|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 1,185
Dawg Talker
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 1,185 |
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
You can not be a still target in todays game.
Aaron Donald a DT put down a 4.65 forty. Clowney a crazy 4.53.
If you are not fast you have to be at least be elusive. You have to be able to sense the rush. Move up, slide, pump fake, something to extend the play.
Mettenberger is coming off a torn ACL. Not good for a guy who was already slow footed. He is a tough kid and has a major arm. But he has not yet demonstrated the abilities to compensate for his lack of mobility.
I respect Jaworski but there is way that I see Mettenberger as the second best QB in this draft.
"Mettenberger is coming off a torn ACL. Not good for a guy who was already slow footed. He is a tough kid and has a major arm. But he has not yet demonstrated the abilities to compensate for his lack of mobility."
Huh. I find it interesting that people are clamoring for Hoyer to be the starter when you can say the exact same thing about him that you said about Mettenberger, aside from having a major arm.
+1 Who do you think is going to take more hits in the NFL? Manziel or Mettenberger?
Tough to say. Mettenberger will take his hits in the pocket while Manziel will take them outside of it. What do you think?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 1,185
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 1,185 |
Quote:
Hoyer is not like Mettenberger.
He is a much smaller guy with mobility and experience in the league even though he has not played much.
Mettenberger is coming out of college with a torn ACL and zero pro experience.
I am not getting the comparison.
Both are coming off of torn ACLs, neither is mobile (Hoyer isn't mobile at all like you claim), and Hoyer has little NFL experience while Mettenberger has no NFL experience. How do you not get the comparison?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 16,188
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 16,188 |
Simple. Hoyer has been in the NFL since 2009. Although he has not played he has gained experience with multiple offenses.
He has way more mobility than Mettenberger, and often throws of the run.
Physical size completely different. The way they play completely different.
Where is the similarity outside of coming of a torn ACL?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 36
Rookie
|
|
Rookie
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 36 |
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
You can not be a still target in todays game.
Aaron Donald a DT put down a 4.65 forty. Clowney a crazy 4.53.
If you are not fast you have to be at least be elusive. You have to be able to sense the rush. Move up, slide, pump fake, something to extend the play.
Mettenberger is coming off a torn ACL. Not good for a guy who was already slow footed. He is a tough kid and has a major arm. But he has not yet demonstrated the abilities to compensate for his lack of mobility.
I respect Jaworski but there is way that I see Mettenberger as the second best QB in this draft.
"Mettenberger is coming off a torn ACL. Not good for a guy who was already slow footed. He is a tough kid and has a major arm. But he has not yet demonstrated the abilities to compensate for his lack of mobility."
Huh. I find it interesting that people are clamoring for Hoyer to be the starter when you can say the exact same thing about him that you said about Mettenberger, aside from having a major arm.
+1 Who do you think is going to take more hits in the NFL? Manziel or Mettenberger?
Tough to say. Mettenberger will take his hits in the pocket while Manziel will take them outside of it. What do you think?
300+ linemen (Offensive and Defensive) are hard on knees whether locked or not. Most ACL injuries are from side impact or force. I just don't relish the idea of banking too much on a QB improvising. I want quick read and get the ball out of the QB's hands. I'm afraid if we draft Manziel, the whole offense will be built around him and one downfield hit puts a less mobile QB on the field and there goes the game plan.
The last three years I was never yelling "run with the ball!"...it was always "Throw the &%$@ ball".
I vow to smack everyone who says the importance of the running back is diminished in the NFL today.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 742
All Pro
|
|
All Pro
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 742 |
JC
If our Front Office is not compelled by this QB Class, I would strongly support trading pick #26 to set ourselves up for 2015.
We could probably get a 2015 1st rounder and a decent pick in this draft. (Brady Quinn and Dallas)
The Franchise QB has to be the focus. If he's in this draft, take him at #4. If not, we have to position ourselves for the next one.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,027
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,027 |
Quote:
Simple. Hoyer has been in the NFL since 2009. Although he has not played he has gained experience with multiple offenses.
He has way more mobility than Mettenberger, and often throws of the run.
Physical size completely different. The way they play completely different.
Where is the similarity outside of coming of a torn ACL?
I think there is value in Hoyer having experience with the day-to-day operation of being an NFL quarterback. Preparing for opponents every week, probably scout-team work. That's why I believe he is probably our opening day starter, despite what we do. Maybe one of these guys gets drafted and just blows away Hoyer, but that's quite the uphill climb, especially with the draft being even later in the year this time around. You get drafted and are 2 months from actual training camp, not even counting all the offseason programs.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499 |
What makes you think Mettenberger gets rid of the ball quick? Serious question.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 6,331
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 6,331 |
Quote:
300+ linemen (Offensive and Defensive) are hard on knees whether locked or not. Most ACL injuries are from side impact or force. I just don't relish the idea of banking too much on a QB improvising. I want quick read and get the ball out of the QB's hands. I'm afraid if we draft Manziel, the whole offense will be built around him and one downfield hit puts a less mobile QB on the field and there goes the game plan.
The last three years I was never yelling "run with the ball!"...it was always "Throw the &%$@ ball".
For two of them we had Brandon Weeden, running it wasn't really an option, lol
UCONN HUSKIES 2014 Champions of Basketball
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 919
All Pro
|
|
All Pro
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 919 |
j/c Watch out for Lombardi and Belichick: Because everyone assumes Belichick is always a step ahead of the pack, theories are all over the board on the coach’s intentions. Among them: 1. Tom Brady is 37 and backup Ryan Mallett is entering the last year of his contract, so Belichick is scouting a future heir to Brady. 2. Belichick is doing his due diligence to gauge trade value in case the top passers fall to the Patriots’ spot at No. 29 and another team comes calling. If Belichick does make a play for a falling quarterback in the first round, the Mike Lombardi factor comes into play. When the Browns fired their former GM, they allowed him to immediately join the Patriots. (Remember the image of Lombardi carrying a Browns notebook while working for Belichick at the NFL Combine?) Standard practice would be to block a fired executive from joining another team until after the draft so as to protect the team’s draft intelligence from being shared. The Browns own the fourth and 26th picks in the first round; the Patriots the 29th. Suppose that Lombardi knows of Farmer’s fondness for a particular quarterback. Suppose Belichick takes a liking to the same quarterback. Lombardi’s knowledge of Farmer’s thinking could prompt Belichick to trade in front of the Browns’ pick at No. 26 to take a player the Browns wanted. It could happen in any round, really. But news of the Patriots’ sudden interest in the top quarterbacks makes it something to watch for on May 8. http://espncleveland.com/common/more.php?m=49&post_id=30431
GO BROWNS!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 42,855
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 42,855 |
Quote:
If Belichick does make a play for a falling quarterback in the first round, the Mike Lombardi factor comes into play.
That would be terrific for the rest of the league if Belicheck took Lombardi's advice.. Unless you are thinking that if Lombardi says take player A and Belichick says.. OK,, we go with player B... 
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 28,165
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 28,165 |
Quote:
j/c
Watch out for Lombardi and Belichick:
Because everyone assumes Belichick is always a step ahead of the pack, theories are all over the board on the coach’s intentions. Among them:
1. Tom Brady is 37 and backup Ryan Mallett is entering the last year of his contract, so Belichick is scouting a future heir to Brady.
2. Belichick is doing his due diligence to gauge trade value in case the top passers fall to the Patriots’ spot at No. 29 and another team comes calling.
If Belichick does make a play for a falling quarterback in the first round, the Mike Lombardi factor comes into play.
When the Browns fired their former GM, they allowed him to immediately join the Patriots. (Remember the image of Lombardi carrying a Browns notebook while working for Belichick at the NFL Combine?) Standard practice would be to block a fired executive from joining another team until after the draft so as to protect the team’s draft intelligence from being shared.
The Browns own the fourth and 26th picks in the first round; the Patriots the 29th. Suppose that Lombardi knows of Farmer’s fondness for a particular quarterback. Suppose Belichick takes a liking to the same quarterback. Lombardi’s knowledge of Farmer’s thinking could prompt Belichick to trade in front of the Browns’ pick at No. 26 to take a player the Browns wanted.
It could happen in any round, really. But news of the Patriots’ sudden interest in the top quarterbacks makes it something to watch for on May 8.
http://espncleveland.com/common/more.php?m=49&post_id=30431
Tony Grossi throwing crap against a wall to see what sticks? That is SO unlike him.......
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 36
Rookie
|
|
Rookie
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 36 |
Quote:
What makes you think Mettenberger gets rid of the ball quick? Serious question.
"Seriously?" answer. Not sure if you're questioning Mettenberg's decision making velocity, or questioning who gets the ball out quicker...a pocket passer or the scrambler.
I'm not arguing the Mettenberger specifically is the best...my point is we need someone who can make quick decisions. I don't want to see a lot of sand lot style improvised play on Sunday. Don't want to see every game carried by one player.
Mettenberger impressed me (and lots of analysts) with his quick decision making and arm strength. Not talking about is ball release.
I will concede Weeden, McCoy, Quinn, etc. appeared to have reasonably quick decisions in college. Just didn't translate to the NFL. Clearly no way to predict that.
I vow to smack everyone who says the importance of the running back is diminished in the NFL today.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,418
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,418 |
I could see the Patriots looking at a QB in this draft, especially if a guy drops in the 1st round, and for some of the reasons Grossi outlined.
They only control Mallett for one more year, and unless they are willing to guarantee him that Brady is going to retire in a year or 2, there is no way he's coming back. On the other hand, Brady is 37. It is unlikely that he is going to play much past 40. If a top QB drops to the Pats at 29, they could easily snap him up and let him sit behind Brady for a few years, then take over.
I think that part is perfectly reasonable, and quite possible.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 28,165
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 28,165 |
My guess is that they have talked to Brady and have an idea of how many more years he intends to play.
If it is more than a couple, I could see them trying to trade Mallet and then drafting another late-round developmental guy (or two) to sit behind Brady while at the same time giving them another future pick - something the Patriots are really good at stockpiling.... basically, try to snooker someone like they did with Matt Cassel.
If they feel he is only aboard for a couple of more years, however, then I could very well see them investing in QB during the first round (and still trying to trade Mallett afterward)..
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,418
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,418 |
They had a perfect storm with Cassel. They had him coming off a year where he looked like another Tim Brady, and they got a nice price for him. I doubt that they get a similar price for an untested Mallett.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 6,370
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 6,370 |
Quote:
Quote:
j/c
Watch out for Lombardi and Belichick:
Because everyone assumes Belichick is always a step ahead of the pack, theories are all over the board on the coach’s intentions. Among them:
1. Tom Brady is 37 and backup Ryan Mallett is entering the last year of his contract, so Belichick is scouting a future heir to Brady.
2. Belichick is doing his due diligence to gauge trade value in case the top passers fall to the Patriots’ spot at No. 29 and another team comes calling.
If Belichick does make a play for a falling quarterback in the first round, the Mike Lombardi factor comes into play.
When the Browns fired their former GM, they allowed him to immediately join the Patriots. (Remember the image of Lombardi carrying a Browns notebook while working for Belichick at the NFL Combine?) Standard practice would be to block a fired executive from joining another team until after the draft so as to protect the team’s draft intelligence from being shared.
The Browns own the fourth and 26th picks in the first round; the Patriots the 29th. Suppose that Lombardi knows of Farmer’s fondness for a particular quarterback. Suppose Belichick takes a liking to the same quarterback. Lombardi’s knowledge of Farmer’s thinking could prompt Belichick to trade in front of the Browns’ pick at No. 26 to take a player the Browns wanted.
It could happen in any round, really. But news of the Patriots’ sudden interest in the top quarterbacks makes it something to watch for on May 8.
http://espncleveland.com/common/more.php?m=49&post_id=30431
Tony Grossi throwing crap against a wall to see what sticks? That is SO unlike him.......
You forgot the purple font, Prpl.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499 |
Quote:
j/c
Watch out for Lombardi and Belichick:
Because everyone assumes Belichick is always a step ahead of the pack, theories are all over the board on the coach’s intentions. Among them:
1. Tom Brady is 37 and backup Ryan Mallett is entering the last year of his contract, so Belichick is scouting a future heir to Brady.
2. Belichick is doing his due diligence to gauge trade value in case the top passers fall to the Patriots’ spot at No. 29 and another team comes calling.
If Belichick does make a play for a falling quarterback in the first round, the Mike Lombardi factor comes into play.
When the Browns fired their former GM, they allowed him to immediately join the Patriots. (Remember the image of Lombardi carrying a Browns notebook while working for Belichick at the NFL Combine?) Standard practice would be to block a fired executive from joining another team until after the draft so as to protect the team’s draft intelligence from being shared.
The Browns own the fourth and 26th picks in the first round; the Patriots the 29th. Suppose that Lombardi knows of Farmer’s fondness for a particular quarterback. Suppose Belichick takes a liking to the same quarterback. Lombardi’s knowledge of Farmer’s thinking could prompt Belichick to trade in front of the Browns’ pick at No. 26 to take a player the Browns wanted.
It could happen in any round, really. But news of the Patriots’ sudden interest in the top quarterbacks makes it something to watch for on May 8.
http://espncleveland.com/common/more.php?m=49&post_id=30431
Some of you may make fun of this, but it is a very real possibility.
I will flip out if we end w/a dud like Carr and they end up w/either Manziel or Teddy.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 81
Rookie
|
|
Rookie
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 81 |
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 16,188
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 16,188 |
This is what this Post asks:
"Rank, Rate, and Compare the QB's of This Draft".
Please Step up and do it.
======================================================
I did as asked and I stand by it:
1. Bridgewater - The best quarterback in this draft. I could care less about the combine or pro day. Look at the game film for the last three years. Consistent production, consistent improvement. Natural instincts, mobility, vision, reads defenses, makes good decisions, accuracy, played in pro-set offense. Leadership qualities both on and off the field. His actions show his commitment to improve and his dedication to the game.
2. Garopollo - Natural passer. Played against inferior competition but dominated. Solid in all aspects of the game. Throws a beautiful ball and is very accurate. Has the best release of all QB's in this draft. Reads the field well and makes good decisions. Won the Walter Peyton award. Very intelligent but will force the ball on occasion. He is the type of guy that if given a chance to develop could be great.
3. Bortles - Has the prototype size. Tough player and a hard worker. Plays well under pressure. Good enough arm, can move. Not a finished product. Needs to learn more about playing quarterback. Has a good upside if brought along and coached well.
4. Manziel - The ultimate wild card. Undersized but I do not think it will play a part if he learns to protect himself. He must learn to play more behind the LOS. He has to learn to take what is there and not force things. He can not run the ball like he did in college. Must win with his arm and use his mobility to feed his arm. Has great upside if he learns to play within structure and dedicates himself to only football.
5. Carr - Great arm talent. Has a complete physical skill set. Played against inferior competition and rolled up gaudy numbers. Was a five year player. Rah rah leader. Mature and dedicated. Been around the game knows what to expect both on and off the field. His game tape shows he has to prove he can play under pressure. Has all the ability to play at a high level but lacks natural feel for the position.
t5. Mettenberger - Coming off an injury. Terrific arm talent. He can make every throw in the book. Big guy but lacks mobility. Prototype pocket passer. Played against top competition and won. If drafted to the right team with protection and weapons he could be a solid starter.
6. McCarron - Winner. Played against the best and won. He does everything well nothing great. Could be a solid starter but will not be the type of QB to carry a team. What you see is what you get. Low risk but not much upside.
7. David Fales and Aaron Murray - Producers. Both with similar skills. Terrific accuracy but lack some arm strength. Both guys forecast as system quarterbacks. They both can lead teams but are not dominate players. Good in all aspects but not great.
======================================================
Let's see what you got.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,151
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,151 |
does anyone else see a lot of Stafford in Murray?
Two QBs that have the size and skill and ability...but just something missing that keeps them from winning as much as they should.
"It has to start somewhere
It has to start somehow
What better place than here?
What better time than now?"
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 16,188
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 16,188 |
Murray won a lot of games and awards but he is much different than Stafford. They both are Georgia products but that is where it ends. Stafford was a first rounder. Murray will not be a first rounder even if he did not have an knee injury.
Stafford is a power quarterback. He is a big guy (6'3") with a total cannon for an arm. Murray 6'1" has no where near the arm of Stafford. He is a smart QB, a leader, and accurate. Stafford has a tendency to force throws. He believes in his arm strength. Murray has more poise and is a better decision maker.
Stafford is still young and coming into his prime. We shall see where the Lions go?
Murray will get drafted as a backup developmental guy. Stafford was drafted as a franchise guy.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499 |
Not really. Stafford has a superior arm and is a better athlete.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 13,358
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 13,358 |
As bone and vers have alluded to, the only thing Stafford and Murray have in common as QBs is their Alma Mater. Stafford's arm is much stronger, Murray is a multiple target, catch-and-run kind of QB. He's a better athlete than some give him credit for.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,151
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,151 |
I guess what I meant...
isn't that they play the same. But theyre both strong guys with high quality skill sets that just didn't win as much as they should have.
"It has to start somewhere
It has to start somehow
What better place than here?
What better time than now?"
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 9
Rookie
|
|
Rookie
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 9 |
There is only two QBs in this draft that I like.One is Bortles and the other is Garopollo.I have never liked a QB that seems to like to run the ball like Manziel.That is what I didn't like about RG3 and I was rite when I said he was just going to get hurt.When it comes to Carr I can't help but think about how his brother so I keep thinking about how he would just be another failure if taken by the Browns.JMHO
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,027
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,027 |
Quote:
There is only two QBs in this draft that I like.One is Bortles and the other is Garopollo.I have never liked a QB that seems to like to run the ball like Manziel.That is what I didn't like about RG3 and I was rite when I said he was just going to get hurt.When it comes to Carr I can't help but think about how his brother so I keep thinking about how he would just be another failure if taken by the Browns.JMHO
I think most of us that like Manziel all realize that his carries need to come down drastically. Go and look at his game logs.... There are a lot of double digit carry games... I think everyone knows he can't operate like that. Nobody can. But I think whatever coaching staff he ends up with can help design some plays that leave the option to scramble. I also think even at the NFL level, he can ad-lib into scrambling on certain plays.
I believe he can cut down on running because he has that quick release.
For the Browns case, it would be good for him to work with Brian Hoyer, who makes quick decisions very well. You see how the vet does it, and hopefully it gets infectious.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,399
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,399 |
Russell Wilson's carries went up his junior year to almost the exact same number of carries Manziel had last year.. .and Manziel's carries went down by over 25% from the 2012 season to 2013..
yebat' Putin
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 42,413
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 42,413 |
The goal will be to get Manziel to carry the ball only when he absolutely has to (this includes designed runs). If that can be accomplished his carry numbers will plummet.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,399
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,399 |
Quote:
The goal will be to get Manziel to carry the ball only when he absolutely has to (this includes designed runs). If that can be accomplished his carry numbers will plummet.
I agree. and if I had to guess, in his first year he will carry it more and over the first few years hopefully those numbers will come down..
yebat' Putin
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,418
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,418 |
Quote:
Quote:
The goal will be to get Manziel to carry the ball only when he absolutely has to (this includes designed runs). If that can be accomplished his carry numbers will plummet.
I agree. and if I had to guess, in his first year he will carry it more and over the first few years hopefully those numbers will come down..
One advantage that Wilson had was that he got to go to Wisconsin and play in a pro style offense for a year. He got to play in a system where he had to read the whole field.
Manziel hasn't. He has fit the scheme he plays beautifully ...... and he has tons of leadership and moxy ...... but he still scares the hell out of me.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 13,358
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 13,358 |
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
The goal will be to get Manziel to carry the ball only when he absolutely has to (this includes designed runs). If that can be accomplished his carry numbers will plummet.
I agree. and if I had to guess, in his first year he will carry it more and over the first few years hopefully those numbers will come down..
One advantage that Wilson had was that he got to go to Wisconsin and play in a pro style offense for a year. He got to play in a system where he had to read the whole field.
Manziel hasn't. He has fit the scheme he plays beautifully ...... and he has tons of leadership and moxy ...... but he still scares the hell out of me.
He ran the same style offense with different terminology at NC State. When NC State brought in a new staff and wanted to switch to a college slop scheme, he decided to transfer somewhere he could maintain a pro style offense in preparation for the pros.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,418
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,418 |
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
The goal will be to get Manziel to carry the ball only when he absolutely has to (this includes designed runs). If that can be accomplished his carry numbers will plummet.
I agree. and if I had to guess, in his first year he will carry it more and over the first few years hopefully those numbers will come down..
One advantage that Wilson had was that he got to go to Wisconsin and play in a pro style offense for a year. He got to play in a system where he had to read the whole field.
Manziel hasn't. He has fit the scheme he plays beautifully ...... and he has tons of leadership and moxy ...... but he still scares the hell out of me.
He ran the same style offense with different terminology at NC State. When NC State brought in a new staff and wanted to switch to a college slop scheme, he decided to transfer somewhere he could maintain a pro style offense in preparation for the pros.
Thanks for clearing that up for me. I thought that he played a simpler scheme at NC State for some reason.
He definitely made the right decision there.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 13,358
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 13,358 |
I agree YT.
Luck also ran a pro-style offense in college and acclimated quickly to the NFL.
Foles didn't, but got paired up with an alternative kind of guy in Kelly which he has succeeded under.
FWIW, This year, guys that have significant experience in a pro style offense (or at least pro style elements) from college are Bridgewater, Zach Mettenberger, Stephen Morris, Bryn Renner (before scheme change at UNC), and Chase Rettig.
I don't know if Bortles has taken a single snap from under center that wasn't for a QB sneak.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,418
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,418 |
There really is something to be said for the concept offense that Kelly runs. Each member of the offense just has to learn a concept, and once they do that, then it's just a matter of telling each player which spot they are. That would seem to be an advantage for a young QB, as they can almost run a full game off of a single concept.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 13,358
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 13,358 |
So... I finished my own personal QB rankings. I have them split into rankings as mobile QBs and pocket QBs. I have detailed write-ups of each of them on the link. And... well.. let's just say it doesn't go along with the consensus. lol. Not that my opinions ever really have since I started spending way too much time doing this stuff. *Please note that "mobile" does not mean "running." It has to do with a QB's ability to move and to throw on the run, incorporate rollouts, etc. Mobile QB Rankings Rank Name School Position Height Weight Round 1 Johnny Manziel Texas A&M QB 6'0" 210 1 2 Teddy Bridgewater Louisville QB 6'2" 205 1 3 Derek Carr Fresno State QB 6'2" 215 1 4 Blake Bortles UCF QB 6'3" 230 2 5 Stephen Morris Miami (Fla.) QB 6'2" 208 3 6 Aaron Murray Georgia QB 6'1" 201 3 7 Connor Shaw South Carolina QB 6'0" 209 4 8 Tajh Boyd Clemson QB 6'1" 222 5 9 David Fales San Jose State QB 6'2" 220 5 10 Jimmy Garoppolo Eastern Illinois QB 6'2" 219 6 11 Brett Smith Wyoming QB 6'2" 206 6 12 A.J. McCarron Alabama QB 6'3" 214 6 13 Brock Jensen North Dakota State QB 6'2" 226 7 14 Logan Thomas Virginia Tech QB 6'6" 250 UDFA 15 Zach Mettenberger LSU QB 6'5" 235 UDFA 16 Bryn Renner North Carolina QB 6'2" 225 UDFA 17 Tom Savage Pittsburgh QB 6'4" 230 UDFA 18 Jeff Mathews Cornell QB 6'4" 225 UDFA Pocket QB Rankings Rank Name School Position Height Weight Round 1 Derek Carr Fresno State QB 6'2" 215 1 2 Johnny Manziel Texas A&M QB 6'0" 210 1 3 Teddy Bridgewater Louisville QB 6'2" 205 2 4 Aaron Murray Georgia QB 6'1" 201 3 5 Stephen Morris Miami (Fla.) QB 6'2" 208 4 6 Connor Shaw South Carolina QB 6'0" 209 4 7 Zach Mettenberger LSU QB 6'5" 235 4 8 Logan Thomas Virginia Tech QB 6'6" 250 4 9 Blake Bortles UCF QB 6'3" 230 4 10 David Fales San Jose State QB 6'2" 220 5 11 Jimmy Garoppolo Eastern Illinois QB 6'2" 219 5 12 Tajh Boyd Clemson QB 6'1" 222 6 13 Tom Savage Pittsburgh QB 6'4" 230 6 14 A.J. McCarron Alabama QB 6'3" 214 6 15 Brock Jensen North Dakota State QB 6'2" 226 7 16 Bryn Renner North Carolina QB 6'2" 225 UDFA 17 Brett Smith Wyoming QB 6'2" 206 UDFA 18 Jeff Mathews Cornell QB 6'4" 225 UDFA
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065 |
Rank - Name - School - (Which round I would take them)
1. Teddy Bridgewater Lousiville (1)
2. Johnny Manziel Texas A&M (1)
3. Blake Bortles UCF (1-2)
4. Jimmy Garoppolo Eastern Illinois (2-3)
5. Aaron Murray Georgia (3)
6. Zach Mettenberger LSU (3-4)
7. Derek Carr Fresno State (3-4)
8. A.J. McCarron Alabama QB (4)
9. David Fales San Jose State QB (4-5)
10. Tom Savage Pittsburgh (4-5)
11. Connor Shaw South Carolina (5)
12. Tajh Boyd Clemson (5-6)
13. Jeff Mathews Cornell (6)
14. Stephen Morris Miami (6-7)
15. Brett Smith Wyoming (6-7)
16. Brock Jensen North Dakota State (7)
17. Logan Thomas Virginia Tech (UDFA)
18. Bryn Renner North Carolina (UDFA)
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,482
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,482 |
Rank - Name - School - (Which round I would take them)
1. Teddy Bridgewater - Louisville (1)
2. Blake Bortles - UCF (1)
3. Johnny Manziel - Texas A&M (1)
4. Derek Carr - Fresno St (2)
5. Tom Savage - Pitt (3)
6. Zach Mettenberger - LSU (3)
7. Jimmy Garoppolo - E Illinois (3)
8. AJ McCarron - Alabama (4)
9. Aaron Murray - Georgia (5)
10. David Fales - San Jose St (6-7)
11. Logan Thomas - Virginia Tech (7)
12. Brett Smith - Wyoming (7)
13. Tajh Boyd - Clemson (7)
14. Stephen Morris - Miami (UDFA)
15. Bryn Renner - UNC (UDFA)
I'll add that I wouldn't draft Manziel or Carr at all for personal reasons, and I don't think Bridgewater is worth our pick at #4...so unless we're moving UP from 26 or Bridge/Bortles falls, I don't expect to see a 1st Rd QB, which means I'd be targeting Savage/Mettenberger/Garoppolo with our first 3rd rounder.
![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/GraffZ06/browns_factory_sig.jpg) Fear us, for we are the BROWNS, led by the mighty BM! Only in Cleveland.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 742
All Pro
|
|
All Pro
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 742 |
Quote:
3. Bortles - Has the prototype size. Tough player and a hard worker. Plays well under pressure. Good enough arm, can move. Not a finished product. Needs to learn more about playing quarterback. Has a good upside if brought along and coached well.
This seems to fit Pettine. I remember seeing tape of him preaching about coaching and work-ethic. Paraphrasing, but look for the physical tools and a trainable mind. Coaching's job is to fill in the blanks and take it to the next level.
Given, its Farmer's pick, but I think he fits our coach. And our division.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,418
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,418 |
Well, Quinn ran a WCO offense in college, IIRC. That requires quick decisions. Unfortunately, he hit Cleveland and looked like he didn't even know what a football was. 
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065 |
Weeden made quick decisions in college...
Blackmon's open? Throw it to him.
Blackmon's covered? Throw it to him.
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
|
|
|
DawgTalkers.net
Forums The Archives 2014 NFL Season NFL Draft 2014 Rank Rate and Compare the QB's of
this draft
|
|
