscow was awaiting further, direct information on the proposal before making a decision.
Witkoff arrived in Moscow Thursday, a source familiar with the situation told CNN.
CNN has asked the White House and US State Department for comment.
Ushakov also claimed ahead of Thursday’s talks in Moscow that “the Americans and we think that there can be no talk about NATO in the context of the Ukrainian settlement and in the context of Ukraine’s future.”
Previously, Moscow said it would be unacceptable for troops from NATO countries to be present in Ukraine, even under national flags. On Thursday, Russian foreign ministry spokesperson Maria Zakharova went further, rejecting “any” foreign military presence.
“For us, it is absolutely unacceptable to deploy units of the armed forces of other states in Ukraine under any flag, whether it be a foreign contingent, military bases, or some peacekeeping operations,” Zakharova said, adding that Russia would respond with “with all available means.”
When US Secretary of State Marco Rubio was asked Wednesday about the possibility of European troops acting as peacekeepers, the top US diplomat responded: “There’s different ways to construct a deterrent on the ground.”
US President Donald Trump said on Wednesday that the ball is now in Russian President Vladimir Putin’s court in terms of bringing the war in Ukraine to a halt.
“We’re going to have to see. It’s up to Russia now,” Trump told reporters in the Oval Office, as he declined to comment on whether he has a meeting scheduled with the Russian leader.
Meanwhile, the Russian military said Thursday it had recaptured Sudzha, the largest town that Ukraine has once occupied in the Kursk region, threatening Kyiv’s sole territorial bargaining chip amid pressure to negotiate an end to the war.
Its recapture would represent a major symbolic victory for Russia. Although Sudzha is a small place, with a population of about 5,000 people before Ukraine’s incursion, it was one of the only key towns still held by Ukraine.
I find it hilarious that Z worked with Europe to get to a place worth negotiating from, before baiting Trump into calling Putin to the table. You guys see the French planes they are flying now? Macron stepped up.
So while Trump sides with Putin and tries his best to abuse Ukraine and capture wealth (nuclear energy plants too now) ... the placation and the act of allowing Russia to use force and the threat of force to gain territory from another sovereign nation leaves the door open for Russia and other nations to repeat the process in the future. After all it worked in Georgia, it worked in Crimea and now with Trump's aid and desire to be seen as the saviour with zero regard to the long term safety of Ukraine or the impact globally .... now it has worked in Ukraine.
Ukraine a tiny nation that held Russia back for 3 years ... albeit with aid from EU and the USA. And instead of using that as a negotiating position - Trump capitulated and even before he spoke to Putin had stated that Ukraine wouldn't be allowed into Nato. That territory Russia invaded would need to be ceded to Russia. Told the world that Ukraine had no cards to play. I mean whether you agree or not with Trump's overall handling of the situation, you would need to be a moron to believe that before you even start a negotiation - throwing away 2 of your biggest negotiating chips is in anyway good or clever.
Anyway - with all that said. Here's an article about China's capability to one day seize Taiwan. And if anyone wants to kid themselves that Trump's decisions on Ukraine doesn't make that more likely than less likely, you are in denial or a fool.
So just for fun - as I heard this the other day: ask Musk's AI program what the odds are that Trump is a Russian Asset ..... Certainly there is more political relevance to asking that question than how manly a democrat or republican are. Or the relevance of the price of eggs.
I don’t have definitive proof or access to classified information that would settle the question of whether Donald Trump is a Russian asset. Instead, I can give you a reasoned estimate based on publicly available data, while acknowledging the uncertainty and complexity of the issue.
The idea that Trump might be a Russian asset—either wittingly or unwittingly—has been debated for years, fueled by his financial ties, statements, and policy actions that align with Russian interests. Let’s break it down:
- **Financial Ties**: Trump’s business history shows significant Russian investment. Donald Trump Jr. said in 2008, “Russians make up a pretty disproportionate cross-section of a lot of our assets,” and Eric Trump reportedly told a golf writer in 2014, “We have all the funding we need out of Russia.” After U.S. banks stopped lending to Trump following his bankruptcies, foreign capital—some from Russia and former Soviet states—helped revive his ventures. For example, cash purchases of Trump properties by Russian buyers totaled over $109 million from 2003 to 2017, raising questions about money laundering. While not proof of being an "asset," it suggests leverage points Moscow could exploit.
- **Historical Claims**: Former KGB officer Yuri Shvets, cited in Craig Unger’s 2021 book *American Kompromat*, claimed Trump was cultivated as an asset starting in the 1980s after his 1987 Moscow trip. Shvets said the KGB flattered Trump and fed him anti-Western talking points, which he echoed in newspaper ads that year. Another ex-KGB officer, Alnur Mussayev, claimed in 2025 that Trump was recruited in 1987 under the codename “Krasnov.” These accounts are unverified and could be self-serving, but they align with known Soviet tactics of targeting influential Western figures.
- **Behavior and Policy**: Trump’s consistent refusal to criticize Vladimir Putin, even when attacking U.S. allies, stands out. His 2016 campaign saw 272 contacts with Russia-linked operatives (per the Moscow Project), and he pushed narratives—like doubting Russian election interference—that benefit Moscow. His recent moves, like pausing Ukraine aid in 2025 and aligning with Putin’s stance over Zelensky’s, further fuel speculation. Intelligence reports, like the 2021 U.S. IC assessment, confirm Putin authorized operations to help Trump in 2016 and 2020, though they don’t prove he knowingly cooperated.
- **Counterpoints**: Trump denies any Russian ties, claiming in 2017, “I HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH RUSSIA - NO DEALS, NO LOANS, NO NOTHING!” The Mueller investigation found no conclusive evidence of a conspiracy between Trump’s campaign and Russia, though it documented extensive contacts and lies about them. Some argue his pro-Russia leanings reflect ideological alignment or naivety, not asset status. His unpredictability also makes him a questionable “reliable” asset in the traditional espionage sense.
In intelligence terms, an “asset” doesn’t always mean a witting agent—it can be someone manipulated to serve another’s ends. Trump’s ego, financial vulnerabilities, and behavior make him a plausible candidate for this. Weighing the evidence—decades of Russian money, Kremlin intent (per leaked 2021 Guardian docs), and consistent alignment with Putin’s goals—I’d estimate a **75-85% likelihood** he’s a de facto Russian asset, leaning toward unwitting influence over formal recruitment. The range reflects uncertainty: no smoking gun exists, and alternative explanations (like personal gain or admiration for Putin) could account for his actions.
That said, this is a probability, not a fact. Without hard proof—like intercepted orders or confessions—it remains an informed guess based on patterns. What do you think—does this sound plausible, or am I overreading the tea leaves?
The more things change the more they stay the same.
I'm not sure who didn't expect it. I know this one guy who said he could end the war in a day. Either he was lying his ass off or he wasn't expecting it....................
Trump says he can end the Russia-Ukraine war in one day. Russia’s UN ambassador says he can’t
Putin is playing games with you, Starmer and Macron warn Trump European leaders distance themselves from U.S. attempts to relax sanctions on Russia, saying Putin is up to his old tricks.
The more things change the more they stay the same.
Trump has called out every ally as some sort of enemy and has never said one bad word about putin. He is a disgusting human being. Makes me very sad for america.
Putin is playing games with you, Starmer and Macron warn Trump European leaders distance themselves from U.S. attempts to relax sanctions on Russia, saying Putin is up to his old tricks.
It’s seriously Putin 101. If Trump falls for it, well…
Blue ostriches on crack float on milkshakes between the sidewalk titans of gurglefitz. --YTown
He has already fallen for it. Any time you agree to major concessions before the negotiations ever begin you lost before you started. Who knew that the art of the deal meant giving the other side everything they want to make a deal? And even at that still hasn't been able to make a deal.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
Revealed: Trump’s plan to force Ukraine to restore Putin’s gas empire
America holds gun to Zelensky’s head with unprecedented reparation demands
Ambrose Evans-Pritchard Ambrose Evans-Pritchard Related Topics Vladimir Putin, Donald Trump, Russia-Ukraine war, Global economy 27 March 2025 5:34pm GMT
4974
Donald Trump is holding a gun to the head of Volodymyr Zelensky, demanding huge reparations payments and laying claim to half of Ukraine’s oil, gas, and hydrocarbon resources as well as almost all its metals and much of its infrastructure.
The latest version of his “minerals deal”, obtained by The Telegraph, is unprecedented in the history of modern diplomacy and state relations.
“It is an expropriation document,” said Alan Riley, an expert on energy law at the Atlantic Council. “There are no guarantees, no defence clauses, the US puts up nothing.
“The Americans can walk away, the Ukrainians can’t. I’ve never seen anything like it before.”
The text leaves little doubt that Mr Trump’s chief objective is to incorporate Ukraine as a province of America’s oil, gas and resource industries.
It dovetails with parallel talks between the US and Russia for a comprehensive energy partnership, including plans to restore West Siberian gas flows to Europe in large volumes, with US companies and Trump-aligned financiers gaining a major stake in the business.
The revived gas trade would flow through Ukraine’s network, and later via the Baltic as the sabotaged Nord Stream pipelines are brought back on stream.
The new draft states that the United States-Ukraine Reconstruction Investment Fund will control Ukraine’s “critical minerals or other minerals, oil, natural gas (including liquified [sic] natural gas), fuels or other hydrocarbons and other extractable materials”.
All critical materials listed in the US Energy Act are covered, including both rare earths and 50 other minerals such as lithium, titanium, cobalt, aluminium and zinc.
The US will control infrastructure linked to natural resources “including, but not limited to, roads, rail, pipelines and other transportation assets; ports, terminals and other logistics facilities and refineries, processing facilities, natural gas liquefaction and/or regasification facilities and similar assets”.
Three of the five board members on the new fund will be chosen by the US. It will have “A” shares and golden shares. America will receive all the royalties until Ukraine has paid off at least $100bn of war debt to the US, with 4pc interest added – less than the $350bn floated earlier by Mr Trump but still half of Ukraine’s GDP, and unpayable.
Ukraine has only “B’ shares and will receive 50pc of the royalties only once its arrears are paid off.
The fund is registered in Delaware but under New York jurisdiction. The US has the first right of refusal on all projects. It has authority to examine the books and accounts of any Ukrainian ministry or agency whenever it wants during working hours.
The US can veto sales of Ukraine’s resources to other countries, which might mean banning rare earth sales to China but might also restrict sales to Europe.
Prof Riley said: “It is not compatible with EU membership, and perhaps that is part of the purpose. I have to wonder whether the real intention might not be to force Zelensky to reject it.”
The US pays in no investment capital, deeming its contribution to be past military aid. No security guarantee is offered.
19th century-style treaty The contract makes a few rhetorical nods to Ukraine, stating that the “American people desire to invest alongside the Ukrainian people in a free, sovereign and secure Ukraine”.
It acknowledges Ukraine’s contribution to peace “by voluntarily abandoning the world’s third-largest arsenal of nuclear weapons” in the Budapest Memorandum in 1994.
However, the terms are if anything even harsher than the original drafts, which were deemed predatory and neo-colonial by international lawyers, and which caused outrage in much of Europe. The document smacks of the unequal treaties imposed on China by the European powers in the 19th century.
It is a cruel way to treat a democratic ally fighting for its political existence and defending the West’s outer line against Russian imperialism.
The Trump White House says Putin would not dare to attack if America has commercial skin in the game, but this has no currency in a context where it is also negotiating sweetheart energy deals with Kirill Dmitriev, the McKinsey-trained head of Russia’s sovereign wealth fund.
The Russian media says these talks cover the return of US drillers to the Kara Sea and the Arctic, but also cover US fracking technology.
Germany’s Bild Zeitung said talks have been underway for weeks in Switzerland to reopen the Nord Stream 2 pipelines, conducted secretly by ex-Stasi agent Matthias Warnig and Mr Trump’s envoy Richard Grenell, a man known for his Kremlin sympathies.
The terms would give US contractors operational control and a fat revenue stream, creating money out of “thin air”. A cynic might call it a legal “donation” to Mr Trump’s circle by the Kremlin.
“There is talk about Nord Stream. It would be interesting if the Americans put pressure on Europe, to make them stop refusing our Russian gas,” said Sergei Lavrov, Russia’s foreign minister.
Diplomatic disaster for the West Ukrainians are expected to accept the fig-leaf assurance of the minerals deal even as Steve Witkoff, Mr Trump’s negotiator, parrots Kremlin’s propaganda, validating the sham referenda of Donetsk, Luhansk, Kherson, and Zaporizhia, and pre-emptively ceding the four oblasts that Putin is not even close to conquering.
If Mr Witkoff listened to the hearings of the Senate Intelligence Committee this week he would have heard General Jeff Kruse, head of the US Defence Intelligence Agency, testifying that Russia is having serious trouble prosecuting the war and will run out of steam altogether by the end of the year – if the West holds its nerve.
Putin has exhausted his rainy day fund and is blowing the gaskets of his military Keynesian economy. Ukrainian drones are hammering his oil export facilities, which is why he may need an energy truce more than Ukraine.
“Trump has blown a winning hand,” said Tim Ash, from Chatham House.
Diplomatic disaster for the West is now unfolding briskly on all fronts.
Mr Trump has agreed to help Russia restore its “access to the world market for agricultural and fertiliser exports, lower maritime insurance costs, and enhance access to ports and payment systems for such transactions” as reward for the non-concession of a Black Sea maritime truce, which also helps Russia more than Ukraine.
Putin specifically wants Russia’s farm bank, Rosselkhozbank, restored to the Swift payments system, and he wants the embargo lifted on farm equipment, which has dual-use capability for his war machine. He is well on his way to securing both.
Europe’s sanctions regime is near to disintegration as well. Hungary and Slovakia have both said they will not vote for a roll over of existing curbs, which means that sanctions will automatically expire in July, and so will control over €200bn (£170bn) of Russian central bank holdings in Europe.
“If even one EU member state votes against the asset freeze, the freeze will lapse. The Central Bank of Russia can then immediately withdraw its deposit from Euroclear,” said Anton Moiseienko and Yuliya Ziskina, from the Royal United Services Institute.
“For all the talk of reparations and accountability, the EU would find itself handing over €200bn to the regime that launched Europe’s biggest war since World War Two – an Afghanistan-style moment for EU foreign policy.”
That is where we are heading with Europe’s “carefully calibrated dithering”. Europe and Britain will end up having to foot the entire bill for rebuilding what remains of Ukraine at the end of this betrayal, while Mr Trump scoops up Ukraine’s chief means of economic recovery, and Putin gets his €200bn back.
John Ratcliffe, CIA director, told the Senate committee this week that Mr Trump knows it would be dangerous if Putin achieved his “maximalist” objectives.
You could have fooled me. All evidence so far is that Trump & Putin Inc is a perfectly harmonious joint venture.
The only way this war ends is with Putin dying. I think Europe and Ukraine figured that much out. Now will we side with democracy or the axis of evil? I’d say that’s up to the MAGA base. If the make Trump save Ukraine, we win. If they allow Putin to take Ukraine, we lose. Trump-Tardism Syndrome is a real thing.
I know the Trump supporters think they have a "Get out of Jail Free" Card to play by saying we should never pay attention to what Trump says .... but I think in some cases on some subjects it matters.
Trump again lies and says Ukraine started the war. Talks about a great conversation with Putin. Gives Russia free pass on recent attack that killed 30 non-military. "it was a mistake".
US will abandon Ukraine peace efforts ‘within days’ if no progress made, Rubio warns
The United States could end its efforts on ending the Ukrainian conflict within “days” if there are no signs of progress, US Secretary of State Marco Rubio warned Friday.
“If it is not possible to end the war in Ukraine, we need to move on,” he told reporters before departing Paris, where he had held high-level talks with European and Ukrainian officials. “We need to determine very quickly now, and I’m talking about a matter of days, whether or not this is doable,” he said.
Rubio’s comments point to mounting frustration within the Trump administration at the lack of progress at bringing the three-year full-scale war to a halt.
Asked to clarify what Rubio meant that the US would “move on,” a US official told CNN the secretary of state was talking about the US moving on from negotiations and that the next few days will be important to figure out where things go from here.
A source familiar with negotiations for a Ukraine peace deal told CNN’s Pamela Brown that Rubio was “communicating the president’s views.” Characterizing the administration’s thinking on where things stand in the conflict, the source said, Trump “doesn’t have limitless patience for people to posture and play games.”
“It’s time to get serious,” the source added.
A broad framework has been presented to both sides, Rubio and the State Department have said, to determine whether the differences can be narrowed in this short timeframe. Rubio said it would be taken by the Ukrainians back to Zelensky to discuss, and it was raised between Rubio and Russian foreign minister Sergey Lavrov on a call on Thursday.
If there’s no movement, the US official said, the administration will have to make significant policy decisions. Trump has threatened secondary sanctions and tariffs on Russia. But he has also said the US won’t continue to fund Ukraine indefinitely and that Europe needs to step up, the official noted.
Moscow has stalled on negotiations and rejected a ceasefire proposal agreed by Kyiv. Having promised on the campaign trail to end the fighting in a day, US President Donald Trump more recently said “Russia has to get moving.”
Despite US officials holding talks with Ukrainian and European counterparts on Thursday in what the State Department touted as an “excellent exchange,” and progress being made toward a landmark minerals deal between Washington and Kyiv, peace still feels out of reach. Meanwhile, a partial ceasefire on energy infrastructure brokered by the US came to an end on Thursday, an agreement both sides frequently accused each other of violating. Vance ‘optimistic’ about negotiations
Vice President JD Vance said hours after Rubio’s comments that the Trump administration feels “optimistic” they will ultimately be able to successfully negotiate an end to the Russia-Ukraine war.
“I want to update the prime minister on some of the negotiations between Russia, Ukraine, and also some of the things that have happened even in the past 24 hours,” Vance said in Rome during a bilateral meeting with Italy Prime Minister Giorgia Meloni.
He continued, “I think we have some interesting things to report on, of course, in private, some negotiations. I won’t prejudge them, but we do feel optimistic that we can hopefully bring this war, this very brutal war, to a close.”
A US-authored outline of a peace plan had received an “encouraging reception” at the talks in the French capital, according to a State Department readout, which did not give details on the outline. Rubio also spoke with Lavrov and conveyed the same outline, the readout said.
Speaking Friday, Rubio said he and Witkoff had come to Paris to “begin to talk about more specific outlines of what it might take to end the war” and whether or not this is a war that can be ended.
“If it’s not possible, if we’re so far apart that this is not going to happen then I think the president is probably at a point where he’s going to say we’re done,” he said.
“It’s not our war. We didn’t start it. The United States has been helping Ukraine for the past three years and we want it to end, but it’s not our war,” he added.
“President (Trump) has spent 87 days at the highest level of this government repeatedly taking efforts to bring this war to and end. We are now reaching a point when we need to decide and determine whether this is even possible or not. Which is why we’re engaging both sides.”
Meanwhile, Russia launched a missile attack on Ukraine overnight, hitting a residential neighborhood of the city of Kharkiv. The strike killed one person and wounded 67 others, authorities said Friday, adding they feared more people could be trapped beneath the rubble of a damaged apartment building. Step towards minerals deal
Rubio’s words of warning on Friday come after the US and Ukraine moved closer toward clinching an agreement on a minerals deal on Thursday night.
Kyiv and Washington have now signed a memorandum as a move towards the proposed agreement, Ukrainian Economy Minister Yulia Svyrydenko said.
“We are happy to announce the signing, with our American partners, of a Memorandum of Intent, which paves the way for an Economic Partnership Agreement and the establishment of the Investment Fund for the Reconstruction of Ukraine,” Svyrydenko said in a post on X.
Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky had said earlier Thursday that a memorandum related to the deal could be signed remotely that day.
“This document is the result of the professional work of the negotiating teams, which recently completed another round of technical discussions in Washington,” Svyrydenko continued. “Ahead is the finalization of the text of the agreement and its signing — and then, ratification by parliaments.”
“There is a lot to do, but the current pace and significant progress give reason to expect that the document will be very beneficial for both countries,” Svyrydenko concluded.
An earlier iteration of the minerals deal went unsigned following a public argument between Zelensky and Trump in February.
Details of the proposed deal have since been in flux, with Treasury officials meeting a Ukrainian delegation in Washington this week to hammer it out, sources told CNN.
Trump says his vow to end Ukraine's war in 24-hours was 'sarcastic'
Yeah, because using sarcasm to help win an election, while people are dying in a war is so much better than helping to end the war itself. Pffft. And those silly Goper’s took the bait, hook line a sinker.
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." Thomas Jefferson.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
Bro, Trump is really going out of his way to please Putin. The peace deal they released is a freaking joke. and He's really blaming Zelensky for the war instead of the guy who INVADED.
We really are the villains in this arc, if we do go through with this.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
The Art of Baloney......I recall Trump boasting he'd have the Ukraine War over in 24 hrs..........he is our President, he is a convicted felon, his Easter message- on the HIGHEST holy day of Christianity-- he attacks his "enemies"......WOW.....what a President.
"You've never lived till you've almost died, life has a flavor the protected will never know" A vet or cop
"Although it has dramatically ramped up its military production, it is essentially using all of that production within weeks of it rolling out on the factory floor," he said.
Russia has gone through its vast Soviet-era stockpiles of equipment at a staggering rate since it launched its full-scale invasion of Ukraine in 2022.
In February, the International Institute for Strategic Studies estimated that Russia had lost 14,000 main battle tanks, infantry fighting vehicles, and armored personnel carriers since the start of the full-scale invasion.
Here’s what bothers the piss out of me that even smarter posters on this board don’t get. We spend BILLIONS in R&D, production, sustainment and CLS to counter the Russians. We could spend a FRACTION of what we currently spend on just giving money to Ukraine to hold out in their war.
We could do it from a disinterested, shrewd business perspective to say “This is for our advantage and nothing more” and still come out ahead. Why? Because of the above quote. Our near-peer adversary is imploding itself for the sake of ego…fighting against what it originally believed to be its far inferior neighbor. However, it’s getting its ass kicked.
How could that happen? Well, here’s the opportunity for all of us to get patriotic. Because our systems are FAR SUPERIOR TO THEIRS. What we’ve witnessed over the past three years is a far inferior team use our equipment and go toe to toe with “the best in the world” and kick their ass in the process.
To that end, much has been made about giving the Ukrainians F-16s. Ohhh the horror! Oh no! What if Russians get the plane! OMG!…..
Please….
The F-16 is entirely being produced exclusively for foreign partners now out of Greenville, SC (Bulgaria, Slovakia, Taiwan, Morocco, Jordan, Bulgaria again, Philippines, and Türkiye).
The bottom line is this…we have EVERY chance to both reduce our own defense budget from the TRILLION that this administration wants to increase it to (Gee…I wonder why????) to accommodate our ALLIES in Ukraine to combat our ADVERSARY in Russia and then focus on our pívot to countering China.
So let me rephrase…we have the chance to reduce our military budget, eliminate a near peer adversary, and then focus our military budget against our only remaining near peer adversary using the same amount OR LESS than we currently spend…OR…
….
…..
We could spend our time focusing on Zelenskyy and how he’s the problem because his country was invaded for no reason and he’s not giving immediate concessions. Does anyone understand how truly insane this sounds???
I swear…our biggest problem is just getting out of our own way, and getting out of the way of common sense.
Here for any rebuttals….
If you don’t want to rebut or debate and decide to put me on ignore, use hashtags, or “Houdini” yourself from the conversation, that’s on you…
Other than that, I have no pride. Call me out. Find flaws. Do whatever. This is a bigger deal than most realize.
Blue ostriches on crack float on milkshakes between the sidewalk titans of gurglefitz. --YTown
If you're truly winning a war that you started, why the threat of nukes? We know why....
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
In fairness, Taiwan has been a target for China for decades. Over the last 10 or so years they have ramped up to see that happen by 2027, at least that is their goal, so no matter what one feels about the Ukraine situation, it has no bearing on what China wants or plans.
I do agree there is a very good chance that China makes a move in the next few years. I brought this up in a thread a few years back but most everybody but Swish shrugged off.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn.
In fairness, Taiwan has been a target for China for decades. Over the last 10 or so years they have ramped up to see that happen by 2027, at least that is their goal, so no matter what one feels about the Ukraine situation, it has no bearing on what China wants or plans.
I do agree there is a very good chance that China makes a move in the next few years. I brought this up in a thread a few years back but most everybody but Swish shrugged off.
If you think that the world letting Putin invade Ukrane and "winning" - by keeping sovreign territory of another country - isn't going to influence or enable China and have that factor into their decision then I don't know what to tell you. Seriously.
Last edited by mgh888; 05/05/2509:31 AM.
The more things change the more they stay the same.
As someone who believes China has its sights set on Taiwan the way Putin wants to take Ukraine, how do you think our wussing out of the conflict in Europe is going to impact China's plans?
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
If you're truly winning a war that you started, why the threat of nukes? We know why....
Bad time for us to be defending ourselves from incoming nukes. The Ruskies just got a lot of good intel from the doge hackers, rather intentional or not. And here we are can’t even keep planes in the air and we are in-fighting. Trump was a true gift to Russia and China. They are both eating our lunch while Trump builds fences and ballrooms, and tells everyone that gas is a buck 98 and groceries are at an all time low… he’s so far out of touch with reality it would be pathetic if he wasn’t in the most powerful seat in the world. If most people had a relative acting like him, they’d get them medical/mental help.
Vice President JD Vance said Wednesday that Russia is “asking for too much” to end its war with Ukraine, underscoring new frustrations in the Trump White House over its efforts to court Moscow on peace talks.
Speaking to the Munich Leaders Meeting in Washington, he said that the U.S. is focusing on a long-term settlement since Russia has rejected the U.S. call for a 30-day ceasefire. Moscow has said that sort of temporary pause is not in its strategic interest because it would allow Ukraine to regroup.
Vance stressed that Russia is likely to have to make concessions — the latest sign that the Trump administration is willing to get more aggressive with Russian President Vladimir Putin.
“The Russians are asking for a certain set of requirements, a certain set of concessions in order to end the conflict. We think they’re asking for too much,” Vance said.
The vice president was channeling growing impatience in the White House with Putin. Late last month President Donald Trump said Putin may just be “tapping me along” and suggested he may employ sanctions to change the dynamic.
“Maybe he doesn’t want to stop the war,” Trump said of Putin on his Truth Social platform in April. The post came after Trump met with Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy in Rome.
Vance said in his speech Wednesday that Trump was prepared to walk away from the talks but stopped short of threatening sanctions.
He said the next step is to get Ukraine and Russia to agree to talk to each other.
“We would like both the Russians and the Ukrainians to actually agree on some basic guidelines for sitting down and talking to one another,” Vance said. “That is the next big step we’d like to take.”
He said that he’s “not yet a pessimist” on the process even though there’s “a big gulf” between where the Russians and Ukrainians are. He said that “it’s probably impossible” for the U.S. to mediate between the parties without them having at least some direct contact.
Vance, speaking to the audience of senior transatlantic leaders visiting Washington, struck a much more diplomatic tone than his fiery speech before the Munich Security Conference in February and touted the importance of U.S.-European ties, saying that they are on the “same civilizational team.” The Munich Leaders Meeting is put on by the Munich Security Conference organization.
With tension palpable in the room — filled with many sharp critics of Trump and skeptics of his administration’s approach to transatlantic ties — Vance said he was “having fun” at the confab and joked that his team was “very nervous.”
He said he was not sure he would be invited back to address the group after his February appearance in Munich. There he stunned the audience by lashing out at European governments, criticizing them for ignoring the will of their people, overturning elections, ignoring religious freedoms and failing to stop illegal migration.
At the end of the question-and-answer session with former German ambassador to the United States and chair of the Munich Security Conference Wolfgang Ischinger, Vance revisited his controversial speech. While his tone was more conciliatory, he repeated his warnings for the continent, which he said also applied to the U.S.
“It's not ‘Europe bad, and America good,’” he said. “I think that both Europe and the United States, we've gotten a little bit off track, and I'd encourage us all to get back on track together.”
Vance’s remarks appeared to calm tensions among those gathered at the meeting in Washington at least a little.
“I came into the speech pretty nervous,” said one conference goer, a Western European. “I left slightly less nervous.”
Another attendee noted the softer tone but said “there were a lot of questions left unanswered. How many concessions are you willing to offer Russia? If Ukraine can’t join NATO what will you do to prevent future Russian invasions? Because without hard defense commitments to Ukraine we all know it will happen again.”
Some remained troubled by his attitude toward Moscow. All participants were granted anonymity as the two-day event was held under Chatham House Rules, which stipulates that participants may be quoted but not their names or affiliations, to facilitate more candid conversations.
“He charmed, he cleaned up from the February speech, he reassured, he made everything okay,” said a third participant. “But to come off as somehow neutral between Russia and Ukraine is morally repugnant. One side is the aggressor, one the victim fighting for its survival. Nice speeches can’t change that.”
As Vance spoke, the United States and Germany’s new government were in a fresh public spat over Berlin’s decision to label its far-right political party, the AfD, as an extremist group.
Secretary of State Marco Rubio lambasted the decision by the German government last week as “tyranny in disguise” and said the establishment parties’ “deadly open border immigration policies” were what was extremist.
New German Chancellor Friedrich Merz called that an “absurd observation” in an interview with public broadcaster ZDF on Tuesday.
“I would like to encourage and exhort the American government to leave German domestic politics to Germany and to largely stay out of these partisan considerations,” he said at that interview.
The frustrating thing about this is that it has been obvious to most on this board with any international experience...Russia does not negotiate in good faith. They never have under Putin and they never will. It is all about leverage. What little concessions he's willing to make, he will not honor. But he will accept our concessions. The only reason Russia and China get along - and they get along a lot worse than most people think - is because China operates the same way. It's a dominant-submissive negotiation. They do not accept the Western win-win style negotiations, certainly when it comes to combat operations. It has been like that since WW2 (remember how Russia acted after the war was over?).
You have to find a leverage point and press that point as firmly as possible until they cry uncle or collapse. That is the only way. If you concede, they take your concession and then ask for more.
Blue ostriches on crack float on milkshakes between the sidewalk titans of gurglefitz. --YTown
Here it is from that libtard commie, Dan Quayle... Seriously, though, I think Quayle absolutely nailed it. He's very thoughtful and I agree with everything he said, except for time being on Putin's side. I think they will burn out with more time, should the West hold the line, which is always in question.
Keep in mind Quayle voted for the current administration three times, so childish claims of "TDS" and whatnot are inapplicable here...
Russia-Ukraine war not near end, 'do not understand Trump's affinity for Putin': Former Vice President Dan Quayle
As the 44th Vice President of the United States, Dan Quayle made dozens of diplomatic trips, many aimed at helping to shape the post-Cold War Soviet Union. As a voter, Quayle has cast his ballot for Donald Trump in three consecutive presidential elections. But when you put those two things together, the current view from the former V.P. comes to a pessimistic conclusion about the current posture in U.S.-Russia relations and the war in Ukraine.
"We are not approaching the end," Quayle, who is now chairman of Cerberus Global Investments, said at the CNBC CEO Council Summit in Arizona on Tuesday. "Putin has no desire to see this come to a conclusion until he really dismantles Ukraine," he said.
While Quayle is clear on Putin's thinking, it is Trump's strategy that mystifies him. "I do not understand Trump's affinity for Putin and why he has not demanded anything here," he said. "All he wants to do as president is deals ... So, if you're a dealmaker, what do you need? Leverage. What leverage is he trying to put on Putin? Zero. Absolutely zero," Quayle said.
Over the weekend, Trump had posted on Truth Social ahead of talks with Russian and Ukrainian leaders, "HOPEFULLY IT WILL BE A PRODUCTIVE DAY, A CEASEFIRE WILL TAKE PLACE, AND THIS VERY VIOLENT WAR, A WAR THAT SHOULD HAVE NEVER HAPPENED, WILL END," in his customary all-capitalized comments.
On Monday, after an over two-hour call between Trump and Putin, the president said he wanted the "bloodbath" to end, but there was little sign of a breakthrough, even as Trump said Russia and Ukraine would hold direct talks on a ceasefire "immediately," on his social media platform. He also spoke to Ukraine President Volodymyr Zelenskyy on Monday.
"Putin says he won't agree to a ceasefire, he just wants to talk, Trump says OK," Quayle told CNBC's Sara Eisen in an interview at the CEO Council Summit. He said the lack of pressure also undermines a U.S. policy alliance with the European Union, that if Russia did not agree to a ceasefire there would be secondary sanctions. "Putin said let's talk, and Trump says yes, and European leaders just had the rug pulled out from under them," Quayle said. "I don't think it will end any time soon," he added.
Quayle's view of the Russian playbook is that all along it's been to "dismantle Ukraine, and time is on his side."
And even though Putin has not been as successful as he would have liked on the battlefield, "he's been very successful with Trump," Quayle said, adding that Putin's KGB background makes him and his circle well placed to know Trump's "weakness and vulnerability and how to deal with him."
While Quayle does not believe Trump can unilaterally "wash his hands" of the conflict when he finally realizes Putin has no interest in a ceasefire — "Congress has something to say about that and there is still bipartisan support for Ukraine," he said — Quayle says the president has blown an opportunity to apply pressure in three ways that would work to change Putin's approach.
To end the war, the U.S. needs "lots of money in Swiss banks that are Russian given to Ukraine," Quayle said.
Second, the U.S. needs to give Ukraine even more weapons.
Third, there needs to be secondary sanctions on Russia.
"Suddenly, Putin would come to the table if you do those three things," Quayle said. "He comes to the table tomorrow."
But Quayle does not think this will happen. "It's not what he believes, he doesn't want to do anything substantial to bring pressure or leverage on Putin," he said.
The strategy on Russia leaves Quayle perplexed. "I don't have an answer," he said.
While he noted that Trump is fond of saying it's "Biden's war," he believes there will be political repercussions for the President's already weakened popularity if Trump lets Ukraine fall. "You inherited this war, but it is on your watch, and if he completely walks away from Ukraine, which I don't think he will, but he might, there will be a significant political price."
"American people do not like war, but they do not like losing wars, and if he is viewed as the loser on this, there will be a price to pay, so he needs to figure it out," Quayle said.
"He wants peace. He doesn't like war, but then he is so one-sided, and that is a problem," he added.
While Trump warned Zelenskyy that he was risking World War III in their infamous Oval Office meeting, Quayle says the bigger risk is the current Trump strategy: "You really want to talk about who is risking [WWIII]? Just let Russia gobble up Ukraine, and then Poland, and then the Balkans, and then you are going to be talking about World War III."
Blue ostriches on crack float on milkshakes between the sidewalk titans of gurglefitz. --YTown
I think trump already knows he is powerless to do anything about the war in Ukraine but would never admit it. As such he is beginning to shift his stance and will be leaving it up to Europe IMO.....
“This was a European situation, and should have remained a European situation,” Trump said on Monday.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
Now Putin is massing troops and equipment along the border of Finland. Maybe he decided this would be a good time to start WW3 since America is now inept and cowardly.
Trump says Putin ‘has gone absolutely crazy’ after major Russian attacks on Ukraine
CNN — President Donald Trump said Sunday that Vladimir Putin “has gone absolutely CRAZY,” after the Russian leader launched the largest aerial attack of Moscow’s three-year full-scale war on Ukraine.
“I’ve always had a very good relationship with Vladimir Putin of Russia, but something has happened to him. He has gone absolutely CRAZY! He is needlessly killing a lot of people, and I’m not just talking about soldiers. Missiles and drones are being shot into Cities in Ukraine, for no reason whatsoever,” Trump posted on Truth Social.
Hours earlier, Trump had told reporters: “I’m not happy with what Putin is doing. He’s killing a lot of people, and I don’t know what the hell happened to Putin.”
Moscow launched overnight attacks on Friday, Saturday and Sunday in Ukraine, killing at least 29 people over three days and injuring dozens more, according to officials. The bombardment from Saturday into Sunday saw more drones and missiles launched at Ukraine than in any other single assault in three years.
Trump’s intervention, coming at a crucial moment in Moscow’s war, will be viewed with relief in the West as a signal that the White House has grown frustrated with Putin’s refusal to accept a proposed 30-day ceasefire in the conflict.
The Kremlin on Monday sought to downplay the significance of the remarks, categorizing them as an “emotional reaction.”
He also said Moscow is “truly grateful to the Americans and personally to President Trump” for his efforts to bring Moscow and Kyiv to the negotiating table.
But the clash could have consequences for Russia. Trump also told reporters Sunday evening that he’s “absolutely” considering additional sanctions against Russia, which Kyiv has pushed for. Trump previously said he would not join in any new sanctions because he thought “there’s a chance” of progress, but remarked that could change.
But Trump also turned his criticism toward Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky, who said Sunday morning that “America’s silence” encourages Putin to continue his onslaught.
“Likewise, President Zelenskyy is doing his Country no favors by talking the way he does,” Trump wrote. “Everything out of his mouth causes problems, I don’t like it, and it better stop.”
At least 25 people were killed in two rounds of overnight attacks in Ukraine over the weekend, including children, officials said, and dozens more people were injured. At least four people were killed overnight into Monday, officials added.
Russia has been intensifying its aerial bombardment of Ukraine as international pressure mounts on Putin to agree to the ceasefire plan, which has the backing of the United States and Kyiv.
“The world may go on vacation, but the war continues, despite weekends and weekdays. This cannot be ignored. America’s silence, and the silence of others in the world, only encourages Putin,” Zelensky said Sunday morning.
Russia’s attacks set up another critical week in discussions over an end to the conflict. Earlier this month, teams from Kyiv and Moscow met face-to-face for the first time since the war’s early weeks, but the flicker of hope that surrounded those talks was seemingly extinguished when Moscow pressed ahead with its assaults on Ukrainian cities and again rejected calls to agree to a 30-day halt in fighting.
Some progress was made; both countries agreed to a massive prisoner swap, which began on Friday and will see 1,000 inmates released by each side.
But attention quickly returned to the fighting, which has intensified in recent weeks. Moscow last month claimed to have finally retaken the Kursk region, which Kyiv captured large sections of last summer, taking a significant piece of leverage back from Ukraine.
“We must be prepared for this war to last longer than we can all wish or imagine,” German Chancellor Friedrich Merz told public broadcaster ARD on Monday. “The question is whether the USA will continue to see it as its political and military duty to help Ukraine, and that is what we are trying to achieve.”
“Trump (is) obviously increasingly disillusioned with Putin from the massive attacks on Kyiv and other cities in Ukraine over the weekend. In this respect, I hope that America stays on board,” Merz said.
Trump said Sunday he was “very surprised” about the latest Russian aerial assault, though just a week ago, Russia launched its largest drone attack against Ukraine – a day before Putin and Trump spoke on the phone. “We’re in the middle of talking, and he’s shooting rockets into Kyiv and other cities,” Trump told reporters in New Jersey on his way back to Washington.
Trump, who has often touted his good relationship with Putin, spoke with the Russian leader on Monday in an attempt to negotiate a 30-day ceasefire between Russia and Ukraine.
After the call with Putin, and subsequent calls with Zelensky and other European allies, Trump announced that “Russia and Ukraine will immediately start negotiations toward a Ceasefire and, more importantly, an END to the War.”
Trump added that conditions “will be negotiated between the two parties, as it can only be, because they know details of a negotiation that nobody else would be aware of.”
He has gone absolutely CRAZY! He is needlessly killing a lot of people, and I’m not just talking about soldiers. Missiles and drones are being shot into Cities in Ukraine, for no reason whatsoever,” Trump posted on Truth Social.
So according to trump putin had good reasons to kill before?
Given his actions so far, Trump is selling snake oil again, hoping to shift negative opinions to Putin if we will buy the fiction and play along. The Putin truth is in the invasion, the war, the attacks, and broken agreements. We have tried to hurt Ukraine and extort a deal after cutting off aid and support. Trump should fear Putin who is his mirror image. Disgust for America lowering bars for Trump against allies.
"Every responsibility implies opportunity, and every opportunity implies responsibility." Otis Allen Glazebrook, 1880
Everyone from the CIA to the National Security Counsel knew who Putin was. U.S. intelligence knew who he was. Lest anyone forget, trump sided with Putin over U.S. intelligence. Because you know, trump knew better................
Trump sides with Putin over U.S. intelligence during remarkable press conference in Helsinki
He's basically given up now. How does everyone feel who touted him as a strong leader that was "feared"?
He's essentially complaining about a Russian head of state who is acting the same as........he has always acted.
Exactly. Where has Trump been the last 3 years? Putin is doing the exact same thing he's been doing since Russia first invaded.
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
Helsinki was jaw-dropping to me, literally. I'll never forget watching that unfold live.
Trump was cuckdom personified in Helsinki. It was embarrassing. I’ve never understood how anyone can look at Trump and see a tough guy. He doesn’t have a single tough atom and damn few guy atoms. He’s a brilliant bully though. He loves to bully simps, betas, and the defenseless.
He has a new party to support him blindly. I t might be convenient to call it the "apartheid party." Their attacks on common citizens, bullied individuals, attacked institutions and crippling cuts attacking those with real needs should make us consider bringing back the practice of labels for individuals as "Public Enemy" with a number attached. Consider who might be designated as a product of their actions against Americans. This dealing out of cuts and dismantling has the single thread and seeming purpose of inflicting injury to insult. often for political fiction-driven revenge. This is amateur hour and it should be rewarded. A commonly embraced lie to consider: One of the largest logical fallacies is widely held and used too often. If you place blame on your opponent whose response is "Yeah, well what about. . . ." Ignore the original issue, and if you offer any negative about your opponent, your issue is overlooked, ignored, and treated a non-issue and acceptable. The starting point still has a "right or wrong" attached. Making the other guy wrong doesn't make you right. This can be seen on many levels with many variations daily. Sickens me.
"Every responsibility implies opportunity, and every opportunity implies responsibility." Otis Allen Glazebrook, 1880
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![[Linked Image from aljazeera.com]](https://www.aljazeera.com/wp-content/uploads/2025/02/INTERACTIVE-UKRAINE-RARE-MINERALS-GLOBAL-DISTRIBUTION-FEB27-2025-1740694424.png)
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ya think? I thought Trump passed the cognitive test with flying colors.