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Hhh

I agree and would be fine with giving Manziel time, weapons and appropriate coaches who know how to best utilize his skills and abilities. This is a huge gamble to build a team around an individual who is so tentative in life. One wrong move and he could be out of the league. Bring in a comparable back up to him who can effectively work in the same type of system and I would feel better.

What a conundrum this situation is. You have your young first rounder Qb displaying clear strides on the field, yet you still have zero faith in his off field actions.

He's one weekend, heck, one evening really, of a media storm and possible suspension/punishment. He's showing decent pocket presence though! What a conundrum!!

Which is something he brought on himself. I'm all for redemption and forgiveness but Manziel needs to realize he needs to be cleaner and less "out there" than other players who do not have his reputation. I don't care if that's "not fair", it is what it is. He needs a good 2-3 year run where he is only in the media for football reasons and mostly positive, then things will calm down a little.

Johnny Manziel pleads for continuity in Cleveland

Posted by Darin Gantt on December 21, 2015, 10:04 AM EST
link

It’s far from a given that the Browns have cast their lot with Johnny Manziel for the long term.

But for what it’s worth, Manziel has cast his with coach Mike Pettine and the current cast of characters there.

Manziel said, in the wake of a loss to the Seahawks that dropped them to 3-11, that he hopes the Browns go for continuity this offseason instead of yet another overhaul, as he works under his second offensive coordinator in as many years.

“The [Seahawks] have been doing this for awhile at a really high level,” Manziel said, via Mary Kay Cabot of the Cleveland Plain Dealer. “I think this is the best that he’s [Russell Wilson’s] played probably throughout his career, so I don’t know if I can really picture that [kind of stability] moving forward. We’ll see what happens. I don’t think anybody really knows. I want these guys to be here next year.

“I want to have these receivers and the people that we have on this roster on the staff so we can go through the spring and not have to learn what this call is and this play and be able to go through a spring and have some of the continuity like. So it definitely would be a luxury for sure.”

While I’m sure that makes Pettine feel much better, no one knows who will survive the offseason in Cleveland. Last week, when Manziel was speculating about a future with suspended wideout Josh Gordon, Pettine replied: “That would turn out to be a positive thing if Josh is with us next year and Johnny’s on the roster, that those two have built a rapport together.”

That was more a hypothetical than an endorsement or an omen, as no one can know what the future holds there other than Jimmy Haslam, assuming he’s met with his homeless oracle and decided himself.

Of course, the differences between the Seahawks and the Browns go beyond time spent punching the clock together. And another year of Pettine and/or Manziel might not necessarily be moving them in the right direction.

But after changing course so often, it would at least be a direction.

Do you think that Johnny elevates the play of his teammates?

He has never had his head on straight for a long period of time.

I think he does

Best QB since the team has been back and if they build around him it may start to get a little exciting.

Why are you so judgmental toward Johnny ?

Why do you follow the Johnny threads and do nothing but insult and degrade Johnny ?

Why are you so negative about a player who may just help this team win ?

You have a very personal vendetta against Johnny, almost like you feel your on a high horse and you are the perfect human being in the world..

I can see why Vers and others have put you on the ignore list, It really is disturbing how you post such negative and insulting posts against Johnny..

Makes me think he turned you down on a date or something.

Maybe you would prefer we had Tebow, Yeah lets go Tebowing.. that will turn this team around...lmao!!!!

It's becoming obvious your becoming a post counter..

I don't even know what a post counter is, so it is hard to be that.

I have made it very clear that I liked Manziel and was happy we drafted him (I am sure that is available somewhere in the archives).

I also wanted him to start at the beginning of the season.

I think he is very physically gifted and have defended him recently in that area.

I would love it if he was our QB of the future, I just don't think he has played enough to make that determination and I believe their are better QBs in this draft with no off the field issues.

It sounds like you just don't want to hear the truth. Manziel has acted like a jackass since he was a freshman in college. He has never had his head on straight for a sustained period of time.

j/c

I believe anyone with an open mind can see a vast improvement in JFF this year. I also believe that those who are purely negative are those trying to compare him to a finished product which he most certainly is not. Looking at him as a QB who has less than 10 starts under his belt, there are certainly things to be optimistic about.

There are however reasons to believe that this FO, owner and coaches have little to no confidence in JFF off the field. Now I don't believe that we on the outside know the entire story. We only know what is leaked out. But there are things going on behind the scene we simply don't have a clue about.

So with all things being equal, I hope whatever is going on behind the scenes do not create an atmosphere that calls for this FO to go in a different direction at the QB position.

Has JFF proven he can be a franchise QB? No, I don't believe he has. Will this four game stretch answer all the questions about JFF being our franchise QB? No, I don't think so. But if the next two weeks go as his last two starts have, I believe that's enough to roll the dice for another season. It appears he is developing and hasn't given up on this team. I see no reason this team should give up on him.

jmho

Theres not a QB in this draft worth taking in first round. I think you spend the picks and get some weapons, use 2016 to evaluate and if you're wrong, you're picking high again anyways and go and get a QB, But from what I've seen, Manziel has a pretty good football IQ, he just needs some weapons. He has plenty of arm and his moxie on the field is second to none. He doesn't wilt under pressure. Problem is he has no running game and wr's shorter than he is..get him a big wr corp and a running game and watch the PA bombs to Gordon. I'm all for keeping the coaching staff on the offensive side. I think they've done a decent job with the crap they were given by farmer.

Picking high and picking in the top two are not the same. We have been terrible for a decade and haven't picked this high.

If it is determined that there is a franchise guy available, we have to pick him.

The truth is, I don't dwell or keep judging the past,

The truth is, I believe people grow and mature.

The truth is, I know what he did.

The truth is, I don't know what he is capable of doing to help this team win.

The truth is, I prefer to give someone a chance , like I have been given.



That's the truth, but guess what ? Don't you think it's time to just put that behind ?

You stated some good positive points about him. Wouldn't it be better, to try and build on those then to dwell on the past ?

You are way to smart to know picking up another QB in the first round won't help this team.. Are you going to expect him to keep throwing to the same receivers that dropped 5-6 passes this last game ?

Is he going to have a running game to help him succeed ?

You know damn well we never build around our QB's, that's why they fail...

Can you put Johnnys past on hold for now, and give him some support to learn on how to become a better QB for the sake of this team ?

Lets try something new.. Lets try giving the QB some weapons and time.. It might just work.

How awesome would it be to see Manziel and Gordon tearing
up the league for the Browns.. It could happen, really it could.

I have no problem picking up a QB prospect in the later rounds, but we need help in other area's besides QB.

But all of this is speculation, Until we know who the HC and GM are next season, there may not be any of the QB's left from this season..

I agree.

If the organization sees Goff as a franchise QB- draft him. Stop being cute and trying to "win the draft" and draft what helps your team win. A franchise QB does that more than any other player. I feel like people are more interested in potential than actual results.

So wouldn't picking up Goff be for potential ? How do you know the actual results ?

Because A N Y T H I N G is better than what we have, don't cha know.

No.....

Depends on how the organization feels. I WANT Manziel to be given another chance. However, if they feel Goff would win them more games than Manziel then draft him.

I don't live in a fairy tale world where track record doesn't matter.

If we were to keep the current coaching staff I would be more inclined to want to keep Manziel. I don't think we are keeping the current coaching staff. That means Manziel starts from square one again.



http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2015/12/johnny_manziel_calls_for_brown.html

I don't dislike Manziel. I just don't know if he gives us the best chance to win. If he returns next season as our starter he will have my full support.

I hope they feel no QB will win as long as he doesn't have a good core around him..

Imo, no QB can come in here as a rookie and win with the receivers we have now.

I agree, I want to see Johnny for another season. No more rookies and no more McCown, he needs to mentor and spit that gum out.. I swear my horses didn't chomp as bad as he did sitting on the sidelines with JM....lol

I do to.

I didn't want to draft him in the first place, but I'm over that. I've liked what i've seen on the field so far from him, enough to say keep him & start him next year. And draft him a tall receiver or two for him to throw to. No more receivers under 3 feet - we have enough.

I think we should stick with Manziel, although I get that new management might not want the baggage. If we do keep him, I also get that his life problems present a higher than normal possibility of him not being able to live up to his potential. So drafting another QB prospect is not a bad plan, on the face of it. There are several concerns, first, drafting a QB high means not addressing other obvious needs on a team that has many obvious needs. Second, drafting yet another high-pick QB will inevitably bring pressure on the management to install the new guy UNLESS it is made plain from the start that the drafted QB is a 2 year project.

If Manziel is traded, then we have to get the best QB in this draft. I have read valid arguments for Lynch, Goff and Cook. I also wouldn't ignore Wentz and Jones. If Manziel stays, I would draft for weapons early, and focus on a 3-5 round QB and make it clear he is a 2 year project. And lets not forget that drafting isn't the only way to get a QB. Signing a FA of value seems unlikely, but not impossible, and trading for one is a possibility.

Well, he's only potentially better than what we have LOL

Is your way of thinking because Pet is hard on him and keeps him grounded.. ( whether or not agreed with )

Flip and O'Connell are doing a good job transitioning him to be an NFL QB.




Is that bad ? it could be good.. won't know until it materializes..

One thing I did find awkward.. At first Pet seemed sour on Johnny because he didn't stay in the pocket enough..

Against the Seahawks Johnny really held back and stayed in the pocket.. He really seemed he was trying to do what the coaches asked of him..

During the game there were times I would say , "just run Johnny " and he didn't, he held on to the ball, and there was no good play.

Now at half time.. Pet says..Johnny needs to use his feet more.. I'm like What ? Holy cow terds this kid is getting mixed messages...

Stay in the pocket.. no, use your feet... Hey, Why don't we give Johnny time to learn to balance between staying in the pocket, and knowing when to use his feet.

Maybe the new coaching staff/ GM might get JM some weapons to help him, because the one we have now thinks these short butter finger guys are the thing..



That... Damn near brought tears to my eyes....

No. I would want to keep Manziel with the current coaching staff because we aren't going to hire anywhere significant and tell them, "You have to start Manziel."

Also, three systems in three years would be death.



I don't know why. I was fully behind Manziel at the start of the season and wanted him to start multiple times throughout the season.

I was making fun of the ones on here who actually seem to believe that just any ole thing is better than what we currently have by virtue of being something else.

Probably should have used purple.

I knew what you meant.. that's why the smiley face was there

I thought he did a bit last week.

This week was really tough. The Seahawks didn't punt until the second half, and the Browns only had 7 possessions. The drops were killer, but more than that, when you're this offense, you can't have a defense giving up points on every single drive. You just can't have it.

Not a whole lot Johnny could have done yesterday. However, there are some things I think he could really work on. The short throws to the flat, for one. He either misses completely, or he doesn't put the ball in a spot for the receiver to catch it in motion. The receiver either has to catch behind him, or jump up (insert short WR joke here). On those routes, the ball has to be placed perfectly. You have a second to maybe a second and and a half to catch, secure, and make the one move on the initial defender to make your play. Brady is phenomenal at it. Manning in his prime... Rodgers, Ben, etc... That is the type of play that can soften the box. When we think of stretching the field, we always think vertical, but it works sideline to sideline as well. When teams have to worry about a WR or RB juking one guy and getting loose, you start to direct more attention that way.

If he could get that down, I think he has a promising outlook going forward. He clearly can get the ball downfield. He can do all of the outside the pocket stuff. He could really be quite a dangerous QB with good and accurate short passes.

You would really think that should be a point of focus right now anyway, since we don't have big receivers, and rely on speed and shiftiness.

I don't think we'll do very good in KC on Sunday, but I truly believe the Browns have a great chance to upset the Steelers in week 17, and how often have we really been able to say that? I really don't think this team has quit at all. They're just not very good, and the coaching isn't helping. IN a finale where maybe the guys rally around their probably departed coach, they an at least send him out with a win.

Back in the day coach Brown would have given him(JM) a swift kick
in the pants on his way out the door. . . . LAST YEAR! Brown ran a
tight ship.

Yeah, like PB did w/Jim Brown.

Paul Brown was a great innovator, but not a very good coach. His ego got in the way too much and he didn't treat players fairly and that is why he became a dinosaur.

Paul Brown is a Bengal. Not a Brown, even though his last name is Brown. LOL

???

Don't agree with everything in your post, but that is the first thing that came to my mind.

2 or 3 question marks would have been sufficient.

What is most painful about this whole saga is that Pettine and Farmer do not seem to have agreed about the selection of Manziel from the start. If Pettine wanted a drop back QB, Carr was there for the taking.

*General reply to catch up...*

If, and IF Manziel plays solid to finish out the season, I am actually comfortable not drafting a QB this year provided we keep the current group of QBs. I think McCown can play #2 in the league for at least one more season, and I don't think his contributions in developing Manziel can be discounted. Plus, given where Manziel was at the end of last season, I'd like to see how much more progress he can make under O'Connell, Flip, and YES Pettine.

I really don't think anyone thinks Manziel can prove he is a franchise guy by the end of the season, but I think there's enough opportunity for him to make a case to be the starter next season. I guess my standard for that would be for him to finish on par with the production we've gotten out of the QB position this season which has been pretty consistent. In other words, if the end of the season was instead the midseason Bye, would you continue to play him?

If he makes a case to start, I think the only way you draft a QB high is if you are really high on him and really believe he has a significant chance at becoming franchise level.

What this offense really needed this year was a legit game breaker or 2. If we had that I'd bet even McCown would have been on pace for a Pro Bowl year.

Agreed. We have a team that's full of 'complimentary players,' but no players who scare DC's into altering their game plans. No real consistent threat outside of Barnage. No stars.

I believe we have the same problem on D. Whit's known as a thumper, but we don't really have those 2 or 3 guys who give a D its identity. Think Lewis/Reed/Suggs.

It's one of the reasons I hate to consider another blow-up in the front office. There's a team that only needs 3-5 difference-makers to compete with the rest of the AFCN. The rest of the team is in place.

It's frustrating.

and some of us don't