DawgTalkers.net Forums The Archives 2015 NFL Season The NFL Draft 2015 Draft Need: QB Part 2

Hope he blows them away ; don't want to trade up for any QB this year ..

If we take a QB in the first 2 rounds, they better assume he can come in and start right away..

Even possibly a 3rd rounder.. They better be ready to compete for it..

We don't need any more QBs that need to sit and watch..

If you want Mariota, trade up for him, make him the starter, and give him every chance to succeed..

Put Johnny on the PUP list, let him figure his stuff out, over time if he's there mentally, he can either get a chance, or possibly work his way up from no trade value to "some"

I'd like to see the Browns take Grayson in the 3rd.

JH's marketing cronies floating info out there especially after Toa Mariota expressed doubts...

Which is funny, because we don't have anyone who can keep a young QB on the bench.

It's a catch-22. You are wasting a pick if you draft a "developmental" QB when you know at some point you are going to end up throwing him on the field as a rookie. We've been ruining "developmental" QBs since '99. (not that we've picked the greatest ones to start off with)

My thoughts regarding the QB situation (and I'm replying to the discussion, not to anyone in particular);

We have a huge question mark regarding JFF, until we know what we have, good or bad, it's foolish to invest too much into another QB. The question becomes, how much is too much.

It is rarely a good move to trade up, and I see no argument for trading up to go after Mariota. (As someone said about Winston, either you look at his talent and he is a top of the draft pick, or you see his off-field issues and he is undraftable. To me he is undraftable.) I think Mariota, if properly prepared, will be a good to great QB. But he has to have time to learn the NFL game, and if we draft him, he will have to be the starter too quickly to properly develop. Even in the unlikely event that he falls to 12, I think it is better to trade down for more high picks than to invest another 1st round pick in a QB when we still don't know about JFF.

I see Grayson and Petty as pretty much equal. They each have strengths and flaws, and to me the aggregate of their skills is too close to differentiate. If forced to choose, I would go with Petty because of the level of competition in the SEC. I would be happy with either in the 4th round. But should we take one in the third? That's where I get a bit iffy, especially if it means missing out on a good player at another position of need.

Why wouldn't you take Grayson because of the level of talent in the SEC?

To me, the SEC gives a better idea of how a player will perform in the pros than the Mountain West. There are good players in the MW, but not as many as the SEC.

All true, but JH isn't taking calls at the Arizona Biltmore for Grayson/Petty discussion.

Baylor is in the Big XII, I think it's the highest-scoring conference in division I, but I may be wrong.

Petty has never played a single game against an SEC team. Grayson has played Alabama once. (and that went about as you'd think it would.)

OK, I stand corrected, I thought Baylor was SEC. But that doesn't really change the point of my post. I'm not sure I'm comfortable going after either before the 4th round.

Actually, it seems I made the same mistake before...just can't get it out of my head the Baylor isn't an SEC team.

Depending on what else is available in the 3rd, I would be ok with them taking Petty there..

Assuming they believe he can come in and play right away..

All that would be would him being able to grasp the playbook quick enough, which from DeFilippo's comments, getting rid of the "gray area" and simplifying it, could be possible..

Because skill wise IMO he's already even with McCown..

Not drafting a player because he didn't play in the right conference is not smart.

With that said, I wouldn't draft any of these QBs before round four either. Not because they didn't play in the SEC, but because none of them are that good.

You guys are making too much about a simple mis-statement. I did not say I wouldn't consider drafting Grayson because of his conference. What I said was that, all other things being equal, I would take a player from a better conference given a choice.

Got it. Thanks for the clarification.

What planet do you live on??????????...

I think it's pretty clear they don't trust Manziel at all. We signed McCown so that we have someone, we tried to trade for Bradford, there are constant rumors of us trading up for Mariota, etc. I think that if there is an obvious way out of the Manziel experiment, we will do everything we can to make it happen.

As awesome as it would be for Manziel to come in this year, and even just be competant...

The likelyhood of that happening is so fricken low..

And this is like, the worst possible year in a long time to try to find a QB...

Sigh.

I guess I'm in the minority here. I think JFF will be on a mission. 1) He's going to be focused on football to keep him sober, 2) he is going to be out to prove he has what it takes to play in the NFL, and 3) he will be humbled by the whole rehab experience.

I was never in favor of drafting him, but once the Browns did, I'm rooting for he success. I think rehab is exactly what was needed.

It's classic Browns - half measures at QB since 1999.

We have extra assets that would allow us to go get Mariota who has all the traits of a franchise QB without ruining our future like the Redskins did.

Instead, the QBs we're talking about drafting are either Day 3 guys pushed into Day 1/2 by demand or developmental QBs later in the draft. The kind of guys that almost never pan out.

Then there are some who would rather use those 1sts to draft a WR who would be completely dependent on our crappy QBs or bring in a 4th Pro Bowl caliber offensive lineman as though QB isn't the biggest driver of success in the NFL by far (which it is).

No worries though... we have two journeyman veteran QBs and a slacker who looked like hot garbage last year that we're hoping will be out of rehab in time for camp. And like Farmer said, don't write off Connor Shaw!

And we're amazed that we suck every year...

NO. MORE. HALF. MEASURES.

I hold the same optimism and viewpoint.

Here is another on board with this thinking

Some will respond that it is only "wishful thinking". But put any one of us in his same situation and I'm certain we'd do everything we can to avoid the embarrassment of being a bust after being hailed as "Johnny Football".

To bust is one thing. But to bust after all the hype and accolades is quite another. None of us would want to live out the rest of our lives with that as our story.

Anyone worth a grain of salt would fight to correct the situation.

I believe he will.

Biggest fear I have is another RG3 situation.

Looks good on the outside, crack open the shell and find nothing of value inside.

Then it becomes a double edge sword. If you do the deal that gets him for you and he doesn't work out, you lose. Then you lose again because you don't have the picks (or whatever) you gave up to get him.

Bang Bang.

Anyway, it's a waste of time to think about. If he's any good, he'll be gone before we can find a way to move up to get him.

get winston or don't even bother this year with a QB.

All of this is true. If there is no QB available to us, what do you do?

I understand the RGIII fear but at the same time, if RGIII were a Browns QB, he'd be the most successful QB we've had since the return. It's a sad truth but the guy lead the Redskins to the playoffs in Year 1, made the Pro Bowl, has never posted a QB rating below 82 and is still only 25.

Plus, I think 2 things derailed RGIII that Mariota doesn't share. One is obviously the injury concern. Mariota didn’t miss a single game in college and has a much sturdier build than RGIII. He also doesn’t run nearly as often as RGIII did in college (even though when he did he was more effective) and relies more on his arm.

The other thing that people don’t seem to remember is the character concern. You don’t hear people talk about it anymore but there was a report that came out saying RGIII was selfish, entitled and treated people poorly. Watching him lose his team’s support and responding the way he has to things has essentially proven that out. I haven’t read a single negative thing about Mariota’s character. The guy is the real deal and has immense respect from his teammates and coaches.

And there is definitely a chance that he’s good AND a team passes on him/trades him for the exact reasons you’re afraid of him… because he’s a projection. The thing is, this team has been garbage since 1999 and will continue to be garbage until they solve QB. How many picks have we made between our last Top 5 QB attempt and now that have been a complete waste because we haven’t had a QB? Even when we’ve hit, HoF caliber guys like Thomas and Haden mean absolutely nothing because we have garbage at the position. This generation's greatest LT hasn't even PLAYED in a playoff game because he hasn't had anyone worthwhile to protect.

If that means taking a bit of a gamble and spending legit resources on Mariota, so be it. He gives us more of a chance to finally get out of football hell than any 2 players you can get at #12 and #19.

"I am with those who think we will see a Manziel not thought of here or in the media. All in and talented with the prospects we held for him when we drafted him. If anything he has been humbled and the rehab should/could have him focused."
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Manziel is your guy EO. There is nothing wrong in believing in a guy.

Mariota is my guy. I wanted Luck more than player I have ever seen but that ship sailed.

In the case of Manziel I do not think him being humbled or dedicated will make any difference. The question about Manziel to me is does he have the skills to succeed?

I question his talent. What he did in college will not work at the NFL level. Manziel has to prove he can play in the offense the Browns put in front of him.

Mariota will have to prove himself as well. It is my belief though that he has the skills to do so. I believe he will learn to operate any system. He is bigger, faster, and is an all around better athlete. There are zero questions about his work ethic and dedication.

As far as the tier two guys? I really don't know. Have not spent the time to truly evaluate them.

Petty has grabbed my attention to a degree. I just like his size and arm. He reminds some of Matt Stafford. Seems like a good kid. Had good numbers in college. Baylor obviously runs the spread.

I think the college offenses are a bit over played. Meaning yes there is a bigger learning curve but no matter where you played you still have to learn the NFL.
NFL defenses are way different than college.

Almost all rookie quarterbacks will require time. No guy comes in and wins the Super Bowl in their first year. So to me it is a given that even if the guy starts the first game the first years are developmental years.

Elway, Manning, and Luck were the top prospects even they took time.

JC

So here is my final what-have-you about QB, the draft and the Cleveland Browns. I'd say Bryce Petty or Grayson. Either of those two, and me personally - I'm happy. Well, about as happy as I guess I could possibly get about our Qb situation and the upcoming season...

He has no past either.

There is an untold story about a kid relegated to the 3rd string QB on his college team, but through a series of injuries, leads his team to the national championship. The best part is still to come, he gets drafted by his hometown team and becomes the QB they have been waiting for decades to find, leading them to a decade of playoffs and a few Super Bowl wins.

Wouldn't it be a shame if, the year before he came out, his hometown team went another direction, going all in on the best QB in THAT draft, while he went on to greatness with another team.

I know, it's an unlikely story, but we never know what the future holds. Maybe it's a good thing there are no real QB options for the Browns this year. Maybe our franchise QB is still a year away. (Even if it isn't that storybook tale.)