DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Offensive Coordinator

This comes up every year. Any non-head coaching position is considered a lateral move. Why would the Chiefs just give Matt Nagy or Dave Toub to us for nothing?

I think that Hue and Dorsey will work together. I understand that people are used to the dysfunction of previous regimes, but I believe we have the right people in place.

I would like to see Al Saunders promoted to OC and perhaps hire Zampese to take over the WR unit.

He would need permission, but with Toub especially the chance to move up may be enough for the Chiefs to say yes.

The fact that they haven't been interviewed may mean that the Chiefs have already said no.

By now Hue should have developed some assistant to run the O. What if he died or got in to an accident?

To me, the head coach coaches his coaches. More then he does his players. That is why you have assistant coaches, to coach their position players.

In business, the Manager directs his or her assistants. The assistant managers direct the crew.

I think Al Saunders could step right in. I think he was running a very close version of this offense before Hue was.

Al Saunders is a very good coach and has a ton of respect around the league. I really hope he is our next OC.

For some reason, I don't think he's being considered or they would have just promoted him instead of going through interviews.

I don't think Rooney rules apply simply to head coaching and FO positions.

They would have just did the token interview if that was the case.

Saunders is a good coach, but the offensive Brain trust in Berea is stale. We need an offensive coordinator who understands run pass option concepts, how to run out of the shotgun and need to use Njoku and Duke as mismatches more.

Nagy would fit that description. KC looked like a completely different offense this year.

It's all opinion, but I don't think our concepts are stale.

I think we have an inferior qb and inferior WRs. I also think our TEs are inconsistent.

I do not believe we should change offensive philosophies.

I believe that once we start burning teams via the pass, that Hue will run the ball more. I believe that because that is his history.

I believe that a lot of people don't realize just how compromised we were by the personnel we put on the field this year.

Got to give you credit. You put a lot of faith in a coach with a pretty pitiful record.


You and Jimmy must see the same things.

I played the game. I coached the game. I scouted the game.

I have never said Hue was great. In fact, I used to question him when all loved him. However, I think the blame is misplaced. I think he is adequate. I think we are better off w/him than starting over again. That's all.

Maybe the concepts aren't stale. Maybe a team can still win playing in an archaic offense. I haven't seen an NFL team win like that, but I'm sure they exist. Today's offenses are a lot different than they were in the early aughts.

I don't want us to change offensive philosophies as much as I want them to update them to the modern game. Hue's always done well with spot passing and isolation routes for WRs and TEs.

I think traditional football focuses too much how many defenders are in the box vs. them needing to think of how many more defenders are in the box than blockers? That's a good question to ask the Browns. They ran a lot in 21, 13 and 12 and faced a lot of stacked boxes as a result. Below is a picture to illustrate.



The Steelers have 8 in the box, but the Browns have 7 blockers in this formation (as well as other traditional formations). So if everyone were to block their man perfectly, Crow would have to break a tackle somewhere ~the LOS just to have a chance at a big gain. It would serve them better to split out Njoku or not have a fullback in the formation at all. You just gotta put your team in a position to win, no matter the personnel.

A sad thing of note, the Steelers will stack 8 men in the box and still play their safety closer than the Browns.

Correct me if I’m wrong, but a current team can’t say no if it is for a promotion.

I didn't have problems with the offensive concepts.
I felt the game plans lacked cohesion. You mention the heavy package concepts. If a team is going to use those on 1st downs then it makes sense to also run play-action as constraint plays from those same formations in the same down and distances they run from. Otherwise the defense is will get a bead on the what we do from certain formations in certain down and distances.

e.g. There were some games where Hue never called play-action from the 1st down run formations he kept using.

One of the best runs of the season came from the under used shotgun. The bulk of the passing game is from spread personnel which almost universally invites nickel defenses. Nickel defenses should be easier to run against and imho should make up the bulk of the run offense. But the nickel run game seemed like an after thought. The run concepts from nickel were very basic.
When I remember Hue as a playcaller i recall well designed run concepts like this:

But imo those were too few and far between this year.

I think we also relied too much on iso routes and didn't do enough to scheme receivers open through combo, rub/pick and routes designed to beat the coverage as opposed to reliant on the receiver winning.
The snugs formation is a good example of the type of concepts I wanted to see more of:

The formation gave Njoku a free release w/ a natural pick rub against his defender and gave Kizer and easy read and easy throw.

I thought Hue was way too focused on pushing the ball downfield vertically and not focused enough on higher efficiency plays.

Imo having another voice on the staff, game plan meetings and self scouting would have done wonders for the offense this year. And its why I think hiring an OC is gonna really help Hue/offense. I remember Hue as a OC turned HC/playcaller in Oakland and he was damn good there. He took a bunch of castoffs and turned them into a highly productive group.

Yeah.

Rosen to Gordon is the next Manning to Harrison!

Add Barcley as the next Faulk!

Njoku is better than anything Manning had at TE.

You are right, but all assistant coaches are now viewed as equal. The only promotion would be if given a chance to be the head coach. Any move to make him a coordinator would need permission.

Thanks, I didn’t know that had changed.

Ed, when you have an HC that draws game plans that push for 2/3 plays to be pass plays, with disregard to the WR's he has, the QB he has and the weather, what makes you confident that HE can gameplan appropriately?

When you have an HC that approves a defense that plays deep safety with the worst FS in the league, and time and time again all-out blitz and get burned in most critical situations in the game.

I'm all for establishing a team identity, but I think you have to be really incompetent to try to force a team identity without the necessary parts.

What is going to happen in games where its necessary to adapt and change philosophies to win games.

Hue has showed time and time again that he is far from being a football mastermind, I actually say that he's outsmarting himself most of the time, like calling 66% pass plays against the best best Pass D in the leagues, with Kizer under center and bad weather...

In his 32 games here, I never saw any hints that Hue could be a good HC or OC. You talk Hue's about Oakland stint,but just take a good look at the Oakland roster in 2011...

QB Carson Palmer
RB Michael Bush/ Darren McFaden
Wr Heyward Bey/T.J Houshmandzadeh/Denarius Moor
TE: Brandon Myers/Kevin Boss

On D he had players like Desmond Bryant, Richard Seymour, Aaron Curry, Rolando McClain, Quentin Groves, Michael Huff, etc

Hue was fired on the end of the season. People talk like Hue won something, or showed greatness but honestly I can't see it.

All I see is the last of Al Davies Coache's...

If memory doesn't fail me (which it often does), he was the OC for the Raiders when Hue was their HC. Since he is aging, he may want a less stressful role, but that's purely speculation on my part.