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Quote:
4. Notre Dame will have an automatic berth if it is in the top eight of the final BCS Standings .
What this should say is any independent school or school from any conference not listed ... rather than saying ND.
And like I said I don't have a dog in this fight. I do think it is kind of fun seeing you fired up 
And BigWillie - you are right. It is all about the money and not the integrity of the game and champion. If I had to pick, I would say I am an OSU fan (though definitely not a diehard). and I agree that OSU didn't belong in the BCS championship game they were in. They were only there because of there name .
Am I perfect? No
Am I trying to be a better person?
Also no
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I wasn't talking about either of the 2 championship games (who the crap was the BCS going to put in over OSU that was more deserving??), but more this year when they should have in all "fairness chosen Texas Tech over us as far as deserving teams. The truth is though, the Bowls aren't designed to be fair, but rather to make alot of money for the Universities, conferences, and of course........the Bowls..lol. Under this system, teams that have a historic significance are going to get exceptions that other teams won't. Unless the NCAA ditches the Bowl system (and that won't happen in our lifetime) then this is the system we currently work under. The best thing a team can do is be a Florida or Florida St., and win enough so that your team is on the special treatment list....lol.
Against logic,the most effective armor is willful ignorance.
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I just wanted to interject .......
To compare a guy to anyone after 3 starts is ridiculous. Quinn might be great ... might be good ...... might be bad .... but there is nothing conclusive in 3 starts allows anyone to come to a definitive conclusion.
In the end, it will depend upon which guy the new regime feels fits their offense and team scheme best. (if either guy does ... frankly we don't know that either) One guy will likely start this season. The other might be the backup ... or gone. Not one of us postiing on this board can say with absolute certainty either way.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Not one of us postiing on this board can say with absolute certainty either way.
this may or may not surprise U ... but I can ... 
BQ will start .... and DA will be gone or the back up ... my $$$ is on gone ... unless we can't get a 3rd for him ...
U can talk till your blue in the face ... DA is what he is ... been saying this since DAY 1 ... even in his so called "hayday" when most fell in love with him ...
there is NO OFFENSE THAT HE CAN RUN AFFECTIVELY ... due to his LIMITATIONS ...
1. CONSISTENTLY INCONSISTENT ....
2. CONSISTENTLY INNACURATE .... look ... when hes on .. hes on .. but that COMES AND GOES ... and OFTEN TIMES it goes for LONG AS STRETCHES ...
3. Poor DECISION MAKING ...
4. NO MOBILITY WHAT SO EVER ....
5. when he does move .. he is ALWAYS VERY VERY INNACURATE ...
people want to talk about the vertical game being his forte ... or he is a good red zone QB (witch I agree with .. but thats cause lots of his defencies are taken out of the equation in a short field) ...
sorry ... he is to INCONSISTENT to be affective doing anything on a long term basis ..
and our folks and quite frankly most of the folks in the league know it ....
U guys can hold onto the fact no decision has been made for as long as U wish ... but EVERYONE DEEP DOWN KNOWS ...
DA'S days are OVER .... and I for one am THANKFUL ...
feel free to go back to your wishful thinking ... 
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I'm laughing my butt off at you for trying to reason with anyone about ND. If ND is in the top 8 they have earned their bowl bid. Especially since you have my team (Ohio State) getting a bowl bid because they travel well. Notre Dame does play some terrible schools every year because they are not in a conference but they also play some of the toughest. ND can't help the fact that the best team in college football (Michigan leads in wins) history has had bad teams of late. They can't help it it other teams they play from the Big Ten have off years as well. Navy and Air Force are better then the bottom dwellers of the Big Ten. The Big East is full of teams that people didn't even know the had football programs.
Notre Dame is no longer the national powerhouse that they once were but they do have to qualify for an automatic bid.
#gmstrong
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As far as DA vs. Quinn...I say we trade DA to Tenn. for Collins and make Quinn the starter. At least that is what I'd say if I was a Steelers fan.0
#gmstrong
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I watched DA in college... all too often, being in Oregon and all... he's the same player now that he was then. An erratic, poor decision making, big armed over thrower. The guy threw 53 INTs in college. 53!!! And that's in the Pac-10, a conference known for weaker defenses.
I mentioned that two years ago,and all the response was:''oh he's improved..blah blah blah..he hasn't changed much..nor has my opinion on him.
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So lets see here ... U started off saying that ND has PREFFERENTIAL RULES favoring them for inclusion ... now that that theory has been blown to bits with ACTUAL FACTS now your hanging your hat on the Army/Navy card??? ... *LOL* ... well thats a card that never loses anyhow ... as for the BCS ... well the best team in the country IMO this year wasn't even in the game ... I believe the Condoms would have beaten the Gators by double digits and would have EMBERRASED the Boomers by 3 or 4 TD's ... and I HATE the Condums ... but the FACT was they were the best team in the country last year ... they just couldn't over come the west Coaat Bias that permeates eastern football ... they need more REPRESENTATION in the Haris poll to help overcome that ... 
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Quote:
the FACT
LOL... 
The fact is a championship game was played and they weren't in it...
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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while i seriously like DA and wished it would have worked out the fans will never give him a chance. The guy has one hell of a cannon for an arm and just needs a decent QB coach to help him develop.....
I like DA too.. but having a canon has got to be the single most overrated quality in football that there is and in my own little scouting world, counts for next to nothing.
yebat' Putin
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I won't be wasting another second reading what u have to say much less responding to U ...
Its been nice knowing U bro ... Good Luck and Enjoy ...
I'm devistated.
I don't know what branch you've fallen off of as of late, but it seems you hit your head during the fall. Good luck with that.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Does this mean he'll disappear for a while, come back and insult us, then post for a week or two, get ticked when everyone doesn't bow to him and then he'll disappear for a while, come back and insult us, then post for a week or two, get ticked when everyone doesn't bow to him and then he'll disappear for a while, come back and insult us, then post for a week or two, get ticked when everyone doesn't bow to him and then he'll disappear for a while, come back and insult us, then post for a week or two, get ticked when everyone doesn't bow to him and the he'll Awww you know the rest 
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Great football discussion here.  I still laugh at anyone trying to compare the stats between Anderson and Quinn, when Quinn played a game and a half or so healthy. Even with three healthy games this kind of thing is ludicrous.
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I still laugh at anyone trying to compare the stats between Anderson and Quinn, when Quinn played a game and a half or so healthy.
To be honest Jules, I'm not sure how anyone can compare the two with so little to go on with BQ... but if you read this thread, there are those that claim to be able to do a fair and honest comparison... Got me...
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Quote:
Great football discussion here.
Wouldn't U need 2 folks who actually have a clue about football to have a discussion about said subject ....
Daman .. at least when I insult U .. I INCLUDE A TON OF FOOTBALL .... I ALWAYS back up what i say with FOOTBALL STUFF ... U on the other hand ... won't even go there ... *LOL* ...
Peenie .... Ya ... they were not in the game ... so that means they weren't the best team in the country because .. cause we all know the BCS is the be all end all .......
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at least when I insult U ..
Ah HA,,, you admit that you insult me.... finally,,,
The point of the other FOOTBALL disussion on comparing BQ and DA is that it's hard to know what you have in BQ.. Yeah Yeah I know we have a ton of info on him at ND and that certainly had value.. won't deny it.
But this is the NFL and lots of guys that were great in college come to the pros and flop.. and I mean flop badly.
For any comparison to be worth the time to consider, it's gotta be apples to apples.
WE don't have that kinda info yet on BQ.
So I gotta question anyone that says they can do an accurate comparison.....
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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The "Short" Version woulda sufficed...lol...
I now have a better understanding of why SOME...And I mean SOME don't like Quinn nor will ever give him a shot...
I don't care about the STATS or anything else from Quinn...All I know is I LOVED what I saw from him on a 3 day week against Denver...Chit D or not...
I personally like ND...And thoroughly enjoyed watching this kid mature under Weiss...
BTW...Watch this Clausen kid this year...He's gettin' ready to light it up...
Go Browns!!!
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I think most can seperate individual athletes from the school itself. Once they become a Brown, it doesn't make any difference to me where they went to school. Michigan, ND, etc.....
In fact, if a player is good, I want him drafted from wherever he's playing. I don't care where he went to school.
JMHO
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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This is going to be a pivotal year for Clausen .. he made some nice strides last year but there is ....... three huge questions ... and its gonna either make or break him ... what we do know about the kid ...
1. Very Physically Tough ...
2. Very Accurate ...
3. Strong enough arm ...
4. Pretty Mobile ...
the three questions ...
1. Leadership ... he needs to take charge .. he needs to be the leader of the O .. last year he was everyones buddy ... witch is fine .. now he needs to be there leader ..
2. Mental toughness ... when things are going good he was the first one greeting the rest of the O on the sidelines ... then he'd be walking up and down the bench and talking with everyone and pating them on the back ....
When things went wrong he sat by himself and was quiet and U could see the dejection in his face and body language ...
and that snowballed on the field ...
that needs to change ... he needs to get mentally tougher ..
3. He needs to learn to look off defenders and quit locking on recievers ... he locked on big time and in the 2nd half of the season and we paid dearly for it ... if he does not correct that ... he may not start for us the entire year .. we got a kid behind him I think is going to be very very good ...
hopefully Clausen starts looking off defenders and quits locking on recievers .. cause we really need if were going to be any good at all next year ..
we'll see ....
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Oh ... as far as BQ goes ... its his INNACURACY and WEAK ARM they dislike ... those make me *LMAO* every time I read that ... all i can say is ... THEY'LL SEE ....
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We have a very limited picture on what Quinn can do.
I will say, what I saw out of him in limited work has me encouraged. I liked his footwork, mechanics and arm strength. He has a MUCH better arm than people are giving him credit for. Better than I thought previously.
Gotta give him the benefit of the doubt due to his injury. I do believe he has the ability to make a play when the play breaks down...Anderson might have been the only QB in the NFL who actually got WORSE when he had a ton of time to throw. It was like he had no clue where to go with the ball if everything wasn't timed up perfectly.
The game needs to slow down for him. How long that process will take is anyone's guess. I'm hoping we can use the Phillip Rivers model in bringing him along. Assuming we get the right players in place by then.
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Ammo,, when I say that I believe it's impossible to compare BQ and DA at the Pro Level,, understand, that like so many others on here, what I did see of BQ, I liked.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Quote:
"you don't thow 29 TD passes in the NFL and be a bad bum QB"
Name we 1 QB in the NFL that did so that stunk?
Only 1 person comes to mind, Don Majkowski but he got injured and Farve took over and no one looked back...
Fun with stats (QBs meeting your requirement in order of most TDs to least going back to 1981):
2008: Brees, Rivers, Warner
2007: Brady, Romo, Roeth, P.Manning, Derek Anderson
2006: P.Manning
2005: C.Palmer
2004: P.Manning, C-Pepp, McNabb, Favre, Delhomme
2003: Favre, P.Manning
2002: Noone
2001: Warner, Favre, Garcia
2000: P.Manning, C-Pepp, Garcia
1999: Warner, Beuerlein
1998: Young, Cunningham, Favre, Testaverde
1997: Favre, George
1996: Favre, Testaverde
1995: Favre, Moon, Mitchell, Erik Kramer
1994: Young, Favre, Marino
1993: Young
1992: None
1991: Kelly
1990: Moon, Cunningham
1989: Jim Everett
1988: J. Everett
1987: Montana
1986: Marino
1985: Marino
1984: Marino, Dave Kreig
1983: Lynn Dickey, Joe Theismann, Danny White
1982: None
1981: Fouts, Bartkowski, Ken Anderson
A couple things really stick out from this list for me:
1. Don Majkowski never had a 29TD season as you stated. His best season was 27TDs in 1989.
2. Marino(4x), Young(3x), then Warner(3x), Favre(8x) and now Peyton Manning(5x) really show how great they are with their consistency on these lists during their peaks.
3. The biggest QB busts on this list: Bartkowski, Dickey, Kreig, Kramer, Mitchell, George, Beuerlein (Delhomme is borderline...Derek Anderson will have judgement withheld for a few years before determination)
4. I find it really interesting that in another year with a lot of gaudy passing TD numbers(2004), the #5 QB is a very similar guy to Derek Anderson. While Carolina fans probably wouldn't say they are overly upset with Jake since then, they are not really happy with him either.
5. While several remembered Scott Mitchell, noone remembered Erik Kramer, who was probably even more of a fluke than Mitchell that same year.
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Oh, and if you cut the requirement back to 27 (Majik's best year) the list has a ton more QBs on it like Jeff Blake. There were just too many #'s, which led to more busts as well, so I just kept the requirement at DA's line.
#gmstrong
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If you only look at QBs with at least 29TDs that also met:
TD - INT <= 10
(so they were within 10 TDs of their INT mark), then the list gets much smaller and more interesting:
2008: Noone
2007: DA (29TD 19INT)
2006: Noone
2005: Noone
2004: Noone
2003: Noone
2002: Noone
2001: Noone
2000: Noone
1999: Noone
1998: Favre (31 TD, 23 INT)
1997: Noone
1996: Noone
1995: Noone
1994: Noone
1993: Noone
1992: Noone
1991: Noone
1990: Noone
1989: Noone
1988: Noone
1987: Noone
1986: Noone
1985: Marino (30TD, 21 INT)
1984: Dave Kreig (32TD, 24 INT)
1983: Lynn Dickey (32TD 29INT), Danny White (29TD 23 INT)
1982: Noone
1981: Bartkowski (30TD, 23 INT)
Other QBs from the previous list with at least 19 INTs that didn't make the above list:
Romo had 19 INTs (with 36 TDs) - 2007
Favre had 21 INTs (with 32 TDs) - 2004
Testaverde had 19 INTs (with 33 TDs) - 1996
Marino had 23 INTs (with 44 TDs) - 1986
#gmstrong
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the best thing the can do is trade quinn and be done with it
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Welcome to the board, Derek.
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I see DA's pass got picked off 
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![[Linked Image from pic18.picturetrail.com]](http://pic18.picturetrail.com/VOL905/3216203/6567769/349897772.jpg) "The Browns' defense is kicking mucho dupa."
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Quote:
I see DA's pass got picked off
and taken to the house.... 
nordawg
The only reason people get lost in thought is because it's unfamiliar territory.
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Quote:
Quote:
I see DA's pass got picked off
and taken to the house....
nordawg
Does anyone know if there is a website that keeps track of such things? That would be a fun thing to complete my table above (how many TDs vs. Pick-6)
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can we all just get off of quinn he maybe steve young or he could be a jeff blake no body know same with da,but i know that browns fans will be crying if da got a superbowl before us.
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As much as I like DA i seriously think its best for him to go to another team and get a fresh start. I mean people cheering when he got hurt, and that fact that Quinn was picked to be the face of the Browns, would tell me at this point it would be best for him to go to another team. I like DA both as a player and as a person as he seemed very likeable, but he struggled and took alot of the heat for our season being the way it was. It wasnt just DA tho, the line wasnt doing very well, WR's dropping passes. It was a team effort to be as bad as we was this year.
While I would love for him to stay and battle it out in camp, his 5 Mil roster bonus is going to be a tought pill to swallow for a guy that MIGHT win the starting spot in camp. I guess Im as torn as the next guy...but I think that if he did stay as soon as he had a pick or a 3 and out people would start chanting brady....its catchy and its easy to chant! For him to grow as a player he would be best to get out of Cleveland fresh start, and not have a young hot shot rookie nipping at your spot. I wish DA lots of luck where ever he goes!
#brownsgoodkarma
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Quote:
Rid...the info available on the board showed the guy had been here a little over a year with only 103 posts...a newbe, especially in terms of the great QB "debates" (wars) that have taken place on this board.
Thus, my reference to him as a newbe...
Not an accurate statement. The info available shows him as being here over 2 years, not one year. Additionally, he already posted to you that he was on the original board as well. Try a calculator next time if you are incapable of doing simple math in your head. (hint- the current year is 2009)
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Thus, respect must be shown in order to receive respect back, is the way I approach those who lurk waiting to take shots at me.
Ahhhhh yes.....I am here lurking and waiting to take a shot at you.
RIF
Good ol' Mac....never one to be short on a conspiracy theory.
We now return you back to the invigorating February discussion on the BCS system. 
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"tabber at ND we do things the right way ."
Relax...I'm just busting your chops.
I know diddly about college football...except watching games and following players I like. I do like certain teams and will watch their games over others as there is about 5 to choose from usually Oklahoma, Penn State and OSU cause of board members here
I think Vanderbilt, Stanford, Duke and Wake Forest have always had pretty high standards. And of course the Service Academies.
But I'm not buying into the Football academic requirements at ND...I'm sure the school has tough ones but so does Michigan. They just went through a recruiting class - I'm sure there's info on these recruits...anyway you can show they all were B to A students and what the requirements were on SATs n ACTs???
I have read over the last 3-4 years how well they did in signing recruits. Not how bad they did and then read a story about how their academic standards are that much higher. Although most of the ones I stated above I have over the last decade or so.
JMHO...but honestly, I really don't care just love busting your hump on ND...lol
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum The Stats: Anderson & Quinn
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