DawgTalkers.net Forums The Archives 2024 NFL Season Looking Back: Browns 15 Giants 21 Postgame Rants

DW is horrible. That is all.

Team has regressed from preseason

The O line stunk. We had plenty of chances to win that at the end and blew all of 'em.

I'm gonna watch the Cowboys/Ravens.

They look like '99 again. Completely unacceptable. Jimmy Haslam needs to address the media. The Giants were 0-2 and regarded as the worst team in the nfl. They look like a disorganized high school team. We didn’t wait 25 years, go through an 0-16 season, and tank for 3 years just to receive a team that, at best , will win 8 games this year. Completely unacceptable crap.


You are a complete moron if you pay for tickets to this crap.

Oh and btw, The Steelers are 3-0. Unflipping Real.

Not a rant.

Last season there were multiple OL injuries and the OL seemed to do okay

This season is starting off with OL injuries

Is it that the OL are missing Callahan

Or did Flacco help the OL more with his QB play ?

This team will never win anything with this FO and staff. They are average at best but so many want to blame DW when no one is winning with this oline and playcalling. Not to mention our lack of talent on offense. Letting Callahan go without an adequate replacement should be a fireable offense. Stefanski running Watson off the field for Winston on a 3rd and short and then the next play running Watson out of shotgun shows how bad he really is. Best thing that can happen is we lose horribly every game so Haslam has to get rid of this staff or this will be the result every year, and slowly get worse as guys like Garrett and Chubb retire

Whole team looks rank, its not just DW.

Chances to win the game despite looking second best throughout but when we had all the momentum we found a way to blow it.

Hard to feel good about the Berry and KS extensions based on the roster and total lack of depth we've seen. The OL is almost criminal in its lack of depth and fragility. 🤮🤮

the result of good coaching and an exceptional ability to draft. We have neither

Maybe, when we are officially out of the playoff mix, we trade any players that are assets and acquire draft picks and start over. This outfit is doomed.

Our oline was not good at the beginning, KS was calling plays as if was fully functional oline. When it became very obvious it was in bad shape he started calling plays to compensate. If he would have done this early on we would have won.

X2… wth is going on in the afcn? Steelers 3-0 leading the division? How is this even possible?

Oline can't block, DW can't complete a pass unless his first option is wide open, defense makes marginal QBs look like Tom Brady, and I seen a stat the other day that showed that we have around the 6th oldest team in the league, might as well just blow it up and start over.

This outcome was predictable and this is your lot in life until he is no longer the coach.

Stefanski does not work as a favorite. He is the Baker of coaches (minus the immaturity).

This team is poorly coached, poorly prepared, and slow to make adjustments in game.

He’s just not impressive. He’ll probably talk about how hard it is to win in the NFL in his presser. He was a 6.5 pt favorite at home who was spotted a 7 pt lead and got completely out coached and out schemed the entire game.

1-2 on the way to 5-12.

Next year when Kev has no expectations he’ll go 11-6, finish third in the division, get trounced first round of the playoffs, and win coach of the year.

And round and round we go.

The fans know. Stadium had a lot of empty seats and a lot of Giant fans.

They didn’t do much in the preseason. Hard to regress from that.

We didn't deserve to win this one! Yes the injuries, losing Callahan, etc didn't help. but the play calling has done nothing to help compensate and help DW. We were horribly outcoached most notably on offense. Defensively, we were OK the 2nd half. This looks like this is going to be a long season....

I thought Jim Schwartz was supposed to be some kind of
Defensive guru. ?? He had no answer for Jones
And Nabors. How bout that tackling on the Singletary
Run. ?? The Browns defense was so over rated coming
Into the season. It was never as good as last year's ranking

The offense misses Njoku big time

Cause the Steelers have darn good coach and culture

- Inexcusable loss at home to a really bad football team.

- The blueprint is out. Blitz the hell out of the Browns.

- The OL is a catastrophic failure and is in crisis mode.

- The offense has yet to put up 20 points in a game. It's a total mess.

- Letting Callahan walk is proving out to be disastrous.

- DW was not terrible today.

- Tillman continues to be just another useless WR from Berry. The offseason hype was silly.

- JOK flying around tackling air.

- It took Nabers absolutely cooking Emerson the entire first half for Schwartz to finally decide to have Ward shadow Nabers.

- Cooper returned to form. Nice to see.

- Shelby Harris was disruptive

Cheers: Jim Donovan and Phil Dawson

Jeers: The Browns offense and coaching staff.

Go Guardians!

We’re not even 4 games in.

Relax.

I’m relaxed. DW is just awful to watch. Maybe I’ll rest my eyes on Sundays while DW tanks us.

In general I agree with this, but DW wasn’t the reason the Browns lost today.

Kev and his inability to get the team ready was the reason.

Kev “it’s hard to win in the NFL” Stefanski.

I’ve seen enough of Stefanski and his play calling give Vrabel his shot.

It’s the lack of a winning culture that separates us and many other teams, especially the Steelers.

Stefanski seems to don’t have the mentality to win the game at all cost.
Inside our locker room we don’t have enough warriors and lions who are willing to sacrifice whatever it takes.

Berry think he can buy success instead of implementing a culture built on trust and accountability.

There are a lot of talented players and coaches in this organization but without the right mentality nothing will change.

It’s tough pill to swallow but the Browns needs new a leadership. Probably a new HC and definitely get rid of Watson, who simply don’t care enough when things go south.

Yes to all.

Letting Callahan walk was criminal. Flacco can read Defenses, had a hell of a play fake and throws a MUCH, MUCH, more catachable ball (accuracy, ball placement, leading receivers), it's not even close.

Was at the game... it was so fricking hot...

I sat next to some nice giants fans who thought they would get blown out.

This team needs to reset this week and get some OL help ASAP.

It felt like as soon as the Newsome roughing the passer call occurred we lost all fire on defense and it took 3 quarters for it to return

Our OL continues to be a huge issue with no solution in the short term

Watson is so below average, but still not the reason we lost today (he was A reason, but not THE reason)

Outside of Cooper, our skill guys were horrid today

3rd and 1 with the game on the line when you have Foreman and Ford to pick up a single yard and you bring in Winston to QB sneak? Then some stupid ass poorly run RPO on 4th and 1 with a trash Offensive line? Hue Jackson would be proud! Who is calling that trash, Stefanski or Dorsey? Wow.

I can't quite believe 3-0 either. But the Steelers have tons of injuries too. It's very early in the season.

Go Yankees. - And thank you dad for bringing me up as a Yankee fan. How in the heck you people can root for a team that calls themselves “The Guardians” is beyond me.


However, I’ll oblige, the Indians/Gaurdians are a much better run organization than this crap that we all root for on Sundays.

Stefanski is regressing.

He’s a run of the mill coach.

The problem is we’ve had bottom three coaches for so long that people love Stefanski just because he’s average and doesn’t say dumb things in pressers.

You will never win anything with Stefanski as HC.

I have said a few times, but Winston on short yardage goes BACKWARDS first. Not sure that's the most efficient way to do it

Tillman’s drop on fourth down sealed it. I thought he’d turn the corner this year, but it’s early.

The Giants are better than people think. They have a really good front on D that was able to take advantage of an OL that is limping. Wills looked really bad at times in PO, I saw a couple of full-field replays showing our WRs were not getting much separation.

I don’t hang this loss on DW, he had guys in his face all game.

Daboll had an excellent plan against our D: quick, easy throws, mitigate our front, and hold MG all day because refs rarely call it when it’s Myles. We should have had Ward on Nabers BEFORE the second half.

I did my best Eotab imitation, so carry on with the rants.

I think doing this colonoscopy prep will be funner than watching the Browns play today.

Another thought: Nabors is better than any WR we've drafted .. maybe ever lol

I agree, SBD. This week better change some situational things, because we will duplicate bad outcomes next week if we duplicate the prep. I see little to no upside DW until he can avoid sacks, strips, fumbles, and losses by getting rid of the ball. NFL is not a hobby for spare time convenience; buy some tackles that dress and are marginally playable. Ours might not grade out in HS films. Dumb it down to what we can execute. Give half of DW's reps to his replacement.
I wonder's, being questions I can't stop asking meself. If not today, what must occur and how much worse must it get to earn DW a sit-down and a dose of Vitamin P (pine) to treat his issues? We are not only shooting oiurselves in the foot. No, we are burning clips and re-loading. Another, what would you build on next week from this game? Also, why can't we defend the flat or hit receivers coming off the line (or refuse to do so)? We need some coaching triage: First, stop the bleeding. I refuse to believe there are quick fixes but dandy explanations. I'll quit; perhaps you have nagging curiosity to add. Brother, can you spare a tackle?

I respect your opinion, but enough with the excuses. This was a home game played against an 0-2 team —- by a team that is supposed to compete for a title.

They look sloppy, undisciplined, and disorganized. Whether it’s DW’s fault or not, it’s clear that the trade set us back and clearly, clearly, has been a giant mistake.

Myles Garrett, Denzel Ward, Joel Bitonio all deserve better. Trade them for picks and start over. What a complete abomination the trade for dw has been.

Probably so. Simply because the colonoscopy prep will be done at some point in the future. No end in sight for play of this caliber.

After Wills and Wyatt went down our OL was kinda like this: Joel at LT, Pocic at RG, Hudson or Jones at RT, Harris at centre and maybe Zinter at LG?

Wow, some of you all are so Funny its unbelievable!!
IF the offensive line is playing like crap, U really think any QB can over come that?? They couldn't pick any blitz, they were getting good pressure with just 4. Stefanski did not establish a running game and really abandoned it. And if your oline is having problems protecting, why the hell are you lining up 5 wide? But we still had chances to win but then either penalties or fumbles blew our chances. Kevin thinks he can out think everyone but that series in the second half when we used the QB sneak on 3rd down and then some pass play on 4 and inches. But if you really were a true Browns fan, you would also question Berry and ask why didnt we address the Oline in the off season with people who can play right now!!....


BTW... Kevin was so smart, teams from last year and this year are running right at Dallas. What does Kevin do, pass!!....

On the bright side we only committed 5 penalties!

Dog I have to agree with you. DW is still somewhat culpable, but he got sacked 8 times (way too many for any QB). Lord knows how many other times he was hit and hurried AND he had no running game not to mention that dropped pass at the end AND I'd like to add the Ford fumble at a crucial time AND the dumb play calling on 3rd and 4th down on one of the final drives. We had plenty of chances to pull this game out. Maybe we're just not good enough. If we couldn't beat the Giants at home we're in trouble!! JMO

Pass happy Stefanski at it again. How many predictable 1st down passes were there today? How many were actually completed and resulted in positive yardage vs incomplete or a sack taken?

Only positive think I saw was Cooper with an excellent redemption game.

something that's gotten lost for me: the Ford fumble was such a devastating play IMO. We had all the momentum and you could tell we were finally ahead of the Giant D

I agree. The fumble and the dropped pass at the most crucial times. Typical Browns. Never gave ourselves a chance. Oh, and for those who care DW had a better QB rating than Baker today

Cowboys got destroyed by the Saints and getting destroyed by the Ravens and the Cowboys destroyed us. Each team had put up over 190 rushing yards. We refused to run the ball. We are a very bad coached team.

and another thing: going into the game, my assumption would be that Nabors is the #1 threat to beat us. Not having Ward on him until so late really cost us IMO

Total team fail. No units could execute. That falls on the coach. HC needs to re-evaluate his approach. Although I will say, it's ridiculously difficult to run an O with turn style OL.

Stefanski was an asset for a team that desperately needed maturity and stability.

Mission accomplished.

Now that that is solved, he’s a liability.

Five years in and hasn’t improved in any area. He’s an average guy with an average approach and a losers mentality.

The Browns will never win anything with him as head coach.

How about not throwing a screen until the fourth quarter.

The list of grievances are long.

This team has a culture and heart issue and the coach doesn’t help.

I think I could tell within 10 plays what the Giants plan of attack was on defense ... and it seemed like our coaches didn't adjust for 3 quarters

So poorly coached.

It’s pretty bad actually.

the losses by the Cowboys the past two weeks surely makes our coaches look even worse

Wheres all the Homer's at ?. I remember years ago Diam Dawg
Was proudly proclaiming the Browns were entering a new era

There’s not many posters left on this board.

It’s a fairly inactive board at this point, at least in regards to football talk.

I would guess the reasons in some order are 1) Watson coming/Baker leaving, 2) other posters driving people away and one poster in particular, and 3) probably just wanting to get off the rollercoaster that is this team.

I love the Browns, but dislike the current version of it. The whole thing with Watson is a dark cloud ... couple that with his actual play on the field and it's hard to watch

This is game is a culmination that identifies TONS of gaps we currently have. Lets look at this:

1. Coaching, once again we look unprepared, we had the wrong gameplan, the situational playcalling was some of the worst I've ever seen. I give Schwartz a semi pass here, he messed up trusting Bust emerson as much as he did, Unless he was trying to match speed on the outside with Ward or something, but for the most part the Defense adapted as the game went on and made some big stops down the stretch. Thats a sign of a good coach, he def. adapted a bit and we started getting stops. Stefanski on the other hand, deer in headlight for 3 quarters and gets gifted a TD drive by watson and the very next drive after the defense got another stop, decides on 3rd and short to take watson(who had been finally in rhythm) and bring in Winston(who comes in cold) for a gimmick play. Then not showing how dumb he was at that time, decided to remove any doubt for those still on the fence. The 4th and 1, and he decides to go for it but put watson in shotgun. Yeah that was a great call. Stefanski is holding this team back from a playcalling and preparation standpoint. The not playing any starters in preseason, along with the camp cupcake, its all showing. Stefanski did nothing to try to establish the run early and get the oline playing in rhythm, oline usually only get that when run blocking because they are playing downhill and hitting people, pass blocking theres too much variable. He also didn't do anything to slow down the rush, nothing, no screens, no quick hitters, didn't even try to go deep until after the half. One of the craziest things I saw was on an obvious screen, ford blocks his guy, Watson is backpedaling, ford I am almost certain was supposed to turn upfield and turn around for a pass, so what's butterfingers do instead, he turns and chases the defender as they sack Watson, watson had nowhere to go with the ball because it was an obvious screen.

2. Talent evaluation: I know its blasphemous to talk bad about Berry, but I would ask, what exactly has he done? Squandered draft picks, yep. not fix the oline depth problem we had even last year, check, not able to draft to save his life and not draft a single impact player his entire tenure.. yep. So yeah I ask, what has he done? You look at the players he's drafted in his career and compare that to who Dorsey has drafted and see if we kept the wrong guy.. FYI, quite a few of his players have won a few super bowls and MVP's.

3. Strength and conditioning. We seem slower, weaker and more fragile than other teams. We let a fat slob like Jones to show up to camp being 30lbs heavier than last year. He simply cannot play either tackle positions right now.. If he can't play guard, then he needs benched and some remedial S&C to get him down to a better composition. He was known for it in college, so you would think you'd have an offseason program in place to keep an eye on it.

4. Assistant coaches, its not common to point to glaring issues with positional coaches but I think we've downgraded in almost every replacement. SVP to Dorsey, Mitchell to Staley, the biggest one of all, Callahan to Dickerson. Not sure who all we swapped out on the defensive side, but the offensive side has been horrible.

5. Overall. What is this team, what do we do well? what is our identity on the offensive side? Defensive side? What things do we do better than anyone else that we build around that. I don't see that, on the defensive side I'd say we are an aggressive defense and like to rush the QB, but outside of that.. meh, and we don't even do that well. I think we want to, but we aren't that good at it. So thats a problem, reminds me of the whole "play like a brown" BS. Yeah they did that today. You look at the good teams, its very easy to say what their identity is.

conclusion, We have a HC who rode the coattails of others to get where his is, but he believes he's deserving of everything, he isn't. His ego won't allow anyone to tell him anything, and thats a problem. We have a FO who do not know how to build a team, they are constantly in reactive mode instead of being able to make sure we are prepared. Last year was a perfect storm. We were relatively healthy all year on defense and they balled out, hiding our putrid offense and QB play (qb's barely, if they did at all, pass 200 yards.) It wasn't until they got all those QB's killed they find a 20 year vet on his couch that caught lightning in a bottle and he was forced to dial back the playbook and just let Flacco go and play. He was a much better QB that KS was a coach. We have a FO that somehow gets shielding from the horrible job they've done getting us to the next level in talent. It all comes down to they did it better than when Hue was here and that seems to be enough for most. The question is, when is it not and people want more. I think we are there

you bring up a good point (and a word that stands out to me): IDENTITY

Stefanski's offense currently has no identity. We used to be a ground and pound team who took PA shots when we had the advantage

The current offense is out there wallowing and praying for a miracle

Watson is definitely not part of the solution. At worst he’s awful and at best he’s average to below average.

I think the team has bigger issues though that aren’t recoverable -

—HC
—Poor drafts
—No development of young talent except Emerson (and he might not recover after today; he was emasculated and started playing scared); there’s literally nothing in the pipeline on this team
—Just a general heart and culture issue; the Browns have yet to sustain any type of identity or sustained success under any regime including this one. The black cloud has been there for a long time.

I think the absence of Njoku and Chubb and Hunt really hurt this team's chemistry and attitude. Just from my observation, the offense has no togetherness or fight

It was hot. My wife went in to the club after the 1st QTR. I went in a few minutes before the half, but stayed there until I saw the first 2 Browns drives of the 3rd Qtr and decided to just head back to the hotel. My desire to get a seat and not stand on the train back to Brookpark station was greater than staying to watch what I had seen up to that point.

As I have gotten older I don't let it bother me all that much anymore. My wife and I just got back from a nice meal....I refuse to allow the Browns to impact my attitude to the negative.

Yep, I think there's also a trust issue at play here, multi-level at that.. I don't think KS trusts the offense to execute, I don't think DW trusts KS to maximize the things he does better, I don't think DW trusts the Oline and his receivers to catch, and I don't think KS trusts his running backs currently.

I agree. The deficiencies are all very well known by all parties

Yeah thats another huge thing missing we had with Baker (for all his faults) but the team had a swagger and it could play off of that and really get rolling.. This team doesn't seem to have anyone with that magnetic personality that can get the team pumped up

Flacco had a little of that last season

yep.. that X factor that guys can rally around.. we don't have a single player on either side like that.

I haven't gone for two years now. I love not paying to see a crap show plus to pay to park for it.


I miss the tailgate friends, nothing else.

Sat out in the sun listening to it on the radio.

I still love the Browns. They are no longer my Sunday top of the list of things to do.

I hope everything comes out alright.

Yep. Plus we have a weak offensive line, a blah run game and a 'rust or bust' QB.

I am not sure how the owner can keep accepting crappy play, crappy drafting, and crappy coaching.

This team is so far from a team like KC, perennial contenders, that it is basically impossible to get our hopes up.

Right, and at the end of the day we aren't going to beat a team like KC, BUF, PIT when it counts ...

And even when it doesn't count.

He can accept it because the Browns make him lots of money regardless if they win or lose.

Our issues started with the selection of Mayfield. Just think: we could/should have had Josh Allen and also kept our three 1st rd picks given up in the DW trade. I didn't like it then, and I sure hate it now. I believe we have drafted OK considering what we had to work with.....

The Watson trade has been a disaster!

Most certainly, but it started before then as I mentioned above....

No point in looking back at the 18 draft. We are where we are. We have the QB that we have.

We’re 1-2 in a tough league, with 14 games to go. A banged up OL doesn’t help, the lack of a difference/making good RB doesn’t help - until Chubb returns - and who knows how he will produce?

The Browns were heading in the right direction with Baker. Then he gets injured and the Browns drop him like a stone. They make the awful Watson trade and things started going south from there.

Do they want to win? Of course they do, but don't seem to have the leadership or motivation to.

But my point is, it’s too early to throw in the towel. Show some guts, and as fans of the Browns, act like you have some fight.

Maybe the team should show some fight

Leading the league in most penalties and dropped passes

How as a fan am I supposed to show guts ?

we've had tough losses before (the past few years) but I always thought our guys were together and fighting and well prepared

I feel the opposite tonight. I feel like there's a big disconnect with the offensive identity

And seeing other teams in the league makes me feel like we aren't even close

First off, quit whining about Callahan.....we didn't let him walk, he wanted to coach with his son.

KS got schooled by Brian frickin' Daboll. I'm still wondering how Daboll ever landed a HC job. You could tell the game was over when that penalty took away our turnover and the Giants marched right down the field. Totally tanking after an early momentum shift ala the Houston playoff game last year.

I agree. KS got out coached big time. The Giants had us in jail on offense an exposed our pressure on defense. It was one of the first times in KS career that it was THAT noticeable

The whole thing was painful to watch. Before halftime, I was hoping that Jameis would start the second half. At least we can't be 0 -17.

Speaking of rollercoasters...are we, as a fan base, still fluffling DePo? Berry laser eyes?

As a whole, I'm not sure I've sensed a more disengaged fan base. Boo birds were out early and often today. There were some, "we want Jameis" chants.

Personally, and I have said this before, I do not think the Browns will ever win anything with the Haslams as owners. Any fool can throw piles of cash at a problem.

Watson's postgame outfit was a hoot!

A couple of observations.

The OL is a problem.

The Browns are beginning to witness the effects of trading away all those draft choices for Watson, who has been less than average.

The defense is respectable, but when the offense can’t move the ball, they will wear down.

I hear you but it is easy to look back and say what we should have or could have done. We could do that for darn near anything we have done in our lifetime.

I’ll add to this that there were a ton of empty seats and a ton of Giants fans. Three games into a season following a playoff season…thought that was really strange.

Disagree on the Haslams…I think. Really depends on what is happening behind the scenes. If Haslam didn’t or doesn’t have a meeting with Kev/Berry after yesterday’s game re-emphasising his expectations, then the org is devoid of leadership from the top down. It would basically be Kev and Berry are running the show, just got nice extensions, and don’t feel any real pressure to win. That’s how Kev coaches and that’s how the Browns play.

I have pretty good seats to the game this weekend and don’t really feel like going. I could not be any less excited to deal with the crowds and traffic and idiots to watch a team that isn’t that fun to root for. Would rather sit on my couch watching redzone.

Speaking of OL, any of the OL experts want to comment on how Zinter performed?

From my untrained eye, I think our OL actually played its best when Teller and Wills exited and we went: Bitonio-Pocic-Harris-Zinter-Jones

K S Has to be held accountable for this mess .
So Amari Cooper manned up this week and admitted he was not practicing as hard as he should have been . The coaches were letting this happen and he took it upon his self to fix it and he did . This begs the question of are we just going thru the motions in practice and is the coaching staff accepting it .
We are only going to get better with practice and that does not seem to be happening . Practice is not overrated . We need work.

I think we can all agree that practices (namely training camp) were a joke. The team is so soft and unprepared in basically every facet