DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Gipson's Big Mistake

LMAO - the false information comes from taking Tab's comment and claiming it said something it didn't.

Another example - who is the only poster to claim there *might* be multiple sources claiming Poyer is studding out??? There is only one. . . . The same poster then says that he searched for the other information claiming Poyer is studding out - but this time he says "as was described" twisting facts to now suggest that Tab or someone else is claiming that their are multiple sources when the ONLY person to mention it was himself.... this is like those journalist hacks where one report is speculation - but the next Bozo in line says "It's being reported that" ... pure and total BS.

Do you ever make a football post. Every single post I see from you is about knocking me, Bone, or others who don't think the way you do.

You are the worst type of poster. No football talk. You just rip others and you do it w/such a hateful tone. Try counseling.

Tabber: http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/news/arti...36-d2b0f5702fd0

I never said a word about Poyer sucking. You said this:



I could not remember reading anything about him studding out. I couldn't remember him getting a lot of praise from coaches and teammates, so I researched it. I couldn't find much. Just the one article that I mentioned and in that article, they mentioned 4 other guys that I really hadn't heard about before.

Therefore, I asked for some proof that coaches and teammates are praising him and how is studding out. I get a few angry responses that completely ignore my question from the usual suspects and your response. However, I have yet to see where he is receiving so much praise from his coaches and teammates and that it is questionable if he is studding out.

tab, I took issue w/how you presented this argument right away. You said things about Gipson that I thought were subjective and unfair. What proof do you have that Gipson lost his hunger? What proof did you have that he was painting himself into a corner and getting bad advice? What proof did you have that he was letting this get to his head?

I really hadn't heard anything from Gipson or the Browns on this matter until just the other day when Gipson told people in Wyomiing that he wanted to remain w/the Browns.

I like Gipson as a player. I love how he has battled his way from nowhere into one of the best players in the NFL. I love how he handles himself w/class and high character. He is NOT just a 1/2 year wonder as a poster or two tried to say. Each DC that he has played for [Jauron, Horton, and O'Neil] have done nothing but praise him. Pettine has also spoke highly of him.

I don't like people unfairly criticizing a guy w/those credentials and I especially don't like untruths being told about him.

Now, I am sure guys like mgh will come back on here and make this all about me and will not address the points I have made about Gipson, Poyer, and what the coaches and players have had to say..........but, I got this off my chest.

Thanks for your time.

My point of view is this:

Gipson has earned everything he has gotten in this league. He was undrafted. He won the admiration of Jauron in his rookie year and actually got valuable playing time because of how well he did. Horton absolutely loved him and called him our best defensive player. Gipson began making plays all over the field. He displayed excellent range and ballhawking skills. Last year, he continued to display those same talents. Throughout it all, he has been a model citizen, a hardworker, and and a well-liked and respected teammate.

My point of view is that you should reward these types of players. Instead, the Browns bring in guys who are not as accomplished and give them more money than they want to pay Gipson. Bowe making more than Gipson? Heck, is the punter making more?

My point of view is that sends the wrong message to other veteran players and to Gipson himself. I haven't seen Gipson bad-mouth the Browns and beat his own drum in the press. He has handled himself w/his usual class, but man, it's got to be a bit tough to think that your employer values guys like Bowe more than you. Bowe has substance abuse in his past and has been called out for lack of effort and having alligator arms at certain points of his career. And then you have a high character guy like Gipson who has EARNED his position and has performed well and you don't want to pay him as much as guys like Bowe and a freaking punter????

Priorities!

Edit: And I am not asking for you--or anyone--to agree w/my point of view. I am just explaining why I got upset that some misleading information [even if it was unintentional] might be persuading other posters and readers to get the wrong idea about Gipson and Poyer.

I'm kinda torn on this one. I see the side of: We should do everything we can to keep our good players, and I feel that the FO has let him coast and not in a hurry to keep him in the fold. On the other hand, We don't know the whole story. It could be the knee, or it maybe something as simple as we want to make sure it is him and not just the system. Right now I don't feel that we handled this right, but like I said we don't know the whole story.

Well said.

The only possible mulligan I'll give Farmer on this is the knee injury was more severe than we thought, but I have not read or heard that is the case...only speculation it could be.

I think it's one thing to let Skrine go. He was a nice player who was overrated by Browns fans. His bad plays got ignored because he was a try hard guy who beat the odds. How much can you really pay a guy like that without potential long-term ramifications? Plus, the Browns could potentially be deep at CB. The only people who get upset at this one aren't looking at it objectively. They just want to pile on Farmer because they already don't like him.

But Gipson seems to be a step above. He's not a try hard guy. He's legitimately good. He's like an Ed Reed light, IMO. Reed made a career of being in the right place at the right time. And he's a great team player, locker room guy, and class act. "Play like a Brown" is so appallingly dumb I hate using it here, but if Farmer is going to preach that silly mantra, he should also walk the talk.

This is a huge head scratcher to me.

Good post.

I know how things get misinterpreted around here, so I need to be clear about this. I am not bringing this up to bad-mouth Farmer.

I just really like Gipson and I want the Browns to keep him! He's earned his payday.

Nor am I. And I didn't interpret your post that way.

I am pro-Farmer, pro-Pettine, pro-continuity.

Doesn't mean I can't be objective and critical.

I have an employee who works for me who is essentially my right hand woman. She does mostly good and receives praise and recognition when she does. She sometimes screws up and she gets called on that as well. No one's perfect.

It happens.

I don't want Farmer fired, but I don't agree with the way he has handled Mack and Gipson.

Wasn't Mack more of Banner and Haslem? Or are you talking about since he came back from a broken leg?

Vers, I agree from the players perspective. But, from the team/owner perspective you can't be held hostage by every good player who wants money. I think Farmer is sending a message, and Gipson is the fall guy. My gut says they will work something out once he gets back into camp and plays a few games.

Browns/Haslam hasn't had to many players who qualified for a big second contract. Hayden is the only guy who comes to mind. I don't remember if Joe Thomas resigned before or after Haslam took charge. Both these guys did receive league leading contracts. Alex Mack held all the chips and was going for LT money. I don't think you can say Farmer/Haslam were playing hardball.

scratching my head..... why is everything on this board
the results of a kneejerk reaction? ok Gipson made a big mistake, how? by not showing up to practice he's losing ground to a backup that's studding out? Hardly, if Poyer is better than Gipson he will start if not than Gipson will. It will not matter if he looked good in shorts or not. Gipson did what many players do. He stayed home trying to push the contract talks, he made no threats, he stayed in contact with the team, He was given any needed information and watched film of the practice. Why he even offered Poyer suggestions on plays. Sounds to me like a guy that lost his desire to be a Brown.

Why is everything micro-analyzed ?
I think you got this one right Vers.


EO Coming back and saying no mistake, after you found out about Gipson signing made me feel like everything you said was overreaction by a diehard fan. Nothing wrong with the love, just step back and let some things play out before reacting on offseason happenings.
When they start hitting , that's when I'll worry.

I'll bet some even have knee dent on their foreheads

I just wish more people could grasp this concept.

We don't know that Gipson was looking for a "huge contract". We do know he was looking for a long term deal. Now from the FO side, they're taking a huge risk in one aspect. If Gipson continues to stud out and stay healthy this entire season, his price tag will only go up, not down. If I were Gipson and started the season off well, I believe I would shelve any contract talks until after the season.

You can simply look at how that panned out For the Ravens when Flacco tried to get a long term deal. The Ravens decided to wait it out another season and Flacco studded out that year which drastically cost them a lot more than it would have to negotiated a long term contract the season before.

So actually, this could easily cost the Browns MORE money in the long run by using such a strategy. It's certainly a gamble.

I haven't seen anything that indicates Gipson was "holding them hostage because he wanted the money". He did however want a long term deal instead of risking injury in a one year deal. I believe everyone who works anywhere, when given the option, wants some stability.

We need more of that type of thinking around here.

Pitt, valid points.

I fail to see what the FO did wrong. The guy had a good year and made the pro-bowl. He didn't finish the season due to injury. The FO puts a second round tender on him, and nobody bit. He is getting a nice pay raise and is in position to earn a nice fat long term contract.

How is this a bad way to handle it? He signed the tender and is going to play this year, how did the FO mishandle it?

BINGO .... we have a winner.

Funny.

Jordan Poyer started an online internet argument.

Just think about that for a minute.

This is hardly a rare occurance; it happens to many teams. Unless somebody has inside knowledge, this rampant speculation is simply just another way to hammer (or praise) Farmer...

The BS Crew is back.

Care to point out your problem with that?If not, go back to dinner and have some dessert to sweeten you up...

Reasons were clearly given as to why this wasn't the best move. If you think paying guys who were not wanted more than you pay a Pro Bowler is smart, well then...........perhaps you should follow the advice given in your sig.

As I often do. If not, then I would freely post what is really on my mind in responding to posts like yours.
(See your post above re: "BS crew"). All football, allthe time. Yeah, right...

We were talking football. There was actually some good conversation going on. Did you not read it? Then, a couple of you gotta come on here and make it all about Farmer again.

It's like several of you police the boards and have to butt in anytime there is even a smidgeon of questioning of this FO.

We clearly stated this was not a conversation designed to diss Farmer. It's looking at one specific move and nothing more than that.

But, you couldn't let it go. It's like none of our points were valid because all we wanted to do was bash Farmer. That is BS!

You guys stifle intelligent conversation and I am so sick of it. Sheesh, there is NOTHING wrong w/differing opinions and just because someone doesn't agree w/you guys doesn't mean that their opinions are not valid.

It's June. There is nothing else to talk about.

I really don't think this thread was started because of Poyer.

Does anyone believe that? Truly?

Any discussion about Gipson and a contract will of necessity involve Farmer...

Yeah, so?

Why can't we discuss that?

And why can't we say some of his moves are really good, some are good, some are okay, some are poor, and others suck?

Why do we have to choose one freaking side and stick to it.

Conversation and debate is good. Censorship sucks!

I can agree with that...

j/c

FYI, Gipson arrived to camp with a hamstring injury.

Yeah, what a bummer. Finally here, but not really.

He said that if there was a game Sunday he could play.

Browns safety Tashaun Gipson returns with hamstring injury, but no bitterness over contract dispute
Jun 16, 2015 -- 3:48pm
By Tony Grossi

Notes, quotes and observations from Browns minicamp …

* Free safety Tashaun Gipson, who signed his second-round tender last week, was in uniform, but was held out of practice with a hamstring injury he suffered working out on his own during his boycott of voluntary workouts.

Coach Mike Pettine expressed displeasure with the situation. “It’s disappointing when a guy’s not here to show up with something,” Pettine said. “We were going to be very careful, anyway. It’s unfortunate that he showed up here with an injury.” Gipson said he tweaked the hamstring while training to come to camp in the best shape of his life. He said if there were a game to play, he would play, but trainers decided there was no need to push it. Gipson never had a procedure on the sprained MCL that kept him out of the last six games and the Pro Bowl. “The knee is good, knee is 100 percent … feels like it did before the injury,” Gipson said. The fact that Pettine complained about a minor hamstring tweak suffered away from the auspices of the club rather than point out Gipson’s knee is fully recovered tells you that Gipson’s dispute over a long-term contract is still lingering. “We’re not going to punish a guy over a contract issue, but it’s still a real issue,” Pettine said. “You’re talking about a guy taking care of his body. He needs to show up for training camp ready to go just like 89 other guys need to do.”

* Gipson said he was surprised that this issue is still lingering, but he is not bitter and has accepted the fact that he could be playing elsewhere after the 2015 season.

“Things are ongoing,” he said of contract talks. “But one of the things (about) me personally believing in myself, I’m not afraid to play under the tender and I know what lies after this season. I believe the Browns want me to be here. I hope they do. I would love to be here. But at the end of the day, I’ve seen the game of football, guys like (ex-Browns free agents) T.J. Ward, Buster Skrine … the reality of this business, no matter who you are, it could come a day when I’m not suiting up in a Browns uniform. I’m back now and I know I’ll be a Cleveland Brown at least this year.” Gipson is guaranteed $2.356 million under the restricted free agent tender he signed last week, a hefty increase over his $570,000 salary in 2014. But he sees the huge contracts signed by Patriots safety Devin McCourty (five years/$47 million with $28 million guaranteed) and Skrine (four years/$25 million, $13 million guaranteed) and says, “You look at it and see at the end of the tunnel there is light. You look at Devin McCourty. It’s starting to be exciting.”

http://espncleveland.com/common/more.php?m=49&post_id=46641