DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Browns Trying to Trade for Gocong

I can't help but feel we got a couple of chicken fried steaks for that ham sandwich and a couple of late round picks we could spare.

Hew I know this would take a little homework, but can you show me all of these 4th and fifth round CB's and LB's that have been regular season starters for their teams? And if you find some, are they the weak link in the chain, marginal guys, or are they starting year in and year out?

I know it's "possible" but it's not likely if you care to take a look at it. It's a far bigger gamble than many here seem to be indicating.

Every draft pick is a gamble. The later the pick, the less likely the success.

I mean we all have our "opinions", but do you have anything of substance to support your opinion? Just asking......

And could you explain to me what veteran leadership "familiar to MH's system" will be here to work with our rookies and younger players who have no experience at this system?

And do you feel like going into this season with very little experience on the field with this system? Do you feel like that would equate to success? Do you feel fourth and fifth rounders have a good chance of being part of "the nucleus" of our team?

I think those looking at this "big picture" can see far more pro's to this than cons.

I believe we're down to 10 now DnD, but none are in the seventh. No need for these guys to be screaming that the sky is falling when we still have more picks in the first five rounds than most teams. lol

We still have four picks in the top 100.

Which is why I don't see cause for such an overwhelming outcry about all of this.

I might be on that bandwagon if I felt we really gave too much for these vets. But there are at least 3-5 years left in both of them as starters. That's at least three drafts where we aren't forced to "reach" in the draft to get players at their positions. It gives us the option of trying to develop lower round picks and if they don't pan out, (which more times than not they don't), you can try again next year. For the next few drafts it "improves" our options plain and simple. But I guess if you focus on one single draft and not the bigger picture, you'll have that.

It gives us more options in the draft since some key components are already addressed so we can go value in places we really may have been weighing need as much or even more than value in this draft as well..

I think the whole move was smart and gave us far more flexability in the draft than we had previous to this move. I mean if Haden was gone, we'd be looking at a drafting a CB with most likely a lesser skill set than Brown.

And having flexability at the LB position is always a good thing in the 3-4. I'm just not getting the logic of why some wish to make a big deal out of next to nothing.

Silly me,I thought you meant just what you said.
I have this strange personality quirk,I take people at the word.
While your rolling on the floor laughing,you can reread the part where I said is was a good trade.
From on now,when I ask a general question just ignore it.No need to waste either of our time.

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fill NEEDS through Free Agency so you can take BPA in the draft

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I have a feeling that we will trade out of the number 7 spot for an extra high draft pick, and we will get Colt McCoy in the 2nd. JMHO Go Brownies!!!

No problem. In English I was taught that's what paragraph structure was for. My bad. lol
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CLEVELAND -- New Browns cornerback Sheldon Brown told The Plain Dealer he is confident the change of scenery will be good for both him and linebacker Chris Gocong, who were acquired today in a trade with the Eagles. The Browns received a starting cornerback and a linebacker with starting potential in exchange for a fourth and fifth round pick in the April 22-24 draft, and third-year linebacker Alex Hall. The picks are the 105th and 137th overall, leaving the Browns with 10 selections.
"It's always good to be able to have a fresh start, but there will be some familiar faces with Chris coming in with me and (Browns general manager)Tom Heckert being there,'' said Brown, a ninth-year pro who started full-time for the Eagles since 2004. "Tom drafted me and I know how he feels about me as a player and as a person.''
Heckert was involved in drafting Brown, a second-round pick in 2002 out of South Carolina, and Gocong, a third-round pick in 2006 out of Cal-Poly SLO. Brown demanded a trade last April because the Eagles refused to renegotiate his contract with four years remaining. The trade with the Browns was contingent on Brown receiving a new deal, which according to Brown is "pretty much in place. We've been working on this for a few weeks. It will be great to put that behind me and focus on football.''
Despite the Eagles' refusal to budge last season, Brown still played well, finishing with a career-high five interceptions, including one that was returned for a touchdown. He also returned a fumble for a TD.
Gocong, who started mostly outside in the 4-3 scheme, never became the pass-rusher the Eagles envisioned, but most feel he's better suited to the 3-4 defense. He started for most of the past three seasons, but lost his starting job at the end of last season to a rookie.
"Chris has the same work ethic and drive that I do,'' said Brown, who will most likely start opposite Eric Wright. "He's the kind of guy who's seen and not heard and he leads by example. This system will fit him a lot better because he can stand up and play to his strengths like he did in college.''
Brown said he's still got plenty left in the tank despite heading into his ninth NFL season. "I'm coming off one of my better seasons numbers-wise,'' he said. "I think mostly everyone would consider that a fantastic season, but to me, winning and being consistent are more important than my statistics.''
Brown said he's looking forward to working for Browns President Mike Holmgren and coach Eric Mangini. "I know I'm coming into a really good locker room, which is what I'm accustomed to,'' he said.
Eagles coach Andy Reid said on a conference call with Philadelphia reporters, "Sheldon Brown has been a very good football player for the Eagles over the last eight years. He’s a good person, a legitimate tough guy and he’ll do a good job helping the Browns. Chris did a good job converting from defensive end to linebacker and helped us win a lot of football games. We wish both of them all of the best."
Eagles general manager Howie Roseman also said on a conference call, "Sheldon and Chris have been nothing but professionals on and off the field during their tenure in Philadelphia and we wish them all the best as they continue their careers in Cleveland.''
Roseman said of Hall, "Alex Hall is a big, athletic linebacker who we’ve had our eyes on over the last couple of years and he’ll have a chance to compete at the SAM linebacker spot."
Hall, a 7th-round pick of the Browns in 2008 out Division II St. Augustine's, never evolved into the fearsome pass-rusher the previous regime thought he would become. He played in 14 games last season, mostly on special teams, finishing with 10 tackles.
The Browns would only confirm that they agreed to terms of the trade pending physicals and will comment after the players pass those tests. Coach Eric Mangini alluded to the fact that another trade was in the works last week at the NFL owners' meetings.

http://www.cleveland.com/browns/inde...e_for_eag.html

Thought I'd post it without paragraphs.

I really like the deal.

Brown is a good player who will fill in for a 2 to 3 years.

Gocung, I wanted the Browns to draft him when he came out, and thought he would be a better player in the 3-4 than 4-3. He has not played much in philly, but I will take him, no problems.

I think that Hall did not fit into Mangini's scheme. I am not sure why.

I can live with the draft choices. It makes sense. 12 choices were not going to be on the team.

I think it was fair for both teams.

Honestely how are you still a Browns fan? You act like this team has been dragged to the bottom depths of hell. We could have traded a 1st rounder for Peyton Manning and you would probabally say:

"Well Manning is geting up their in age, that 1st rounder could have been a great player! Also Manning's contract is to much! What the hell is Mangini doing!!!!"

I think you put WAAAAAAAYYY to much value in draft picks. When it comes down to it, the draft is always a crap shoot. Sorry 4th and 5th round picks are still 4th and 5th round picks. That's like saying our 1st rounder is like the 1st pick in the draft.

MH stated he ain't got time to wait and he ain't waintin AND hoping one or ALL of your rookie picks SOMEDAY turn into what we just GOT. We still have 10 picks to get those same guys to groom and develop for the future. Since your so sure you can spot those no miss rookies maybe you should tell MH who to draft so we can't miss.... That way we get a decent product on the field right NOW and build towards the future at the same time...

Gosh.. I wonder why MH hasn't thought of that ???

"Do you see the Steelers or Ravens signing and overpaying 4 to 5 30+yo stop gaps every offseason? No"

Actually Baltimore has done it many times.Remember Mason,Mcnair, Rolle,Stallworth,etc.

Alright, I'll try to explain this a little slow for you. I understand people like you have a superiority complex. I'm also afraid you might pop a blood vessle because it's obvious you're stressed out. What I also saw was a team buying into his system and finishing the year with our longest win streak in quite awhile.

It's pointless to debate trading draft picks past the 3rd round. How in the hell do you know that those draft picks would have even made this team? Do you KNOW we would have traded up? I mean that would be a good move but listening to you nobody on the Browns know how to make good decisions. I mean seriously HAVE YOU SEEN THIS TEAMS DRAFT HISTORY?!??!?

Alex Hall would have probabally been cut off this team. Unless you saw superstar potential in him it's pointless to be upset so just drop that debate now. The kid had huge weakness and was very raw.

I'm done having debates with you I'll probabally place you on ignore anyways. You sound more like a steelers fans then a Browns fan. So please go root for them.

YEP sign me up .. I'll take TWO years of ANY kind of decent production from PROVEN players compared to what we've had on the field in those positions.. We've missed on players through HOW many GM's and Head coaches in the past ? Give me a known quanity for this price and I'm on board everytime... Also.. you need to go look up what the Pats AND Steelers did this off season AND in the past with getting aging vets. I'm sure Moss is making league min... And Walker from Miami. Why didn't they just use a 4th rounder in one of their drafts to get the same production ? I know... Their ALL idiots

Just look at how many starters on our team have been drafted by us...and then look at the league average and the number from good teams...maybe then 2 of your braincells start making love and produce a 3rd one

You guys act as if Brown is a good-CB...he isn't, he's average and declining at that, he was to them what Leigh Bodden was to us 2 years ago (and some 5 years older)...you won't get many "good" tier players in FA, you know why? because other teams aren't stupid

Here are some facts:

1. The Eagles did not want to pay Brown the money we NOW gave him...have you thought about WHY? They do not have promising players on their depth chart at CB either...so why? Maybe, just maybe...the FO and team that drafted Brown and saw him play for 8 seasons every sunday thinks he IS NOT WORTH IT (anymore: aging, declining etc) ? Now that's a shocker for your La-La Land, huh?

2. The Eagles replaced Gocong with their 7th round rookie last season...for those of you who still haven't gotten it...he got benched on a very weak LB-group...OLB is one of their biggest needs...also, after 4 years, the Eagles obviously didn't intend to re-sign the benched bum...WHY?

Dj borders on whether he is a well disguised troll or ....just a troll.

J/k Dj....well....maybe a little

You don't get good CBs for a 4th and 5th, sorry to delude you...you know who was the last CB to go for that price? Hobbs...from NE to Eagles

Funny thing is...I had this discussion with Eagles fans last year at that time...they were all hyped up on draft day, they got Hobbs for 2 5th rounders....WHAT A STEAL they screamed....I replied: you think the Pats let a good CB they know every toenail of go for that? Dream on I said...."no, he's going to push S.Brown, who's unhappy and declining anyway"...that's what they said back then....then came reality...Hobbs not only didn't push Brown....he couldn't even beat out Hanson for the Nickelback role...he finished the season appearing in 8 games and made 11 tackles

Moral of the story? My Grandpa always said...."you always have to sell your ailing cows to people from out of town...they don't know them and they can't see the cow every day"...there were no management books back then but he got an important rule of Economy 101 down...ask the Cowboys if they would have traded for Brown and give him 5+mil/year

Troll..........and a waste of time.

Maybe so, but don't discount the fact Heckert worked that farm and knows the cow in question.

There goes another Savage guy out the door.. I always thought Hall had potential, but I guess Gini' doesn't like really athletic LB's, b/c he got rid of Wimbley and Hall (Identical Twins) in the same off season.

Now my underdog LB is strictly Benard.

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You are officially full of crap. I know a lot of Eagles fans, and I have watched a lot of Sheldon Brown. He was good last year. Not amazing, but solid.

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Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Brown play with a bad hammy a good part of the season? I'm sure that would have an effect on his play.

And regardless what some think of him at this point in his career, he's still an upgrade over BMac, and will be our starter opposite of Wright, who is a solid corner himself.

IF, and it's still a big if, IF we get Berry in 3 weeks, our secondary went from being pretty damn weak to possibly being pretty damn solid. Our team got better today, which is all you could ask for.

All I know is that getting Sheldon Brown and Gocong makes the selection of a CB as one of the first 5 picks, not a requirement. We were ok at LB.

We can speculate on who will be targeted, but my guess is something along the lines of OL, QB, S, WR, and DE.

Found out about this trade from a Jaguars m-board, where the consensous was the Browns should have traded with jacksonville because if they are going to settle for an average corner they'd sure love a couple of Jaguars.

Their feeling about Gocong, is blanking vacuums, and 100% trash.
Is Jacksonville more familiar with Gocong for some reason? They're not in the same division.