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GraffZ06 #457884 01/27/10 11:33 PM
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I'm a Shay Hodge pimp....calling it now...the dude's going to have a productive NFL career...


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wojo_dew #457885 01/28/10 09:17 AM
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Aside from St. Tebow, they were talking up these 2 on Mike & Mike this morning. Supposedly looking really good . . .

Myron Rolle, SS, Florida State
Height: 6-1. Weight: 217.
Projected 40 Time: 4.56.
Projected Round (2010): 5-6.
Left Florida State to become a road scholar. SMART kid. But apparently he's shaken off the rust real quick and looks more like a 3rd or 4th rounder instead of a 5th or 6th.

and one of my Bobcat brethren . . .

Taylor Price, WR, Ohio University
Height: 6-0. Weight: 198.
Projected 40 Time: 4.38.
Projected Round (2010): 6-7
Have been hoping we might land him in the 6th or 7th. Apparently he may be going higher now.

And I'll go ahead and state that I'm officially on the Anthony Dixon bandwagon. I would like to think we're confident that James Davis can be the other, bigger back and we won't need to take a RB, but who really knows what we have in him. I'm really curious to see what Heckert thought of Davis going into the last draft.

GraffZ06 #457886 01/28/10 10:05 AM
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I want no part of Mays and the talk is he could moved to be a specality LB..well if he can't cover(lack of instincts) the Browns don't need a project LB..goodness..just draft a natural safety..can't waste picks..

"Oklahoma State QB Zac Robinson was the most impressive quarterback on the South team today. Robinson struggled with the deep ball but his intermediate throws were sharp and accurate with tight spirals."



Again ,don't need a QB who struggles doing things that effect sustained drives..

"The best way to describe Mississippi State RB Anthony Dixon is "A Bruiser"."


Heckert better be looking for a RB .. U guys can keep arguing about Elbow..and I'll keep chuckling..

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Quote:

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Any thoughts on your Georgia boy Geno Atkins?




I think he is overrated.. if any of the Georgia lineman were brought to the browns... I would prefer Kade Weston. His size is perfect.. 6'5.. 320 lbs.. He would be another reason to get rid of Rogers (not necessary), but Weston would help fill in for the old Smith and Coleman.




I've read that Jeff Owens is getting quite a bit of props.

Ballpeen #457888 01/28/10 10:56 AM
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Quote:

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Peen...legit question. I am still pondering what I think about the kid. How fast is he? What do you think he will run at the combine/pro days?




Who knows??

It says 4.6-4.7...sounds about right. He is pretty fast for a guy his size, but speed isn't his thing....he's a qb......now ask me if he can run people over....yes, he can.




That's the thing....do you want your QB "running over people"? I don't see his as a wildcat QB at all, I know it wont be popular but the guy is just not fast enough to press the edge (which is what the wildcat is build for). So I think he is an everydown NFL QB or Bust....

What does he bring to the table as a QB? Becuase the running over or people is not going to help him....I am all for innovaion and i belive you that he game is changing and will continue to change, however teams are not giong to start carring short yardage QB's.

So I ask you agian what do you think he brings to the table at a QB? How does he move the chains on 3rd and 5? Is he fast enough to threat the run/scramble in that situation?

I see top end Steve Young. Or he could be a bigger version of Eric Crouch.

moon #457889 01/28/10 11:17 AM
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Not to mention he would be running over defensive lineman in the pros like he did in college. He'll just end up getting hurt.


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Quote:

Myron Rolle, SS, Florida State
Height: 6-1. Weight: 217.
Projected 40 Time: 4.56.
Projected Round (2010): 5-6.
Left Florida State to become a road scholar. SMART kid. But apparently he's shaken off the rust real quick and looks more like a 3rd or 4th rounder instead of a 5th or 6th.





If Rolle lasts until the 4th I would sprint and dive head first....Sliding into the podium knocking down people/decorations to get my card up there with his name on it. I bet he continues to rise and is a 2nd rounder when it's all said and down. Shame too...I was hoping to steal him late.

moon #457891 01/28/10 02:00 PM
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Quote:

That's the thing....do you want your QB "running over people"? I don't see his as a wildcat QB at all, I know it wont be popular but the guy is just not fast enough to press the edge (which is what the wildcat is build for). So I think he is an everydown NFL QB or Bust....





I disagree. I think Tebow will make a fantastic Wildcat QB, one that actually does bring the pass-threat into the equation, unlike some of these other guys like Josh Cribbs.

Furthermore, Cribbs is no burner but runs the wildcat effectively. Why? Because the Wildcat in many instances isn't so much about "pressing the edge" as it is winning the numbers game. Unlike a conventional handoff, where a QB is a waste person once the ball is out of his hands, some plays in the wildcat allow the RB's to instantly become blockers. Many of Cribbs' runs weren't outside, but rather off-tackle. It worked because once they picked a side of the field to run towards the numbers favored the offense.

Even if Tebow runs a 4.8 he's plenty fast enough to run the wildcat. Unlike a true RB who needs speed to be elusive and hit "homeruns," a guy like Tebow running the 'Cat isn't asked to break one off for 40 yards. The team would be perfectly content getting 6 or 7 while setting up the threat of a pass at some point.

I don't like Tebow as a traditional QB. I disagree with 'Peen with the belief that the spread as it's run in college is coming to the NFL. However, short of Mike Vick, Tebow is the prototypical guy to run the 'Cat at this level. In fact, he's probably more prototypical than Vick because he has years of experience running play-action with all the read-options he's run in his career.

So what does that mean to some teams? Absolutely nothing because they don't run the 'Cat. It also means nothing for the Browns as we probably aren't that interested in spending a mid-level pick on a gadget just to upgrade the passing part of our version of the 'Cat when we only run it 5 times a game. But for some team looking to add the option while holding out hope he can turn into a traditional QB, yeah, he'll go earlier than he would have ten years ago.

I like Tebow for the things he can do, but for the thing which would be his primary goal, no thanks.


***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
OverToad #457892 01/28/10 04:00 PM
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I guess we need a Tebow thread. The guy is very interesting.

I knew that saying he was not a cat Qb would not be popular, but I still don't think he is. You say the cat is designed off tackle that is very true but off tackle is very much pressing the edge. I just don't think he is fast enough/athletic enough (it is more than speed) he just does not have the hips and accelration to threaten a defense as a wildcat runner. His throwing would be an advatage he would have over say Cribbs (who I think they should let throw more...but that is a whole other conversation). I think as a runner his best quality is being physical which, is simpy not something that is going to happen in the NFL.

I don't know if I am sold on him as a QB or not. I love his work ethic and do believe he will develop, but I am unsure of how his running ability can get him out of trouble at the next level...I mean big ben is very powerful and he can use his power to elude and then has the arm to make throws late. Can Tebow be similar?

I was interested in seeing what Peen thought was the skills that would make him a SB MVP? I have not seen him enough.

moon #457893 01/28/10 04:12 PM
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Quote:

I guess we need a Tebow thread.




We have one in every single thread involving the draft or QBs. I think it might be being discussed in the State of the Union thread by now.

moon #457894 01/28/10 04:22 PM
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I was interested in seeing what Peen thought was the skills that would make him a SB MVP? I have not seen him enough.




This is not meant as a shot at Peen at all,he loves his Gators and I respect and understand that but I think he is letting his heart stand in the way of reason. I like Tebow a lot,and actually would like to have him as a Brown, but not in the top 3 rounds and not as our everydown franchise QB.

KING


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GraffZ06 #457895 01/28/10 04:40 PM
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"Physically USC S Taylor Mays is a man amongst boys. It’s shocking how much bigger he is compared to the other defensive backs. He truly does look like a linebacker out on the field. Mays drew a reaction from the crowd when he basically ran right through Andre Roberts on a play in the deep middle."

Would much prefer Eric Berry but considering our need at S we could do much worse than Mays.




I've actually seen some mocks where Earl Thomas and Nate Allen get drafted before Taylor Mays and have Mays slipping into the the second round. I personally think the scouts making them mocks are stoned but I can't say it would completely shock me. If the guy is as stiff and has been consistently been getting beat I wonder if his stock could actually fall that far. I mean look at Maualuga, he was a top ten pick early in the year and ended up falling pretty far.

If Mays would by some chance fall to the second round we definately gotta grab the guy. I'm not even going to begin to think about what a draft with Haden in the first and Mays in the second would be like because it surely won't happen. But man oh man I would be drooling.

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I liked Mays a ton last year....watching him this year, he definitely had a bad year, but there is still a lot of raw ability there.

Mays range seems to be in the 20-50 range right now (late 1st to mid 2nd), so there is a decent chance we could nab him with our 2nd pick. Considering all that raw ability and our need for a S, it would not be a bad pick (even if he has coverage issues, we could use him as a monster-back and give Rob Ryan another toy to use in his blitz packages while helping against the run).


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If Rolle lasts until the 4th I would sprint and dive head first....Sliding into the podium knocking down people/decorations to get my card up there with his name on it.




I love it

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I agree, if we draft Haden and he ends up being the shutdown guy he's supposed to be and our pass rush improves a bit more than it already did the last half of the year Mays could be a stud if given the chance to roam a bit. That being said the only way I take Mays is if we get Haden in the first.

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Quote:

Quote:

I was interested in seeing what Peen thought was the skills that would make him a SB MVP? I have not seen him enough.




This is not meant as a shot at Peen at all,he loves his Gators and I respect and understand that but I think he is letting his heart stand in the way of reason. I like Tebow a lot,and actually would like to have him as a Brown, but not in the top 3 rounds and not as our everydown franchise QB.

KING





I have honestly considered that. I have always said I don't fall in love with players, and I don't.

I honestly think the guy can be a great NFL QB, because I honestly think the NFL is evolving as we type.

You are seeing more and more of the "cat", "spread", whatever you want to call it, and I honestly think it is only going to grow in the coming years.

I see it simply from a numbers perspective when I make the statements I do. I am simply not just shooting from the hip or just flapping my lips.


In high schools all across the country the cat, spread, whatever, is the O that is run. College team after college team is adopting it as either the standard O or a option that gets lot's of play. Look at OSU and Michigan. The old Big 10, 3 yards and a cloud of dust land is adopting it to various degrees.


I don't think you are going to find many 'classic' drop back QBs in the future..... and not all that far away.



So, that leaves NFL teams trying to find fewer and fewer prospects, or do something else.


We are already seeing something else from the teams that don't have a classic drop back passer....


I agree....if you are rating Tebow as a classic drop back passer, I agree, he probably isn't going to be very good, or a guy who will be a project and a half.


However, if you open your minds for even 30 seconds and ponder what I said, then all of a sudden he is looking a whole lot better.


As Toad said, he brings a legit chance at passing the ball, and as he said, the goal when running the guy isn't 70 yard break aways, just like when Alstott was handed the ball the Bucs weren't expecting 70 yard scampers. Take your 4-5 yards, move the chains and keep on plugging.


I know I am asking a lot to think out of the box, but sooner or later you will.....numbers are going to dictate that. The league is already short of good QBs. Teams will adapt if they don't have a Manning type player.

I have heard the arguments that you don't change a O for one guy...well, teams change their O every time a new coach shows up.....why not when a new QB shows up???

If you want to win you will.


There is no doubt in my mind that if Tebow is put in to a situation where he can play his game, he will be a SB MVP.


If everybody had like minds, we would never learn.

GM Strong




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Ballpeen #457900 01/28/10 09:21 PM
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I think it's still a passers league and Tebow's weakness is passing....Yes, they are running spreads, but the emphasis is creating mismatches on the outside and letting the QB make the quick, accurate, smart throw....

Can Tebow do it?....he did it in college where the competition was often much much worse. When he ran up against solid defenses, he was mediocre as a passing QB (good as a fullback QB).

Indy - Great pocket/throwing QB
Minnesota - Great pocket/throwing QB
San Diego - Great pocket/throwing QB
New Orleans - Great pocket/throwing QB
Green Bay - Great pocket/throwing QB
Arizona - Great pocket/throwing QB
New England - Great pocket/throwing QB
NY Jets - Up-and-coming pocket/throwing QB
Baltimore - Up-and-coming pocket/throwing QB
Atlanta - Up-and-coming pocket/throwing QB
NY Giants - Good-to-great pocket/throwing QB
Philly - Good-to-great pocket/throwing QB
Pittsburgh - Great pocket/throwing QB
Houston - Up-and-coming pocket/throwing QB
Cinci - Good-to-great pocket/throwing QB

I listed these teams b/c they are the ones that will consistently be going for playoffs and/or championships for the foreseeable future...

Spread or not spread, the common denomator is that they can all sling the rock.....And do it consistently from the pocket with an above average arm or supreme accuracy. Is that Tebow?


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wojo_dew #457901 01/28/10 09:49 PM
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NRTU.

I just saw some of the clips from the practices and WOW does Tebow's release look even slower than it did in the Youtube vid's I posted.

He throws the football like an outfielder playing long-toss......


***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
Ballpeen #457902 01/28/10 10:10 PM
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Is there any way you see him fall to the third round? That is the only way I could see us picking him up.





How many 3rds do we have?
Maybe trade back into the mid to late 2nd.

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Some team will take him in the 1st.

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Quote:

I have honestly considered that. I have always said I don't fall in love with players, and I don't.




I know you have, I feel the same way about McCoy. I am not going to pimp him all offseason because I fell like I have been blinded by watching the kid play for the last four years. You seem so sold on Tebow that is why I wanted to hear you thoughts on how he can move the ball consistently at the next level.

Quote:

However, if you open your minds for even 30 seconds and ponder what I said, then all of a sudden he is looking a whole lot better.




I am very open minded in this matter. In fact I agree with you that the league is changing, I am just not sold on wholesale changes...I think it continues to happen with personnel packages.


Quote:

n high schools all across the country the cat, spread, whatever, is the O that is run. College team after college team is adopting it as either the standard O or a option that gets lot's of play.




This way of thinking just does not stand up when you talk NFL. It's been happening for years. Single Wing...Wishbone....Wing T...Slot T...Veer....Spread...and now Spread Veer. The high school and college game is not the same as the NFL. I don't know why, but very few high schools zone block and drop back and protect the passer, it is very hard to teach and it takes a bunch of time and talent (something few high college teams and fewer high schools have the luxury of). But in the NFL everything is zone blocking and everything is built around the protection of the QB. They can do it because they don't have to have ALL the college kids only the very best.


Quote:

I agree....if you are rating Tebow as a classic drop back passer, I agree, he probably isn't going to be very good, or a guy who will be a project and a half.




I think he can be (and has to be) a drop back passer. His greatest quality in my eyes is his drive....not willing teams to win type of drive, but his drive to overcome. He will give his all into learning to be a passer in the NFL. That is why i said steve young is his ceiling. I just don't see a NFL team paying thier QB to be Mike Alstot with an arm. At his best he will run bootlegs where he can move the chains with those 4-5 yard runs or pass to open recievers in the flats and such, but what happens on 3rd and 7. Teams can not pick up those with tough running and play action wont cut it either....the defenses are too fast 7 yards is a long damn way in this league. Can he drop back and throw a 12 yard comeback across the field to pick that up? I don't think he can right now, but I think he has the drive to develop that skill. His toughness will come in handy to extend plays I will defiantly give him that.

Quote:

There is no doubt in my mind that if Tebow is put in to a situation where he can play his game, he will be a SB MVP.




..Our (UT) Tim Tebow was Vince Young, they still have not figured out how to use him.

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For some reason I just cant see that happening.
Other prospects at QB, Teams needs (a lot of linemen, O & D), sprinkle in a few DBs, LBs, RBs, WRs and TEs and he could easily fall.

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From what I saw of the practices, Tebow had trouble with the quick hits, but downfield he was good.

They had him on the sideline with a cement block in front of him throwing into a net.

He reminds me of randall cunningham and byron leftwich.


There will be no playoffs. Can’t play with who we have out there and compounding it with garbage playcalling and worse execution. We don’t have good skill players on offense period. Browns 20 - Bears 17.

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Actually, I think the Titans have finally figured out how to use Young.....just let him play.

If you just let Vince be Vince, he is going to be a pretty good player in the league.

Anyway, enough on Tebow. My opinion is known by this point as is the opinion of others. Time is the only thing that is going to finally sort of what is and what isn't, so there is no sense hashing and rehashing the same points.

There are a lot of other players we can discuss and I think I will start concentrating on them...guys we are likely to draft, because I agree, the Browns and Tebow probably aren't a fit even though he would fit well in Cleveland....the type of player, the fans, the weather...I think it would work well.



but....enough........zzzzip


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GM Strong




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If Brady Quinn fell in the 1st round..

I just know Tebow will fall to the 2nd/ 3rd peen...


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webbage

Best/worst of Senior Bowl practice Story Highlights
Ole Miss' Dexter McCluster improved his draft stock at least 30 spots in Mobile
Arkansas State DE Alex Carrington went from a mid-round choice to a top-60 pick
USC's Taylor Mays was exposed, likely ending the interest of some franchises


By Tony Pauline,TFYDraft.com, special to SI.com


Ole Miss' Dexter McCluster may have vaulted himself into the early portion of Round 2.

MOBILE, Ala. -- NFL coaches have left Mobile and most of the scouts are headed home. The only thing left at the Senior Bowl is to tee up the ball and kick off the game. After three full days of practice its time to look back at the highlights and lowlights of the past week, many which will impact April's draft.

Best Offensive Player in Mobile
Dexter McCluster/RB/Mississippi: McCluster presented himself as the jack-of-all-trades in Mobile and someone who mastered all the applied trades. He was explosive carrying the ball, making defenders miss and creating yardage while also running hard on the inside. He was also a game-breaking pass catcher who sprinted past opponents down the sidelines. All that's left is for McCluster to showoff his return abilities during the game. He's improved his draft stock at least 30 slots and could now hear his named called as soon as the early portion of Round 2.

Honorable Mention: Taylor Price/WR/Ohio: Scouts were aware of his underlying talent entering the week but few expected Price to be as polished as he was on the field. He displayed the ability to make all the catches in the short and deep field. Price is another who moved up draft boards almost a full round based on his performance this week.

Best Defensive Player in Mobile
Alex Carrington/DE/Arkansas State: Carrington came to Mobile with a complete game, which caught scouts off guard. He was fast and powerful, the latter which answered questions about his playing strength. Scouts loudly applauded Carrington each day at practice. Coming into the week he was a mid-round choice. As Senior Bowl practices end Carrington leaves a top-60 pick.

Honorable Mention: Daryl Washington/LB/TCU: Expectations were high when Jerry Hughes, the All-America from TCU, was originally listed on the Senior Bowl roster. Hughes bypassed the event with a quad injury but the Horned Frogs program never missed a beat as his college teammate proved to be a star. By Wednesday scouts branded Washington as the top athlete of all the linebackers in Mobile and the only true three-down defender at the position.

Most Disappointing Player in Mobile
Taylor Mays/S/USC: For Mays the week turned into a potpourri of skills he's likely to struggle with in the NFL; he'll struggle handling man-to-man coverage assignments and struggle making plays sideline-to-sideline as a true NFL centerfielder. Mays is still a legitimate prospect for the next level but the limitations he displayed this week will reduce the number of teams wanting to acquire him in April.

Honorable Mention: Eric Norwood/LB/South Carolina: Norwood's inability to make plays in coverage all week was alarming. He looked like a fish out of water trying to stay with running backs and tight ends down the field. Like Mays, he has a place at the next level, yet the number of NFL systems Norwood can line up in has been reduced.

Most Surprising Player
Joe Webb/WR/UAB: Webb has been the Blazers starting quarterback the past two seasons yet made a seamless transition to receiver this week and looked like a seasoned veteran at the position. Webb was solid catching the ball all week, regularly beating defensive backs that are graded as early round picks.

Honorable Mention: Myron Rolle/S/Florida State: Rolle certainly did not look like someone who has not played football in over a year. He never embarrassed himself on the field. In fact by weeks end he was making plays and playing at a higher level than many of his teammates.

Most Memorable Moment
Midway through the first practice of the week Andre Roberts of The Citadel went across the middle trying to catch one of the many wayward throws made by the quarterbacks at the Senior Bowl. He was met head on by Mays, who laid out the small-school receiver with one of his patented crunching blows. After the crowd reacted with gasps, Roberts peeled himself off the turf, brushed himself off and quickly got back to the huddle.

NOTES: With the media hammering Tim Tebow at every given opportunity this week, we decided to stay away and give it some time. Through no fault of his own Tebow was put in an impossible situation at the Senior Bowl. His supporters were expecting an instant transformation from college legend to NFL franchise quarterback. His detractors were ready to pounce on any ounce of bad news. They all failed to realize there was no magic button to push and four years of poor throwing mechanics would not be repaired in three practices. The process will be a long one and NFL decision-makers understand this. His passion for the game and knowledge of the position puts the Heisman Trophy winner ahead of the curve, but he won't be NFL ready any time soon. ... NFL scouts and general managers were disappointed in the overall talent on this year's Senior Bowl roster. Just one player, Penn State's Jared Odrick, leaves the week as a certain first-round choice. This compares to last year when 11 veterans were selected in the opening round. Several top prospects that were invited to play bypassed the event thinking it would do more harm than good to their draft ranking. History has proven them wrong as players from B.J. Raji to Marcus Trufant to Philip Rivers all benefitted from good performances at the Senior Bowl. NFL scouting departments will also not take kindly to the fact many of these players purposely avoided competing head-to-head with some of the nation's best.


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very surprising to me is:

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Honorable Mention: Eric Norwood/LB/South Carolina: Norwood's inability to make plays in coverage all week was alarming. He looked like a fish out of water trying to stay with running backs and tight ends down the field. Like Mays, he has a place at the next level, yet the number of NFL systems Norwood can line up in has been reduced.






Norwood looked like a beast in the 3 games I saw him play this year....was torn between him and Graham as my favorite OLB prospect for us. Guess I should stick with Graham? (can he stop doing well so he'll drop to us?)


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Being asked to turn and run with speedy backs is not something he's accustomed to..and once one I say stay away from Mays..his instincts and judgement are poor..

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I think Terrence Cody will end up being how Gabe Watson of Michigan was.. He was highly tauted prior to the finish of his senior season, but it wall went downhill after that...

I hope he falls... I would snag him in the 4th round..


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Tue Jan 26, 2010 9:04 am EST
Tim Tebow meets his worst career fears in Senior Bowl debut

By Matt Hinton

On top of the technical issues NFL scouts have with Tim Tebow as a prospective pro quarterback, there's also the standard next-level complaint about "the system" -- specifically, among other things, that Tebow spent the entirety of his college career at Florida taking snaps from the shotgun, never from under center, even in short-yardage situations. That seemingly minor qualm opens up an entirely new avenue of doubts about his ability to adjust to basic mechanics like footwork and turning his back to the defense, fundamentals most quarterbacks have converted to second nature long before they show up for NFL auditions (or, in most cases, before they ever set foot in an actual college game).

Florida tried to address that last year by hiring respected quarterbacks coach Scott Loeffler from the pro ranks, practicing with Tebow under center and having him take a handful of "conventional" snaps in a few games, all with an eye to making the most celebrated college player in modern history a more viable prospect to the skeptics. But when he showed up Monday for the first day of heavy scrutiny at the Senior Bowl, all the old alarm bells started ringing at maximum volume -- Tebow reportedly flubbed his first snap from center, and it only got uglier from there:

Performing drills with fellow South team quarterbacks Zac Robinson of Oklahoma State and Jarrett Brown of West Virginia, Tebow fumbled the ball at least twice while taking snaps under center.

Later in team drills, Tebow fell into his same old habits — holding onto the ball too long, locking onto receivers and throwing wobbly passes.

The scouts noticed.

"He looks like the third QB out there," one NFC South talent evaluator said.

Of course, the two QBs in front of him, Robinson and Brown, also come from shotgun-based spread schemes that featured a steady dose of quarterback-as-runner, and former Texas Tech coach Mike Leach -- as prominent an acolyte of the "college spread" as you can find -- hilariously mocked the NFL mantra when his prolific protegé, Graham Harrell, met with failing grades from the scouts last spring. ("How could you possibly look yourself in the mirror and consider yourself an NFL coach and not be able to teach a guy to run back three steps, five steps and seven steps? I can teach a child that!") Longtime coach and quarterback guru Marc Trestman, who worked with Tebow to prepare for this week, said he didn't think Tebow looked bad enough to hurt himself; Miami Dolphins coach Tony Sparano, overseeing the South roster, said Tebow improved over the course of the practice. If nothing else, he's already well on his way to replacing Brett Favre's spot in Peter King's heart in the league's most influential weekly column.

But for a guy who needed a knockout week, the initial reviews are unadulterated fuel for the haters. Handling the snap is supposed to be the easy part of the transition; if he's still struggling with the basic exchange on national television this Saturday, we won't be hearing the end of it anytime soon.



I am sure if anybody can learn how to play the QB position it is TT

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I'll add this here, I thought it funny.

The Browns might as well draft the left handed Tebow to go along with Anderson and Quinn.

Both of those guys are left handed too, but at this point they don't know it.



If everybody had like minds, we would never learn.

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I'm still taking in info about the guys at Senior Bowl.. I'm looking forward to the game and I intend to do some evaluating of my own.. here's some more info..

Five Senior Bowl players whom I learned about

Eric Edholm
eedholm@pfwmedia.com
Senior editor

Posted Jan. 29, 2010 @ 1:48 p.m.
By Eric Edholm
MOBILE, Ala. — One of my favorite things about Senior Bowl week is coming down here, not knowing anything about some of these players, and watching them impress me firsthand.

Once you talk to these kids, of course, you figure out they have been the stars of their high schools and colleges and are used to being the big man on campus.

There's no doubt it has been the Tim Tebow week. After all, who was the last Senior Bowl player to need two police escorts to come off the field every day? And certainly there were other well-known players, some for not-so-good reasons, such as Oregon RB LeGarrette Blount. (Blount, incidentally, impressed me with both his play and how he has handled the daily questions about the most famous punch since Kermit Washington decked Rudy Tomjanovich.)

But for the lesser-known players, until they do something here, they might not get the full attention of NFL people, or at least from dopes like me.

I came into this week thinking it was not a great group of talent here. I even had the nerve to ask South team coach Tony Sparano if he thought the same, compared to other years. He looked at me strangely and assured me it was as solid a group as he could remember.

And I think he's right. Sure, there might not be a lot of top-10 talents strolling through here this week, but I saw some really good players, several of whom I hadn't had a chance to see before.

Here are five players whom I knew little or nothing about coming in but was impressed by this week:



Washington LB Donald Butler

I had to read up on Butler after watching him look solid all week. Turns out he was second-team All-Pac-10 with 15½ tackles for loss, three forced fumbles and two interceptions. Those are pretty nice numbers for a middle linebacker on a rebuilding Huskies defense.

Butler was a late addition to the North roster, but he has shown he belongs. I can tell how he got all those tackles for losses: Butler appears to diagnose plays well and fit in the proper run gaps. He showed a quick first step, was willing to take on bigger blockers in the live portion of practice and looks like he has the athleticism to be a three-down linebacker in some systems.

"I feel most comfortable at the 'Mike' but I can play (weak side) if needed," Butler said. "I didn't drop below 240 (pounds) and didn't get above 245 my senior year, and that's where I am at now. I feel like I can gain some weight, to 250 or 255, and still be able to run. And I think I could drop to about 235 or 230 and play in a Tampa-2 defense."



Boston College C Matt Tennant

It's not that I didn't know of Tennant before, having watched a good amount of BC games the past few years. It's just that I didn't know he was this good. It's so cliché and lazy to say this, but he really reminds me of Dan Koppen when he came out of Chestnut Hill several years ago. But then again, don't all those interior Boston College linemen have a similar type of build and game? I asked him whether he thought the BC lineage helped or hurt him, given the sheer number of linemen that school has produced over the years.

"It definitely raises the bar," Tennant said. "BC has developed some great linemen. I just want to continue that tradition. And I know everyone else back there wants me to, also."

From the first practice on Monday, Tennant fit in very well. He held up in individual drills, standing up some accomplished linemen such as Penn State's Jared Odrick, North Carolina's Cam Thomas and Purdue's Mike Neal despite being a tad light in the shorts at 290 pounds. But Tennant has been as consistent and solid as any lineman here — not ever getting embarrassed and perhaps not dominating people. He looks like one of those 10-year centers who constantly is overlooked but does his job day in and day out.

"I came out here in all this craziness, learning a new scheme, and all the while you are being evaluated by all 32 teams," he said. "I think I played great this week. I won my one-on-ones, and I showcased my talent."



Arkansas State DE Alex Carrington

I knew zilch about this guy coming into the week. Nada.

But he was one of the first guys to catch my eye in what appeared to be a so-so group of North team defensive linemen. First, you notice the size — he's 6-5 and 284 pounds — and you think, 'Man, this kid looks like a base end in a 4-3 defense or even a five-technique in a 3-4. Then, you notice the quickness. He flew off the snap and really harassed most of the North offensive linemen, frustrating them with his strength and quickness. Even Mike Iupati, probably the best lineman in town and a possible top-15 pick when it's all said and done, was completely manhandled by Carrington on one play.

One of my regrets was not getting a chance to talk to him this week. I will be running by the hotel today and hope to snag his number so we can get a Q&A with him down the road.

Once I started reading about Carrington, it was clear that he didn't always play up to his potential in college. But he dominated on the small-school level and came into Mobile and did the same thing. Carrington looks like Jarron Gilbert, who was a high third-rounder last year, but to me might be a better player. In fact, the talk now is that he is a second-rounder for sure.



Citadel WR Andre Roberts

Roberts had two memorable moments this week. The first was when he made a diving catch, sustaining a crushing blow from Taylor Mays, one of the big boys. Not only did Roberts catch the ball, but he simply got up after the hit and ran back to the huddle. The next was when Roberts adjusted to an overthrown ball from Tebow and made a terrific over-the-shoulder catch, keeping both feet inbounds on the sideline.

Turns out I was not the only one who didn't know much about Roberts coming into the week. Some Alabama fans behind me asked who "that Carolina receiver" was, assuming that his powder-blue helmet meant he went to Chapel Hill. To me, Roberts looked like he could have gone to a bigger school, and heck, he might have even given some of those Tar Heel receivers from last year a pretty good run.

Roberts has a quiet confidence to him. He acts and carries himself well. I can see a home for him in the slot, but I didn't leave here this week thinking he was only a two-way go guy. He lined up outside plenty of times and got off press coverage. Roberts might be tad raw, but I thought he stood up nicely against the competition.



Miami (Fla.) TE Jimmy Graham

I caught up with Graham, the former Hurricanes basketball player who has been playing football for less than a year, and asked him if we could give him a call down the line. He was another player I wished I had chatted with (you can't get them all) because he has a fascinating story and appears to be a very athletic and intriguing prospect.

My guess is that if Antonio Gates can make the transition from hoops to football, so can Graham. Why? Graham is at least an inch taller, looks fluid running routes and, simply, doesn't look clueless out there on the field. That's the first thing I looked for: Does he look like a football player?

Unequivocally yes. Will he be a Gates-level star? Well, let's hold back on that a little bit. But Graham has something. His nice footwork and post-up ability are evident. Now I heard that he was loafing it during practice this week, but I honestly can't say I saw it. It's not as if I was watching Graham and only him this week, but I saw no evidence of him not giving a solid effort.

We'll see. My guess is he can make a team and add an interesting dimension if he can commit to blocking and special teams. And I can't wait to hear about his family when we chat down the line.


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Thanks for posting that,....I had just discovered that The Citadel had a player on the roster. Reason to watch now,....

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Iupati moved back to LG and is looking better. Getting to the second level on run plays. Announcers described him as being a grabber, rather than a puncher.

The QBs looked bad in this game not just Tebow. Although you could time Tebows release with a sun dial.

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Just learned it's on NFL Network,...no Direct TV here,...

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Michigan DE Graham wins Senior Bowl MVP
Posted by Evan Silva on January 30, 2010 7:41 PM ET
Michigan DE Brandon Graham, a likely mid to late first-round pick in April's draft, took home Senior Bowl M.V.P. honors as Jim Schwartz's North squad whipped Tony Sparano's South team 31-13 at Ladd-Peebles Stadium on Saturday evening.


Graham was highly disruptive despite seeing limited snaps so everyone could play. He finished with five tackles and two sacks, including a strip-sack of Oklahoma State QB Zac Robinson to force a fumble recovered by the North at the South's 49-yard line.

Cincinnati WR Mardy Gilyard was highly productive for the North offense, catching five passes for 102 yards and a touchdown. Gilyard, who struggled with drops during the practice week, proved much better in the live setting. He beat decorated Alabama CB Javier Arenas down the right sideline for his touchdown, hauling in the 32-yard throw from Central Michigan QB Dan LeFevour. LeFevour doesn't possess great arm strength, but moved the ball aggressively and finished with 97 yards on 10 attempts, the one passing touchdown, and another one-yard rushing score.

Headliner Tim Tebow of Florida was a non-factor. His scrambles didn't work against the elite speed of Schwartz's defense, and Tebow refused to throw down field. Tebow also fumbled twice, losing one, and managed just 50 yards on 8-of-12 passing. He gained four yards on four carries.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/01/30/michigan-de-graham-wins-senior-bowl-mvp/


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Quote:

NRTU.

I just saw some of the clips from the practices and WOW does Tebow's release look even slower than it did in the Youtube vid's I posted.

He throws the football like an outfielder playing long-toss......





He's too slow afoot, he won't be able to make anyone in the NFL miss, he won't be able to run over an NFL linebacker and a four man rush got to him and caused a fumble with that looong slooow release. Like I said before, he's in the wrong sport. He'd make someone a great center fielder.


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He's too slow afoot, he won't be able to make anyone in the NFL miss, he won't be able to run over an NFL linebacker and a four man rush got to him and caused a fumble with that looong slooow release. Like I said before, he's in the wrong sport. He'd make someone a great center fielder.




You're wrong! Tim Tebows heart and determination will lead him to greatness! He's a winner dang it! Teams needs to mold their sceme around him! That way he can lead his team to the superbowl and earn himself MVP!!!



I couldn't type that without

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I watched the game, and have it on DVR. a couple of comments.

It was not a good day for Tebow. Much Better for Lefevor. I doubt if Lefevor gets out of the 3rd round.

Gilyard looks like Deshawn Jackson.

The North DL was very good. The defense of the north was just better. Many players, looked very good. On the south Williams the DT from Tennessee looked very good.


There will be no playoffs. Can’t play with who we have out there and compounding it with garbage playcalling and worse execution. We don’t have good skill players on offense period. Browns 20 - Bears 17.

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