DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Everything Else... Why Some Whites are Flocking Towards Trump

Neoliberalism is just as dangerous as fascism, don't get it twisted. Neoliberalism will keep you working till 80 just to afford retirement, while fascism will have you working in a camp till you die. Both are ploys.

Hitler also got rid of the right to bear arms which is a big goal of Democrats, especially Hillary.

Or am I wrong about that?

While I like the topics you bring up, you did start this thread and the topic is Trump.

Maybe if you would post your thoughts on changing the system the topic will take that turn again. I'd like to hear what you have to say on it.

You're wrong.

I dunno but a handful of democrats wanting a full on ban on guns.

That's as false as saying the biggest thing republicans want is a government ran by the bible. Only a handful of nut jobs actually want that.

Please explain how he is a fascist. This ought to be good.

I'll start with this as reason #1 why he is not: Donald Trump received more votes in the Republican primaries than any Republican candidate ever has.

Here's a question for you: which side has tried to silence which during this election season? Was it the Trump supporters who regularly got 'shut down' by rival groups or was it the Bernie supporters who got 'shut down'? (I still have not really seen a significant amount of people who are pro-Hillary but I suppose this could apply to her supporters as well). Who are the ones who got attacked, unprovoked, by angry mobs?

That's funny.

Last time I checked, the first act of violence from a mob was a trump supporter who sucker punched the black dude at a rally.

And then said, and I quote "next time we might have to kill him"

Why you always leaving out good bits of information bro?

That was not the first act of violence. Maybe it was the first one widely reported or just the first one that you remember.

It also wasn't a mob-- it was one lone old man. In fact, I can literally count two occasions where there has been unprovoked violence on an Anti-Trump person this whole time. One was the incident you are referencing. The other was a strikingly similar incident where a black male Trump supporter sucker punched a white protester under very similar circumstances. Again, an isolated incident by a lone person, but it is interesting that one was not widely reported. I'm not sure if it was because the media was uncomfortable showing a black person assaulting a white person? Maybe they were uncomfortable showing a black Trump supporter? Maybe it is a bit irresponsible of me to speculate on this-- let's just call it random chance and leave it at that.

The violence directed at Trump supporters has been by mobs and it has been nasty. They've been brought up on here a lot. I've posted many of the videos myself. Lots of unprovoked attacks, the San Jose rally alone had gangs of people tormenting the Trump supporters. One dude got nailed in the head with a bag of rocks (literally), one chick got cornered and pelted with eggs, another got chased down and tackled. There was a lot of disturbing stuff. The other thing that stood out to me at the time was the amount of ridiculous justification there was for such behavior. If things happened the other way around, oh my goodness.

You are saying that Hillary is an example of neo-liberalism?

The national socialist party elected Hitler. Guess that means he's not a fascist? Lol what? Just because a bunch of Republicans couldn't decide between 16 candidates means he's not a fascist? What type of logic is that? Because there was an election he's not a fascist? Don't make me laugh.

Trump wants to have a national registry of Muslims, which is essentially like rounding them up to major cities. We're a Mosque away from having A Night of Broken Glass in America under Trump.

Also, if we're talking about the media and the candidates. There's only been one candidate who has mocked a reporter's disability because he disliked them.

Yes, as was Obama and Bush.

That was the first one.

It's funny how you go "that was a lone person" when it's your side, and an angry mob when it's people you don't support.

I don't like any of the anti trump protestors and rioters. That crap was dumb.

But to sit there and act like one side is completely clean while the other isn't smells funny.

I'm not certain I meant a "full-on BAN" of guns. But it's simple common knowledge that she wants to enact very strong gun control laws. It's one of her big issues.

I don't care about it enough to posts links to the scores of articles on this very same issue. A simple google search of "Hillary and guns" will provide more than enough facts.

I just went back and read what I said that you responded to. So rather than say she'll get rid of the second ammendment I'll just say she'll make it as hard as possible to arm oneself.

By which definition is Hillary a neoliberal?

By her support of capital commanding labor and doing anything she can to keep that dynamic.

I do remember that comment from Trump and I do not agree with that. He backed off from that long ago. Not to excuse it but I do not think you understand the extent of the surveillance society in 2016. There is an enormous amount of information out there about you, me, and everybody on this board in various databases out there controlled by a wide range of actors. Think various government agencies, Google, advertising companies, etc. Something as overt as religion is not in any way private in today's society. That information is already out there, for a price. The amount of data mining that is going out there is beyond comprehension.

Again, I'm not justifying that comment. He made that a long time ago and he seems to recognize the unAmerican nature of what he suggested. I'm not even convinced he believed in it himself as much as some rhetoric got the best of him. I believe his current position is to indefinitely suspend immigration from countries that are overrun with terrorism, until such a time as we can figure out a way to safely and reliably vet people who come into our country. That is a completely sensible position. In fact, that more than balances out his previous comment on the grounds that he is the only person with the guts to talk about actual solutions. It is not fascist to suspend immigration from a country. Obama did it a few years ago from Iraq and it was the reasonable thing to do. Trump's position is just a little more broad, after all, the Middle East is far less stable now than it was even five years ago.

From CHS, this ideology scares the crap out of me and if we ever get to that point I hope I'm dead and gone when it occurs.
I like competition personally, and to say you can't collaborate with competition is ridiculous as well. I feel pretty free myself, but to each his own.

chs's comment actually sounds like communism multiplied.

Destroy the class system. Sounds great in theory. But what it means is, in reality, destroy ourselves. Make everyone financially equal. Dude working at McDonalds gets the same as the guy running a multi million dollar company. That's only fair, right? That person living on welfare? Hey, they need more money, right?

Damn right, let's get rid of the monetary system. Eliminate it. I shouldn't have to pay my bills, YOU should have to pay my bills, right?

Let's be "civilized" and everyone pulls their share. Right. That'll happen. I know if it does, my butt won't be working 6 days a week. I won't be sweating my ass off so I can be equal with those that don't do anything.

Did you all hear that? I will be entitled. Not to my house though. Not 2 my 2 acres of ground. I will be entitled to live in gov't. housing. In crime ridden, murderous areas. But, at least someone else will pay for it.........................wait, no, no one else will pay for it as we'll all be sitting our asses around waiting for the gub'mint check.

I agree, completely.
It would take an Stalin-esque purge of the "elite", but even then, I doubt that it would have much effect beyond a temporary changing of the players.


The entire issue reminds me of the cartoon below.
While it is delivered as humor, the truth behind it is much darker, much truer. I really, truthfully no longer distinguish between the Al Capones and Hillary Clintons, and while the Clinton's may perhaps be the most extreme example, I'd be willing to bet that they are simply just the best known extreme example, and I'm not limiting this to one side of the aisle or another.

Trump was talking about it today at his rally. That's the only reason I even thought to bring it up. He also talked about Megyn Kelly having her period, and being mean to him because of that, today as well. Again, if you want to talk about a candidate who tries to silence others, then look no further than the orange blob who uses peoples' disabilities to invalidate them, and when he can't, he'll use a biological function to invalidate them.

No offense, but you don't really know what you're talking about when it comes to our security state. It's not as simple as Google, Apple, FBI, CIA, and the NSA having all of our data -- which you're right, they do -- however, they do not share their info with the others. Actually, most of the private industries have strongly refused sharing their data with the government. But besides that.. The FBI, CIA, and NSA are completely different organizations and do not share a lot of intel with each other. They do not consolidate lists or anything of that matter. So while you could be investigated by the FBI, the CIA might not have a file on you. Now, what Trump is talking about, is compiling a real intact list, instead of just a bunch of incomplete lists. That's what is very scary about this. Maybe the majority wouldn't have to worry about the list, but if you're a minority, then you should be very concerned.

You're right. It's not fascist to suspend immigration from a country. It is fascism when you want to start tracking people because of their religious affiliation. Don't believe me?

Can you find where I said that???????????????????????????????

A nugget from this summer:

I visited the national Holocaust memorial museum in DC this summer. I had a chance to speak with a couple of Holocaust survivors. While waiting, I heard each of them talking with other groups. These groups, different people and in different locations in the waiting area, asked these two survivors about Trump; both of these survivors were located nowhere close to each other. Both of these survivors immediately drew comparisons to Hitler.

I'll leave it at that. 40, you live in D.C.? Maybe head to the museum, and talk to a couple of survivors about it.

--------------------------

The irony about my visit? I came across a family decked out in full Trump regalia from head to toe. I wish I could make this whole post up, but it happened while I visited the museum.

Been there at least 5 times. Very moving.

Once when Hillary came by those same two survivors were wondering what happened to their wallets.

See, it isn't hard to say something you have no proof of, but nice try.

You expect the monetary system to be blown up but still expect a check and a bill????????????????????????????????????? Are you just hysterical or something worse?

Time for someones meds and a nap.

Well, "collaboration instead of competition", sorry if I didn't interpret that correctly.

Actually, Trump has put forth a very non-interventionist, at time, almost isolationist foreign policy. I see no chances that he would try to order the military to invade and take over our closest neighbors. I also see no evidence that Trump s a Socialist, like Hitler was.

Unless, of course, you meant that Hillary could be Hitler.

Except for taking out their families.

Sounds real isolationist, apparently.

I did not watch Trump's rally today so I can't really comment on that. However, I'm skeptical of taking at face value somebody else's attribution of what he said, because I have seen over and over how his words are taken out of context with the worst possible interpretation applied to those words that were already out of context to begin with. Over, and over, and over again.

And of course, sometimes he says silly things. He has legitimately taken things too far. I have always conceded that, but those times are in the minority, and are usually blown out of proportion themselves. Again, just speaking in generalities because I really haven't paid much attention to politics these last couple days.

Think about some of the crap he has to deal with. So a veteran gifted him a purple heart the other day. I didn't follow that story closely, but from what I gather, many people were very upset with Trump for accepting that gift and not giving it back. I'm sure Donald knows that he (himself) did not earn that medal, but I can only imagine what the headlines would have been if he had rejected that gift. Maybe something like, "Dark Donald shoves Purple heart into the face of a war hero!!1!"

Exaggeration perhaps, but how about this: the recipient of that prestigious medal earned it the hard way. It is his right to give that to anybody he feels is deserving, and what a selfless decision by that man to gift it to Donald Trump. My experience is that it is usually best to graciously accept others' gifts, even if I don't feel I am needing or deserving of that gift. Perhaps Donald Trump feels the same way.

It could have been written clearer, for sure. Although I didn't think it would be taken that way. I am a major fan of competition. Not only is it THE biological force driving life, it's also best for everyone. As the Bible says, "Iron sharpens iron like man sharpens man". However, I believe, over the past few decades we have seen us become too competitive with our fellow citizens and friends. A shift back to getting us to be more collaborative would be the best. We see a lot of people here asking why we aren't as friendly towards each other as we once were. Well, I think our focus on being very competitive with each other has caused this slip.

Telling Mexico they'll build a wall upon our Southern border and then pay for it is non-interventionist? Weird. I see that as weilding power over a sovereign country. I think Donald has pushed a non-interventionist policy because he doesn't understand global politics. He was in Scotland praising the Brexit the other month, after Scotland overwhelmingly voted to go against Brexit. Hitler wasn't a socialist. The term was very nouveau in the 20's and 40's. Many people from all political sides called themselves that. However, if you examine the economy of Nazi Germany, you see a lot deregulation and a lot of capitalistic enterprises to take place. I wouldn't put too much stock into the name. It's a useless label. A good analogy would be calling George McGovern a modern day democrat.

Hillary doesn't want to register all Muslims, now does she?

No, she just wants to flood America with Muslims from war zones.
Isn't it the Presidents job to protect Americans and America first?

Can't say I disagree with that assessment.

When coupled with your wanting to remove all monetary systems it was easy for me to go down the path of you not wanting competition as well.

Me neither. I follow a lot of reporters on twitter however and they do care about the news and tend to follow it. Again, he just briefly mentioned it. He didn't say anything. Here's a transcript of it:

https://twitter.com/SopanDeb/status/760947560613806080

Actually, I'm glad you bring up the Purple Heart comment. Unsurprisingly you frame Trump as the victim. Either out of habit or just being unaware of the real situation. Yes, people are mad that Donald Trump took a "Purple Heart" but more people are upset that Donald Trump lied about the whole ordeal (Surprising, I know). Trump originally claimed it was a real purple heart even though he was told by the person who gave it to him that it was a replica and wasn't the real award. So Trump goes out there and lies about getting an original and he makes a big deal that it's real. So of course, when the guy who gives it to him, tells us, like he told Donald, that the purple heart was a replica, people got mad that Trump against once lied to them and tried to play them all like fools.

Trump's actually a funny dude. Very smart too. I don't know how well read he is, but he's certainly read The Art of War. He takes everything he does from those 90 or so axioms. If you read the Art of War and then listen to Trump, you'll be able to tell. He is very much the living embodiment of, "Appear weak when you are strong, and strong when you are weak.”

Again, very smart dude.

Hitler wasn't a Socialist?

Here are some of the 25 points of the Nazi Party:

That all unearned income, and all income that does not arise from work, be abolished.

We demand the nationalization of all trusts.

We demand profit-sharing in large industries.

We demand a generous increase in old-age pensions.

We demand the creation and maintenance of a sound middle-class, the immediate communalization of large stores which will be rented cheaply to small tradespeople, and the strongest consideration must be given to ensure that small traders shall deliver the supplies needed by the State, the provinces and municipalities.

We demand an agrarian reform in accordance with our national requirements, and the enactment of a law to expropriate the owners without compensation of any land needed for the common purpose. The abolition of ground rents, and the prohibition of all speculation in land.

We demand that ruthless war be waged against those who work to the injury of the common welfare. Traitors, usurers, profiteers, etc., are to be punished with death, regardless of creed or race.

In order to make it possible for every capable and industrious German to obtain higher education, and thus the opportunity to reach into positions of leadership, the State must assume the responsibility of organizing thoroughly the entire cultural system of the people. The curricula of all educational establishments shall be adapted to practical life. The conception of the State Idea (science of citizenship) must be taught in the schools from the very beginning. We demand that specially talented children of poor parents, whatever their station or occupation, be educated at the expense of the State.

The State has the duty to help raise the standard of national health by providing maternity welfare centers, by prohibiting juvenile labor, by increasing physical fitness through the introduction of compulsory games and gymnastics, and by the greatest possible encouragement of associations concerned with the physical education of the young.

We demand that there be a legal campaign against those who propagate deliberate political lies and disseminate them through the press. In order to make possible the creation of a German press, we demand:

(a) All editors and their assistants on newspapers published in the German language shall be German citizens.

(b) Non-German newspapers shall only be published with the express permission of the State. They must not be published in the German language.

(c) All financial interests in or in any way affecting German newspapers shall be forbidden to non-Germans by law, and we demand that the punishment for transgressing this law be the immediate suppression of the newspaper and the expulsion of the non-Germans from the Reich.

Newspapers transgressing against the common welfare shall be suppressed. We demand legal action against those tendencies in art and literature that have a disruptive influence upon the life of our folk, and that any organizations that offend against the foregoing demands shall be dissolved.

We demand freedom for all religious faiths in the state, insofar as they do not endanger its existence or offend the moral and ethical sense of the Germanic race.

The party as such represents the point of view of a positive Christianity without binding itself to any one particular confession. It fights against the Jewish materialist spirit within and without, and is convinced that a lasting recovery of our folk can only come about from within on the principle:

COMMON GOOD BEFORE INDIVIDUAL GOOD

In order to carry out this program we demand: the creation of a strong central authority in the State, the unconditional authority by the political central parliament of the whole State and all its organizations.

The formation of professional committees and of committees representing the several estates of the realm, to ensure that the laws promulgated by the central authority shall be carried out by the federal states.

Some of these are straight Socialism ..... and would be wholeheartedly supported by many people today.

The Syrian refugees bombed us already?

When?

I'm searching for a link about any of the 1,100 refugees bombing us here in America yet.

Could you help me out, 40?

Sorry I didn't try and record this for you. Figured the sanctity of the moment, along with the individuals, conquered any sort of proof for 40 to accept.

You are kidding right. Not even close to what I said.

Yeah. I get it. There's a reason why I don't actively spout these ideas off. They're very jarring, very different than what most on here are used to and a lot of conclusions can be jumped to. I learned that I would have to post treatise and wall of texts to be able to get my point across without need for interpretations. But when Vers asked for mine and everyone else's honest opinion, I couldn't resist. These convos are best for real life though, because I don't have the drive to explain all that on a Browns forum.

Don't worry all. I'm a damned communist, not a dirty damned communist.

I have not read that book. It's an old classic though and one that I've meant to read but just haven't ever gotten around to it.

Trump is very smart and crafty. I actually am suspicious of people who say otherwise, because that much is very obvious, even if reasonable people can and do differ on how he uses that craftiness.

There are some on this board who underestimate his chances because they do not realize how skilled of a persuader he is and how well he uses the media to his advantage, despite the fact that almost all mainstream media is against him. Case in point: every political thread eventually turns into a Trump thread. just an observation.