|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,297
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,297 |
Lerner is receiving great kudos in Europe for his rebuilding of his "damn" soccer team.
He finally got the right guys in place and let them do their jobs.
His "damn" soccer team was Detroit Lion-like and are now quite competitive.
Not saying he will do that here...but the guy is not stupid and has a lot of experienced people in his circle of trust.
I am ok with every single move - and non-move - made thus far.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 13,205
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 13,205 |
I don't care about his soccer team at all; I was posting in the context of his possibly having financial issues due to the market or Madof or whatever.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 39,814
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 39,814 |
I only mentioned it more as a ????.....like who knows why.
Maybe more on point, it that questionnaire sent out by the team several weeks back to season ticket holders, the marketing mucks, using whatever model they use have projected a 20% drop in renewals this year for one reason or another, and possibly the league people are preparing NFL teams to expect much less this year in ticket sales, advertising etc.
I think league wide the expectation is things aren't going to be very good this year so they better tighten their belts.
Not sure how it would all work uncapped, and we assume salaries will go nuts...but I think you may see overall salaries drop. A few of the big guys might get some crazy numbers, but with no agreement, who says league minumums will remain the same.
In the end, the ball of playdough is only so big.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015 |
Quote:
JJ was gonna make $1.2 Million if he made the team. Frankly, that is chump change in the NFL.
The number was $2.9 million.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,877
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,877 |
Actually it was $2.4 million. But what's $500,000 among friends?  Not sure where I got 1.2 from unless it was when you and Diam were arguing about what he was worth or might be asking for instead of league minimum.
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 28,217
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 28,217 |
2.4 was only the salary... the roster bonus that he was due added another 250k.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,877
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,877 |
I stand corrected.
Doesn't change my mind, though. They still shouldn't have dumped him.
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 28,217
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 28,217 |
I agree.
I mean, did they feel that pressured to not pay a measly $250k roster bonus? Teams fart and lose that much money with no idea where it went. I cannot believe that they HAD to let him go. My guess? They simply tried playing hardball with JJ and gave the ultimatum of Vet Minimum or be gone with a deadline of the day before that roster bonus... .without even giving him a chance to show that he might still be worth that money.
Basically, they flat out didn't want him around unless they could get him at the absolute minimum.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,877
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,877 |
I think you've hit the nail on the head.
I understand that "it's a business". But it's a business that has an end goal of winning or at least looking like you're trying to win. And these moves baffle me because it looks like they're making moves just to show everyone that there's a new sheriff in town.
At this point I don't see these moves translating into a better team. I hope I'm wrong because another 4-12 season, frankly, and I'll retire to my easy chair on Sundays and let someone else oil the Lerner machine with their money.
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,465
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,465 |
Quote:
I agree.
I mean, did they feel that pressured to not pay a measly $250k roster bonus? Teams fart and lose that much money with no idea where it went. I cannot believe that they HAD to let him go. My guess? They simply tried playing hardball with JJ and gave the ultimatum of Vet Minimum or be gone with a deadline of the day before that roster bonus... .without even giving him a chance to show that he might still be worth that money.
Basically, they flat out didn't want him around unless they could get him at the absolute minimum.
That is chump change for even the Bengals.
JJ was a player that spoke out in favor of keeping Crennel. I think Mangini dont want vets around that might speak out against him. It would not have hurt to keep JJ around, like I've said many times today, until he gets beat out in training camp. These moves arent even salary cap moves. Its like Mangini is just trying to send a message.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 34
Rookie
|
|
Rookie
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 34 |
I think what Overtoad said is correct. It's all about return on your investment. Joe was a great guy, but if you look at it from a football stanpoint, you can get a more productive receiver for the money he was going to make.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,877
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,877 |
Quote:
you can get a more productive receiver for the money he was going to make.
If you assume that he (JJ) can still play at the level he played at in 2007, who would that WR be?
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 28,217
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 28,217 |
If you don't let him show on a field what he can still do or not do - how do you have any clue whatsoever about any of that?
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015 |
Please, just "Toad" or as your father'd type "OT." That long name is just so damned formal *L*
Quote:
but if you look at it from a football stanpoint, you can get a more productive receiver for the money he was going to make.
A slight word to clarify what you wrote...........A more applicable description would be to explore his reliability in terms of health. When healthy, he produced, but that health has always been in question, long-before the seven knee surgeries. So it comes down to a gamble of health V. $2.whatever million. (I pulled the $2.9 million from Rotoworld as I went looking for his contract numbers) To me, he's clearly not worth that kind of gamble.
Purp, your last sentence is about right. If Joe didn't accept the teams offer by now, why pay him $250k just to turn around and cut him later? By waiting this long, they were putting pressure on him by letting the market dry up. It makes sense, even if one doesn't agree with releasing him.
That leads me back to Stallworth. If you'll forgive the pun, the organization is trying to stall him out by holding onto him, thus letting the market dry up. By doing that, they can put pressure on him to renegotiate a friendlier contract. They'll simply do what they did with JJ, which is to wait until the last possible moment. In truth, he won't get anything on the free agent market, so it seems to me they are doing to him what they've been doing to Tucker, Shaffer, and Joe. It's almost beyond obvious.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 34
Rookie
|
|
Rookie
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 34 |
I don't think that's a safe assumption, though. I would have to speculate that they know his health and that they feel that the 7 surgeries has diminished his already declining skills. Again, this is all pure speculation on my part. I was just throwing out a possible reasoning. I have no clue why it happened and probably wont (with Mangini the miriacle plumber fixing all the leakes in Berea  ) until Dad is out of the hospital. Even then, I don't know how much he will be able to get from those he knows.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,877
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,877 |
Well, I say assume that (his health is OK) because if you read what he said yesterday about playing somewhere else and coming back into CBS it sure sounds like he thinks he can at least contribute to a team enough to earn his keep.
If he had doubts about his abilities this year I am assuming he would have gone ahead and retired as a Brown.
The team is gonna say they have doubts if only to justify his release.
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 5,521
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 5,521 |
LCB thought he was healthy enough to walk back into a starting role, too. How did that turn out for him?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 34
Rookie
|
|
Rookie
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 34 |
I see your point, but (and I"m probably telling you something that you already know), the player is the last to realize his physical limitations. Baxter and Bentley are two recently from the Browns that had that same situation. I'm not saying you're wrong, just that it isn't easy for a player to realize and/or admit that they are done physicallly. Dad even had that same problem when he tore his ACL. The spirit is willing but the flesh is weak so to speak. They still have all the instincts and can't accept or realize the body doesn't respond anymore.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 15,188
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 15,188 |
thats good and makes sense .. I do not agree with it .. but its a plausible scenario .. Now if we do pay Donte his bonus and keep him as is ... the silver lining will be seeing how U spin that one into the smart thing to do and how it fits into everything else we've done ... 
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015 |
If that happens, I'll spin it like this:
I'm wrong and the FO are idiots.
How's THAT for spin
Now maybe the contract was structured in such a way that we're screwed no matter what we do, in which case all bets are off. That remains a possibility.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
|
|
|
DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Ryan Tucker restructures deal,
asks same of J.J.
|
|
