|
|
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,577
Dawg Talker
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,577 |
"If it weren't for my horse, I wouldn't have spent that year in college"
GO ROCKETS
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 871
All Pro
|
|
All Pro
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 871 |
Quote:
And the Tribe fans would be defending Perez. Pot...meet kettle.
I will keep defending him, because I honestly don't believe he did it purposefully.
Two pitches in a row at his head at 100MPH not on purpose? Whatever.
And no I wouldn't defend Perez. There's no call for that crap. Would you still defend Chapman if one of those pitches knocked Swisher unconcious?
Last edited by Molly Hatchet Dawg; 05/27/13 04:58 PM.
"My opinions and feelings are mine and shall not be influenced by anyone....especially liberals."
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,027
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,027 |
I don't care for the 2 pitches as much as I care for the fake tough guy act.
Baseball players..... smh.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,426
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,426 |
I disagree. The first pitch was accidental, fine. The second wasn't and then for Chapman to glare and walk Swisher back around the bases is not unintentional at all.
My biggest complaint is that the umpire did nothing. The fact that he did not issue a warning after the second is unacceptable. Now, when retaliation comes, the Indians will end up getting a pitcher ejected/suspended. Not that a warning stops that, but it is at least a message to the Indians bench that the umpire saw it as well.
[color:"green"] "World domination has encountered a momentary setback. Please talk amongst yourselves." Get Fuzzy[/color]
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,447
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,447 |
To move the discussion along ; I think Franacona has made some really bad decisions as of late ..
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,806
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,806 |
I was a pitcher and if a batter crowded the plate you have 2 choices. Back him away or give a double off the wall.
Am I perfect? No
Am I trying to be a better person?
Also no
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,426
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,426 |
I agree with this. The Perez/Pestano thing hurts the pen, but the bigger issue may be the lack of a consistent LH option from the pen. Hill is mediocre at best, Hagadone has no control and no real reason for being up here right now, and Barnes is more of a long option.
[color:"green"] "World domination has encountered a momentary setback. Please talk amongst yourselves." Get Fuzzy[/color]
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,426
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,426 |
Quote:
I was a pitcher and if a batter crowded the plate you have 2 choices. Back him away or give a double off the wall.
Backing a batter off the plate is fine. But you don't do it throwing at the head.
[color:"green"] "World domination has encountered a momentary setback. Please talk amongst yourselves." Get Fuzzy[/color]
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 13,205
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 13,205 |
I agree about Francona's decisons the last two games. I thought he pulled Kluber too soon yesterday, and then stayed way too long with Perez. Perez actually got into TWO separate jams in the 9th yesterday - Francona should have had someone up and throwing before things got to that point.
Today - like I said earlier - I think you walk Votto with first base open and a man on third with one out in the 8th.
I like Francona (is it Terry or Tito?); I'm glad he's here. But he's had a crappy couple games, imo.
One other thing, maybe a conversation for a separate thread ... is anyone else really sick of the formula in baseball where the 9th inning, when you have a lead, is the exclusive domain of the so-called closer. I can certainly understand that thinking if you have a Mariano Rivera or a Trevor Hoffman, but how many teams have one of those? Way too often - imo - the manager takes out a guy pitching well because - well, he's the closer and it IS the 9th inning.
Drives me nuts.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,419
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,419 |
There is a difference between high and tight, and at someone's head. You knock someone off the plate with a pitch in around their chest/chin, and that's one thing. If you throw a 90+ fastball directly at a guy's head though, that's a different animal entirely. I do want to add that I did not see the pitch in question today. I was out at a family picnic. It was more fun than I would have had watching the bullpen implode again. 
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349 |
Quote:
And the Tribe fans would be defending Perez. Pot...meet kettle.
I will keep defending him, because I honestly don't believe he did it purposefully.
Talk about pot meet kettle, you cry every time a Indians fan posts in your precious Reds thread. So why don't you talk your gloating behind back to your own thread instead of talking crap in ours.
King
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,367
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,367 |
You all brought up the Reds in this thread, when our teams play each other it's all fair game. You were the ones that were too thin skinned to take any ribbing in the past, which is the only reason I give the Indian fans some crap when they venture into the Reds thread.
I haven't gloated in this thread, what is there to gloat about? I was simply giving my opinion on the comments about Chapman made by some posters. But, you have never let the facts get in the way when making an argument. So yes, there is some crap here, but as usual, it's coming from you.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 5,368
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 5,368 |
Just for all the silly accusations Latos should plunk Bourn to start off tomorrows game.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 137
Practice Squad
|
|
Practice Squad
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 137 |
I'm a Reds fan and will be till the day I die, but you don't do what Chapman did today.
He clearly threw at the head twice. If you want to back a guy off, throw at his body or his shins, that works well enough.
Because of this nonsense, Votto is going to eat a fastball tomorrow, and if he gets hurt, the team gets hurt, all over some nonsense that no one knows the cause of.
Proud fan of the Pulaski Academy football strategy.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,955
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,955 |
Quote:
So why don't you talk your gloating behind back to your own thread instead of talking crap in ours.
King
You know, when I read crap like this, I know why I've been taking LONG breaks from this place. Oh, and you can say ass on this board.
See you all in the fall.
#gmstrong #gmlapdance
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,367
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,367 |
CINCINNATI -- Reds closer Aroldis Chapman irked the Indians a bit in Cincinnati's 4-2 win over Cleveland on Monday, when he threw a 100-mph fastball right past the head of Cleveland first baseman Nick Swisher. It was the second straight wild pitch Chapman delivered to Swisher, with the first one sailing high and outside all the way to the backstop. Swisher did not seem pleased after the second pitch, mouthing the words "Don't do that" in Chapman's direction, while Swisher's teammates all hopped to the top step of the dugout. After the game, though, cooler heads prevailed. "I know you guys are trying to stir some stuff up here," Swisher said. "The first one I saw go by, and I thought, 'Wow, that's pretty quick.' And then that second one was a little too close for comfort. Let's be honest, 100 mph at somebody's head? That's not exactly the best thing." Reds manager Dusty Baker didn't hesitate when asked what he thought about the pitch past Swisher's helmet. "Is that the first time you've seen Aroldis throw one on the screen?" Baker said. "I'm serious. I just think that maybe everybody overreacted except the umpire [Paul Schrieber]. The umpire was really pretty cool about handling the situation. That's not something that we'd like to be known for or he'd like to be known for either." Jason Giambi agreed that Chapman, who is known to have a wild arm at times, did not throw at Swisher on purpose and said the Indians' reaction was more about supporting their teammate. "I've talked to Chapman plenty of times, and he's a great kid," Giambi said. "But we're going to protect our guys, too, especially Nick, who's a big leader on this ballclub, just to let him know, 'Hey, we've got your back.' But I don't think there's anything to it." http://cincinnati.reds.mlb.com/news/arti...in&c_id=cinAt least the Indian's players aren't as reactionary as some of their fans.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 5,521
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 5,521 |
Just watched the replay. Definitely intentional on the second throw. Should've been tossed.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 39,554
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 39,554 |
Seems to me the chin is a part of the head.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,419
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,419 |
When I hear that someone threw at a player's head, I generally take that to mean at the side of the player's head, where he had to duck out of the way or face permanent damage.Quite frankly, I think that a message can be sent without ever throwing at a guy's head. However, the chin is about the only area I would consider even remotely close to acceptable.
A pitcher can come inside and knock a batter off the plate with a tight fastball at the letters. To me, throwing at the top/crown of the head, or the face, is pretty bush league.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 13,205
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 13,205 |
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349 |
Yeah definitely intentional. Oh well, let the teams police themselves. Hopefully Brandon Phillips loses some teeth today.
KING
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349 |
Quote:
.
And no I wouldn't defend Perez. There's no call for that crap. Would you still defend Chapman if one of those pitches knocked Swisher unconcious?
Come on man, no Reds player can do anything wrong. I mean he couldn't possibly be wrong for doing it, we are all just upset and whining because we lost, obviously.
KING
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349 |
Quote:
You all brought up the Reds in this thread, when our teams play each other it's all fair game. You were the ones that were too thin skinned to take any ribbing in the past, which is the only reason I give the Indian fans some crap when they venture into the Reds thread.
I haven't gloated in this thread, what is there to gloat about? I was simply giving my opinion on the comments about Chapman made by some posters. But, you have never let the facts get in the way when making an argument. So yes, there is some crap here, but as usual, it's coming from you.
Blah blah blah ,some things never change. Jules gets to decide for everybody what is fair game, and what isn't. So Tribe fans "should go back to Tribeville" when she doesn't want them posting in her thread, but its all fair game when Jules decides it is. I didn't see anybody come over to The Reds thread to complain about Chapman, yet you had to troll your behind over here to call us whiners for not liking one of our best players having their head thrown at.
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,419
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,419 |
That certainly looked intentional enough to warrant a warning ..... and maybe even being thrown out of the game, being as it was the 2nd in a row.
The guy didn't just suddenly and completely lose his control, only to come back with a perfect pitch on the next pitch. It was a dirty play, and if the Indians retaliate today, they better not get a warning of any kind.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 13,205
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 13,205 |
I don't have a big problem with a pitcher staking his claim to the inside of the plate - Bob Gibson used to do that at least once a game - but it bugged me that after two questionable pitches there was no warning from the ump. It could have ended right there, but by not acting the ump has set the table for a retaliation today. I don't want to see anyone hit in the face or head, but I wouldn't mind a pitch behind someone just to send a message. The trouble with that is then its our pitcher getting the warning, instead of the one who instigated it.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,027
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,027 |
Quote:
That certainly looked intentional enough to warrant a warning ..... and maybe even being thrown out of the game, being as it was the 2nd in a row.
The guy didn't just suddenly and completely lose his control, only to come back with a perfect pitch on the next pitch. It was a dirty play, and if the Indians retaliate today, they better not get a warning of any kind.
Knowing MLB, there won't be a warning... They'll just toss the pitcher.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 13,358
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 13,358 |
Quote:
much, much too early. that usually happens right around Memorial Day. too many fans are discounting the past 10 games still. today honestly doesn't matter, we'll go and win the weekend series with Detroit to convince most fans that this team may have something real. then, go and do okay until that game comes right before the end of May and THEN comes our tailspin.
NLR pretty much nailed it.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,850
Legend
|
|
OP
Legend
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,850 |
Quote:
Quote:
much, much too early. that usually happens right around Memorial Day. too many fans are discounting the past 10 games still. today honestly doesn't matter, we'll go and win the weekend series with Detroit to convince most fans that this team may have something real. then, go and do okay until that game comes right before the end of May and THEN comes our tailspin.
NLR pretty much nailed it.
ah, but which game was it? the Perez game + DL trip? or the series on a whole (easily could have been 3-1 Tribe, instead 3-1 Boston)
also, I sort of cheated in that I looked up our end of May / early June schedule ahead of posting that note.
A/H split - Cinci
Tampa
@NYY
@Detroit
@Texas
Washington
all above .500. all with some good SPs. most with good hitting to go along with it. if we go 9-10 over these 19 games (9-9 over the remaining 18), then I'll be mighty impressed and we'll be ready to contend for one of the wild card spots.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,367
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,367 |
Quote:
Quote:
You all brought up the Reds in this thread, when our teams play each other it's all fair game. You were the ones that were too thin skinned to take any ribbing in the past, which is the only reason I give the Indian fans some crap when they venture into the Reds thread.
I haven't gloated in this thread, what is there to gloat about? I was simply giving my opinion on the comments about Chapman made by some posters. But, you have never let the facts get in the way when making an argument. So yes, there is some crap here, but as usual, it's coming from you.
Blah blah blah ,some things never change. Jules gets to decide for everybody what is fair game, and what isn't. So Tribe fans "should go back to Tribeville" when she doesn't want them posting in her thread, but its all fair game when Jules decides it is. I didn't see anybody come over to The Reds thread to complain about Chapman, yet you had to troll your behind over here to call us whiners for not liking one of our best players having their head thrown at.
Haha, you are so full of it. Indians fans post in the Reds thread, it's only when someone starts with smack that I give them grief. Which is in strict retaliation to folks like you who can dish it out but, can't take it. You and the truth seem to often have a disconnect. I was discussing the topic at hand until you came on in typical attack mode. If I said the sky was blue, you would argue it. We all know what you think of me, let's just give it a rest. It's become tired, worn out, and boring.
And then we get this little gem:
Quote:
Hopefully Brandon Phillips loses some teeth today.
Nice.
You will get your wish though, once again, I'll stay away from your exclusive thread. It's funny that you still don't get why I do that in the Reds threads....here it is right under your nose. 
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 871
All Pro
|
|
All Pro
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 871 |
Quote:
Quote:
.
And no I wouldn't defend Perez. There's no call for that crap. Would you still defend Chapman if one of those pitches knocked Swisher unconcious?
Come on man, no Reds player can do anything wrong. I mean he couldn't possibly be wrong for doing it, we are all just upset and whining because we lost, obviously.
KING
Heard Dusty Baker on the radio today and he pretty much said the same thing.
"My opinions and feelings are mine and shall not be influenced by anyone....especially liberals."
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349 |
That's how the game goes, you go after one of ours, we go after one of yours. If it was to happen the Reds would have nobody to blame but themselves.
KING
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 305
1st String
|
|
1st String
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 305 |
Quote:
At least the Indian's players aren't as reactionary as some of their fans.
Hogwash...They get paid handsomely to keep their cool with reporters, and they are quoting a couple of class vets here. Chap threw at him...twice, the first one was the only one that was wild it was meant for the head. Then showing a ton of remorse for nearly decking a guy in the head (supposed on accident) chased him back to the dugout giving him an ear full....
Throwing at people (not throwing inside that should no even be questioned) is part of the game always has been one of the great things about a great sport, but at the head is off limits...that is a fact among these guys, you don't throw at the head. There will be a retaliation. Don't expect it tonight, but it will happen at some point. My guess is game 4 in Cleveland and it will be form a bullpen guy.
My question is did I miss something, I only watched the last couple of innings yesterday. Did indian pitchers hit somebody earlier?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 27,310
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 27,310 |
I just don't see what the big fuss is about a little chin music  It's been a part of baseball since i was a young'in 
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,419
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,419 |
Man, we are on the skids big time right now. We are losing games we shouldn't ..... and guys who have been reliable are getting blown up one at a time. Tonight was Shaw's turn.
We had a bad losing streak early on, then we went on a major winning run, and now we have lost 8 of our last 9. (IIRC) Many of those games have been put out of reach, or lost, by an implosion in the bullpen. That was the strength of this team. We need to get that turned around ASAP.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 8,427
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 8,427 |
Yeah, the way they've been playing these past few games have been downright disgusting and need to be corrected. I mean I can accept that people will get injured and you might be without them and that teams go through rough patches or whatever. That is part of the game. But to have bullpen meltdowns such as these when you're getting decent starts from pitchers is unacceptable. A couple of questions I'm beginning to ask myself are the following: 1) Why is Nick Hagadone in the majors? 2) Were pitchers pitching better with Gomes behind the dish? How much of a difference does he make vs Santana behind there calling the game? Did he play a role in the losing skid?
Find what you love and let it kill you.
-Charles Bukowski
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 2,387
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 2,387 |
The wheels are coming off and we're leaking oil BIG TIME! Yup this is the kinda Cleveland meltdown that us fans are accustomed to. It was going to happen sooner or later it always does. We can all try to break it down and come up with excuses as to why it happens...2 words for ya...it's Cleveland!!!
Congratulations to our 2016 NBA Champion CLEVELAND CAVALIERS!!! Greatest comeback in sports history... Hail to the King!
The great QB guru and the Moneyball group: 1-15
Record of Criminal Haslam owned Browns: 20-60 (0.250)
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 27,310
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 27,310 |
Every team goes through it's ups and downs with a 162 game schedule it's best to keep an even keil about things
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,850
Legend
|
|
OP
Legend
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,850 |
this is why we got Francona. hopefully, he can calm everybody down and we can start winning some of these games again.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 2,341
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 2,341 |
Well..... Let's see what happens tonight. Masterson gave up a cheapy to Votto, but Reynolds just crushed one. We need to string some runs together. We should be killing Arroyo..... 
#gmstrong.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 413
1st String
|
|
1st String
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 413 |
Well thats one way to kill a potential big inning... bonehead baserunning
|
|
|
DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum Tribe Continued
|
|
