DawgTalkers.net Forums The Archives 2015 NFL Season The NFL Draft 2015 Browns draft Cameron Erving with the 19th pick.

I completely agree with this. How many years did we draft WRs in the second round and completely neglect our O-line? While it's not sexy and it doesn't fill a huge need, we still got arguable the two best interior linemen (offense and defense) in the draft.

They showed that one graphic last night of drafts where Cleveland had two first round picks:
Joe Thomas and Brady Quinn
Trent Richardson and Brandon Weedon
Justin Gilbert and Johnny Manziel.

Oddly enough, the only pick that has worked out was the lineman.

Just think...at #19 overall say we drafted a pure OT...which everyone can agree is a need even if its only for depth or to push Shwartz...its capable that OT would be "insurance" as well...

Didn't like the pick last night, but that was looking at him as an interior lineman. Looking at the film/measurables, I think he's a solid utility guy at all five positions now and can develop into a stud RT, maybe sooner than later. Good feet, long arms, big hands, 30 reps 225 with those long arms. I don't see another right tackle prospect I like better with Flowers off the board.

I think he's a good player. Very well could have been BPA for us at #19. I can't knock that.

In terms of the team getting better? I don't know. We lose Rubin, use our top pick on a NT. Mack is rumored to be on the fence, we use another 1st at center.

Its kind of frustrating to see Good Guys leave and us re-draft the same spots. Hope that's not what is going on here with Mack. And that's not necessarily a shot at the front office. It might just be an indicator of people wanting out of town, and us being forced to replace them.

Since agenda-accusations are the apologists preferred method of argumentations, here's the pre draft thread on Shelton or Parker, remember?

https://www.dawgtalkers.net/ubbthreads.php/topics/938623/danny-shelton-or-devante-parker#Post938623

Thatwas my assessment then:

"From what I saw, neither is worth the pick."...
"Shelton otoh, I like his motor and hustle, but he's not dominant in anything he does, but he seems like a decent bet to make it in the NFL, but not star caliber."

Should I change it now only not to sound negative and be a good cheerleader?

My biggest issue with the pick was passing on Dupree again and leaving him for the Steelers to pick up. That was my nightmare scenario. He ends up anywhere else I wouldn't be bothered as much. Not that Dupree would have been amazing for us for sure, but just because it's the Steelers he'll turn into a human wrecking ball against us twice a year for the next 12 seasons.

not in reply to anyone in particular... just my rambling thoughts:

This is a SOLID move. What killed us last year as much as anything was having nothing to step in when Mack went down. We had no 6th man. Our line was trashed; continuity was gone.

One way or another, now we have solution to the "what if we lose one of our starters".

We have a guy that potentially is as good as Mack and likely could displace either of Bitonio and Greco from their positions.... AND he can (will?) probably turn Schwartz into the Swing Man while being able to step over and fill in at any of the three interior spots on his own.

What this means is that with the exception of Joe Thomas, we could have ANY one of four players go down and we could keep on trucking while barely missing a beat - it wouldn't destroy our season like it did a year ago.


Say what y'all want, but last year was rocking until Mack went down. Had he stayed healthy all year - and not likely triggered the implosion we saw in Hoyer - we had a completely legitimate shot at being in the playoffs. So.... is a 1st round pick worth creating the insurance that the OLine won't keep us out of the playoffs again? I think so.

One measly pick and a bargain rookie contract for that sort of peace of mind.... AND now we're insured for if (when?) Mack bolts.


This is what reloading looks like.

No, there are some posters that turn any negative comment into a blasphemy of demonic proportions. What's the point of that?

Look, we could have done much worse than Shelton-Erving, but we needed more. Farmer drafted scared and worst of all, there's still no evident plan. Now they talk about winning through the trenches with solid players...after picking up bom/bust projects after another last season. I don't see any plan, it's pure reactionism to save their butts

I don't think anyone can wreck on us. We've kept elite, proven nfl elite, rushers at bay. The only real rush threat, IMO, is JJ Watt, but he rain on anyone's oline. Even the wall that Dallas has.

Baltimore getting Perriman to go opposite of Smith Sr is more of a danger/threat/concern that Steelers getting Bud. JMO

I like Dupree a lot but he is going against Joe Thomas.

I'm happy Dupree plays for the Steelers. Pre-draft I compared his game to Jarvis Jones, obviously, the Steelers agreed. If he's "as good" as Jones, we will be fine....even with Erving at RT

I wasn't even thinking of you when I wrote that. LOL.

A DE with questionable instincts and a WR with very questionable hands.

Not only a WR with questionable hands, but he's replacing a guy that was better.

Ozzie has no idea what he's doing.

I whiff on most backers so the fact that i do like him isnt a plus for his chances of success. OL, CB and QBs, I usually hit on pretty well though. The only corner i have missed on recent memory was the kid from LSU that went to Dallas, what a bust. OL have been really good on. QB, Aaron Rogers was really about the only big miss, I liked Rogers but he was from a system that just produced one turd after another and it scared me from any endorcement. If Johnny doesnt vastly improve he will make that list in a very negative way.

I know, since you responded to someone else, but when I quit posting around here it was like that with you and seeing it is still the same I though it (you) needs to get called out for it. It was one of the reasons I felt it wasn't worth it anymore on here. I'm sure Vers does it in a much more contradicting way, but it is what it is, as in pure rhetorics and not much of an argument

Need to see how the rest of the draft falls .. I admit that I would have gone Parker at 12 and then hoped for Shelton or Brown at 19 ( NE took Brown at 32 ).. I understand the pick though ..

Not only that but it's really interesting for someone like me who doesn't watch college tape to read DJ say "watch the tape he's bad", then to hear you say "I watched it and he was good".

Just makes someone like me wonder how much to trust what I read on here and how much of what you see is not only open to interpretation but to also understating what is occurring schematically on every play. My impression from your back and forth with DJ is he takes a very myopic view of what he's seeing where you were trying to understand everything that was going on during the play.

Not saying either of you are right or wrong. Just don't know what to put any stock into.

Claiborne, yeah. He was my biggest non QB miss too.

Again, Shelton and Erving are pretty safe bets to be solid players with a low bust chance and Farmer avoided bigger mistakes, but I'm underwhelmed with regards to their ceilings. We needed more than that to get better. We will see how he does with the next picks, but I'm not holding my breath

This was me, I had Parker valued really high but I understand the pick. I think his quality of person was also a big selling point for this team. Plus now i get to go back to hating on Lousiville players lol and Vers hell with Teddy too lol.

Erving, I had going to the Chiefs in the first. I was higher on him than a lot of folks, didnt think he would be there in the 2nd at all but hey I would rather have Erving at 19 than Scherff at 5 lol I cant imagine taking a guard that high.

But save for Bodine, they are better players.

Does every post I make have to be in the form of an argument or debate? I can't post an observation?

There is an intense amount of negativity on this board, and there are people who are consistently negative, no matter what happens. I find it incredibly annoying and unproductive. Was my comment productive? No, it wasn't. So I'm a hypocrite in that regard. But you know, I feel it needs calling out. LOL.

I'm glad you left because of me, and I hope you do it again.

There's a lot of negativity? Go figure, might have something to do with the team and entire organization. Wild guess.

FWIW, I didn't leave because of you or anyone. Debate was weak and I mainly left because of general disinterest.

I look at Dupree as the complete opposite if Jarvis Jones. Jones has less size and is less explosive. He played in a scheme where his skills were emphasized in college rather than hidden. Jones was relatively polished, Dupree is not. I had off the field red flags for Jones, none with Dupree.

I'm not worried about Dupree versus JT. I'm worried about Dupree against Schwartz and later whoever replaces JT.

Come on, you're ruining their argument. It's easier to just say we picked wrong and point to players that are guaranteed Pro Bowlers.

This isn't my opinion, but isn't this is a weak draft for first rounders? Meaning, there's a lot of 2nd rounders that will get drafted in the first. I've heard McShay, Pollian, and other board members say that too. If that's true, and you're selecting at #19, you have to expect every player available is going to have some problems. A WR that can't catch, a one-dimensional pass rusher, or an OT/G/C that isn't perfect from day one.

I might have gone DE with #19, but they did their homework. They have a plan. You, anyone claiming they don't have a plan, might not agree with the plan, but they have one. They know more about their own roster than we do.

I wasn't thrilled with the Bitonio pick last year. not that I didn't think we needed a G but I certainly felt he was overdrafted. I thought it was a reach pick. I see many saying the same thing here about Erving.

I'm not sure what role they see for Erving, but I have to look back at the Bitonio pick and say that until I have a reason to see for myself that he will not be a starter and not be a good OL player. I have to look at last year and the evidence indicates they know what they need and how to draft OL.

If Jalen Strong lasts until #43 and we take him, I will feel they got very good bang for their buck at the WR position. I certainly didn't see any of the WR's they passed up at #19 as worthy of the pick.

I was under the same impression. This draft seemed to have a lot of "safe" picks in it but not a lot of star power. Even the 2 QBs taken 1 and 2 both have some pretty serious ????????....

So who do you sit then ....... our best Guard of a year ago, Greco, or our 2nd round pick of a year ago, Bitonio?

Man, I have no idea why people want to replace Greco, who was our best Guard last year. He is probably a top 15 Guard in the NFL, and he might even be higher. He was effective playing next to McDonald and Seymour on the inside, and Schwartz on the outside. (who many greatly dislike) Imagine if he had played the entire season next to Mack, instead of the revolving door we had at C.

I just don't get why people think that moving Schwartz to RG would improve the 3rd best position on our OL.

J/C

I like the Erving pick, I just don't like Dupree in Pitt. Hopefully Butler changes things up. I see Dupree as a perfect fit for Lebeau's scheme.

I could be wrong but if Erving improves and has some upside could he be JT's replacement someday? Just a thought.

If Erving can stuff Dupree twice a year like he did Eli Harold in college, you will LOVE this pick.

That should be the measuring stick here...We will get to see the two picks line up across from each other for at least the next 4 years, probably 5.

Me neither. I looked up some other 'reports' that do align with your comments as well. So, naturally, there are varying opinions.

Grecco wasnt our best guard last year. Hell Bitonio may have been our best player last year, should have been in the probowl.

When is the last time when we had legit competition for a position between multiple qualified guys and had the luxury of picking the best one to start and having the others for depth? Historically our position battles have been choosing the better of two weak players then praying he didn't get hurt.

I get that you don't draft depth at 19.. but how many teams have had their entire season fall apart from an injury to the OL? Kind of like ours did last year...

I like Grecco, I would dispute that he was better than Bitonio but then Bitonio had JT to his left and Grecco had Schwartz to his right, so there is that....

Grecco just turned 30, which isn't old but it's getting there. For years and years fans screamed that we didn't focus on the trenches, now we are and people are screaming we didn't draft a WR...

I think we slide Erving in at RT. Schwartz is an okay RT, but he doesn't have the nasty/finisher mentality we need to take our running game to the next level. Erving flashes it.

That's the nature of the beast.

Sadly, it's like the IRS - talk to 5 different IRS people with a tax problem you have, you may get 5 different answers. Same with scouting players for the MOST part. (examples: Luck - panned out according to pre-draft thoughts. Brady? 6th rounder -and even some experts thought THAT was too high)

Here's a personal example: After we drafted weeden, I watched some of his tape and I thought "what on earth did we draft HIM for? He can't make tight throws - rec. has to be wide open. Plus, he locks on to 1 rec. way, way too often. (hey, I'm not a scout - don't claim to be.)

Just like I think 40 times are, for the most part, over rated - quickness matters, not a difference of 2/10 of a second over 40 yards. Even 3/10 of a second isn't a big deal. IMO

This.

If he outplays Dupree, I will