DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Roster/etc moves in Cleveland..

A big man with bad knees = a career that is over. If they think he can't stay healthy then it's best to let him go.

I agree Phil was so freakin' overrated. The play would be right in front of him and he couldn't make it. Just think we could have had Julio Jones. Thanks Heckert! Buh Bye!

I am with you on Taylor and Kitchen

I think that it is unfair to say the H&H regime set us back years. Pretty much every front office we have had has held us back. The regime that set us back the most though was Policy and Clark. We had so many opportunities with them to get quality players with the #1 picks and the extra expansion draft picks and the expansion draft for that matter. That was time to establish a foundation of talented young players and bring in seasoned vets to show them how the NFL works. But alas now is the time to forget about regimes past and look to the future. IMO this team is one player away from being a playoff team. Unfortunately that player is an average Qb. And I don't have a lot of faith in Farmer's ability to judge Qb talent.

Shelton, Hughes, Meder

Our run defense was better, but it still wasn't good.

I think the coaches feel our new NT will be a 3 down player and won't need a ton of rest. You can't coach with the thought that your starters are guaranteed to get hurt.

We have also been running a lot of four man fronts.

I agree with almost all of this.

I would be surprised if we re-sign Kitchen, because I expect that he will be picked up fairly quickly. I loved Kitch, especially him being a YTown guy and all ...... and also the fact that his motor never stopped. I also felt that he was superior to Taylor.

I suspect that with Shelton, Hughes, and Meder, we have our depth on the inside. (and I like all 3 players there as well)

Hughes was never getting cut. We just signed him to an extension.

was a observation from the third preseason game. spirit brought up the same thing. seem to be playing alot of 4/3. and as i said even last year i just dont think we played alot of base 3/4. i could be wrong about that but its what i recall.

to be truthful. i dont really care what we play as long as we do it well....

Pettine plays multiple fronts. I think his second most used front with the Bills was a front with two down linemen. Rex Ryan does the same. They also use a ton of DBs.

It'll be the Danny Shelton and Jamie Meder show!

So we still have Bryant, Hughes, Winn, Meder, Shelton, Cooper, Wynn, Starks, and Bryant on the defensive line.

Good post. I like how you debated me.

Look it up and inform us!

True, but I didn't think that Kitchen was the reason our run D was poor. He's pretty stout. Very underrated if you ask me.

Let's face it, Pet and O'Neil's defensive scheme has a history of being poor against the run. They have their outside guys crash in too much and then put a lot of guys in coverage. This leaves the defense vulnerable to outside runs, especially against backs that have good vision.

When we tried to correct that problem later in the year, we completely lost our outside pass rush and gave qbs way too much time to throw.

Our scheme is very d-back friendly. It's designed to stop the pass. In order to do that, you either give up run defense or the pass rush. Not saying that is necessarily a bad thing, but it is what it is.

Hopefully now that we have more talented players on the defensive line (Shelton, Cooper, a healthy pair of Bryants, etc.) we can do more things. I agree that the system is built for DBs.

Yeah, our d-line should be okay. I was just giving Kitchen some love. I had no idea who he was when we first got him, but he impressed me early and often. And I like rooting for the underdog guys.

General Reply:

You have come a long way when you can replace the likes of Ruben, Big Phil and Kichen and consider the team improved from last year. I really like this defense. I would have kept big phil but I can understand it. Meder earned his way onto this team. Wynn vs Winn may be the next big camp battle.

You could say that with any cut. You don't make player decisions because somebody "might" get hurt.


We, as in our coaches, felt he wasn't going to make the team. Once a guy is a vet and you know you aren't going to keep him, you cut him in this round. It gives him the chance to shop around a bit rather than seek the first bargain basement offer that comes after the final cuts.

We did it the right way, and as others said, we are getting better. It's not like when we could easily cut ties with Hank Potee or Terry Kirby.

I agree with all of mourg's statement.

We really don't know if they made the right moves, though.

These moves will have to be evaluated after we see how all the principals play.

I don't think Seattle is unhappy w/Reubin.

We'll see.

man some of you guys are hilarious, I was one of the few PT supporters here and am disappointed to see him go... not because he was cut but more because he never got as good as I thought he would.

Now because of a couple plays in a preseason game some of you are acting like he was all he we hoped to be, face it he wasn't, sorry to say

AS Vers reminded me ad naseum he was never in shape, his attitude was suspect and he never achieved the hype.

As far as the money goes... so what... he gets paid the same if he sits on the bench or if he is gone... the bottom line is not affected.

If Pet feels he is not the top 53 and if you watch the DL you will realize he is not then Pet has done what he said he would do... keep the best players regardless of money, or draft status.

Depth... really 3 isn't enough, you want 4? so 7 1/2 % of our daily roster to be NT... don't think so.

AND if it's true he asked for his release that says to me that he sees players better than he is and he will not be able to get his next big contract playing behind Shelton so he needs to be somewhere else.... attitude....

Sorry to say it about a guy I supported but it's time to go.

And yes vers... I WAS WRONG

we have not played one real nfl game with the replacements. we will see.

I am confident Shelton will be a monster for us =) I was so happy when we drafted him =)

Obvious keeps:

Hughes, Bryant(s), Shelton, Cooper, Randy

Most likely: Meder

Questionable: Billy Winn and Dylan Wynn

Billy also just can't stay on the field. Plays very aggressive. I think he's on his last year of the contract, could be traded. Wynn is a victim of a flooded group of talent.

All JMO

Shelton, Cooper, Meder and Starks have really impressed the hell out of me and I was a huge fan of Ruben, Phil and Kichen. I just see more explosiveness and more range out of the new guys.

I think you combine their ability to fire off the snap with this secondary and the potential is there for a scary defense. I know its preseason and I dont put a lot of weight on the team stuff but individually, this group has a set of skills that can make more teams look like Winston did this weekend.

I have to keep telling myself its only preseason but Vers you and I both know The warning signs are there for a premiere defense. If you get Kruger, Cooper, Armonty, Desmond and Meder rushing on a 3rd and long, if i am a QB, I am in panic mode.

You weren't wrong, bro. And even if you were, so what? We are all wrong from time to time. At least you admitted to it.

That sounds weird. I don't think you were wrong in that you were actually right that Phil had very good measurables. He played w/a nasty streak. At times, he showed a good motor. He was quick. Strong. You saw a very good prospect.

You didn't see how out of shape he was. How he asked to come out of the game so many times. You thought the injuries were freakish and random, rather than from being out of shape.

You wanted a guy from your new home state to be the man for your pro team. Nothing wrong w/that, bro. It could have just as easily worked out the other way around and Phil could have been great.

It kinda sucks when a guy you pimped fails. Heck, I pimped Elton Brown like crazy. Thought he was going to be an All Pro guard. He sucked for Arizona. Haven't heard of him since.

It happens, bro..........I'm sorry.

I have to wait and see, Mourg. That's just the way I am.

I do hope you are right, though.

suprised Mingo hasn't been cut yet. he's trash.

cue cfrs15 jumping from the rafters...

Mingo played last year with a wonky shoulder but is good in coverage. Going into his third season, it's too early to give up on him yet.

It's okay, you just don't understand.

If we are willing to cut players with guaranteed money, I wonder if Bowe is more of a possibility to get cut.

i'm a wrong for thinking this guy is turning out to be like that Nate Burleson signing?

i know, just me and 15 have gone at it about mingo. especially in gameday chat.

i just want him to stop getting burned by FB's. that's all i ask.

Burleson wasn't owed any real money though. He also was never expected to be our #1 receiver. If we cut Bowe our off-season upgrade at wide receiver was basically just signing Hartline. That is not good enough.

Jaccobi McDaniel is still a NT on the roster. Has anyone seen this guy do anything? I have not paid attention to this guy at all.

How do you know?