DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum Ohio State/CFB continued

At the end of the day, I still think if OU beats Texas, they would jump OSU again, no matter how bad they beat Northwestern...

If OSU beats Northwestern (Handily) theBuckeyes will make the playoffs and believe me that is one team Saban and Bama do not want to play ... JMHO

hope you're right

Saban Vs. Urban

Conference titles — Saban: 6 (1 Mid-American, 5 SEC), Meyer: 5 (2 Mountain West, 2 SEC, 1 Big Ten)
Conference championship record — Saban: 5-1 (SEC), Meyer: 3-1 (2-1 SEC, 1-0 Big Ten)
National titles — Saban: 4 (1 LSU, 3 Alabama), Meyer: 3 (2 Florida, 1 Ohio State)
National championship game record — Saban: 4-0; Meyer: 3-0
BCS/New Year’s Six record — Saban: 5-3, Meyer: 6-1

Head to Head 2-2

Meyer has 2 Big Ten titles

j/c

so the only way we get in is if Georgia and oklahoma lose.

i dunno if thats gonna happen with oklahoma.

I can't see any OSU movement by beating Northwestern unless everybody lose.


Georgia is going to be the team screwed. Georgia is a great team that will probably be bumped if they don't win against Bama. They are way better than #5 or #6.


Good gosh, a 3 loss Northwestern is the best the Big 10 can get in to the championship game? Sad.

4 loss northwestern team sir ...

They should just let 2 - 5 play for 2nd this year ... talk about anti-climatic ...

Ill be extremely excited to see how we fair against Clemson f it happens .. if we happen to get by them ... i won’t be very excited for the national championship game ... how sad is that ...

N.W. has 4 losses.

But it is what it is. The big 10 was split into 2 divisions. The winner of 1 division has to play the winner of the other division.

Will playing NW help the bucks? No. Would playing n.w. and losing hurt the Buckeyes? Heck yeah.

But, they have to play the games on the schedule.

j/c:

Can someone tell me if Oklahoma has a win that is better than Ohio State's victory over Michigan?

I don't believe they do.

Biggest issue for the bucks? The spanking they took from Purdue.

Nope. They also don't have one better than their win over Penn State.

Ohio State currently has wins over #7 Michigan and #12 Penn State with a date with #21 Northwestern.

Oklahoma has wins over #14 West Virginia and #23 Iowa State. They have a date with #15 Texas.

They have one common opponent in TCU, Oklahoma went to TCU and won 52-27. Ohio State beat TCU on a neutral field 40-28.

A lot of people will point to the Purdue loss as the reason to leave Ohio State out. It doesn't work like that. You don't base these selections off of a game, but rather the entire body of work. That's how this will work. That absolutely should come into play, and last year, it was the sole reason, simply because there was nothing about Alabama's body of work that said "yes, put them in" so they looked at Ohio State's blemish in their loss to Iowa.

It may end up where Oklahoma gets in because of this though, because once again, there is absoultey nothing remarkable about Oklahoma's body of work. They have a few nice wins, but OSU has the two best wins between both teams, one of which against a top ten team.

If Oklahoma struggles against Texas, and Ohio State rips Northwestern a new one, Ohio State gets in.

If Oklahoma wins big, I think they'll favor them over Ohio State.

I do think Ohio State is the better team. Both of these teams aren't great, and both have suspect defenses, but I think OSU would win on a neutral field.

If OSU doesn't make it, I'm ok with that. I think it's stupid to hook the Purdue loss as the one reason to dismiss it. I'm more upset with the way they played for a good portion of the year.

I will ask for those who want Ohio State out of the playoff, without bringing up what OSU has done, what's so great about Oklahoma's resume?

Nobody could seem to come up with anything for Alabama last year. I know they ended up winning it all, and they obviously look poised this year, but I just found that funny.

I think you mean #4 Michigan. Have the new polls come out that I'm not aware of? Possible, I guess, as it IS Tuesday.

Yes, they were just released. Michigan came in at #7.

I'm someone who puts ZERO stock into where a team was when you beat them. I want to know where the teams you played ended up at the end of the year.

New polls came out at 7 tonight. Michigan only dropped to #7

To me, OSU needs to win big and OU has to either lose or win UGLY ... like TONS of points

Thank you, and spergon. I wasn't aware.

Question though: Does it matte where a team is ranked AFTER a loss? Of course, Michigan is going to drop after losing but they WERE #4 when the Buckeyes played them.

In my opinion it does. The committee only dropped Michigan to 7, even though they got creamed by OSU. That to me shows the committee still respects Michigan .

I think only dropping ichigan to #7 is going to help OSU in the end. We have to mop the floor with Northwestern, though.

Mopping up a 4-loss NW won’t help much if Oklahoma beats Texas, even an ugly, lucky win. As said above, Georgia has to lose and then Oklahoma must do the same for the Big10 championship to be worth turning on in the evening. If Georgia wins, Oklahoma’s or OSU’s results won’t matter. It’ll be this:

Clemson
Georgia
ND
Bama

That way, we can watch a double rematch game again (last years title game and the SEC title game from this year).

That’s why I kind of want 6 teams in. Two teams get a bye and then 3-6 fight it out. I think 6 is the best setup for “fairness”. I’m cool with 4 though.

IMO, all the favorites will win. OSU will finish at #5 and play in the Rose Bowl

My brother and i had this discussion over the weekend ... we were watching the fighting irish at the time ...

He said we played one of the toughest schedules in the country ..... i *LOL* thought he was joking ... and he knows football ... hes not some clueless dolt ...

He says we played Stanford when they were #7 ... and there was another team ranked on the top 10 when we played them and another around 15 when we played them and a fourth somewhere ... he says couple them with Michigan and Syracuse and u got a tough one ..

Ummmm .. Alan ... ummmmm ... Stanford and the other 3 or 4 not named Michigan or Syracuse aren’t even in the top 25 anymore ... WHO CARES WHERE A TEAM IS WHEN U PLAY THEM ... they may have been ranked high then but have since proven that there not very good ...

That would be like the kid that stole the champs bike when he was 10 or so that he whooped the champ once w/o mentioning the age ... *L* ....

I dont see how where a team was ranked when u play them has any bearing .... NONE IMO ...

If u guys wanna count the QUALITY of each teams wins (witch i agree with ... and u guys have much better quality wins ... then u can’t discount the quality of the losses ... u can’t have it both ways ...

If OU wins u guys aren’t getting in ... its to bad u couldn’t play #4 Michigan this week ... that W would surely change the discussion form the W U oughta get over a 4 loss team ...

I want u guys to get in ... i think u have a better shot of beating Bama ... i’d give u guys a 7% chance cause your D’s way better than OU’s ... they’d have about a 4% chance of outscoring them ... *L* ...

Are they going to go down as the greatest college team ever?

Here is my problem with Oklahoma over Ohio State. And yes, I admit I could have some bias.

Oklahoma does not have a signature win. And the best defense they played....was Army. The next best defense was TCU, and they had a similar crushing of the team as Ohio State did. Ohio State has at least 2 signature wins...Penn State and Michigan. In my estimation...Both Penn State and Michigan would ROUT Oklahoma.

Diam, you have a very valid point about looking at quality of wins as well as the quality of the loss. And I do understand your point concerning what a team was ranked when they played them. I don't fully agree with it. We all know teams can grow and regress throughout a year. Injuries can change a season. I do think what a team was ranked at the time they played matters. I don't think it has a large amount of weight....I do think it has some weight. When you play a high ranked team, at any point in the season, there is far more pressure. There is far more scrutiny. There are far bigger consequences. Combine that with the fact a very good team can end up being a totally different team by the end of the season...And I think ranking at the time of play matters. Heck the Browns season is a perfect example. There was a time where we legitimately could argue that the Browns could be 5-0...Then just before the firings, they looked like a team that wouldn't win another game. Now we are looking at a team, whom we can argue, could possibly win out. (especially if they can get past Houston...no small feat) They are the same team. They are just playing differently then right before the firings...So if they can play differently at different times of the year...I think the ranking at the time they played matters because it is the ranking they deserved.

Yes, you have to look at the Purdue loss. It was a BAD loss...But Oklahoma does not not have a single "quality" win. They play in a conference known for not having defense. And Ohio State has one of the best quality wins of the entire college football landscape.

Also when looking at current rankings...If we don't want to give Ohio State points for beating Northwestern in a Championship game....why should we give Oklahoma points for beating Iowa State who is currently ranked lower...

On a side note...Am I reading something wrong??? Looking both at current rankings as well as at the time rankings...I do not see 4 top 25 wins for Oklahoma....

With current rankings, they beat Iowa State(23) and West Virginia (16)...Ohio State beat Michigan (6) and Penn State(12) Ohio State wins that discussion...

With as played rankings...Oklahoma played 2 games against ranked opponents...They beat West Virginia (13) and lost to Texas (19)...Ohio State played against 4 ranked opponents and beat them all. TCU(15), Penn State(9), Michigan State(18), and Michigan (4)

Oklahoma has a flashy Offense...and a Putrid Defense. The flashy offense did not play a defense all year except for Army (a 28-21 OT win) Think about that...No one is going to confuse Army with National Championship prowess...and they were held to 21 points in regulation...Their average is 50 a game this year.

They have no signature win.

They pass an eye test because no one cares about defense and their offense looked so good against sub par defenses. Penn State and Michigan would crush them.

Ohio State...well they may or may not deserve to be #5 or higher...But I do believe they deserve to be ranked higher than Oklahoma.

And to add...

I honestly think Michigan is a better team than Ohio State...just like Ohio State is a better team than Purdue. Ohio State just put it all together on Game Day...just like Purdue did. People keep claiming that if we give credit to the Michigan win, we have to give credit to the Purdue loss...Well the reverse is also true...if you give credit to the Purdue loss...you HAVE to give credit to the Michigan win...(and Penn State...and TCU....and Michigan State)

My argument is not about Ohio State being #5....My argument is that Oklahoma is overrated #5 as there are better teams and Ohio State should rank above them...

Good post, Pete. However, because the committee already has OU over Ohio State, it's going to be almost impossible to jump them unless we win and they lose.

Yeah, especially since Texas is valued ahead of Northwestern

I don't disagree Verse...I just think it is an error that Oklahoma is rated above them...Should Ohio State be #5....honestly...I don't think so...Playing on all cylinders you get the Michigan game. Otherwise they are just inconsistent this year...But they should be ranked higher than Oklahoma...

I agree w/you. I was really hoping we would jump them this week, but it didn't happen.

I wonder if the committee doesn't want us in due to the earlier scandal this year?

I was talking about ND with my bro .. were IRISH baby ... were weren’t taking about the Sooners bro .... i’m As honest with my critique of ND as i have been of our dawgs .... so u know i ain’t a homer ...

U started with u may be bias ... theres NO MAYBE ABOUT IT BROTHER ... *L*... the fact u tried to discount the losses while propping up the wins PROVES IT BRO ...

comparatively speaking ... how is a quality win against UM weighted heavier than the “quality” of the loss to Purdue ... only one reason for that ... u want to hold one up as a shining example as to why your better ... well then u need to take into account u had a HORRBILE loss ...

I don’t agree about the “pressure” being a factor .. if your a better team and u don’t go out and win cause of “pressure”/OUTSIDE INFLUENCES ... you may have football talent but u gots a bunch of losers on yours hands if they can’t go beat a team there better than ... once the game starts Pete ... all the PAPER CRAP goes away .. now its me against U ... none of the hype matters ...

I 100% agree about teams evolving ... 100% ....

I believe u guys have evolved as a team and are much better than u were at the beggining of the year ... just curious .... are u guys a young team? .... i don’t believe OU has but i don’t know that much about that aspect of them .. i’m Just ASSuming and thats wrong of me ... my feeling is there D still sucks so how much better canthey have gotten .. *LOL* ..

I hope u guys get in ... and until u lose the liar as a HC thats gonna be a VERY VERY RARE OCCASION ... *L* ...

Hope u had a good turkey day bro ... i should be down in c-town after the 1st of the year for soccer a few weekends ... we’ll hook up then my brother ...

Good luck to you and your buckeyes this weekend ... hope things break your way ... and if U and OU win .. i hope the OU fans are mad as hell next week ...

I know you are an Irish Fan...wasn't knocking you about your thoughts on OSU/Oklahoma...(or the Irish...lol)

My only discussion with you is about whether Rankings "as played" matter...I think they do...I explained why and I think we understand each other even if we don't agree...everything else is separate...LOL

Yes I am biased...But I don't think I am jumping off a cliff to say Ohio State should rank higher than Oklahoma...

you ask How does the Purdue loss compare to Michigan win???

well...which is harder...Destroying the best Defense in College football when you have been inconsistent...or staying vigilant so you are not caught on a bad day. I make no excuses for Purdue...But even if you say Purdue and Michigan cancel each other out...that still leaves Penn State, Michigan State as quality wins (well Penn State at least...lol) where I feel Oklahoma has none. I don't consider shoot out's as quality wins...JMO

I still say Michigan and Penn State would bury OU. again JMO and that carries a lot of weight for me when comparing the 2...what teams did OU play that would wipe the floor with Ohio State??? I don't see any...

I obviously would love to see Ohio State in the CFP...But my argument is not about that...My argument is strictly OSU vs OU. I just think Ohio State should rank above OU. Regardless of where in the rankings they fall.

Turkey day was relaxing...didn't do squat...LOL Hope your's went well.

Would be great to hook up with you!!!

I hope things break for OSU...but not expecting it to...If I am honest...I really don't think they should be in...They were too inconsistent this year...and they seemed to struggle once Bosa went down.

It shouldn’t. A team can come in preseason top ten and absolutely suck. They lose 3-4 games, and probably hover around the 20-25 ranking (which is why these preseason rankings are horrible) but you shouldn’t get credit for beating them if you did earlier in the year when they were highly ranked.

Team by team playoff guide:

Alabama - Win and in. Lose and probably still in (?)

Clemson - Win and in. Lose and probably out (?)

Notre Dame - Done playing, surely already in

Georgia - Win and in. Lose and out.

Oklahoma/Ohio State - Oklahoma is ranked higher and is facing the tougher opponent in the conference title game. It seems to me like Oklahoma is in with a win, but a loss opens the door for Ohio State to get in. Oklahoma/Texas being exceptionally sloppy and Ohio State looking dominant in a win could change this.

With a lot of help (Georgia gets embarrassed, OU and OSU both lose) and a good win over Memphis, UCF might sneak in... as much as a team can sneak into the playoffs with an undefeated record.

A lot of people will.. when comparing 2 teams like this what is the normal thing to do? You do just want everybody on here is doing, you look at the 2 or 3 high points of the season and you look at the 1 or 2 low points of the season.. everything in the middle is generally a wash...

So what are OUs high points?
Beating WVU on the road
Beating Texas on neutral site (assuming they beat them)

What are OUs low points?
Losing to Texas at home by 3 points
Winning 28-21 against Army at home

What are OSUs high points?
Beating PSU on the road
Beating Michigan at home

What are OSUs low points?
Losing to Purdue 49-20 on the road
Needing OT to beat MD 52-51 on the road

Overall I don't see all that much difference.. OSU has slightly higher highs but also lower lows... and in the end, the fact that OU has seemed like the more consistent team all year might make the difference.

I thought u were confused over who i was reffering to with the multiple wins against teams ranked when we played them ... my bad dawg ...

We totally disagree on how much where a team is ranked when u play them ... not sure we could agree less ...

By your theory ...

Your victory over UM means more then ND’s did .... i have no clue where they were ranked when we played them .. but it wasn’t in the top 4 ... so lets say we played them when they were 15 ...

Does our W not mean as much cause they were 15 when we played them and they were 4 when u played them ...

OR

Do both W’s hold the same weight? ....

If its #2 ... same has to hold true for when they DROP in or out of there ranked spot at the time of your meeting ... ...

As for your example ... UM was the statistically ranked #1 D in the country .. NO WAY do they have the best D in the country .. NO WAY are they better than bama’s D .. NONE ...

If UM played in the big 12 they’d be closer to 100 than 1 as far as ranking goes ... *LOL* ...

U don’t consider shootouts quality wins ... well bro .. i don’t consider UM or PSU quality wins ... they beat up on the MULTIPLE WEAK SISTERS in the big 10 ...

Who did PSU or um beat? ...

I know UM lost to a QB when they played ND that COULDN’T HIT THE BROAD SIDE OF A BARN ... who else did they beat out of conference .. i thinkyour conference is no better than the Big 12 ... YOUR JUST DIFFERENT ...

Would love to see u guys play OU ... don’t think u could out SHOOT OUT them ... even though u don’t think shootout w’s should count ... *L* .

Sorry bro .. your a HOMER on this one ... u just can’t see it ... ...

Boomer Sooner...

If OSU wins they will have beaten 5 top 25 teams while if Oklahoma wins they will have wins over 2 top 25 teams seems pretty cut and dried to me ...

Where was Purdue ranked? ... ...