DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Winslow's demands may necessitate Derek Anderson's departure!

Yeah, but what the hell is the big deal when you represent that many people at that high a level for that much money,...I doubt Rosenhaus has been "starving" for three years.

He is using Kellen to be/make an ass of himself.

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Yeah, but what the hell is the big deal when you represent that many people at that high a level for that much money,...I doubt Rosenhaus has been "starving" for three years.

He is using Kellen to be/make an ass of himself.

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Correct but he still wants paid for representing him.. This is all about money for the agent first K2 second.

nordawg

I don't like Drew Rosenhaus, he's a ............. fill in the blank yourself! He and his clients are all selfish. However, I think we're in good shape to sign everybody at this point, unless one player wants to try and break the bank, which Phil won't let happen.

ABOUT THE BROWNS . . .

Kellen Winslow is at least a year too early in asking for a new contract. Yes, he is a Pro Bowl tight end. Yes, he's tough and has matured a lot. Yes, he has the best hands of any Browns receiver since they returned in 1999, and he may rank with some of the best receivers ever with the Browns. And yes, he is a tight end, but his knee problems limit his blocking so he really is more like a receiver. But no, it's not time for a new contract.

History lesson: In his first season (2004) with the Browns, Winslow received $11.3 million. That was primarily his signing bonus and his first year's salary. He was injured in the second game and missed the rest of the season. Then he had the motorcycle accident in 2005 and missed the entire year. The Browns could have not paid him a dime -- instead, they gave him $300,000 the year he recovered and reworked his contract. At this point, he had been paid $11.6 million and had played two games.

In 2006, he was paid $2 million. In 2007, he earned $2 million. That brings him to $15.6 million in his first four years with the Browns, two of which he played. He is under contract for about $4 million annually through 2010, and it could be as much as $5 million depending upon how he performs.

Remember that NFL contracts are usually not guaranteed, only the signing bonus and (sometimes) the first year of the deal. That meant the Browns could have dumped Winslow when he was hurt and perhaps sued him to return some of his signing bonus because the motorcycle accident was not football related. Instead, they worked with him on a new contract -- and to Winslow's credit, he worked hard to come back and has produced. But he does have three years left on the deal.

Winslow has recently signed with hardball agent Drew Rosenhaus, who has held out some players to force renegotiations. Rosenhaus will not be paid unless Winslow gets a new deal -- an NFL agent often receives about 2 percent or 3 percent of the contract. It's a good guess that the Winslow camp looks at tight ends such as Tony Gonzalez, Dan Graham and Antonio Gates all earning about $6 million annually and believe their guy belongs in that class. The Browns may agree, but they also can counter that Winslow has averaged nearly $4 million a year over the last four seasons -- and only really played two. The Browns are in no rush to change his deal right now.

There are positive whispers coming from the Jamal Lewis talks. Remember, the key is the signing bonus. The Browns are willing to offer two years with some easily attained incentives to make them guaranteed, and also a decent bonus. Lewis' agents want three years, but they are talking and interested in keeping the free-agent running back here.

Lewis will be 29 in August. The Browns believe he will be effective at least for two more years. Some studies indicate a back who carries the ball more than 325 times tends to have a less productive season the following year. Lewis had 298 carries for the Browns, gaining his 1,304 yards. The one time he exceeded 325 carries was in 2003, when he ran for 2,066 yards in 387 carries. In the next three years, his production fell to the 1,000-yard range. His 2007 season was his best since 2003. The Browns respect how Lewis cares for his body, watches his diet and has emerged as a leader in the clubhouse and a strong supporter of coach Romeo Crennel. They are working hard to get him back.

As for the Derek Anderson contract situation, the team and player are looking at several options from three years to six years -- it depends on the bonus, etc. But nothing is expected to come of these talks until free agency begins on Feb. 29. While Lewis is unrestricted and can sign with any team, Anderson is restricted so the Browns can match any offer he receives -- or else they can get first and third round draft picks from a team that signs Anderson to an offer sheet.
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Terry Pluto
Plain Dealer 2/10/2008

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Kellen Winslow is at least a year too early in asking for a new contract.

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I completely agree.

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History lesson: In his first season (2004) with the Browns, Winslow received $11.3 million. That was primarily his signing bonus and his first year's salary. He was injured in the second game and missed the rest of the season.

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Many players are injured. Many players are still paid. Stupid lesson.

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Then he had the motorcycle accident in 2005 and missed the entire year. The Browns could have not paid him a dime -- instead, they gave him $300,000 the year he recovered and reworked his contract.

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True, but once again.........the Browns did not keep him because they were being "nice guys." *L* Sheesh, do people really believe that garbage? They kept him for one reason only-----------they felt the reward was worth the risk. They felt that he could help the club in the future. Being kind had nothing to do w/it.

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The Browns are in no rush to change his deal right now.

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As it should be, but please stop w/the hogwash logic.

Anyone notice Winslow limping somewhat at the Pro Bowl?
I did and I was surprised none of the announcers saw it..

He wouldn't get a new contract from me if I was the GM..play it out and lets see where you're at..

I don't see him getting a new contract anytime soon. Of course he has to know that he cut his career short with the accident. The oppurtunuity too make another big contract might not be there for him. This is probably his way of trying before it's too late.

If I'm Phil ..I'm taking a TE in the draft..and that also SAYS alot about what i think his health is..
Dude's knee will limit his years in the NFL..

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If I'm Phil ..I'm taking a TE in the draft..and that also SAYS alot about what i think his health is..
Dude's knee will limit his years in the NFL..

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I don't know how smart that would be.. really, Winslow is under contract and I don't think he's stupid enough to pull a TO. I have a feeling his father would step in...JMO however..

But more importantly, we have Heiden who isn't horrible by any means.

I don't think I'd press the panic button on a TE yet,, and I don't think Phil will either...

Having said that, if one falls in our lap and is a bit of a project,,, I have no problem with it..

Since the Senior Bowl reveiled who teams talked to Phil has his eyes on
Kellen Davis from MSU..a guy who can be had in mid-late rounds..but he's another weapon..remember Chud is a guy who likes a TE threat..
No one knows how this next surgery will go on Winslow..so I would want another weapon behind him..and one that can be groomed for another two years..

Daman from a practical standpoint it would quite logical to bring in another TE who stretches the field , something Heiden cannot do...

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Daman from a practical standpoint it would quite logical to bring in another TE who stretches the field , something Heiden cannot do...

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Yeah I understand and like I said, if one falls into out laps I'm good with that. But we do have a few priority holes to fill and TE really isn't one of them at the moment... At least I don't think so... for what it's worth....

While it's not a obvious one it is one..

It's also known they are interested in some WR's..
If you observe how Phil attacks FA, he hits the immediate holes there..then goes in the draft to get the minor holes filled..
I expect a TE to be drafted sometime on the second day.

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we have Heiden who isn't horrible by any means.

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Heiden has no ability to be able and step up to be a no.1 TE in this league. I love him but he possess no speed at all. Him and Dinkins are better blockers. If we had a chance to pickup someone else I would. Maybe Smolko who earned his way on the Jags this year from the PS.



Yes, I'm just talking about Smolko because his dad and my wife's dad are close.

Wow Pit..if you actually thought about it you wouldn't take the comment so literal as if it's a insult..I'm just showing a pattern that Savage takes..

Fact ..we had a starter at LT so he went into the draft to upgrade it..
We didn't have a starter in ILB so that was a hole..


FYI..he did hit FA market aggressively BEFORE he went into the draft the last two seasons regarding the Oline..did he not?

I already addressed the LB core in the draft forum so I don't need to rehash it here...

Tony Grossi: Derek Anderson's Pro Bowl performance continues unsettling trend
Posted by Tony Grossi February 11, 2008 11:55AM
Categories: Browns

Derek Anderson's performance in the Pro Bowl was a preview of what may have happened if the Browns had made the playoffs. It could have been a train wreck.
Anderson's season went downhill after 10 games.

Starting with the Arizona game on Dec. 2, his accuracy deserted him and his production dropped. He threw seven touchdowns and eight interceptions.

You can blame some of that on poor weather. But that wasn't the case in Arizona and it wasn't the case in Honolulu.

With literally an all-star supporting cast in the Pro Bowl, Anderson misfired for 16 incompletions in 26 passes, had one pass intercepted and one interception dropped.

Counting the Pro Bowl, Anderson completed barely 50 percent of his passes over his last six games and had a passer rating of 62.1.

The Pro Bowl game shouldn't be held against Anderson in contract talks with the Browns. But it is a reminder of the inconsistency he brings to the field.

-- Tony Grossi


-----After beating only one above 500 team all year (Seattle), can anyone really say DA played well in the second half OR against top notch competition??? Sounds like someone was a product of K2, Braylon, Lewis, JT, Steinbach, Fraley, Shaffer, and Tucker

Well given his performance or lack of it on a consistant basis combined with his contract demands....IMHO I would be amazed IF any team offered us a 1st & 3rd Rd. for Anderson ....However , IF anyone does....Take It ! ASAP , before they wake up realize what they are about to do ....

You know DA might be a one year wonder so I would lean toward a sign and trade over signing him to a long term deal.

Brady Quinn with a pro bowl O-lineman, WR, TE and a solid RB sounds like playoffs in 2008 for the Cleveland Browns.

If anything, the Browns will be lucky to get a couple of 2nds, or lower, for DA. No way anyone is coughing up a 1st & 3rd for him.

It's pretty basic ATTACK. We had a RT playing LT.

When we SIGNED him I was baffled. He played LT for a left handed QB. Basicly a RT in LT clothing!! He played the "weak side" and did NOT protect the QB's "blind side".

Savage got a "band aid" at LT in the FA market. He got his "franchise LT" in the draft. ( See Pace #'s to compared to Shafer to varify )

The highest FA's paid are LT's, QB's and CB's as of late. Savage addressed ALL of those positions *long term* in the draft.

The lesser paid positions, ie.... G,C etc..... you CAN address long term in the FA market. It's VERY smart business!



But to suggest he doesn't address our "dire needs" in the draft, but does it in the FA market is a rather odd and off the mark comment IMO.

It's not a big deal. Just a comment that left going........"Say WHAT??"

That's not necessarily true. I'm not sure what Houston gave up for Schaub, but DA is more proven then Schaub was at the time Houston picked him up. DA at this point, is a Pro Bowl QB. And GM's will take a chance on that, and I can think of several teams in QB hell.

We may nitpick DA, but other teams would LOVE to have the luxury of having a Pro Bowl QB that nobody likes!

Just clicking

Just listened to Phil Savage on his weekly thursday morning interview with Wills and snyder on WTAM.. you can catch it on WTAM.com or at the Browns main site in the multi media area..

Two things he points out

1. He says it was reported that talks with DA had stalled.. he says that that is NOT the case at all.. far from the truth. (Just a note, I think it was either Grossi or Cabot that made that comment,, like I said, they make stuff up when there isn't anything else to report and fans go nuts about it,, just what the reporters wanted..)

2. He was asked about KW2's comment about a new contract.. Actually, Phil said that he and the Browns are open to listen to a deal.

He complemented KW on how he's handled himself and how much he's proven to be a leader and how hard he worked to get back in shape.

But he also was quick to point out that the Browns were very patient with him after the motorcycle accident.

He added that with FA coming up and the Combine, he didn't feel that NOW was the time to address that with KW.. later, he'd listen, but not now.

Of course I'm paraphrasing,, he said it better than I can write it,, but I'd go and listen to it if you have time.. Enlightening about the Combine and FA as well..

If you say so but I just don't see a team dumping a 1st & 3rd on him. Houston swapped 1st's & gave up two 2nd's for Schaub. I could see Savage settling for less than a 1st rounder for him. It's all conjecture because I don't see him going anywhere.

Phil doesn't like to go into the draft with glaring holes if he can fix those in FA first..perhaps thats what I should have said...

It will be the same this year..he will try and get front seven help in FA first..and whatever position he can't upgrade there, he'll target in the draft..

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2. He was asked about KW2's comment about a new contract.. Actually, Phil said that he and the Browns are open to listen to a deal.

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From yesterday:

Savage will listen to Winslow but says Browns hold cards
Thursday, February 14, 2008
BY Steve Doerschuk
REPOSITORY SPORTS WRITER

Browns General Manager Phil Savage responded Thursday to Kellen Winslow Jr.'s wish for an improved contract. Yes, Savage used the word "motorcycle."

Last week at the Pro Bowl, in a Sirius Radio interview, Winslow indicated he wants a restructured contract after putting up seasons of 875 and 1,106 receiving yards.

Prior to that, the 24-year-old tight end missed 30 of 32 games because of injury, including all 16 games in 2005 following his infamous motorcycle crash the same day he rode to Canton to see a StarBoyz stunt team.

Savage gave his response to Winslow's contract situation Thursday morning during an interview with Browns AM radio flagship WTAM.

"Kellen does have three years left on his deal. We're always open to listening to anything, and then it's kind of the Browns' choice to proceed or not do anything.

"Kellen has come back (from the injuries). He's overcome a lot over the last few years. He's a great competitor. He's got an incredible passion for the game.

"At the same time, we showed incredible patience with Kellen after the motorcycle accident and those sorts of things, but at the end of the day, right now, all of our focus is on the Combine and upcoming pro free agency.

"There is a time and a place for everything. I'm not sure it all synchs up at this particular moment."

Savage said he and his staff are in crucial draft and free agency meetings, some lasting from daybreak to midnight.

"This is probably the most important week of the year in terms of the college draft," he said. "I would say in the next two weeks is the most important two weeks of the year in terms of pro free agency. We're extremely busy right now."

The Browns are stacking their draft board before heading to the Combine next week in Indianapolis. They will use the Combine to tweak rather than set their board.

Savage can start signing free agents Feb. 29.

"We've been working on pro free agency since Thanksgiving," he said. "We're making our list, checking it twice. The coach has been evaluating some of the players to make sure we're on the same page."

Reach Repository sports writer Steve Doerschuk at (330) 580-8347 or e-mail: steve.doerschuk@cantonrep.com

Basically this ain't the time to worry about Winslows wishes..
We'll worry about it when the time comes..

j/c

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Winslow, who caught 82 passes for 1,106 yards and five touchdowns in 2007, signed a one-year extension in 2005 through 2010. He made $2 million in 2007, and he's set to make $4 million in 2008, $4.9 million in 2009 and $4.75 million in 2010.

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Sung to the tune of " How Much is that Doggie in the Window?":

How much is that Dawggie, Kellen Winslow?

The one with the real messed up knee.

How much is that Dawggie, Kellen Winslow?

Five million is too much for me!