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well it's safe to say that if we lose less than 7 games then it'll be KS's last year

Do you mean win less than 7 or lose more than 7

sorry haha yes, win less than 7

The Browns were on the low end of motion at the snap through the first three weeks this year with Watson at QB.

The Browns were near the bottom part of the league in running motion at the snap in 2020, 2021 and 2022.

Winning less than 7 with this team, then for sure he is gone. Where that cutoff lies really depends on his relationship with Berry and Hadlam. A good relationship and he gets another year with 8/9 wins. Maybe even 7. A bad relationship and 9 might not cut it, unless that gets us in the playoffs and we win a playoff game or 2. But then I guess technically that would be more than 9 wins

j/c...

I love Nick Chubb

Comparing KS to BB is ridiculous. Ski is not a great coach, period.

Nice job D Hop !!

K Dustin Hopkins named AFC Special Teams Player of the Week

https://www.clevelandbrowns.com/news/k-dustin-hopkins-named-afc-special-teams-player-of-the-week

Without Brady, just how good of a coach would BB be?

What is the sound of one hand clapping?

Bellichek went 10-6 with a young Matt Cassell.
He has lost a ton of coaches throughout his time and has been in the league forever.

Some NE fans may be frustrated but for the most part I believe many are ready for him to move on so they can begin another chapter. As it looks as his window has closed.

BB would still be a good coach without Brady but I really believe he wouldn't have won as much. How much less is a matter of conjecture. It would have been predicated on whom he had as a QB. He certainly wouldn't have won too many games with most of the QB's we've had.

Tom Brady left the Patriots in February of 2022.

In 2022 Belichick had a season record of 8-9. This year so far he has a record of 1-5.

Just because you don't like the comparison does not mean it doesn't exist.

Drew Brees retired after the 2020 season.

In 2021 Payton had a win/loss record of 9-8. So far this year he is also 1-5.

I think thou dost protest too much.

BB about to lose his job. Dont forget he is also the GM.

good for Hopkins .. he deserves it

Tom Brady actually left the Pats in Feb of 2020 not 2022.

The Pats under BB have posted records of 7-9 in 2020, 10-7 in 2021 with a playoff appearance, 8-9 in 2022 and currently 1-5 in 2023 without Brady under BB.

Payton finished his last 5 years in NOS with a winning record each season (4 w/Brees) and he's in his first year with Denver currently at 1-5.

Stefanski has gone 11-5 in 2020 with a playoff appearance and win, 8-9 in 2021, 7-10 in 2022 with a last place finish and 3-2 thus far in 2023.

So can you tell me how much better Bilichick has done over the past three seasons than Stefanski? It appears they have both made the playoffs once and both eliminated in the first round with two other sub par seasons. And thus far this season Stefanski is actually doing better. Yes I did make a mistake when posting it was 2022 when Brady left. I'm really not sure how you feel that makes the comparison between the two HC's and their accomplishments since that time change to any great extent. Same goes for Payton.

edit: Nope.

I am not the person that brought up or said that BB has been better than Stefanski over the past 3 seasons. The point of contention was BB couldn't win without Brady and that's untrue. BB had the Pats in the playoffs in 2021 without Brady and even more remarkable in 2008 when BB had backup QB Matt Cassell go 10-5 enroute to a 11-5 season. Just as it is untrue that the Browns cannot win without a QB of Watson's caliber because they did. Payton has had only one season without Brees and went 9-8 that 2021 season.

Though winning the Super Bowl is the ultimate goal, only 1 out of 32 teams achieve that goal on a yearly basis with only 2 of 32 or 6.25% making it to that game. 93.75% of the NFL teams fail in that quest to be in the Super Bowl every year. On the other hand, 43.75% of the NFL teams make the playoffs on a yearly basis. That figure basically means that every team has close to a 50% chance of making the playoffs every year due to the spots available. It would also lend credence to the reason for replacing 5-7 HC's (15.6% to 21.2%) on an annual basis for not being a playoff contender.

That said, according to reports, BB is supposedly on the "hot seat." IMHO, it's much more a continuance of last year's cluster of having 2 bum OC's and unexpected slide from being a playoff team as recently as 2021. That's the difference between a winning organization and the Browns because the heat is being applied in NE after one losing season and a slow 2023 start. With Stefanski though, a 3-game slide in 2021 after a 2020 playoff appearance followed up by a poorer last place finish in 2022 is to be ignored for reasons every team goes through. No team in the NFL has had a larger spend than the Cleveland Browns over the last two seasons. So, should Stefanski be on the "hot seat" on a weekly basis without excuses - YOU BETCHA!

J/C

Just for myself I judge Stefanski on his complete body of work as a HC for the Browns. I take into account injuries and challenges he and the team have faced along the way- and in many cases Stefanski has done well when facing adversity, nothing more obvious than the Covid impacted season, his best year as HC.

But with that said - and this is true of other managers across multiple sports, soccer being one that I know well - some managers can absolutely do more with less and can face obsticles and overcome a lack of talent and get the most out of those situations.... while at the same time those same managers can struggle to do well with talent laden teams, and finding ways to win and win consistently to challenge for titles and championships with teams that are built to do so. I've seen many managers in soccer specifically that can keep a title challenging team in the hunt and maintain a winning edge - but fail miserably in that first situation when given a team facing adversity and a lack of talent. If your a mid-bottom tier team you want the manager that does more with less - If your team is built to be a title challenger you want the other guy. Sometimes they can be the same guy - but not always.

I'd say Belichick has shown he can handle both situations over the long haul - I've not seen NE play the last two seasons to comment on whether he's lost it.

I've not seen - and neither has any Browns fan seen - Stefanski do enough consistently to be labeled a good/great HC. He's done some things really well, and he's done some of them consistently. He's also shown a few flawed tendancies and shown that despite talking about change and improvement, he's also done these consistently even in 2023. I reached a tipping point with my opinion of KS a few games ago - at this point from my own perspective and opinion, he needs to win and win consistenly and lose all the bad decisions and tendancies for the entire rest of the season for me to gain complete faith back in him ... getting pass happy, bad clock and game management (even though in some games it can be very good), losing to teams we should beat, coming out flat after big wins, looking badly prepared in huge must win games, geting cute on 4th and short, repeatedly calling the same play that has has a demonstrable history of having a high probability of not being executed, not being able to make half time adjustments ... repeating those would all be things that would cement my opinion. Having a badly injured QB and leaving him exposed with a 3rd string RT one on one with TJ Watt in a game would be another - although a less likely situation to repeat itself.

We're all Browns fans. We all want the team to win. It's okay to question and highlight percieved issues. Hell - last year about half the posters wanted to tell us there was nothing wrong with Joe Woods scheme. Look at us now - anyone think we have the same defense this year with this talent but Joe Woods as DC? I don't think so .... so on to the Colts. Here's to a big win and movement towards the positive !

And Stefanski made it to the playoffs with Baker. While you wish to make it about Belichik not being able to win without Brady, that wasn't the message at all. So since you missed it, I'll clarify the message for you. Even NFL HC's people see as being great are limited in their success by the QB they are given to work with. Look at Reid's last couple of years at Philly. Look at Payton the last couple of years. Look at Belichick. They have produced basically the same results as Stefanski when they lost their great QB's.

Hopefully that brings the focus back on the topic rather than you taking it down a back alley.

From the 2020-22 seasons, Belichick has won 25 games as HC. Stefanski has won 26. Thus far in the 2023 season, Belicick is 1-5 while Stenaski is 3-2.

Stop pretending it isn't about the QB.

IMO, if you have to break it down between Tom Brady and BB Brady is probably 75% responsible for the Pats success all the years they were together. There's no way they would have won that much without Brady. Actually, 75% might be a little low. Belichick would not be looked upon the same way if he had some of the QB's we've had playing for him.

Which is my point exactly. Tom Brady left. Tom Brady got a ring with the Bucs. No rings since for Belichick. It's pretty basic math.

And the thing is I'm not trying to degrade Belichick as an NFL HC. He is a great football mind and is a good HC. But in this league if you don't have a QB you're not going to have great success. I some cases like Harbaugh in Baltimore you can tailor your O around a QB to maximize his value and have some success, but you aren't going to be able to sustain it on a high level. Look at Tomlin in Pittsburgh. How does his O look with Pickett?

Huh? Can they hang that ^ banner above the stadium?
This team hasn't won ANYTHING YET. pfft press clippings. gimme a great big motherlovin break. TwentyFour years back.

Y'all may want to act like the Giants didn't beat the Bills in the super bowl when the Bills had a better @uarterback, way back when Bill was the D coordinator
or act like the Browns playoff win in ninetyfour or ninetyfive didn't exist when Bill had Vinny Testeverde.

Bill Bellichic was and is a pretty good coach I'm just saying, his boat is named seven rings, or 8 after he won his last super bowl,
what the heck is your or my boats name?

I see you somehow think 40 years ago adds some value to the results over the past three years. Well since you would like to go there, Belichick was a first time NFL HC of the Browns for five years with a combined record of 36-44. That was his first five seasons as an HC in the NFL. Stefanski is now in his fourth season as a new NFL HC with a current record of 29-26 during the regular season and 30-27 overall. Stefanski also has one playoff appearance thus far. Now can you tell me which QB Stefanski has had since he was the HC which as played better than test Testaverde did in that playoff year?

I was talking about Bellichic, a pretty good coach, one of the best of all time who is going to be in the hall of fame, and don't give a rip about your petty argument over current head coach. Do you think only 3 years matter in history? That'd be narrow minded.

Per Dianna Russini of the Athletic, the #Browns have made calls as both “buyers and sellers” at the trade deadline. They’re believed to be looking to add to the offensive line and wide receiver rooms. #DawgPound

Agreed - I was just giving my opinion and not trying to sway anyone else's opinion.

Here's to a big step forward today with a W vs the Colts

I don't know it we need to cross fingers.

My feeling is D is normally pretty consistent. You usually get the same thing week to week.

Thus far, the O has been about as bad as they can be. If the O can start scoring 24-28 points a game, we may not lose another game this regular season.

I can't believe we have a $230 million QB and we are just asking for him to not turn it over lol but here we are

I'd be wary of this game ... Minshew has a knack for keeping teams afloat, they have a really good run game, it's at their place, we don't know what Watson will be like ... I think it's a close one

You have an interesting fandom. You always predict doom and gloom, then are really upset when it materializes.

Expect more. The Browns are the better team. We should win comfortably.

we definitely are the better team. I think I'd obviously feel better if we knew what the QB would be ... time will tell how he plays