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Yikes. He's worse than I thought haha
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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Unless of course we make some sort of trade. But with the trade rules, we'd need to give up salary too. For Love, we'd need to give up something like 10m in salaries to make it work. That means Andy has to go, plus either Miles or Gee (assuming we don't want to trade a recent draft pick). I think it'd cost us #1, Andy and Gee, and maybe a future pick for Love.
Don't the Cavs have a ton of cap room? They could pretty much absorb any players salary without having to match it.
Ya know, I forgot about trade exceptions. That does give more flexibility. My bad.
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Legend
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Ya know, I forgot about trade exceptions. That does give more flexibility. My bad.
As far as I remember ... our trade exceptions are all expired. It doesn't matter anyway, as we have $20 million in cap room. We can trade for $20M worth of contracts and don't have to match salaries on any of it.
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Quote:
Good news:
Win the #1 pick this year.
Bad news:
Likely won't win the #1 pick next year.
I'd rather be playing for a championship than a #1 pick.
It's supposed to be hard! If it wasn't hard, everyone would do it. The hard... is what makes it great!
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Legend
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If you get Wiggins you are a championship contender within three years.
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Legend
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Just wanted to say this; if Kevin Love is available you trade anything besides Kyrie Irving to get him. He does only have two years left on his contract.
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Legend
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Just wanted to say this; if Kevin Love is available you trade anything besides Kyrie Irving to get him. He does only have two years left on his contract.
Would 100% be all for trading that pick and other assets for Love. Could we somehow get an extension with it? Can you do that with 2 years left? I don't even know.
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I don't know. I see Noel as topping out as a Dikembe Matumbo
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The Wolves are coming out and saying that Love is not going to be traded. I don't believe them one bit. I think the Cavs at the very least could make them really sweat out a deal like the one they could put together.
I really want to see what kind of magic Chris Grant can put together over the next few months.
I do like that Dan Gilbert's whole theme of the lottery last night, and leading up to it, was that he and everyone else are tired of being there.
People can say whatever they want about the guy, and some of it is probably warranted, and some not, but I know that guy is going to put his money where his mouth is when that time comes.
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If the Cavs sign Oden does that preclude them from drafting Noel. I say no.
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j/c
I say let someone else have Noel. I think he's to much of a risk to take # 1. I'd see if one of the other top 5 teams in the draft wants the pick then select between Porter, McLemore, Len.
#gmstrong
Live, Love, Laugh
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Browns fans think we should trade down with that top pick, but if you trade down with one of the later round picks, it's the end of the world, and everyone should be fired.
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Dallas wants out of the 1st round to have more cap space to go after Dwight. Also, Marion is on their books for $9.3mil next year (last year of contract) and will be 36yo.
I would love to help out the Mavs:
#13 + Marion ($9.3mil - 1yr) for #31,33, Sacramento Pick (and all the cap space)
We get the best 2 players in the deal, but it works for Dallas because they can stash those 2nd rounders in Europe without a cap hit (1st rounders carry a cap hit regardless) or they can get cheaper useful players there to fill out their roster (Franklin, Green, etc.). All while going after a Dwight/Dirk frontcourt monster.
At that point, we could turn around and shop #13+19 to get back into the top10 for Shabazz (and draft Noel #1 --- scoring SF in Shabazz, defensive in Marion + defensive center and lots of assets to try to trade for a veteran)
#gmstrong
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Legend
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Under ordinary circumstances, I would agree with your comparison. However, just as the NFL draft was rather flat, so is this NBA draft. Both have a handful of really good players ..... then a whole bunch of guys who are pretty good ..... but there's not a ton of separation between say 10 and 20 like there normally would be.
I really don't see us being capable of grabbing Love .... but maybe we could trade back up for Porter after drafting Noel 1st overall.
Now bear with me here. We own a 1st round pick from the Kings ..... someday. Maybe. (From the JJ Hickson trade) Let's say that Porter falls to 7 where the Kings pick. We call up the Kings and say "Look, we'd really like to make an offer that could help us both out. You give us the 7th pick, and we'll return the future pick you owe us, and we'll send you picks 19, 31, and 32, I think that they would, at least, listen. The Kings need lots of pieces, and they could add a lot of pieces in a hurry with a deal like that. Would there be a drop-off from 7 to 19? Of course. Is it as huge a drop as in previous seasons? I don't think so. They might say no. Then again, they might just decide that it makes sense to infuse the team with a lot of young talent they can sell to the city of Sacramento, now that the team is staying put. They need a lot of help, and new bodies They have a couple of nice pieces, but man they still do have a lot of gaping holes.
Hell, last year we managed to trade up to 17 from 24 for that 24th pick, plus 33 and 34. I think that this year is weaker, but flatter. OKC at 12 might be a possible target as well, if a player we like drops. Maybe Dallas at 13. They might like a few non-guaranteed contracts. I really think that there are possibilities in this draft .... and I suspect that Grant will work them all really hard.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Legend
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Can one of you guys explain how the pick we got from Memphis works?
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Quote:
Can one of you guys explain how the pick we got from Memphis works?
In 2015 or 2016, if the Grizzlies' first-rounder falls between picks 6-14, the pick goes to the Cavs. Starting in 2017, if the Grizzlies' pick falls outside the top five, the Cavs then get the selection. In 2019, the pick becomes unprotected.
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Not a chance.  It is protected in varying degrees, until it becomes a 2nd rounder some 50 years into the future. ("slight" exaggeration) 
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Question for the salary cap people:
Can we offer a max deal this year, and then still have a max deal left for next year? I'm not sure how far under we are?
Can we do it if we get rid of Varejao's contract for an expiring in there?
~Lyuokdea
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Legend
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Quote:
Quote:
Can one of you guys explain how the pick we got from Memphis works?
In 2015 or 2016, if the Grizzlies' first-rounder falls between picks 6-14, the pick goes to the Cavs. Starting in 2017, if the Grizzlies' pick falls outside the top five, the Cavs then get the selection. In 2019, the pick becomes unprotected.
Awesome, thanks.
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Who would you want to offer a max deal for this year?
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How did we get the Grizzlies pick? Or are we still talking about the Sacramento pick?
Don't blame the clown for acting like a clown.
Ask yourself why you keep going to the circus.
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Quote:
Question for the salary cap people:
Can we offer a max deal this year, and then still have a max deal left for next year? I'm not sure how far under we are?
Can we do it if we get rid of Varejao's contract for an expiring in there?
Well according to this ... http://www.hoopsworld.com/cleveland-cavaliers-team-salary ... we're in extremely good shape. The salary cap figure is supposed to be $70 million-ish this year, which gives us $28 million to play with THIS year. I don't know all the rules on how much you can offer for a max contract, as it depends on years of service with your current team and number of years total ... but it's usually in the neighborhood of $15-$20M. That gives us plenty of room to sign a guy to a max deal.
That said, we're should have $40 million in cap-space next off-season (provided we don't sign all $28 mil of our cap-space this season) ... which should be PLENTY of room to sign another guy to a max deal. We also have a number of guys that have team options, so if we need to clear further room for some reason, we could do so by not renewing those.
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Quote:
How did we get the Grizzlies pick? Or are we still talking about the Sacramento pick?
Leuer trade I believe
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Who would you want to offer a max deal for this year?
Not sure that I would (Howard/Paul are worth it, but it won't be here).
I think you have to step back if you are the Cavs, and figure who is on the "championship contending team 3 years from now" - those players are - in order:
Irving
Noel
Waiters
Thompson ?
And Thompson becomes a question mark, because he doesn't fit alongside Noel (who I think is the guy you have to take here). We need a PF/C with some offensive capabilities to put alongside Noel. There are some FAs who fit the bill pretty well:
Jefferson/Bynum/Millsap? / Maybe Josh Smith, though he's a SF?
And then you can try to trade Thompson + Varejao for a SF?
Of course, you definitely don't want to disrupt your ability to get a top 5 guy in 2014, so if you can't do that, don't worry about it.
~Lyuokdea
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Legend
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Quote:
How did we get the Grizzlies pick? Or are we still talking about the Sacramento pick?
It was supposed to be a salary cap dump for Memphis ... instead:
"Memphis sent big man Marreese Speights, guards Wayne Ellington and Josh Selby, and a future first-round draft pick to the Cavs for forward Jon Leuer."
I think we worked them slightly in that trade.
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Legend
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Quote:
Who would you want to offer a max deal for this year?
A max? Nobody.
I'm factoring in that I don't think Dwight Howard is realistic even though there have been very very mild rumors of interest (by the Cavs)
I've heard people bring up Tony Allen, and I would LOVE to have him, but not at a max deal.
I would like a signing, but they should only slightly overpay for a guy they really like.
And that's not directed at the thought of getting LBJ in 2014, that's just how it should be done when you're trying to do this in the NBA.
Although last night is another feather in the cap of the guy who thinks LBJ is coming back.
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I would feel bad for whatever team gives Dwight a max deal, except that they should know better.
CP3 is the only FA worth a max deal this year in my opinion, and that's not happening in Cleveland.
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I've heard people bring up Tony Allen, and I would LOVE to have him, but not at a max deal.
They are filming a lot of movies in Cleveland lately. He could probably get a part in one with those acting skills he showed off last night.
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Legend
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Quote:
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I've heard people bring up Tony Allen, and I would LOVE to have him, but not at a max deal.
They are filming a lot of movies in Cleveland lately. He could probably get a part in one with those acting skills he showed off last night.
Yeah I didn't see it but I heard it was Bosh-esque.
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Thanks guys, I forgot about that trade. Quote:
I think you have to step back if you are the Cavs, and figure who is on the "championship contending team 3 years from now" - those players are - in order:
Irving
Noel
Waiters
Thompson ?
Or:
Irving
Waiters
Thompson
Porter
I am not sold that Noel is definitely the way to go.
Don't blame the clown for acting like a clown.
Ask yourself why you keep going to the circus.
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I think that we will pick up a top notch FA in the off season (if one is available and wants to sign with us). I would love a scoring small forward. Who do you guys think that would fit that would be available?
As an aside I would love to keep Speise, Livingston, and Ellington.
Don't blame the clown for acting like a clown.
Ask yourself why you keep going to the circus.
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Quote:
Quote:
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I've heard people bring up Tony Allen, and I would LOVE to have him, but not at a max deal.
They are filming a lot of movies in Cleveland lately. He could probably get a part in one with those acting skills he showed off last night.
Yeah I didn't see it but I heard it was Bosh-esque.
Man, you gotta see it. He was convulsing on the ground with both hands on his head like he was having a seizure.
I'd link it here but the fans start chanting a word that's a no-no here.
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It wasn't quite Bosh-esque. He actually got fouled pretty well, but it was the convulsing and head-grabbing afterwards that made you think you were watching the WWF.
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I'd be very surprised if Noel isn't the pick (barring a trade).
Personally, I don't care if he's worth a #1 or not. Thompson wasn't worth a #4, but I'm not complaining. The NBA Draft is a different animal.
If we get a rim protecting center to pair with Thompson, we're a competent small forward away from competing seriously.
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Does Noel really only weigh 206? Dude will need to pack on 50 pounds minimum if he has any hope of being an effective 5 in the NBA.
Larry Sanders is at 235
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Legend
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Does Noel really only weigh 206? Dude will need to pack on 50 pounds minimum if he has any hope of being an effective 5 in the NBA.
Larry Sanders is at 235
not true. centers were like allstars with a 20.4PER vs. Sanders. however, PFs could only must a 13.9PER (15PER is average).
http://www.82games.com/1213/12MIL13.HTM
Noel would likely be similar.
#gmstrong
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FWIW Noel stated in an interview he was around 220 entering the CBB season.
Through a combination of running some of it off and inactivity over the last few months, he's shed some of that weight.
I think once he is 100% (6-7 months from now) he'll be closer to that 220-25LB mark.
With even average growth he'd hit 230 or so by his 3rd NBA season, which would be plenty of weight given his athleticism and quickness.
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Legend
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by his 3rd NBA season
that is one of my biggest worries with Noel. between his ACL injury, lack of size, and lack of offensive game, we are not likely to redeem rewards from him until that season.
#gmstrong
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by his 3rd NBA season
that is one of my biggest worries with Noel. between his ACL injury, lack of size, and lack of offensive game, we are not likely to redeem rewards from him until that season.
We're talking weight, not production.
He'll still be a very productive player in seasons one and two, he just may not be dominant until year 3.
This is a VERY young team. The Cavs have time on their side.
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I think if your goal is to win NBA championships (and not just to be a team that makes the second round of the playoffs) - then you have to take risks in order to maybe acquire superstars.
Noel is the only guy with super-star potential in this draft.
You are going to build your team around Irving, Noel, and a Max 2014 FA (James, Bosh, Anthony). Waiters is a possible 4th star, but probably not one of the big three in a championship team
You are going to part Thompson and Varejao for another player who fits with those three above.
Noel also gives us a decent chance of being in the lottery next year (especially if we dump Varejao) and improving our team one last time.
~Lyuokdea
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