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certainly not trying to be something they are not.
daman...though Randy did not try to be the type that gets involved in the decision making process, until he hired Holmgren, he was!
When Randy made the decision to extend Butch Davis after the Browns went 10-6, he did so on the advise and input from others.
When Randy hired Savage and Crennel, he did so with input from others.
When RL hired Mangini, he did so with input from others.
Now that Randy has hired Holmgren, he has virtually removed himself from the decision making process and removed his need to consult others.
I'm not claiming Randy did anything wrong in the way he handled the Browns since he took over, but, I believed it took a while before he realized, the only way he was going to be able to set the franchise up the way he wanted...a way in which he could remove himself from the decision making process...was to hire someone capable of running the football side of the franchise for him.
Randy's father hired someone to handle the franchise for him from the very first day the New Browns came into existence. It did take Randy 7 yrs, but IMO, he finally has the Browns setup the way he wanted...with himself removed as far away from the decision making process as possible.
I do believe Randy hired a better man to run the football side of the Browns than his father did.
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daman...though Randy did not try to be the type that gets involved in the decision making process, until he hired Holmgren, he was!
No, he wasn't.. he was being the same guy that hired Savage and RAC and Collins and Kokinis and Mangini and now Holmgren..
Who else could have authorized such decisions... he's the top.. the very top of the org..
To say that he made those decisions to extend contracts and call it meddling or anything else, is really off base because there wasn't anyone else to do it..
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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To say that he made those decisions to extend contracts and call it meddling or anything else, is really off base because there wasn't anyone else to do it..
daman...did I call it meddling?
You totally missed the point...
...until Randy hired Holmgren, he "was involved" in the decision making process...probably more than he ever wanted to be.
Daman...step back and look at the decisions on Butch, Crennel and Savage, and Mangini and Kokinis...who made those decisions and what was the process used to arrive at those decisions?
Look at the way Randy has the management structure set up now...see any difference?
Randy finally has himself where his dad was, when it comes to the management structure.
Last edited by mac; 01/11/10 01:06 PM.
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...,...hire someone capable of running the football side of the franchise for him....I think he's finally got it right ! 
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daman...did I call it meddling?
Oh lord, the minute I said that, I thought,, the first words out of Mac will be,, I didn't use the work Meddling  I knew I should have changed it....LOL
Mac,, it's simple,, listen carefully,, are you ready 
There isn't or wasn't anyone else to make decisions.. that's why he made them... now he has holmgren...
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Quote:
daman...did I call it meddling?
Oh lord, the minute I said that, I thought,, the first words out of Mac will be,, I didn't use the work Meddling I knew I should have changed it....LOL
Mac,, it's simple,, listen carefully,, are you ready
There isn't or wasn't anyone else to make decisions.. that's why he made them... now he has holmgren...
Daman...if you knew you were misrepresenting what I said, why didn't you change it?
I'm glad to see that you "now" agree with my post...
daman...though Randy did not try to be the type that gets involved in the decision making process, until he hired Holmgren, he was!
When Randy made the decision to extend Butch Davis after the Browns went 10-6, he did so on the advise and input from others.
When Randy hired Savage and Crennel, he did so with input from others.
When RL hired Mangini, he did so with input from others.
Now that Randy has hired Holmgren, he has virtually removed himself from the decision making process and removed his need to consult others.
I'm not claiming Randy did anything wrong in the way he handled the Browns since he took over, but, I believed it took a while before he realized, the only way he was going to be able to set the franchise up the way he wanted...a way in which he could remove himself from the decision making process...was to hire someone capable of running the football side of the franchise for him.
Randy's father hired someone to handle the franchise for him from the very first day the New Browns came into existence. It did take Randy 7 yrs, but IMO, he finally has the Browns setup the way he wanted...with himself removed as far away from the decision making process as possible.
I do believe Randy hired a better man to run the football side of the Browns than his father did.
FOOTBALL IS NOT BASEBALL
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Mac, it's really the same as before.
He consulted with people about holmgren, now he will let Holmgren make the decisions....just as he did with savage or anyone else.
The difference is hopefully this time he won't have to get involved again and MH makes all the right calls.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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Daman...if you knew you were misrepresenting what I said, why didn't you change it?
I'm glad to see that you "now" agree with my post...
Oh Bull I DON'T agree with you..
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Mac, it's really the same as before.
He consulted with people about holmgren, now he will let Holmgren make the decisions....just as he did with savage or anyone else.
The difference is hopefully this time he won't have to get involved again and MH makes all the right calls.
Peen...I'm glad to see that you agree with me too...
From post..." Now that Randy has hired Holmgren, he has virtually removed himself from the decision making process and removed his need to consult others."
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I'm not sure why Daboll being fired is even being discussed.
If I'm not mistaken, Holmgren said the whole staff would be back. Last time I checked Daboll was part of the staff right?
Anyway, I would rather have Daboll return, and have continuity on the offensive side of the ball, then have Holmgren fire Daboll. He'd then probably force one of his guys on Mangini, and as we have seen in the past, that doesn't work well.
Daboll stays and it's for the better.
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Actually, I believe that the statement was worded along the lines of "most of the staff".
That may or may not have been because of the Wide Receiver's coach leaving, but it does leave open the possibility of there being more movement.
That said, I do not think that he's going anywhere. I think that, if nothing else, Holmgren is keeping everything together for a year to evaluate and see - from the inside - where we are headed before he makes any big decisions.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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You're right. It was "most of the staff." I also think that was referring to the WR coach.
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j/c from holmgren's call today: Quote:
On Eric Mangini's assistant coaches: "That'll be Eric's call. Of course, we've talked about it. My feeling is he was pleased with how the guys did this year. That's not to say if somebody became available that a change would take place. We're still a little bit aways from that. There could be some changes down the road."
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2010/01/cleveland_browns_president_mik.html
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I think that it's excellent that he's letting Mangini making the calls on his coaching staff. That's the way it should be.
So far so good by Holmgren.
Also, if it's up to Mangini I don't see Daboll leaving.
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Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Forget Mangini, fire Daboll
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