DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Top NFL Head Coaching Candidates

I concur.

It seems impossible to me that any NFL coaches, scouts or anyone involved with evaluating NFL prospects would look at Tebow as a NFL starting quarterback.

It was so revealing what happened in Denver. Elway after Denver went to the playoffs moved him off the team in a New York minute.

Then again I never really thought that Weeden was anything more than a third rounder.

good read on Chip Kelly's aggressiveness (which, based on my recent posts, you can probably guess that I absolutely, 100% agree with.)

http://www.thepostgame.com/blog/men-acti...-revolution-nfl

It even makes good mention of Bill Belichick and Sean Payton as being very aggressive, which I have mentioned in the past. I would add Mike Smith of the Falcons to that list as well.

I don't disagree with much of the article but I do disagree with the base premise of how Kelly will 'change the NFL'.
Kelly can go for it on 4th down all the time because the opposition he faces is so much less talented/deep than his team. He knows he can just keep running his midget sprinters out there. One after the next until his roster wears out the opposing roster. This type of talent gap is not prevalent in the NFL. Neither is the roster size. He won't have a stable of 5'8" WR sprinters to keep throwing out onto the field.
As far as Chip being the most talented coach in college football. He's not even the best coach in his conference. I'll take Riley over him. He does more with much less.
I think Kelly will get a wake up call if he moves to the big boy league with his high school system. At least without a major overhaul to his system. Which I believe he's far to much an egomaniac to change.
My worst case scenerio... Kelly on the sideline. The team drafting Gino Smith to play QB. With Tebow as our backup.
Kill me.

let's be honest, we are talking about the wrong Kelly.

Brian is the HC we should want. He has proven he can be a high-scoring minded HC when needed and go undefeated (Cinci) or be a defensive/ball-control HC when needed and go undefeated (ND).

he is adaptable and proven to be successful. his schemes are more NFL-oriented.

I almost agree with you. I dont remember ever seeing ND play so well. Id like to see another year of his work though to be sure its him, and not just the talent.

I thought about Brian Kelly over Chip also.

But neither Kellys have any kind of NFL experience at all.

If we look college coaches, the two I'm looking at are ...


David Shaw (Standford) and Kevin Sumlin (Texas A&M)

The scariest thing to me about taking a college coach is that in the NFL, you don't get to recruit. You have to play the hand you are dealt and you are only going to get 3-5 new guys a year that have a realistic chance to make your team better...

And that's the distinction you have to make, some college coaches are good because they are excellent salesmen with a great brand to sell, who consistently have far more talent than most of the people they play.. that means nothing in the NFL.

I agree, which is one reason I like Brian Kelly more than the other mentioned college HC candidates. He has proven he can adapt to his surroundings and play to his teams strengths.

Yeah, that is one of the things that make me leery of Chip Kelly, even though I like his aggressive philosophy. That, and the fact that his teams struggle against physical defenses.

Chip Kelly has been the coach at Oregon since 2009. Here are his commits by rankings.

5 star - 3
4 star - 33
3 star - 45
2 star - 11


Just for comparison, USC in that same period has had ...

5 star - 12
4 star - 47
3 star - 17
2 star - 3


Records in that time period ...

USC 34-16
Oregon 45-7


Head to Head record, Oregon leads 3-1.


Chip Kelly can coach, he's not just a recruiter.

Oregon recruits a different type of athlete than USC. USC looks to recruit NFL type players. 4 and 5 star athletes that can play in a pro style system. Oregon doesn't need, can't use, these kind of players. Kelly can recruit 3 star 'football players' that are actually 5'8" track stars. USC isn't after half these guys. It's why Kelly can recruit them. USC doesn't want them. Notice the difference in 3 star recruit numbers. Kelly builds a roster off them.
Also notice the amount of elite players each team puts in the NFL.
As far as recruiting, Kelly couldn't even keep Suh in state with all of Nike's money. My guess is because if you want to win some games in college you go play at Oregon. If you want to be drafted at the top of the draft because you played in a pro style system, you get out of dodge.

General reply here .......

Frankly I don't care if our next head coach is an offensive genius ..... or a defensive genius ........ if he can coordinate an offense with his eyes closed ...... or if he comes up with some brilliant schemes on defense .....

What I care about is that he is able to take that next step to become a great head coach.

Look at Mike Tomlin when he came to the Steelers. He was a defensive coordinator, and a 4-3 guy through and through. However, from day 1 he said that there was nothing wrong with the defense the Steelers run, and nothing wrong with the coaches they have to run it.

He knew when not to break a good thing. He didn't have an ego that required that things be changed to fit what his history would seem to dictate.

In short, he knew that he was hired to be the head coach, and that he would work through his coordinators, not in place of them.

This is the hardest thing for a new head coach to learn. It's why I do worry about a hotshot coordinator coming in and trying to do it all on one side of the ball. That approach rarely works. Even if the head coach is involved to some degree in play designs and such, he has to learn to work through his coaches to get things done. He cannot do it all himself.

That was Shurmur's biggest mistake last year. He wanted to do it all. He was the head coach, and the offensive coordinator. He was designing the offensive gameplan, and calling the plays.

In short, he was doing everything except being the head coach. It bit us in the Bengals game where they blew a play by us when we weren't looking, because Jauron was busy calling a play, and Shurmur was busy trying to decide what we were going to run when we got the ball back, and no one was paying attention to what was going on on the field.

I want a head coach who, if asked, "what system will you run" would answer:

"I will run the system that best fits the talent we have. I am not coming here to be the coordinator. I am coming to be the head coach. That means that I will try to hire the very best talent I can find to be my coordinators, and while I will set the general direction of the team, and have the final say on things, I will allow my coordinators the opportunity to be the brilliant coaches I know they can be."

The head coach is responsible for everything that happens on the football field. However, often times he cannot divorce himself from wanting to be the coordinator, and he gets in the way. That's why so many "offensive geniuses" wind up with great defensive teams, and visa versa. The head coach stays out of the way on the side of the ball he is less familiar with.

I want a guy who understands this rather simple concept.

Just reinforcing the idea that this thread is needed, here's what Banner said about how beating the Steelers changes his opinion on the future of Shurmur:

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Banner added nothing to his standing position that the big calls will be made after the season.

To what extent does beating the Steelers strengthen Shurmur’s position?

“It’s not going to be that kind of a microdecision,” Banner said, noting that he is assessing qualities “that would lead to long-term success.”

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I may want to keep Pat on board. Someone tell me I'm crazy.

For the most part he called a good game.

The one very frustrating call was the play action bootleg pass on third and six. Literally no one on the defense bit on the run (who is running on third and six?), leaving everyone on one side of the field covered. It really was a horrible call.

That's picking nits though. Congrats to Shurmur on his best playcalling day as a head coach.

I liked the way he (finally!) used that Benjamin reverse action on the handoff to Richardson for the TD. Benjamin took 2 defenders with him on the reverse action.

Nicely done.

J/C

I mentioned to my dad after the game today that I thought he did a better job than he has. My dad replied that he'd love to see how a better offensive mind would utilize the talents and strengths on this team because he doesn't think Shurmur is doing it.

Food for thought, but it did make some sense to me.

One of the things I noticed yesterday, was that we actually had guys running WIDE OPEN. You know those few plays a game where the underneath guy goes against the grain and catches the ball with no defenders in the picture and runs for big yardage... we never seem to get those plays, it seems like we always have to work harder for yards than other teams.. well today we had a couple of those... Good play design and good execution...

I was watching the game and thinking about why we do not try to take advantage of Weedens arm a little more by stretching the field and then he connects with Gordon on th exact type of play I was thinking about.It just doesn't seem like we run those plays very often.
The thing about Shurmur is that it seems to take him alot longer to "get it" than other coaches. He is now getting more aggressive on fourth downs, doesn't seem as predictable on 3rd and 1-2 but it took him a while to make the change. The same can be said about Hardesty. He has been very good on the few opportunities he gets in the game. I would like to see him get worked into the game plan a little more and give T.Rich a few more chances to stay fresh throughout the game but Shurmur seems very slow at altering his game plan. Most coaches make adjustments at halftime whereas it seems to take Shurmur 2-3 games.

Hue Jackson anyone?

The transformation he did in Oakland was pretty impressive considering where they are now without him.

In 2009:

266.1 Yards Per Game
106.3 Rushing Yards Per Game
159.8 Passing Yards Per Game

2010 & 2011 Averaged:

368.1 Total Yards Per Game (+38% compared to 2009)
223.2 Passing Yards Per Game (+40%compared to 2009)
143.9 Rushing Yards Per Game (+35% compared to 2009)

I just wonder what he could do with our O-Line/Richardson and Weeden with our WR's.

He developed Joe Flacco in 2008 & 2009 as the Ravens QB Coach.

He thought trading two first round picks for Carson Palmer was a good idea

I mentioned him as well. Didnt get alot of love lol but he did do some good things with Oakland. Not saying hes the man or anything like that but should be looked at as a valid option.

So you want to discredit a HC Candidate because of a bad roster decision to go after a franchise QB?

Add to the fact that he won't have control over the 53 man roster, the GM should.

Also, I'm sure each coach has made a blunder of some kind. At least Jackson went after a decent QB, and not a complete has been or "unknown" like Flynn (unknown), Farve (has been) and the list could go on.

Rumblings of Chucky back to Oakland?

I guess the guy can't lose. Seems like people either think he's the ultimate coaching candidate or the ultimate NFL announcer.

I think he's overrated at both . . .

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I think he's overrated at both . . .

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Agreed