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The Ravens lead the NFL in point differential with +115.
The Browns are six point underdogs.
This is one of those games where if the Browns want credibility. Then go and get you some.
The Ravens are at home. After coming to Cleveland and giving us a beating.
The Browns went out on a limb to make the DW deal. You make a deal like that to win games like this.
In the first game DTR took a beating and the defense got beat. This is an opportunity to make a statement. If we are going to win the North. We have to beat this team.
I honestly do not know if we can beat the Ravens. Lamar has been outstanding. They are well coached. There defense is damn good.
So far this year our defense has been really good. There have some disappointments. But we have a good defense.
Special teams has been a pleasant surprise. Outstanding kicking game. Way more than expected going into the year.
This is a game that if we are going to win. We will need the offense to play their best game of the year. That begins with Deshaun Watson.
He will need to play mistake free. In addition he will need to make all the easy throws and some big ones as well. This is a big game for DW. He knows it. He wants this game bad.
What I remember about DW before he became a Brown was he came up big in big games. In college I saw him take over games. Winning with arm and legs. He was one determined player.
I am looking for that guy now. I want to beat the effing Ravens in their backyard.
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Two Things:
1. Unless this defense can seriously elevate its game when playing Zone, or unless it can figure out how to not be forced into Zone, they will have the same experience as last time.
2. Unless this Offense has a coming out party, they simply cannot keep pace.
There is little reason, despite how insanely good this defense has played this year, to expect anything other than another lopsided 28-3 outcome.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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There is the fact that DTR was the starter and he threw 3 int's. Not saying it will make the difference between a W and a L but it should help the score not be so lopsided at least.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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We NEED this game to win the division IMHO. We’ll see, but I think Purp nailed it.
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provided Watson doesn't throw a Pick 6 and allow a fumbled scoop & score (and another fumble) like he did against the Steelers.
Three turnovers is three turnovers.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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I don't see us winning this game although it shouldn't be the beat down we took in our 1st meeting. If we win by some longshot, it keeps our division title hopes alive. If not, we're playing for a wild card the rest of the year. Right now I feel Baltimore is the best team in football. JMO
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I guess we should not show up.
Ravens vs Cardinals
total yards:
Ravens 268 yards
Cardinals 310
============
First Downs:
Ravens 21
Cardinals 22
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Turnovers:
Ravens 0
Cardinals 2
----------------------------
Score 31 to 24.
Dobbs was the Cardinals qb.
The Ravens lost to the Colts and Steelers.
What the hell maybe we should give them the title as the division champs.
Last edited by bonefish; 11/07/23 05:55 PM.
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We were huge underdogs against the 49ers, too. Use JOK as a spy to keep their QB contained, send some pressure.
We can beat anyone when our D is firing on all cylinders.
Watson has to have a big game, Get the ball out fast and hit a couple long ones downfield.
![[Linked Image from i28.photobucket.com]](http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c201/shadedog/mcenroe2.jpg) gmstrong -----------------
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IMO playing zone is not the way to win for the Browns.
It is not the strength of the defense. You win by doing what you do best. That is not to say don't ever play zone. Nor is that you cannot play split.
There is reason for hope given that the Browns lead damn near every defensive category.
In addition DW did not play in the first game.
That's ok. I love your optimism.
I think I will tune in. Just for grins.
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I know it's not our strength, not by a long shot. That's why I said what I said. We either have to get good at it, or we have to get better at stopping them from forcing us into zone like they did the last time.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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I'd go man as well ... and just be ourselves. Strength on strength and hope our players win their matchups and execute their keys
I think this game will come down to our offense doing enough and not turning it over
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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KS should put a few new plays in our O or new variations in the plays we have something that the Ravens haven't seen. Going toe to toe with them with our banged-up O-line worries me.
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Oh but why worry?
Lol, I get it. They have a great front so that’s why we need to get rid of the call quickly on passing plays. Some no-huddle might put them off balance early, as well.
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KS should put a few new plays in our O or new variations in the plays we have something that the Ravens haven't seen. As long as they don't include Moore running backwards or going for it on 4th and long.
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir
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Quick slants to Moore might work to utilize his speed. Maybe some screens. How often do we run screens. Long and short snap counts would keep them off balance. They're going to want to really hit DW so the quick passes will be important. Keep the ball away from Lamar as much as possible. We miss Nick every game but a game like this we miss him more when you're trying to control the ball and win TOP.
Last edited by Homewood Dog; 11/07/23 08:08 PM.
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we seem to run (and/or convert) slants less than any team in the NFL
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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I hope ya'all know that the playbook was scaled down right?
DTR played against the Ravens.
It was clear in the Cardinals game KS did not want DW throwing the ball 30 times. There was a reason behind sticking with the running game.
Every game plan change. There are different matchups. Players are filling in for starters. No game plan stays the same.
There is history with division games. The teams know each other.
Except they don't really know DW as a Brown.
KS will look for favorable matchups in both where to run and who to throw against.
Last edited by bonefish; 11/07/23 08:33 PM.
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We also don’t throw skinny posts or deeper slants to the middle of the field, I don’t know why we don’t but I know we don’t.
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The Ravens are the best at the pass rush and getting sacks
Callahan has his hands full with the O line
Stephanski has to game plan for that and a lot of this will be put on Watsons hands to scramble and make plays
If the Defense plays as they did last week with the intensity they did
Although against a 1 win team, that mentality should put heat on the Ravens O
I believe the Browns can pull this off, just got to play smart and keep the penalties and give away turnovers down
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Interesting to me that Gus Edwards only had 5 touches last week. Lamar and Ravens have been looking great the last few weeks. Browns likely to come out swinging. We can still make playoffs if we lose but to compete for the division need this W.
Steelers and Bengals still have to play each other twice. So one of them either loses twice or they both lose once. Which helps with the chance to make the playoffs. But can we just compete for a division title in December for once.
![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/captainphil/browns bills sig 5.jpg) When it gets cold and snows and the wind blows, you gotta be able to run the ball. - TR
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It’s time to kick Baltimore’s ass, the Move still hurts after 28 years, and their two Lombardis, and Art Model and our suckiness ever since.
I want to punch them hard in the mouth on Sunday. I don’t disrespect Pittsburgh - I don’t like them - but I absolutely hate the Ravens.
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Man, I just don't feel good about this one. I feel like there's this glass ceiling between us and Baltimore/Pitt we just can't seem to break. I'm freaking tired of it though. I want nothing more to win, but it's hard to get your hopes up.
Blue ostriches on crack float on milkshakes between the sidewalk titans of gurglefitz. --YTown
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A loss almost definitely kills all chances at the division. We'd have two head-to-head losses AND we'd be at LEAST two games back. They, and the rest of the division, would have to collectively implode to allow us to jump all of them.
Yes, it's mathematically possible, but the actual probability approaches zero.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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It’s a long season, especially this one with all the crap that’s gone on. Chubb hurt, all the other injuries, QB uncertainty, heart-stopping finishes. Feels like the season started six months ago.
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the Ravens use their RBs in a pure rotation from game to game ... they truly keep you guessing.
The rookie RB they displayed last week was really quick ... something they hadn't shown yet
And like you said, Edwards had very few touches ... he usually kills us
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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I read you loud and clear.
Hard to believe there are still nine games to play.
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Have a feeling Browns are winning this and will be the talk of the sports world all week. I am going to end up eating my words on Stefanski.
On O, don't turn the ball over. Also, be comfortable going three and out. Use Deshaun's legs. A lot of short, move the sticks passing.
On D I would not rush wide. Do not give Jackson the middle of the field. Burrow does this thing where when it's 3rd and long and the DL abandons the middle of the field, he just runs for the first down. He knows he's going to do that before the ball is even snapped. I feel like Jackson can hurt us the same way. Clog the lane, make him rush outside, shadow him with JOK. Play press man all game.
Browns win and I get a nice moneyline payday.
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
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We usually play the Rats close at their place on a 1pm Sunday kickoff.
They will have a couple of guys back on D and O that sat out the first game. We have lost our LT and we have a "rusty" noodle arm Deshaun.
Our D will have to turn in a SF type performance to win.
I doubt it happens, but hope it does.
Browns 17
Ravens 23
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I read you loud and clear.
Hard to believe there are still nine games to play. It feels as though we're already 12 games into the season. 3/4 a season's worth of drama, to date. Being a Browns fan is exhausting no matter the flavor of the current season, or running W/L record. I guess I wouldn't have it any other way. After all- I'm still here. 
"too many notes, not enough music-"
#GMStong
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Man, I just don't feel good about this one. I feel like there's this glass ceiling between us and Baltimore/Pitt we just can't seem to break. I'm freaking tired of it though. I want nothing more to win, but it's hard to get your hopes up. That's kind of where my head has been, for the most part. But then, I thought about what this D is capable of doing. Forget about their most recent dominance of a last-place team, consider this: they held TEN's entire output to 94 total yards. Limited them to just 6 first downs, and gave CLE 40 minutes time of possession. Derrick Henry: 11 carries/20 yds. TEN receiving: 13/104. Tannehill: 13/25 for 104 4.2 TD:0 INT: 0 SACKS: 5/36 QBR: 25.1. A D like that has the potential to drop a top-flight O down to mere mortal status. If Schwartz's Wrecking Crew shows up, Elves have a puncher's chance to grind out this win. If CLE doesn't get in an O foot race, a low-scoring win is definitely possible. .02
"too many notes, not enough music-"
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I revel in the passion of wanting to win.
I like to hear fans who want revenge. Never give in to defeat. Don't ever give in to the feelings of not having hope.
It is ok to believe we can beat any team.
The Ravens are a good team. So what. They got beat by the Colts and Steelers. Those teams are not better than we are.
When you have a defense that has done what the Browns defense has done. You can beat any team.
We have not yet seen what the Browns offense is capable of. That is solely because of inconsistent quarterback play. The rushing game is third in the league.
We don't need miracles from DW. All we need is solid play. Make the throws that are there to be made. Don't turn the ball over. The defense will give the offense more chances to score.
We can beat the Ravens.
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Play smart football with no or only one turnover and we can win. It's time to make a statement in our division.
We all know how the media hates on our Browns. Would love to see how they react if we win this one.
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IIRC, the defense played very well, just got ground down with the complete lack of offense (DTR game). Defense kept the game close but then tailed off in the second half.
Defense needs to bring every bit of it, and as long as Watson is at least efficient, then we will be right there with them.
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
-PrplPplEater
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Defend the run
Run it right at them.
Take 3 or 4 deep shots on the day.
Beat them on the last play of the game.
Run it right at them with all your players getting a carry of the ball on the day.
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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Most important game of the year by far. The best team in the league right now, at full strength, at home, smack-dab in the middle of the season, right before the playoff sprint.
I don’t think this is an understatement: This is probably the most clear measuring stick game we’ll play this year and statement about what we are as built and run by this FO, coach and QB. We don’t have Chubb and our OL is banged up & missing pieces. But good teams find a way. Good teams, at the very least, don’t fall apart because everything isn’t perfect. See: this years Steelers.
We don’t have to win in terms of getting into the playoffs but we need to show that we belong. A demoralizing or embarrassing loss, having our D get exposed again, will set a very bleak tone for rest of the season. A close loss up through a win sets a much different tone.
One thing I know for sure, this is going to be an extremely physical game, much like the San Francisco game. I want to be the bully’s of the AFCN for a change. Even if we lose, I want a pound of Raven flesh. I want them limping the rest of the way. If we get beat down, the Steelers game and the rest of the season will be about fighting over scraps and “next year”. If we win, however ugly, it means we’re for real. Pretty cut and dry in a way few games ever are.
Go Browns!!!
"Team Chemistry No Match for Team Biology" (Onion Sports Headline)
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I want to see the tackle eligible run play about fifty plus times on the day,
with EVERYBODY getting a carry,
including Jordan Elliott, and Dalvin Tomlinson running up the middle of the ravens defense
and the outcome doesn't matter as much
as long as you get to knock the ravens down like bowling pins at the end of every run.
Hudson gets a carry
Bitonio gets a carry
Pocic gets a carry
Jordan Elliott behind Nick Harris gets a carry,
Many Carries for all of your runningbacks
and Play fake > deep throw, 3 to 4 times on the day, come what may. You were expected to lose anyway.
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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Last time the Browns won in Baltimore was 2019..
This is one of those games that you can say that if you win. You've turned a corner. I believe they can do it.
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provided Watson doesn't throw a Pick 6 and allow a fumbled scoop & score (and another fumble) like he did against the Steelers.
Three turnovers is three turnovers. Anything is a possibility. I understand that neither the Titans nor the Cardinals are Baltimore, but in the last two games watson played the entire game nothing like his performance against Pittsburgh has happened. In fact he's looked pretty good. The biggest question in my mind is can the Browns banged up OL keep him upright and healthy.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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This game was always going to be hard, but now with Wills, chubb, and conklin out, having to rely on a really bad Hudson and a getting worse by the week Jones, we are going to have to be ready to counter the pressure with playcalling and getting the ball out quick, Watson's mobility is going to be key in this game and I just hope it doesn't lead to him taking some unnecessary shots since he doesn't like to slide.
Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It's perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands. It hopes we've learned something from yesterday. -John Wayne
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One principal in football that I have always been a believer of is the value of quarterback mobility.
You don't have to be Lamar. However, when you are in third and 8. The defense is in pass defense. What mobility brings is what in essence becomes a quarterback draw. If the interior line leaves an opening. A mobile quarterback once past the LOS can get that first down.
That is a back breaker for the defense. Mahomes is a perfect example. So was Steve Young.
DW can do that. He has done that in the past. He will need to do that. However, he must also protect himself and the ball.
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yep, DW has done it quite a few times in the short amount of games. He's actually kinda like lamar in his ability to be elusive and hard to bring down in the pocket. That will be key for us against the Ravens.. I just hope we are working on a game plan to dink and dunk and screen them to death and then hit them deep with PA. I like how schwartz said where people fail against Lamar is they try to contain him in the pocket, his plan is to treat him like a ball carrier at all times, hit him hard and often and just attack him like he's a RB or WR.
Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It's perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands. It hopes we've learned something from yesterday. -John Wayne
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After watching Lamar for a few years now. When I see defenders try and get into a tackling stance with eyes on his belt. The way you are trained to tackle. He leaves guys in the dust.
If you rush him straight on. He then is forced to move horizontally. There is that split second where he is deciding where to go. That is when you get him. We have a few guys who can get to Lamar. JOK, Delpit and Thornhill all three are quick enough.
In the SF game JOK made some great tackles on McCaffrey. He is a tough guy to tackle.
Delpit is having a pro bowl type season. Excellent tackler. Thornhill plays smart. He knows how to sniff plays out.
This last game Schwartz made an emphasis on fixing the run defense. The DT play was excellent. The Ravens really run the ball well. We are going to have to slow that down.
Lamar is a scary guy for defenses. He is at the top of his game. We are going to have to depend upon our corners to cover. We have to get Lamar to hold the ball. That will be key.
I think the Browns are up for this challenge. They seem hungry to me.
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Should be a key factor on Sunday.
At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
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IMO Schwartz is going to get after Lamar.
I think he will do it with different guys at different times. Our two safeties and JOK will be part of the plan.
They give the look pre-snap of Delpit on the LOS as if in blitz. He will drop back into coverage. The blitz will come from JOK.
JOK will be at the LOS pre-snap. Then they will reverse it. Both will be on the LOS pre-snap. The next time Delpit will come and JOK will drop.
Another time it may come from Thornhill.
Schwartz in most cases does not like to blitz. This will be an all day cat and mouse game. Where is going to come from? Sometimes nobody.
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It's amazing how different JOK looks in a defense where it's designed to allow him to use his skill set.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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I totally agree.
Last year the DT play was horrific. It made it impossible to use his skills.
I watched a ton of tape on him when he played for Notre Dame. He won the Nagurski Award over Parsons.
He was brilliant.
He makes mistakes sometimes. But overall he is a damn good player.
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While I supported the JOK pick as well for all of the reasons you mentioned, you were certainly the most vocal supporter of him and there wasn't even a close second.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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The biggest difference with Jackson & Mahomes and the the rest of the mobile QBs in the league is that no one ever seems to lay a good solid square-up lick on Jackson or Mahomes. They’re just super gifted at not getting seriously hit. It’s the most confounding thing. But I think it also means you can’t try to murder them. They’ll totally dust you if you sell out against them when they’re running. You have to nag them, box them in, clutter their decision making and take away their rhythm. JOK as a straight-up spy is a pretty good idea imo. He’s not a big hitter but he’s got wheels and he’s a solid tackler. It’ll leave more open field kuncovered but I think if we’ve learned anything, Jackson with open lanes is game dominator.
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The Brett Kollman analysis of him was spot on and knew that he was going to be a factor with whatever team he was going to get drafted to.
Certainly was banging the JOK drum as that draft we really needed linebackers.
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The biggest difference with Jackson & Mahomes and the the rest of the mobile QBs in the league is that no one ever seems to lay a good solid square-up lick on Jackson or Mahomes. They’re just super gifted at not getting seriously hit. It’s the most confounding thing. But I think it also means you can’t try to murder them. They’ll totally dust you if you sell out against them when they’re running. You have to nag them, box them in, clutter their decision making and take away their rhythm. JOK as a straight-up spy is a pretty good idea imo. He’s not a big hitter but he’s got wheels and he’s a solid tackler. It’ll leave more open field kuncovered but I think if we’ve learned anything, Jackson with open lanes is game dominator. People have put plenty of good hits on mahomes, he's hurt alot too.. But not sure why you are excluding Watson from those two.. he's every bit if not more mobile than mahomes, he's also been more successful at it too.
Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It's perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands. It hopes we've learned something from yesterday. -John Wayne
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When you break down DW. He has every skill you want. That is why the risk to get him.
He dominated at Clemson. The bigger the game. The better he played. He took games over with his arm and legs. But what jumped out was his determination to win. He would sacrifice himself to score. There were questions about his accuracy coming into the draft. My view of him was. He was a winner.
With the Texans he was lighting up the league. That is why damn near every team wanted a shot to get him. Then the crap hit the fan.
When he is right. He can be great.
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Not over the past few years he hasn't. I mean if people can cancel what a Browns WR did last year because of what he produced this year, why would it be okay to give credit to another Browns player claiming he can do this year what he hasn't done in years? just a little consistency here would be nice.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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Not over the past few years he hasn't. I mean if people can cancel what a Browns WR did last year because of what he produced this year, why would it be okay to give credit to another Browns player claiming he can do this year what he hasn't done in years? just a little consistency here would be nice. Still upset over nothingburger DPJ...and the last couple years suspended and hurt this year sure he hasn't.. thats an obtuse comment, The whole time in the NFL he's been a great runner, despite missing 3 years basically he STILL has more rushing yards, ypc and tds than mahomes. Thats my point. People act like DW isn't on the same level as mahomes when it comes to mobility and he is and more.. And DPJ isn't here because he was the 88th rank WR and dead last in separation. That has zero to do with QB. we didn't miss him at all and we will be fine and maybe he will too. I would venture to say if DPJ had another year on his contract he would probably still be here.
Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It's perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands. It hopes we've learned something from yesterday. -John Wayne
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There’s a DPJ thread in Pure Footfall, as you know.
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JOK is a guy I learned about after we drafted him, soon liked his speed, tackling especially and his get-to-the-football thing he does. I thought he’s been very good for us this year and those stats are damn impressive.
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The more I think about this game. The more intriguing it is.
Division games are way different. You play a team twice a year when the same coaches are involved. They know each other.
The players know each other. Teams have identities. Playing personalities.
These games become about adjustments. What can we do to mess up their plan?
I listened to Harbaugh today. He knows what our defense does. Will we change or, just just line up and play them straight up?
You have to play your game. But more than likely you add wrinkles. That goes both ways for both teams.
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Who can hurt us the most?
Lamar Jackson. Make someone else beat you.
D has to be at their best, Jim needs to dial up a great plan, as he did against the 49ers.
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Two Things:
1. Unless this defense can seriously elevate its game when playing Zone, or unless it can figure out how to not be forced into Zone, they will have the same experience as last time.
2. Unless this Offense has a coming out party, they simply cannot keep pace.
There is little reason, despite how insanely good this defense has played this year, to expect anything other than another lopsided 28-3 outcome. Yes sir I couldn't agree more. I am thinking so.ething like 34-9 Browns run defense is very overrated. Teams can gash us when they want. Ravens are on top 5 of nfl in rushing. Browns have a very long list of injured players also. Ravens are one of the best at getting to the qb. Watson has always had one of the slowest ball release times in the NFL since he became a pro. He is not very good at reading a defense. Not a good combination
Last edited by slick; 11/08/23 09:11 PM.
" Now here you are running these dirty old streets tattoo on your neck fake gold on your teeth, got the hood here snowed but you can't fool me, we both know who you are"
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I hope all you doomers eat crow on Sunday.
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I hope all you doomers eat crow on Sunday. The poster above you also predicted an easy win for the Cardinals last Sunday.
[color:"white"]I've always been crazy, but it's kept me from going insane -Waylon Jennings
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How does he like his crow done?
Baked or broiled?
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did anyone else watch the Bengals double spy Allen on key 3rd downs? It brought up an interesting idea for us to do that against Baltimore
Man up with Delpit on Andrews, Ward on Flowers, and double spy Lamar with JOK and Taki
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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I think schwartz has the right idea, it just comes down to execution. but you have to treat Lamar like a ball carrier at all times while also being cognizant of the scramble drill, almost 100% of their big plays come from that. Our linebackers outside of Jok are very meh, and slow.. we will def need safety in the box help but then TE are going to be open down the field +
Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It's perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands. It hopes we've learned something from yesterday. -John Wayne
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I hope all you doomers eat crow on Sunday. Me, too, because the season is toast if we don't get to eat crow. I feel that there is a difference between acknowledging shortcomings and doomsaying, however. Facing reality doesn't mean you don't try to have hope; you just see that the odds of that hope paying off are slimmer than you'd like. The offense has not been prolific or efficient and it has struggled mightily with turnovers regardless of who the QB is, and the defense has struggled with teams that run well and force us into zone when they want to: Ravens, Colts. You are what you do, and if nothing changes, nothing changes. If the defense can stick to what it does well and can dictate for itself what it will do instead of being forced into reacting to what they're doing, we'll shut them down. If the offense can simply get rid of the turnovers, we're 100% better off than we were the last time, and if Watson can figure out how to play like he did vs the Cards, then we're in for a treat. Our run game will still suck because Ford ain't Chubb, and the Ravens D is effectively as good as ours, but it is what it is.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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did anyone else watch the Bengals double spy Allen on key 3rd downs? It brought up an interesting idea for us to do that against Baltimore
Man up with Delpit on Andrews, Ward on Flowers, and double spy Lamar with JOK and Taki My random defensive idea was having Myles follow Andrews whenever he is inline and have Myles use the TE as a human battering ram on the OT on his way to the QB. It would both delay Andrews in getting out into a route and theoretically be an easier pass blocking matchup than an OT. See how many defensive "pancakes" he could get while generally causing chaos in the blocking scheme. Perhaps also have Za'Darius inside on Myles' side and use him as a looper. Maybe have Hurst outside crashing through Andrews with Myles as the looper.
![[Linked Image from i.ibb.co]](https://i.ibb.co/fkjZc8B/Bull-Dawg-Sig-smaller.jpg) You mess with the "Bull," you get the horns. Fiercely Independent.
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Well, I’m in the camp that believes this is very likely a loss. The main fault line being their defense against our OL. This really is going to be on Ski & DW to cook up a plan to get the ball out QUICK and try, however we can, to get the run game going. If we can’t get 1st downs and our D is living on the field it’s just a matter of until we break. I really do feel this game is about our O and maintaining possession for as long as possible. Gonna be very hard to do.
But hey, we almost every year have 1 big upset win. Maybe we spent that chip already with San Fran. Maybe we have 2.
I for one will gladly dine upon roast crow if it comes to pass. Garnished with mango chutney and a nice merlot please.
"Team Chemistry No Match for Team Biology" (Onion Sports Headline)
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Browns defensively need to clog up the middle, and force things to the outside.
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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well Andrews is split out wide too much to rely on having Myles take him out IMO ... but I'm worried about our OL too. It's an issue
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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With their D it's probably the biggest issue.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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I think we win by 10 or more.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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Reasons for optimism.
Ford is not Chubb. Neither is Kareem or Strong. However, The Browns are third in rushing.
DTR understandably committed 3 turnovers against the Ravens. He was ill prepared to start his first NFL game against the Ravens.
DW in his last two (full games) is beginning to look like what we were expecting. Accuracy and no interceptions.
It is easy to dismiss what DW is because of a limited sample and health. However, he has the ability to win with both his arm and his mobility.
On defense the Browns have the personnel to beat the Ravens. We have the corners to man up on their best receivers. We have the safeties in Thornhill, Delpit and JOK at linebacker to disguise coverage and blitz packages. All three can tackle and be used against the mobility of Lamar.
This game will be a supreme challenge. Both teams know the importance of this game. A Browns win reshuffles the deck of the North. A Ravens win gives the Ravens control of the North. The Ravens are at home. Motivation need not to be mentioned.
The Ravens are the favorites no doubt. However, outside of Titan's game we have not seen the true potential of this Browns team. The reason is inconsistent quarterback play. For the most part the defense and special teams have played very well.
My single concern at the moment is the OL. How are the Browns going to handle the changes at tackle? That could be a real problem.
However, I am optimistic that we will finally see some rhythm to the offense with better play from the quarterback position.
The defense will stand up and provide more scoring opportunities for a better offense. If we win the turnover battle. IMO we will win this game.
This game will be a bloody battle. I expect a real nail bitter. IMO this is a 50/50 game. I am not buying favorites in this game.
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Some here need to temper their awestruck attitude toward the Ravens. They lost to the Colts and Steelers, and only beat the Cards and the Titans by one score each. They spanked us when we trotted a shell shocked DTR under center. The rats did have convincing wins vs the Lions and Seahawks, but it's not like they're doing that to everybody.
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir
#GMSTRONG
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I think we win by 10 or more. Would love that my good friend I too hope that I feel it might be a field goal at the last minuete To win it ! For the Browns that is. 42-10 Browns Hey they legalized weed WTH ! LOL !!! 
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Being that the Ravens lost to the Colts and Steelers if I were KS and his staff I would look at the films and see what they did to beat them.
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I think we win by 10 or more. NfL network at midnight had as a note note about the , Browns have given up ten point nine; points per game at home, but twenty something point eight? ]well over 24] points per game on the road this year. I don't think the game will be 'real close, I think whichever team wins; will rip the rug out from under the other one, I just hope it's the Browns that win this time.
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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The Browns need to play a perfect game to win with the situation at OT. I would like to see them control time of possession with effective running and a short passing game. The defense needs to keep Jackson in the pocket at all costs and might even need to score (or a special teams score). If Stefanski gets pass happy over 15-20 yards I think the Browns are in trouble. Cannot afford a bunch of 3 and outs. Bojorquez can hopefully give the Ravens long fields all day long. It's going to be a stiff test but the season is not over if the Browns lose. Winning the division might be out the window. The Steeler game is a MUST win if the Browns do not win this week.
After 55 years, I'm walking away from this dumpster fire. Good luck to everyone who continues to hang on. You'll need it.
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The offense has their work cut out for them, for sure.... we NEED them to step it up to have any shot at all.
Of course, if the defense can find a way to get a few defensive scores, it'll make life a lot easier.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Obo is on there too in pretty good shape.
At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
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Imagine if Myles wasn't held on every play!!!!
Last edited by Homewood Dog; 11/10/23 04:11 PM.
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#gmstrong
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The Ravens have the best run defense in the league. We do not have a starting caliber OT available for this game. I see the beat down coming. Then Watson will get beat to death, and not play against the Steelers. Then the drop to the bottom of the division will be complete
RIP, Jim
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Nothing quite like looking at the bright side of things.
This is the biggest game the Browns have had in quite some time. I am really excited to see the game.
It is a serious challenge with loads on the line for both teams. The Ravens are understandably the favorites.
Division games never seem to go the way most figure. The standings and games played against each other reflect that.
Both defenses are near the top in every defensive category. The Ravens have the better offense to date.
The Browns are third in rushing. The unknown factor is what will we see from DW?
I look forward to seeing how he will play in this game. If we lose. The wild card is still in play. A lot of games remain to be played.
But I guess you have it all figured out. Let us know the fortune teller you see for all the tips.
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Nobody is a fortune teller. The closest to that would be the odds makers. Then of course there's the fact that their O put up 28 points against the Browns D just five weeks ago. Nobody who gives their opinions on here claim to be fortune tellers. I think thou doth protest too much.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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I give us a 5% chance of winning if Baltimore scores more than 21. Our OL is a trainwreck and we are on our 5th string tackle.
the defense has to keep it close and we gotta keep DW from ending up on IR.
Hunter + Dart = This is the way.
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Read his post.
Maybe he has another source.
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I did. He has some pretty strong opinions. Some of them are certainly not those that I share and I see some of them as over the top. But it is what it is.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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The offense has their work cut out for them, for sure.... we NEED them to step it up to have any shot at all.
Of course, if the defense can find a way to get a few defensive scores, it'll make life a lot easier. In the first Ravens game , the ravens exposed that while the Browns D is keyne to stop a screen, and attack the @uarterback, that the weakness of the Browns D or pass D was a @uick out breaking slant route, inside headed toward the sideline about nine to twelve yards deep, that the Browns who have been crowding the line of scrimmage don't have anyone there if it is thrown early enough. Balt seemed to do that a lot with success.
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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I give us a 5% chance of winning if Baltimore scores more than 21.
the defense has to keep it close and we gotta keep DW from ending up on IR. Ehh you don't have to beat them until the final play of the game, all you have to do is hang around with them and enjoy knocking them around until the 4th @uarter. It wouldn't be super great to get a big lead early, because the opponent is at home and if you get a big lead, then the opponent knows exactly how much they have to do to come back in the game, no, what you want to do is, hit em, knock em, stay within a couple scores of them, get all the points you can, but when the 4th @uarter comes, that's when you dominate them, and get your big scores leaving no time for them to come back. beat em on the last play of the game. If they go up seventeen early, no worries, seventeen is that limit.
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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The biggest challenge is Watson is a slow processor. He's a backyard football QB. This game needs to be drop back, plant, throw. The short passing game becomes your running game. Watson is not capable of executing that type of game plan. He needs a bunch of long developing, broken plays to get going and play well. That's likely not happening against the Ravens.
Having said that, I have a good feeling about the game. I can't put my finger on why. There's a lot that goes on during the week that the fans are not privy to. Leading up to the SF game they said the defense was very, very, locked in. Watching the pressers this week I've gotten that feeling they are locked in.
Browns win and are the talk of the sports world this week.
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
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Regarding the game I am not far away from you.
The Ravens offense to date has been better than the Browns. The Browns defense and the Ravens defense are both really good.
Lamar has been the better quarterback. It is easy to understand why most people feel the Ravens will win.
I agree there is an undercurrent of confidence within the Browns. They are confident and loose. This Browns team believes in themselves.
IMO they believe in DW. The defense is confident in their ability to adjust and overcome.
When it was announced that Dawand Jones was out. My instant thought was they will move Bitonio to LT and Harris to guard. That solution works for me because of experience. Bitonio has done it before and Harris can play guard. Hudson goes to RT. Not ideal but a workable solution.
That is the plan from what I read.
Each game with DW is a kind of reveal. Mostly because of start and then stop. Play then don't play. However, his last two complete games there has been some encouraging signs.
My hope is that he is getting fully healthy and more comfortable playing. There is a groove or rhythm in sports. It is often called "the zone."
You see it baseball with hitters and pitchers. Shooters in basketball. It happens with quarterbacks as well.
The game slows down. You see and are ultra aware. The game around you is in slow motion.
Near the end of the Titan game and the Cardinal game. DW was beginning to find it.
That is what I am looking for. I feel Myles is in it. He has been unstoppable.
If the Browns can win this game. I will be on cloud nine. It would change this entire season. A loss will be more of "well we got to fight for a wild card now."
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My biggest concern is that the Browns are in a terrible position at both OT positions against a great Ravens D. They are first against the run so their DL isn't leaving holes to run in. When you combine that with them having Roquan Smith at LB'er it makes this a very difficult match up. I'm not saying the Browns "can't win". I'm saying the odds certainly aren't in their favor. I understand what you're saying about being "in the zone". But neither the Titans nor the Cardinals are in the same category as the Ravens in terms of D. I believe a QB needs at least some time in the pocket or some sense of security to get in a zone. I'm not sure under the current conditions that the Ravens will be allowing him the time to do so.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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The biggest challenge is Watson is a slow processor. He's a backyard football QB. This game needs to be drop back, plant, throw. Yeah. other teams do this, every year, with scores of @uarterbacks, multiples of 20 @bs, over many years, but the Browns, not since Testaverde was the caller, ..maybe Garcia did a little in 04? could we count on that as a legitimate regular part of the offense.
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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If the Browns can get consistent pressure with their front of their defense then they can stay in the game.
And if the Browns offense can do things well by not trying to do what we all know won't work, then they can hang around in this game.
and.
Beat em on the last play of the game.
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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Their linebackers are good and they are schemed well.
Bitonio can handle LT. Hudson will have to be at least adequate. Your concerns are justified.
My thoughts are KS and AVP will not be looking at long developing plays. Personally I think Ford is not very good. However, both Kareem and Ford can catch the ball. I think that will be part of the game plan. Emphasis on getting the ball out.
I am expecting Njoku to be used often. The Ravens are going to try to take away Cooper no doubt. Another receiver will have to step up either Moore or Tillman.
We will need to play well. That is all that can be said. We cannot be in long yardage for first downs because of penalties. We have to play clean football. Field position all the little things that lead to victory.
It is not about 300+ yardage games for the quarterback. It is about not turning it over. Making field goals. Keeping them in their territory.
I am looking forward to the game and hope we can find the way to win.
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Nothing quite like looking at the bright side of things.
This is the biggest game the Browns have had in quite some time. I am really excited to see the game.
It is a serious challenge with loads on the line for both teams. The Ravens are understandably the favorites.
Division games never seem to go the way most figure. The standings and games played against each other reflect that.
Both defenses are near the top in every defensive category. The Ravens have the better offense to date.
The Browns are third in rushing. The unknown factor is what will we see from DW?
I look forward to seeing how he will play in this game. If we lose. The wild card is still in play. A lot of games remain to be played.
But I guess you have it all figured out. Let us know the fortune teller you see for all the tips. No fortune teller. I don't have anything figured out. I actually think about this game about exactly like you are saying. My post was in a minute of instant despair, after reading we will not have either starting Tackle. I am a half full thinker in reality. It's just we can never go into these games full strength. I don't know if the curse is real, but sometimes it sure feels like it
RIP, Jim
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2nd String
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Not long ago I wanted to know more about the number of injuries. So I looked around. The numbers are wild.
Over 3k per year. 10 guys per team on average go to the IR or IL. That is a lot of players. It is random and can happen to anyone.
Bodies are flying around and shoulder pads and helmets don't protect joints, muscle tears, etc.
When we lost Chubb my favorite player. I was sick. I didn't even want to watch the games. But injuries happen and are a part of the game. It really is next man up.
We can beat the Ravens. If the Steelers beat them. We can.
We need to play a complete game. We have the players to win this game. We are not perfect by any measurement. There are things I wish we had. Like more proven receivers. I am still sick about Chubb.
But there is talent on this roster. I don't think the Ravens are somehow way above us. They are not. They have weaknesses as well.
These are the kind of games you want to play. If we are going to do anything. You want to prove that you can. This is one of those games.
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Nothing quite like looking at the bright side of things.
This is the biggest game the Browns have had in quite some time. I am really excited to see the game.
It is a serious challenge with loads on the line for both teams. The Ravens are understandably the favorites.
Division games never seem to go the way most figure. The standings and games played against each other reflect that.
Both defenses are near the top in every defensive category. The Ravens have the better offense to date.
The Browns are third in rushing. The unknown factor is what will we see from DW?
I look forward to seeing how he will play in this game. If we lose. The wild card is still in play. A lot of games remain to be played.
But I guess you have it all figured out. Let us know the fortune teller you see for all the tips. No fortune teller. I don't have anything figured out. I actually think about this game about exactly like you are saying. My post was in a minute of instant despair, after reading we will not have either starting Tackle. I am a half full thinker in reality. It's just we can never go into these games full strength. I don't know if the curse is real, but sometimes it sure feels like it The Ravens haven't been healthy in like three years. And they still find ways to beat us. They can beat us even if we are fully healthy. But here's the thing...the defense is pretty much completely healthy and Watson is healthy. That should be enough. If not, I know the injury excuse will come up but I'm not buying it. It's excuse making.
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
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All Pro
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Fist of all Lamar is 2 wins no losses against deshaun teams.
They have a dynasty level defense we have statistically a good defense.
Ravens clearly better offense
Baltimore wins 20 to 14
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The one injury that you really cannot cover up is your quarterback.
You may get by for a few weeks but you are not going anywhere really. Hell it is hard enough when you have good starters.
Herbert is really good. And SD cannot seem to get it together.
This is a big game and I am glad to play it.
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And Clowney doing things we apparently didn't let him do. Looks like his beef about being the edge setter opposite Myles had merit.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
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Clowney has always had strengths to his game.
At the same time inconsistent play. There are reasons behind why he has been a one year contract guy.
Early this year Z looked dominant. But I have seen plays lately where I questioned his effort.
Still overall the defense as a complete unit has been excellent.
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Fist of all Lamar is 2 wins no losses against deshaun teams.
They have a dynasty level defense we have statistically a good defense.
Ravens clearly better offense
Baltimore wins 20 to 14 I truly hope not, but I'm expecting that we will be in last place by the end of the day. All the other AFC North teams should win today....
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers...Socrates
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Fist of all Lamar is 2 wins no losses against deshaun teams.
They have a dynasty level defense we have statistically a good defense.
Ravens clearly better offense
Baltimore wins 20 to 14 I truly hope not, but I'm expecting that we will be in last place by the end of the day. All the other AFC North teams should win today.... I sadly feel the exact same way. I'd feel a lot more confident with a healthy Watson, Chubb, Conklin, and even Wills out there...I just can't see us keeping pace with Baltimore...we are just too stagnant on offense, and I feel they will will shadow Coop and slide coverage on Njoku...I think Nick Harris is going to have a poor showing...and Watson is going to have a lot of issues today. I'd feel much better if we end up having two pick 6's lol....but highly unlikely.
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This is a big game and I am glad to play it. Now THAT I would love to see. 
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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j/c
Its funny how the Chubb injury isn't discussed on a national level when people talk about our team ... it's like people forget that our best player is gone
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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I think that's because injuries happen to every team. If they spent their time talking about all the great players every team had that were injured, there wouldn't be time to talk about anything else. The NFL is a passing league. Everything is QB centric. Supposedly that's what was supposed happen when the Browns traded for watson. I think the media, as well as some of us are more focused on why as of now that hasn't happened. I mean Chubb isn't the 230 million dollar man. Watson is.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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HERE WE GO BROWNIES! HERE WE GO!!
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Facts sometimes seem inconvenient to you.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Facts?? They don't talk about Chubb because Watson got paid 230M?? 
HERE WE GO BROWNIES! HERE WE GO!!
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Try reading it a little slower. It's a passing league. It's a QB centric league. You must have missed that part. The media focuses on the QB position. Why? because they make the big bucks and take up the biggest portion of the salary cap of any position in the league.
Most teams with quality QB's have found a way to move the ball on the ground with RB's of much lesser talent. When defenses must focus on stopping the pass it opens up opportunities in the running game. When the browns signed watson to the highest guaranteed contract in NFL history the focus went to watson and if he would live up to that contract. Of course you already know these things but never let facts get in the way of your desire to ignore them.
There's also the fact that the Browns have the fourth most rushing yards in the league. If the Browns were ranked low in rushing yards that would be a factor that might bring more attention to the Chubb injury by the media.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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If you think about it, If the league were fixed, and they were sure the Browns wouldn't lose 2 in a row,
then
making it so the Browns win today and not next week, would hurt the Browns royally.
In case anyone else has noticed that none of the Browns wins have moved them up in the standings this year.
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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How would you like your crow cooked deep fried?
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How would you like your crow baked, broiled, how about barbie- qued?
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I said we would lose by 6 in a close game...You call that crow material? I'll take it fried.
PS: Are you the local Mall Cop?
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We need to drop the eating crow references. Don’t act like turkeys!l, we bested the Ravens!
gmstrong -----------------
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Have a heaping dish. Enjoy.
No I am not a Mall cop. I am a Browns fan.
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Wonder if they flex us next week to Sunday night.
The scheduled game is Denver/Vikes
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Who cares just win it,
playing on sunday night is overrated anyway.
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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Wonder if they flex us next week to Sunday night.
The scheduled game is Denver/Vikes I'm in a class all day Sunday, so them flexing it is the only way I'd get to watch
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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They can't flex the game after 10 days prior ... so we are at 1 no matter what
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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They can't flex the game after 10 days prior ... so we are at 1 no matter what I wasn't aware of 10 days, but figured it was at least a week. There is more involved than just switching the kickoff time. Teams would need to alter travel plans. Networks would need to make their necessary moves. City police would need to alter schedules, fans might need to alter travel and hotel plans. There is a lot involved.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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They can't flex the game after 10 days prior ... so we are at 1 no matter what I wasn't aware of 10 days, but figured it was at least a week. There is more involved than just switching the kickoff time. Teams would need to alter travel plans. Networks would need to make their necessary moves. City police would need to alter schedules, fans might need to alter travel and hotel plans. There is a lot involved. yeah I think it's probably a big ordeal to flex games within a week or whatever
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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Gosh, I never thought about that.
Blue ostriches on crack float on milkshakes between the sidewalk titans of gurglefitz. --YTown
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DawgTalkers.net
Forums The Archives 2023 NFL Season Looking Back: Browns 33 Ravens 31 The Ravens Game
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