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It's obvious that the guy doesn't want to be in Cleveland.
I don't know I must be slow or something cause I just don't see this "obvious" thing.
I saw "obvious" after Chud got fired...yes true.
But once we had the where with all to visit him out west - HC, OC, OL coaches - he came right out and stated it would not be so bad to end up in Cleveland.
Is he pursuing every avenue to get a Contract bid thrown his way...sure that is called FA. When I guy says - the Browns better trade me cause I don't want to be there or I won't show up to camp - I'll sign the tender but I'll stomach the year.
Those are obvious things to me.
Stuff his Agent says...pfft - Agents are on an even lower plateau than the Bozos!
In that Window of Post CHUD FIRING and Pre TRIP by Coaches West - He didn't want anything to do with the Browns. He had it.
But time heals. There was a different opening to playing here. That opening can get even wider. We'll see but I don't see this disgruntle - I hate the Browns I don't want anything to do with them (my interpretation of "obvious") - please show me where I missed something?
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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Just a general statement, not to you.
In my view, there may come a point where the Browns rescind their application of the transitional tag on him and allow him to become a free agent. It's obvious that the guy doesn't want to be in Cleveland. Personally, if I'm the Browns front office, I would calculate the day on the calendar where it would be most disadvantageous to him and circle it. If he hasn't signed the $10 million offer by that date, I would rescind the offer and make him a free agent.
Can't get emotional about it. It's a business, he'll be highly motivated to play well if he's on a one year deal.
I'm not really emotional about it. I wouldn't have given him the tag anyway, but how long should the Browns hold onto that rope? I'd let it go at the most beneficial time for the Browns (which means the most disadvantageous time for him) and move on.
The team could use the $10 million in cap space to keep other players here longer. He's a freaking CENTER. Oh, I know, he's a Pro Bowl player. And in his entire tenure for the Browns, the team has won either 4 or 5 games. If he doesn't want to be here, it's time to move on - but to do so at the time that it's most advantageous for the team.
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I think Chud was a mistake and I think Haslam was a man over reacting and who got the wrong INTEL he acted rashly and cause the most damage.
We'll never know. They embarked on last season with the "STATED" goal of building for the long term. I can't even remember how many times they made that kinda comment.
But, the actions they have taken since the end of the year tell a different story.
How they will work out in the end, hell if I know.
They told us one thing and did something else. Now, at first I thought, they lied to us, but time and a cooler head tells me that maybe not. Maybe upon review, Haslam looked at it and decided he simply made a bunch of mistakes and decided to correct them.
I can understand that. As for if he was right, on that, we'll just have to wait and see.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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If Mack signs elsewhere, I can't imagine the deal being more than one year.
If you want out of Cleveland so badly, why run the risk of getting stuck there long-term?
I bet we have him for another year.
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I don't know I must be slow or something cause I just don't see this "obvious" thing.
Would you say that his comments can't be interpreted to mean something? How about those of his agent (who speaks for his clients)?
Mack doesn't want to be on the Browns. I have quite a funny feeling that he'll be on the Browns next season because teams won't make him an offer that he wants and that the Browns won't rescind the offer until such time as his signature on the contract is sent back to them.
In such a case, I wouldn't keep him on the roster past this season. He wouldn't get a long-term offer and I might move him to one of the guard spots while drafting his replacement.
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I don't see that as the case at all. I've seen absolutely nothing that suggests he doesn't want to be here.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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I don't know I must be slow or something cause I just don't see this "obvious" thing.
Would you say that his comments can't be interpreted to mean something? How about those of his agent (who speaks for his clients)?
.
Not even remotely.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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agreed, seems all of the supposed negative comments are coming from his agent and lets be honest they are going to say whatever they can to try and get the most money. I don't trust agents and what they say as 'representing their client'
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I don't see that as the case at all. I've seen absolutely nothing that suggests he doesn't want to be here.
Really?
La Canfora was just on 92.3 and said that Mack and his camp have been quite clear lately that he wants out of Cleveland.
He also made a pretty good point - if Mack doesn't sign elsewhere, he probably won't be in TC, as it's unlikely that he signs off on his tag until he absolutely has to.
I think it's pretty evident that he wants out, though he's handling it intelligently and with class.
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I don't see that as the case at all. I've seen absolutely nothing that suggests he doesn't want to be here.
prp...EXACTLY...until I hear it from Mack...until I hear Mack say, I DON'T WANT TO BE IN CLEVELAND... the comments from his agent, the media and from the fans...nothing more than unfounded hype and speculation.
Home of the Free, Because of the Brave...
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I don't see that as the case at all. I've seen absolutely nothing that suggests he doesn't want to be here.
prp...EXACTLY...until I hear it from Mack...until I hear Mack say, I DON'T WANT TO BE IN CLEVELAND... the comments from his agent, the media and from the fans...nothing more than unfounded hype and speculation.
Even if it's true, you'll never hear it.. He's a gentleman and way more savvy then to burn bridges.. He's smarter than to ever admit that.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Something else to consider:
The only time we really heard anything resembling Mack wanting out was right after Chud & co. were fired. Even then, it was only rumor and speculation- NOT a direct quote from Mack himself.
That was 2 months ago. Much has changed at 76 Groza since then.
IF he stays this season and likes the new culture/coaches/FO, there's every opportunity to re-do his contract long-term. A lucrative contract on a team showing upside might be the long-term outcome of all this.
At this point, I'd not presume ANYTHING regarding Mack's desrie to stay or go....
.02
"too many notes, not enough music-"
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Not sure it was very intelligently to tell every Brownsfan that he'd give us teh right to match. He's exactly in the spot he'd like to be, if he didn't lie through his teeth, which he did.
If he wants out that badly, I'd rather appreciate saying so and not act as if he'd consider staying.
That said, a thought crossed my mouth on this matter:
Let's pretend all those reports/rumors are true that DQ, Ward, Mack wanted out, no matter how nice the new FO or coaching staff. Where does the finger point here? Where's the mistrust?
Is it possible that the locker room has ZERO trust in their new owner after this offseason? They get to meet him and know him a bit, so what if Haslam is our no1 problem here?
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
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Let's pretend all those reports/rumors are true ...
OK, fair enough. Now take the opposite side of your supposition: If after "The Purge", they, for the most part, want to remain in Cleveland, what does that say about Haslam, about the old FO? You're up...
Last edited by bbrowns32; 03/14/14 02:17 PM.
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers...Socrates
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...well, there's little to no indication for that, is there?
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
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...well, there's little to no indication for that, is there?
I would suggest that it is 50/50.
- Mack may/may not want to stay
- DQ likely wanted to stay, but itwas not his choice
- Ward, depends on what reports you want to listen to...
Tag! You're it...
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers...Socrates
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Not sure it was very intelligently to tell every Brownsfan that he'd give us teh right to match. He's exactly in the spot he'd like to be, if he didn't lie through his teeth, which he did.
The situation changed a lot when the whole coaching staff was fired again.
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Not sure it was very intelligently to tell every Brownsfan that he'd give us teh right to match. He's exactly in the spot he'd like to be, if he didn't lie through his teeth, which he did.
The situation changed a lot when the whole coaching staff was fired again.
I thought Mack said that AFTER the coaches were fired... you sure about the timing? I wouldn't hold Mack to anything he said before the purge but I really don't think he said it before...
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edit. not directed at you Django.
jc
Maybe Ward, Mack, DQ just wanted to play some years on teams that might consistently make the playoffs? What if they just figured even if Pettine and staff were great, and getting rid of Banner/Lombardi was an awesome move, but still felt like the team was 3 years away in a tough division? Players know they'll only play so long.
then since we had holes we sign player for more since we're Cleveland, but at the same time they are a bit older.....not as wanted maybe? Anyway, I'm stoked with Whitner and Dansby. I hope DQ and Ward well. I hope Mack stays and it turns out we are only 1 year away from contention.
Last edited by AkBrownsfan; 03/14/14 03:03 PM.
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Mack's agent would be terrible if he wasn't hinting that Mack wanted to leave Cleveland -- you don't get a team to sign you to a contract if that team thinks they are just being used as a pawn in order to negotiate with the Browns.
~Lyuokdea
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I hear you and agree. We keep Mack almost without a doubt. Regardless of how he likes/dislikes it. I think his agent is doing what they are paid to do.
I hope he finds himself liking things, that we are actually moving in the right direction, and he buys in. time will tell.
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I still think if any of these guys are still availible in the 3rd round we draft one.
1. Bryan Stork Flor. St. 6-4 300
2. Weston Richburg Color. St. 6-1 300
3. Travis Swanson Arkansas 6-5 315
4. Marcus Martin USC 6-3 310
I do like Strok & Swanson they both have a mean streak to them, Richburg to me is more athletic and Martin is pretty raw but can play guard also.
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Quote:
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I don't see that as the case at all. I've seen absolutely nothing that suggests he doesn't want to be here.
Really?
La Canfora was just on 92.3 and said that Mack and his camp have been quite clear lately that he wants out of Cleveland.
He also made a pretty good point - if Mack doesn't sign elsewhere, he probably won't be in TC, as it's unlikely that he signs off on his tag until he absolutely has to.
I think it's pretty evident that he wants out, though he's handling it intelligently and with class.
I disagree with LaCanfora. I've heard NOTHING that makes it clear - in any way - that he wants out.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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What about Mack's agent saying he thinks he can get a deal that the Browns can't/won't match?
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What about Mack's agent saying he thinks he can get a deal that the Browns can't/won't match?
A desperate cry in the wilderness trying to get someone to call him?
... eh... agent speak. it's what they do, that and eat children
#gmstrong
A smart person knows what to say.
A wise person knows whether or not to say it.
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What about Mack's agent saying he thinks he can get a deal that the Browns can't/won't match?
A desperate cry in the wilderness trying to get someone to call him?
^^ That right there.
If he doesn't get the other 31 GM's thinking that it MIGHT be worth a team's time to at least speak to him, then NOBODY is going to even give him the time of day.
As long as those GM's believe that we can and will match anything they would put down, nobody is going to waste their time. Period. Nobody will even make an offer because the moment they do and it is signed, that is cap money frozen until we either match or declare we aren't going to.
With other shopping to still be done, NOBODY - except perhaps Oakland - is going to risk freezing up that much cap space just to test us.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Makes perfect sense. There are still many FAs available that teams are trying to sign and there simply isn't time right now for a team to take a flier on constructing a complex deal to somehow steal Mack away. Mack's only chance is that if after this initial FA signing frenzy is over that at least a few teams have both the cap space and desire to sign a highly paid Center knowing that we certainly will be able to match it if we want to.
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I've thought that it was pretty obvious he didn't want to return when he said he would not negotiate during the season. If he wanted to stay he had nothing to gain and everything to lose by waiting until the offseason. It's not as if his play this past year was going to make him appear any more valuable than they already knew he was.
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I think the closer a player gets to the end of his contract the less likely they will be to resign with that team before their contract ends. Negotiating during the final season of a contract is just way too distracting and every week the player is getting closer to hitting the free market... why not just wait then? Risk of injury is real but I don't think it's nearly as big of a concern to the player as some make it out to be... especially a guy like Mack who just doesn't miss games. That's why it is so critical to get the deal done the year before.
Personally, I think Mack wanted to be here with the Browns but couldn't get a deal he liked out of Banner so he suspended negotiations once the season started (pretty standard move at that point). Then Chud got the axe and he decided he wanted to go but didn't want to say that straight out so he kept saying he'd allow the Browns to match. Well, Farmer called him on it by placing the Transition Tag and now Mack is kind of stuck...
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What about Mack's agent saying he thinks he can get a deal that the Browns can't/won't match?
A desperate cry in the wilderness trying to get someone to call him?
… eh... agent speak. it's what they do, that and eat children
And apparently play hockey
Don't blame the clown for acting like a clown.
Ask yourself why you keep going to the circus.
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I ain't going to start listening to Bozos now...lol 
La Canfora was just on 92.3 and said
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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j/c
my two cents:
I plan for the future to protect the now. How long does Mack have to sign the his tag, can he hold out into OTA's, training camp, pre-season.... At some point his actions will affect the browns preparing for the next season, if he doesn't sign.
If he does sign, then what about next year. The soap opera starts all over again?? I think we have to draft the next guy now, hope he can play guard as well. At worst we upgrade the guard position, and that is way better then getting caught unprepaired. Best case scenario is we have our center for the next five years and find an upgrade at guard.
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Mack may be wanting out,, that's up for discussion of course.
But I don't think anyone will offer him 15 mill a year so that probably isn't a point of contention.
The frustrating part for me is that nothing appears to be happening which fuels a ton of speculation. The truth is, a deal like this isn't as easy as it may appear.
I don't think anyone wants to pay him outrageous money and then tie that money up for 5 days while the Browns decide if they should match it or not..
Others have said this and I wonder as well, is anyone going to offer anything knowing the Browns have the money to match..
Has he talked to teams or not? We don't know. As I said some days ago, once we tagged him, he may not want to be interviewed. He may be happy to take our 10 mil and revisit this party next year.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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I will be honest, he aint that good lol. He is slightly above average but he there is no special to Mack. If he doesnt want to be hear, dont let the door hit ya in the ass on the way out Mr. Mack.
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Quote:
Quote:
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What about Mack's agent saying he thinks he can get a deal that the Browns can't/won't match?
A desperate cry in the wilderness trying to get someone to call him?
… eh... agent speak. it's what they do, that and eat children
And apparently play hockey
Let's get off that. People have lives.
The problem that guy has is his phone was even turned on. People need to learn how to turn those things off a few hours a day.....or, just don't answer.
Just because my phone rings doesn't mean I am obligated to answer the damn thing. As my message says, "I'll get back as soon as possible"....and I usually do.
I think people have become slaves to their phones. I lost mine 2-3 months ago....I might replace it this weeklend....but maybe not anytime soon.....I like the fact it isn't ringing.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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He doesn't want to be here....well there's the door.The Browns should let him walk.Does no good to have players with that kind if attitude,when a lot of the guys are excited about the future of this team.
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J/C
If he DOES want to be here, why hasnt he signed his 10 million dollar tag?
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Quote:
What about Mack's agent saying he thinks he can get a deal that the Browns can't/won't match?
What is it you expect him to say... "I can't get a deal that the Browns won't match" LOL
Of course he's gonna say that.
I am VERY sure he can get a deal that the browns DON'T WANT to match, but there isn't a deal that can't match..
Dumb comment by an agent... really dumb.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Dumb comment by an agent... really dumb.
Do you know who Marvin Demoff is?
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DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Alex Mack Transition Tag in FA
Part 2
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