BROWNSVILLE, Texas — The Trump administration has selected Tornillo, Texas, for the construction of tents to house the overflow of immigrant children, many of whom have been separated from their parents under a new "zero tolerance" policy, according to three sources familiar with the decision.
The Department of Health and Human Services will erect a "tent city," full of large tents whose walls touch the ground, that is estimated to hold 450 beds for children, say the sources.
It will not be the first time the U.S. government has erected tent cities to house immigrants. U.S. Customs and Border Protection used tents to house an influx of immigrants in 2014 and at the end of the Obama administration. But now the overflow of a particular immigrant population — in this case, children — is a government-created problem.
The increase of children who are alone and in need of care at the border is the product of a new Trump administration policy that on May 7 began criminally prosecuting all adult migrants crossing the U.S.-Mexico border between ports of entry. As a result, the Department of Homeland Security separates any children traveling with those adults before prosecution.
One shelter in Brownsville, holding nearly 1,500 boys aged 10 to 17, opened its doors to reporters on Wednesday. NBC News was among the first to tour the facility, which closely resembled a jail and allows children outside for only two hours per day.
The overflow of children at HHS facilities has caused backup at border stations, the first stop for immigrants crossing into the United States. As of last week, over 570 unaccompanied children were in the custody of the U.S. Border Patrol, and nearly 300 of those had been held for more than 72 hours, the limit for holding an immigrant of any age at a border station.
Ron Vitiello, acting deputy commissioner of Customs and Border Protection, told MSNBC on Thursday that about 1,500 immigrants are being arrested each day for crossing the border illegally. Vitiello said the policy is meant to deter families of immigrants from coming to the U.S.
"If you apply consequence to illegal activity you get less of it," he said in defense of the policy. "They are only in these shelters long enough to be reunited with their family members. That's the purpose of them."
The facility in Brownsville is holding children for 52 days on average. They are sometimes sent to foster homes if relatives in the U.S. cannot be found.
"HHS is legally required to provide care and shelter for all unaccompanied alien children referred by [the Department of Homeland Security], and works in close coordination with DHS on the security and safety of the children and community," a spokesman for HHS said in a statement.
Due to a lack of Democrat participation on immigration and border control it was necessary to begin this program of arresting illegals trying to cross and separating the children while the parents are under arrest and in court.
As word of the arrests and separations spreads south, people will think twice about coming here. It is all we currently have to stop the unchecked flow of illegals because of a lack of laws.
Now the illegals are being treated fairly, just like American citizens who find themselves under arrest for crimes and are separated from their children. Happens to our citizens all the time.
Due to a lack of Democrat participation on immigration and border control it was necessary to begin this program of arresting illegals trying to cross and separating the children while the parents are under arrest and in court.
As word of the arrests and separations spreads south, people will think twice about coming here. It is all we currently have to stop the unchecked flow of illegals because of a lack of laws.
Now the illegals are being treated fairly, just like American citizens who find themselves under arrest for crimes and are separated from their children. Happens to our citizens all the time.
"it will not be the first time the U.S. government has erected tent cities to house immigrants. U.S. Customs and Border Protection used tents to house an influx of immigrants in 2014 and at the end of the Obama administration."
Woe to those who make unjust laws, to those who issue oppressive decrees, 2 to deprive the poor of their rights and withhold justice from the oppressed of my people, making widows their prey and robbing the fatherless. 3 What will you do on the day of reckoning, when disaster comes from afar? To whom will you run for help? Where will you leave your riches? 4 Nothing will remain but to cringe among the captives or fall among the slain.
Yet for all this, his anger is not turned away, his hand is still upraised.
Daniel 3:12 New International Version (NIV) 12 But there are some Jews whom you have set over the affairs of the province of Babylon—Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego—who pay no attention to you, Your Majesty. They neither serve your gods nor worship the image of gold you have set up.”
This is what the Lord Almighty said: ‘Administer true justice; show mercy and compassion to one another. Do not oppress the widow or the fatherless, the foreigner or the poor. Do not plot evil against each other.’ “But they refused to pay attention; stubbornly they turned their backs and covered their ears. - Zechariah 7:9-11
He defends the cause of the fatherless and the widow, and loves the foreigner residing among you, giving them food and clothing. And you are to love those who are foreigners, for you yourselves were foreigners in Egypt. - Deuteronomy 10:18-19
He upholds the cause of the oppressed and gives food to the hungry. The LORD sets prisoners free…The LORD watches over the foreigner and sustains the fatherless and the widow. - Psalm 146:7, 9
Thus says the Lord: Do justice and righteousness, and deliver from the hand of the oppressor him who has been robbed. And do no wrong or violence to the resident alien, the fatherless, and the widow, nor shed innocent blood in this place. - Jeremiah 22:3
"So I will come to put you on trial. I will be quick to testify against sorcerers, adulterers and perjurers, against those who defraud laborers of their wages, who oppress the widows and the fatherless, and deprive the foreigners among you of justice, but do not fear me,” says the Lord Almighty. - Malachi 3:5
“‘When you reap the harvest of your land, do not reap to the very edges of your field or gather the gleanings of your harvest. Do not go over your vineyard a second time or pick up the grapes that have fallen. Leave them for the poor and the foreigner. I am the Lord your God. - Leviticus 19:9-10
Open your mouth for the mute, for the rights of all who are destitute. Open your mouth, judge righteously, defend the rights of the poor and needy. - Proverbs 31:8-9
Learn to do good; seek justice, correct oppression; bring justice to the fatherless, plead the widow's cause. - Isaiah 1:17
Give justice to the weak and the fatherless; maintain the right of the afflicted and the destitute. Rescue the weak and the needy; deliver them from the hand of the wicked. - Psalm 82:3-4
Remember those who are in prison, as though in prison with them, and those who are mistreated, since you also are in the body. - Hebrews 13:3
A righteous man knows the rights of the poor; a wicked man does not understand such knowledge. - Proverbs 29:7
If you see the poor oppressed in a district, and justice and rights denied, do not be surprised at such things; - Ecclesiastes 5:8
BROWNSVILLE, Texas — The Trump administration has selected Tornillo, Texas, for the construction of tents to house the overflow of immigrant children, many of whom have been separated from their parents under a new "zero tolerance" policy, according to three sources familiar with the decision.
The Department of Health and Human Services will erect a "tent city," full of large tents whose walls touch the ground, that is estimated to hold 450 beds for children, say the sources.
It will not be the first time the U.S. government has erected tent cities to house immigrants. U.S. Customs and Border Protection used tents to house an influx of immigrants in 2014 and at the end of the Obama administration. But now the overflow of a particular immigrant population — in this case, children — is a government-created problem.
The increase of children who are alone and in need of care at the border is the product of a new Trump administration policy that on May 7 began criminally prosecuting all adult migrants crossing the U.S.-Mexico border between ports of entry. As a result, the Department of Homeland Security separates any children traveling with those adults before prosecution.
One shelter in Brownsville, holding nearly 1,500 boys aged 10 to 17, opened its doors to reporters on Wednesday. NBC News was among the first to tour the facility, which closely resembled a jail and allows children outside for only two hours per day.
The overflow of children at HHS facilities has caused backup at border stations, the first stop for immigrants crossing into the United States. As of last week, over 570 unaccompanied children were in the custody of the U.S. Border Patrol, and nearly 300 of those had been held for more than 72 hours, the limit for holding an immigrant of any age at a border station.
Ron Vitiello, acting deputy commissioner of Customs and Border Protection, told MSNBC on Thursday that about 1,500 immigrants are being arrested each day for crossing the border illegally. Vitiello said the policy is meant to deter families of immigrants from coming to the U.S.
"If you apply consequence to illegal activity you get less of it," he said in defense of the policy. "They are only in these shelters long enough to be reunited with their family members. That's the purpose of them."
The facility in Brownsville is holding children for 52 days on average. They are sometimes sent to foster homes if relatives in the U.S. cannot be found.
"HHS is legally required to provide care and shelter for all unaccompanied alien children referred by [the Department of Homeland Security], and works in close coordination with DHS on the security and safety of the children and community," a spokesman for HHS said in a statement.
Where was your anger and tough guy attitude during their trek through Mexico I don't recall you posting anything about the children then. It wan't until they came here and you could bash Trump about it did you show any emotion about it. Why are you not up in arms at the countries they came from who treated them so poorly they traveled up to 2000 miles across Mexico? Do you think they stayed in Hotels or Motels on their way here?
It's all ok now... Sessions found justification...
Sessions cites Bible to defend separating immigrant families
WASHINGTON — Attorney General Jeff Sessions cited the Bible on Thursday in his defense of his border policy that is resulting in hundreds of immigrant children being separated from their parents after they enter the U.S. illegally.
Sessions, speaking in Fort Wayne, Indiana, on immigration, pushed back against criticism he had received over the policy. On Wednesday, a cardinal in the Roman Catholic Church said that separating mothers from their babies was "immoral."
Sessions said many of the recent criticisms were not "fair or logical and some are contrary to law."
"I would cite you to the Apostle Paul and his clear and wise command in Romans 13, to obey the laws of the government because God has ordained them for the purpose of order," he said. "Orderly and lawful processes are good in themselves and protect the weak and lawful."
Last month, the attorney general announced a "zero tolerance" policy that any adult who enters the country illegally is criminally prosecuted. U.S. protocol prohibits detaining children with their parents because the children are not charged with a crime and the parents are.
According to U.S. Customs and Border Protection, more than 650 children were separated from their parents at the U.S.-Mexico border during a two-week period in May.
White House press secretary Sarah Huckabee Sanders said Thursday that she hadn't seen Sessions' comments but affirmed that the Bible did back up the administration's actions.
"I can say that it is very biblical to enforce the law. That is actually repeated a number of times throughout the Bible," she said. "It's a moral policy to follow and enforce the law."
In an unusually tense series of exchanges in the White House briefing room, Sanders wrongly blamed Democrats for the policy separating children from parents and insisted the administration had made no changes in increasing the use. Until the policy was announced in April, such families were usually referred for civil deportation proceedings, not requiring separation.
"The separation of illegal alien families is the product of the same legal loopholes that Democrats refuse to close, and these laws are the same that have been on the books for over a decade, and the president is simply enforcing them," she said.
"We don't want this to be a problem," she said.
Cardinal Daniel DiNardo, the archbishop of Galveston-Houston, told the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops on Wednesday that he was joining other religious leaders in opposing the government's border policy.
"Our government has the discretion in our laws to ensure that young children are not separated from their parents and exposed to irreparable harm and trauma," DiNardo said in a statement.
It's all ok now... Sessions found justification...
Sessions cites Bible to defend separating immigrant families
WASHINGTON — Attorney General Jeff Sessions cited the Bible on Thursday in his defense of his border policy that is resulting in hundreds of immigrant children being separated from their parents after they enter the U.S. illegally.
Sessions, speaking in Fort Wayne, Indiana, on immigration, pushed back against criticism he had received over the policy. On Wednesday, a cardinal in the Roman Catholic Church said that separating mothers from their babies was "immoral."
Sessions said many of the recent criticisms were not "fair or logical and some are contrary to law."
"I would cite you to the Apostle Paul and his clear and wise command in Romans 13, to obey the laws of the government because God has ordained them for the purpose of order," he said. "Orderly and lawful processes are good in themselves and protect the weak and lawful."
Last month, the attorney general announced a "zero tolerance" policy that any adult who enters the country illegally is criminally prosecuted. U.S. protocol prohibits detaining children with their parents because the children are not charged with a crime and the parents are.
According to U.S. Customs and Border Protection, more than 650 children were separated from their parents at the U.S.-Mexico border during a two-week period in May.
White House press secretary Sarah Huckabee Sanders said Thursday that she hadn't seen Sessions' comments but affirmed that the Bible did back up the administration's actions.
"I can say that it is very biblical to enforce the law. That is actually repeated a number of times throughout the Bible," she said. "It's a moral policy to follow and enforce the law."
In an unusually tense series of exchanges in the White House briefing room, Sanders wrongly blamed Democrats for the policy separating children from parents and insisted the administration had made no changes in increasing the use. Until the policy was announced in April, such families were usually referred for civil deportation proceedings, not requiring separation.
"The separation of illegal alien families is the product of the same legal loopholes that Democrats refuse to close, and these laws are the same that have been on the books for over a decade, and the president is simply enforcing them," she said.
"We don't want this to be a problem," she said.
Cardinal Daniel DiNardo, the archbishop of Galveston-Houston, told the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops on Wednesday that he was joining other religious leaders in opposing the government's border policy.
"Our government has the discretion in our laws to ensure that young children are not separated from their parents and exposed to irreparable harm and trauma," DiNardo said in a statement.
Have you complained about the children in TENT CITIES in California? Or the children that have to walk to school through feces and syringe and needle covered streets?
I can almost understand this policy as it pertains to illegal border-jumpers, but this is also happening to legal assylum-seekers.
Sessions has simply said that we will no longer make a distinction between legal and illegal immigrants.
"Lock them all up." All of them. Every last one of them.
In the history books, Karma is going to sodomize this administration and all those who currently cheer its policies.
And when it happens, I'll call it: Just desserts.
Well that's what happens when a problem is ignored for decades and you have to make sure the children are really with their parents and not a human traffic or worse. The children are not being abused the will get good care food water and treated better than they were during the trip across 2000 miles of Mexico. This problem was not created by Trump it was here long before him and was caused by people who don't want to make the tough stand and get it fixed.
In the history books it will go down as finally someone taking a stand and getting the problem solve!
I can go through each of your posts, along with a large portion of your post history in this forum, and provide a large extensive whataboutism analysis.
This could all end today if the Democrats would participate.
The law being followed currently is a law passed by the Democrats.
Republicans and Trump do not like the situation either but there are not enough Republicans to be able to change the law.
When Obama was president, Republicans in congress spent years blocking and obstructing anything he tried to do with immigration as opposed to participating and the republican base cheered.. now suddenly that's the wrong approach?
The problem with immigration politics is quite simple.. both sides see millions of votes on the line for whomever is in office if/when substantive immigration reform is enacted.. whichever party holds the oval would be able to claim that victory on behalf of latinos and other immigrants indefinitely into the future.. so neither side will allow anything substantive to be passed when they are not in power.. neither side seems to care that these are actual people, lives, children that we are talking about.. it's all about partisan politics and 2 sides with egos too big to overcome.
The law being followed currently is a law passed by the Democrats.
This is what the Lord Almighty said: ‘Administer true justice; show mercy and compassion to one another. Do not oppress the widow or the fatherless, the foreigner or the poor. Do not plot evil against each other.’ “But they refused to pay attention; stubbornly they turned their backs and covered their ears. - Zechariah 7:9-11
He defends the cause of the fatherless and the widow, and loves the foreigner residing among you, giving them food and clothing. And you are to love those who are foreigners, for you yourselves were foreigners in Egypt. - Deuteronomy 10:18-19
"So I will come to put you on trial. I will be quick to testify against sorcerers, adulterers and perjurers, against those who defraud laborers of their wages, who oppress the widows and the fatherless, and deprive the foreigners among you of justice, but do not fear me,” says the Lord Almighty. - Malachi 3:5
“‘When you reap the harvest of your land, do not reap to the very edges of your field or gather the gleanings of your harvest. Do not go over your vineyard a second time or pick up the grapes that have fallen. Leave them for the poor and the foreigner. I am the Lord your God. - Leviticus 19:9-10
---------------------------
40YEARSWAITING Chapter 1 Verse 2
"Follow unjust laws, march lock in-step, and continue to preach hypocrisy to what you claims to believe!"
This could all end today if the Democrats would participate.
The law being followed currently is a law passed by the Democrats.
Republicans and Trump do not like the situation either but there are not enough Republicans to be able to change the law.
When Obama was president, Republicans in congress spent years blocking and obstructing anything he tried to do with immigration as opposed to participating and the republican base cheered.. now suddenly that's the wrong approach?
The problem with immigration politics is quite simple.. both sides see millions of votes on the line for whomever is in office if/when substantive immigration reform is enacted.. whichever party holds the oval would be able to claim that victory on behalf of latinos and other immigrants indefinitely into the future.. so neither side will allow anything substantive to be passed when they are not in power.. neither side seems to care that these are actual people, lives, children that we are talking about.. it's all about partisan politics and 2 sides with egos too big to overcome.
Nice lecture on history mixed with your personal opinions on ego but the truth is simple, The Law is the Law and must be obeyed until the Law is changed.
Trump did say this morning that some Democrats have approached him about getting something done to fix this mess.
I can go through each of your posts, along with a large portion of your post history in this forum, and provide a large extensive whataboutism analysis.
So you LIED and made up a post using my nick that's low as it gets.
Nice lecture on history mixed with your personal opinions on ego but the truth is simple, The Law is the Law and must be obeyed until the Law is changed.
Which has nothing to do with my 4 sentence "lecture".. not one single thing.
Trump says this is a democrat law but there is no law on the books that says you must split immigrant children up from their parents. The decision to treat people like animals by splitting up families and to charge asylum seekers are trump policies, not laws made by any other administration.
Another popular claim is that we split up families here if a parent commits a crime, but I will note that we don't split up families if the dad is caught jaywalking, or parking his car for too long in a metered spot. That is reserved for felonies and other serious considerations. And why is this important? Because the charge of being in the US illegally is "unlawful presence." And unlawful presence is a civil violation, not a crime. It is as serious as a parking ticket, insofar as the US Code has written it.
Originally Posted By: RocketOptimist
How can any of you support this treatment towards any human being?
Because too many people unfortunately in this country consider immigrants to be subhuman. I have no other explanation for why someone would be OK with inflicting pain on a family seeking asylum in the United States.
Because too many people unfortunately in this country consider immigrants to be subhuman. I have no other explanation for why someone would be OK with inflicting pain on a family seeking asylum in the United States.
Because too many people unfortunately in this country consider immigrants to be subhuman. I have no other explanation for why someone would be OK with inflicting pain on a family seeking asylum in the United States.
You need no other explanation.
Once again the Left sees not being accountable for your own actions as being someone else's fault. Why would parents bring their children here knowing they would be arrested and separated from their kids?
They are caught crossing the border and arrested because it is a crime. They apply for asylum while in custody and are temporarily separated from their children while their case is heard. They are then given asylum or rejected and their children returned to them as they go home or stay.
Because too many people unfortunately in this country consider immigrants to be subhuman. I have no other explanation for why someone would be OK with inflicting pain on a family seeking asylum in the United States.
You need no other explanation.
Once again the Left sees not being accountable for your own actions as being someone else's fault. Why would parents bring their children here knowing they would be arrested and separated from their kids?
They are caught crossing the border and arrested because it is a crime. They apply for asylum while in custody and are temporarily separated from their children while their case is heard. They are then given asylum or rejected and their children returned to them as they go home or stay.
Once again, misplaced emotions rule your world.
40 you're making to much sense...if it's not a twisted concept they don't understand. They only want LAWS to be enforced when it comes to their issues.
Trump says this is a democrat law but there is no law on the books that says you must split immigrant children up from their parents. The decision to treat people like animals by splitting up families and to charge asylum seekers are trump policies, not laws made by any other administration.
Another popular claim is that we split up families here if a parent commits a crime, but I will note that we don't split up families if the dad is caught jaywalking, or parking his car for too long in a metered spot. That is reserved for felonies and other serious considerations. And why is this important? Because the charge of being in the US illegally is "unlawful presence." And unlawful presence is a civil violation, not a crime. It is as serious as a parking ticket, insofar as the US Code has written it.
Originally Posted By: RocketOptimist
How can any of you support this treatment towards any human being?
Because too many people unfortunately in this country consider immigrants to be subhuman. I have no other explanation for why someone would be OK with inflicting pain on a family seeking asylum in the United States.
Can you link this, the only one I've seen say this is you.
Trump says this is a democrat law but there is no law on the books that says you must split immigrant children up from their parents. The decision to treat people like animals by splitting up families and to charge asylum seekers are trump policies, not laws made by any other administration.
Another popular claim is that we split up families here if a parent commits a crime, but I will note that we don't split up families if the dad is caught jaywalking, or parking his car for too long in a metered spot. That is reserved for felonies and other serious considerations. And why is this important? Because the charge of being in the US illegally is "unlawful presence." And unlawful presence is a civil violation, not a crime. It is as serious as a parking ticket, insofar as the US Code has written it.
Originally Posted By: RocketOptimist
How can any of you support this treatment towards any human being?
Because too many people unfortunately in this country consider immigrants to be subhuman. I have no other explanation for why someone would be OK with inflicting pain on a family seeking asylum in the United States.
Can you link this, the only one I've seen say this is you.
I have never met a subhuman. What do they look like?
Angela Merkel's German government facing collapse over her immigration stance
Angela Merkel’s government is on the brink as the German chancellor battles her coalition partners on immigration and asylum seekers.
The coalition between Merkel’s Christian Democrats (CDU) and the Bavarian Christian Social Union (CSU) has fractured over the latter’s new proposed policy that would turn away more asylum seekers at the country’s borders. http://www.foxnews.com/world/2018/06/15/...ion-stance.html
People everywhere have about had it with the foolishness of open borders!
Because too many people unfortunately in this country consider immigrants to be subhuman. I have no other explanation for why someone would be OK with inflicting pain on a family seeking asylum in the United States.
You need no other explanation.
Once again the Left sees not being accountable for your own actions as being someone else's fault. Why would parents bring their children here knowing they would be arrested and separated from their kids?
They are caught crossing the border and arrested because it is a crime. They apply for asylum while in custody and are temporarily separated from their children while their case is heard. They are then given asylum or rejected and their children returned to them as they go home or stay.
Once again, misplaced emotions rule your world.
Because they'd rather trek thousands of miles for a chance at life, rather than dying in their violence invested countries. It's like they're refugees or something.
Because too many people unfortunately in this country consider immigrants to be subhuman. I have no other explanation for why someone would be OK with inflicting pain on a family seeking asylum in the United States.
You need no other explanation.
Once again the Left sees not being accountable for your own actions as being someone else's fault. Why would parents bring their children here knowing they would be arrested and separated from their kids?
They are caught crossing the border and arrested because it is a crime. They apply for asylum while in custody and are temporarily separated from their children while their case is heard. They are then given asylum or rejected and their children returned to them as they go home or stay.
Once again, misplaced emotions rule your world.
Because they'd rather trek thousands of miles for a chance at life, rather than dying in their violence invested countries. It's like they're refugees or something.
So the least of their problems is being temporarily separated from their children while they pass through the system. I agree.
Because too many people unfortunately in this country consider immigrants to be subhuman. I have no other explanation for why someone would be OK with inflicting pain on a family seeking asylum in the United States.
You need no other explanation.
Once again the Left sees not being accountable for your own actions as being someone else's fault. Why would parents bring their children here knowing they would be arrested and separated from their kids?
They are caught crossing the border and arrested because it is a crime. They apply for asylum while in custody and are temporarily separated from their children while their case is heard. They are then given asylum or rejected and their children returned to them as they go home or stay.
Once again, misplaced emotions rule your world.
Because they'd rather trek thousands of miles for a chance at life, rather than dying in their violence invested countries. It's like they're refugees or something.
How many can we count on you taking in? 10, 20 more?
So the least of their problems is being temporarily separated from their children while they pass through the system. I agree.
A truly wise man once said...
Quote:
Boy, these conservatives are really something, aren't they? They're all in favor of the unborn. They will do anything for the unborn. But once you're born, you're on your own. Pro-life conservatives are obsessed with the fetus from conception to nine months. After that, they don't want to know about you. They don't want to hear from you. No nothing. No neonatal care, no day care, no head start, no school lunch, no food stamps, no welfare, no nothing. If you're preborn, you're fine; if you're preschool, you're screwed.
Conservatives don't give a crap about you until you reach "military age". Then they think you are just fine. Just what they've been looking for. Conservatives want live babies so they can raise them to be dead soldiers. Pro-life... pro-life... These people aren't pro-life, they're killing doctors! What kind of pro-life is that? What, they'll do anything they can to save a fetus but if it grows up to be a doctor they just might have to kill it. They're not pro-life. You know what they are? They're anti-woman. Simple as it gets, anti-woman. They don't like them. They don't like women. They believe a woman's primary role is to function as a brood mare for the state.
Because too many people unfortunately in this country consider immigrants to be subhuman. I have no other explanation for why someone would be OK with inflicting pain on a family seeking asylum in the United States.
You need no other explanation.
Once again the Left sees not being accountable for your own actions as being someone else's fault. Why would parents bring their children here knowing they would be arrested and separated from their kids?
They are caught crossing the border and arrested because it is a crime. They apply for asylum while in custody and are temporarily separated from their children while their case is heard. They are then given asylum or rejected and their children returned to them as they go home or stay.
Once again, misplaced emotions rule your world.
Because they'd rather trek thousands of miles for a chance at life, rather than dying in their violence invested countries. It's like they're refugees or something.
How many can we count on you taking in? 10, 20 more?
Are you suggesting that I take in illegal immigrants?
Rocket you do understand the difference between a foreign traveler, a foreign immigrant, and someone who comes into a country illegally right?
Foreigners the Bible talks about are there legally. They were there either for asylum or trade/business LEGALLY. The USA is the second most welcoming country when it comes to legally allowing asylum seekers to take up residence. We also allow the most LEGAL immigration IN THE WORLD.
This false idea that the USA hates immigrants is stupid and false. What we hate are those that break our laws to become criminals. When you come into a country without permission you are not a foreigner. You are an INVADER. You are a criminal who is breaking the laws of a nation and you are causing harm. Invaders are not welcome anywhere in the world.
Illegal immigrants cause an extreme amount of damage to this country every year. Over a 4th of our entire prison population are illegal immigrants who have broken other federal crimes besides just entering the country illegally. That's just on the federal level on the more serious crimes.
The financial cost of illegal immigration PER YEAR is about 135 BILLION dollars. Do you understand that this is not a small amount of damage? It cost less to deal with the damage from 9-11, a terrorist attack, which was just one time than it does to clean up the damages from illegal immigration EVERY SINGLE YEAR. It is flat our reckless to ignore such a disaster that happens every single year.
Criminals are not foreigners here to do legal business. They are invaders who are here after breaking the laws of the land. They are causing immense harm to our nation and need to be stopped.
Those who are here legally are foreigners who deserve every bit of love and charity the Bible tells us to. The Bible also allows a country to defend itself from invaders. Please understand the difference.
Y’all keep bringing up scripture when the USA is a secular state.
The fact that sessions and sanders even mentioned the Bible in their justification for immigration policy should automatically make whatever they do unconstitutional.
The subject is how the illegal children were to be housed in tent cities and I just pointed out how the OBAMA did it with no outrage from the left …. sorry if I put a crimp in your blind hate for Trump...no surprise really....just keeping it real guy
This is what reading your posts is like there are no breaks no pauses no punctuation and no coherent thoughts just an endless stream of semiconsciousness semiliterate word diarrhea that never freaking ends.
Hard to respect someone who doesnt respect himself enough to look after his public appearance in a community setting thats why you get treated as you do its not because you play for team red its because you are team reds special water boy who cant get on the field with his helmet on correctly.
Now lets see how fast 40cent can rush to your aid as he always does in situations like this hes really predictable in that way because dropping down on his minions always triggers him at least he knows the rules of grammar too bad he doesnt give private tutorings in PMs to needy posters such as you.
Damn. Pick up a book. You don't even have to actually read it. Just look at how things are arranged, and imitate the people who know stuff.
At least make an effort. Everyone else does.
"What we've got here is... failure to communicate."
This is what reading your posts is like there are no breaks no pauses no punctuation and no coherent thoughts just an endless stream of semiconsciousness semiliterate word diarrhea that never freaking ends.
Hard to respect someone who doesnt respect himself enough to look after his public appearance in a community setting thats why you get treated as you do its not because you play for team red its because you are team reds special water boy who cant get on the field with his helmet on correctly.
Now lets see how fast 40cent can rush to your aid as he always does in situations like this hes really predictable in that way because dropping down on his minions always triggers him at least he knows the rules of grammar too bad he doesnt give private tutorings in PMs to needy posters such as you.
Damn. Pick up a book. You don't even have to actually read it. Just look at how things are arranged, and imitate the people who know stuff.
At least make an effort. Everyone else does.
"What we've got here is... failure to communicate."
You mentioned, in no particular order, "what about Obama" and "what about your outrage then".
That is a whataboutism.
Since you like videos soooo much, here's a video that explains whataboutisms:
I also highly reccomend John Oliver's video on whataboutisms, but I can't link it here due to the use of a single f-word.
We post critical articles. You usually go
"What about Hillary?" "What about Obama" "What about her Emails" "What about Dr. Ben Ghazi" "What about that one minority I will point out that did e heinous thing, even though that one person an an outlier from that minority group. "
40 does this, but he's self-aware. He knows he does this, and he does this since he gets his jollies from arguing with us.
Diam, Riley, yourself, and a few others usually engage in this same practice. I don't think many of you remain aware of this.
I'll talk with Ted, DC, JFan, YTown, Jules, Devil, and others who show me they will discuss in good faith. Take notes from them if you want to actually learn from the opposite political ideology; I've learned a ton from them. Sometimes I just read exchanges between them and other posters. Be like them.
--------------------
I guess my lesson on paraphrasing didn't stick. I'll find a video that explains paraphrasing.
I summed up all your arguments to me as a whatabout.
You said things about what about obama, and what about your lack of outrage then.
Catch up. We'll all learn from each other better that way.
Why should we let you stay in this country if you do illegal things?
-----------------------
Also, you've claimed on multiple occasions to be a Christian man. Can you explain or refute these verses? All these verses tend to rally against the current treatment of migrants in the United States.
This is what the Lord Almighty said: ‘Administer true justice; show mercy and compassion to one another. Do not oppress the widow or the fatherless, the foreigner or the poor. Do not plot evil against each other.’ “But they refused to pay attention; stubbornly they turned their backs and covered their ears. - Zechariah 7:9-11
He defends the cause of the fatherless and the widow, and loves the foreigner residing among you, giving them food and clothing. And you are to love those who are foreigners, for you yourselves were foreigners in Egypt. - Deuteronomy 10:18-19
He upholds the cause of the oppressed and gives food to the hungry. The LORD sets prisoners free…The LORD watches over the foreigner and sustains the fatherless and the widow. - Psalm 146:7, 9
Thus says the Lord: Do justice and righteousness, and deliver from the hand of the oppressor him who has been robbed. And do no wrong or violence to the resident alien, the fatherless, and the widow, nor shed innocent blood in this place. - Jeremiah 22:3
"So I will come to put you on trial. I will be quick to testify against sorcerers, adulterers and perjurers, against those who defraud laborers of their wages, who oppress the widows and the fatherless, and deprive the foreigners among you of justice, but do not fear me,” says the Lord Almighty. - Malachi 3:5
“‘When you reap the harvest of your land, do not reap to the very edges of your field or gather the gleanings of your harvest. Do not go over your vineyard a second time or pick up the grapes that have fallen. Leave them for the poor and the foreigner. I am the Lord your God. - Leviticus 19:9-10
Open your mouth for the mute, for the rights of all who are destitute. Open your mouth, judge righteously, defend the rights of the poor and needy. - Proverbs 31:8-9
Learn to do good; seek justice, correct oppression; bring justice to the fatherless, plead the widow's cause. - Isaiah 1:17
Give justice to the weak and the fatherless; maintain the right of the afflicted and the destitute. Rescue the weak and the needy; deliver them from the hand of the wicked. - Psalm 82:3-4
Remember those who are in prison, as though in prison with them, and those who are mistreated, since you also are in the body. - Hebrews 13:3
A righteous man knows the rights of the poor; a wicked man does not understand such knowledge. - Proverbs 29:7
If you see the poor oppressed in a district, and justice and rights denied, do not be surprised at such things; - Ecclesiastes 5:8
Will you start the second Civil War over not being able to rip your bimmer down E.9th at 100mph?
Just remember to claim "States' Rights!" when you lead the rebellion. You'll get a ton of honorable statues, and they'll probably be close to NASCAR tracks, too.
Rocket you do understand the difference between a foreign traveler, a foreign immigrant, and someone who comes into a country illegally right?
Foreigners the Bible talks about are there legally. They were there either for asylum or trade/business LEGALLY. The USA is the second most welcoming country when it comes to legally allowing asylum seekers to take up residence. We also allow the most LEGAL immigration IN THE WORLD.
This false idea that the USA hates immigrants is stupid and false. What we hate are those that break our laws to become criminals. When you come into a country without permission you are not a foreigner. You are an INVADER. You are a criminal who is breaking the laws of a nation and you are causing harm. Invaders are not welcome anywhere in the world.
Illegal immigrants cause an extreme amount of damage to this country every year. Over a 4th of our entire prison population are illegal immigrants who have broken other federal crimes besides just entering the country illegally. That's just on the federal level on the more serious crimes.
The financial cost of illegal immigration PER YEAR is about 135 BILLION dollars. Do you understand that this is not a small amount of damage? It cost less to deal with the damage from 9-11, a terrorist attack, which was just one time than it does to clean up the damages from illegal immigration EVERY SINGLE YEAR. It is flat our reckless to ignore such a disaster that happens every single year.
Criminals are not foreigners here to do legal business. They are invaders who are here after breaking the laws of the land. They are causing immense harm to our nation and need to be stopped.
Those who are here legally are foreigners who deserve every bit of love and charity the Bible tells us to. The Bible also allows a country to defend itself from invaders. Please understand the difference.
The bottom line is that the bible should not be used when taking matters of the state in hand... there should be a separation...
Religion has too many times used justify a position and is always a matter of interpretation...
Everyone should live by a common set of laws, but there are many beliefs on a religious level or none at all... a personal choice...
We're wasting time with this one. There will never be a thought-out response from him in any of these threads.
Two possibilities exist:
1. It's not his agenda to engage in meaningful dialogue (sophomoric trolling). 2. He's incapable of meaningful dialogue, and uses this as basic communication.
Either way, the end results are the same: Meaningless wastes of Prp's bandwidth, and zero value to the thread.
Engage only on your terms. His avatar tells you pretty much all you need to know.
We're wasting time with this one. There will never be a thought-out response from him in any of these threads.
Two possibilities exist:
1. It's not his agenda to engage in meaningful dialogue (sophomoric trolling). 2. He's incapable of meaningful dialogue, and uses this as basic communication.
Either way, the end results are the same: Meaningless wastes of Prp's bandwidth, and zero value to the thread.
Engage only on your terms. His avatar tells you pretty much all you need to know.
A decade in the smack shack defending this awful franchise against Steelers fans has melted his brain. It is not his fault he's like this. He started off with the best of intentions.
Why should we let you stay in this country if you do illegal things?
-----------------------
Also, you've claimed on multiple occasions to be a Christian man. Can you explain or refute these verses? All these verses tend to rally against the current treatment of migrants in the United States.
This is what the Lord Almighty said: ‘Administer true justice; show mercy and compassion to one another. Do not oppress the widow or the fatherless, the foreigner or the poor. Do not plot evil against each other.’ “But they refused to pay attention; stubbornly they turned their backs and covered their ears. - Zechariah 7:9-11
He defends the cause of the fatherless and the widow, and loves the foreigner residing among you, giving them food and clothing. And you are to love those who are foreigners, for you yourselves were foreigners in Egypt. - Deuteronomy 10:18-19
He upholds the cause of the oppressed and gives food to the hungry. The LORD sets prisoners free…The LORD watches over the foreigner and sustains the fatherless and the widow. - Psalm 146:7, 9
Thus says the Lord: Do justice and righteousness, and deliver from the hand of the oppressor him who has been robbed. And do no wrong or violence to the resident alien, the fatherless, and the widow, nor shed innocent blood in this place. - Jeremiah 22:3
"So I will come to put you on trial. I will be quick to testify against sorcerers, adulterers and perjurers, against those who defraud laborers of their wages, who oppress the widows and the fatherless, and deprive the foreigners among you of justice, but do not fear me,” says the Lord Almighty. - Malachi 3:5
“‘When you reap the harvest of your land, do not reap to the very edges of your field or gather the gleanings of your harvest. Do not go over your vineyard a second time or pick up the grapes that have fallen. Leave them for the poor and the foreigner. I am the Lord your God. - Leviticus 19:9-10
Open your mouth for the mute, for the rights of all who are destitute. Open your mouth, judge righteously, defend the rights of the poor and needy. - Proverbs 31:8-9
Learn to do good; seek justice, correct oppression; bring justice to the fatherless, plead the widow's cause. - Isaiah 1:17
Give justice to the weak and the fatherless; maintain the right of the afflicted and the destitute. Rescue the weak and the needy; deliver them from the hand of the wicked. - Psalm 82:3-4
Remember those who are in prison, as though in prison with them, and those who are mistreated, since you also are in the body. - Hebrews 13:3
A righteous man knows the rights of the poor; a wicked man does not understand such knowledge. - Proverbs 29:7
If you see the poor oppressed in a district, and justice and rights denied, do not be surprised at such things; - Ecclesiastes 5:8
Yes, I obey the speed limits. I enjoy driving the speed limit and watching people being annoyed at being forced to obey the law behind me. It's great fun for me >) I have no criminal record of ANY kind.
I've already answered your question about the scriptures. Your reading them out of context because you don't understand what was written and why.
Let me share some scriptures of my own:
Proverbs 28 4-5 Those who forsake the law praise the wicked, but those who keep the law strive against them. Evil men do not understand justice, but those who seek the Lord understand it completely.
Illegals break the law. So will you continue to praise the wicked?
Ecclesiastes 8:11 Because the sentence against an evil deed is not executed speedily, the heart of the children of man is fully set to do evil.
Illegals are cowards who run from the problems of their own country instead of fighting them. They look at the USA and they COVET what they don't have. So they lie and steal their way into the country to take what is not offered. That makes them thieves. They cause severe damage to our country as they break the laws to be here.
They are not foreigners who have come to our country legally so there is no courtesy due to them. They are invaders who come to break our laws and to take what they covet.
I strive against those who break the laws and seek punishment for the wicked.
Illegals are cowards who run from the problems of their own country instead of fighting them. They look at the USA and they COVET what they don't have. So they lie and steal their way into the country to take what is not offered. That makes them thieves. They cause severe damage to our country as they break the laws to be here.
They are not foreigners who have come to our country legally so there is no courtesy due to them. They are invaders who come to break our laws and to take what they covet.
I strive against those who break the laws and seek punishment for the wicked.
Your post reeks of hypocrisy to the point of being absolutely pathetic... To call someone a coward for trying to better their life and/or the lives of their family... escaping some environments that have, in many instances, already taken family members from them by very violent means... sickening
I would bet a month's salary that you have never even been close to seeing first hand what some of these people have experienced in their lives... except maybe on fox news...
You and your attitude are part of the problem... not part of any solution... other than putting people that don't think like you in positions of leadership...
Stop quoting scriptures... you're not fooling anyone...
j\c Wasn't it about a year or so that the libs were using all kind of stats bragging about Obama being the deporter -in-chief when it was their political point of the day LMAO.
Where was the outrage for those poor people and their children then?
You nailed it Clem! Trump is using the lives of brown children as a bargaining chip to make American taxpayers pay for his wall. He can ONLY get away with this because his base will let him. Then he tells bold faced lies blaming the dems for his outrageous policy. SHAME.
these people broke the law coming here, their kids are collateral damage. If the Mexican government cared about these kids they would have already made arrangements to take custody of them. the Mexican government fully intends to drop them in our lap. Yet somehow our President is being blamed for it?
do you realize this so called "tent" is probably a better home for these kids then any home they have had in their entire lives?...do you realize a lot of these kids grow up in literal landfills?
LOOK AT IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
TAKE A GOOD DAMN LOOK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
how dare you try and deomonize the USa and try to demonize our President. Yes, Trump has faults, he isn't perfect, but he has done more for these kids with these tents their their worthless famlily or foreign government has ever done for them. At least in this tent they will get clean food, non contaminated water, and proper vaccinations so they at least have a chance at some kinda life....
We are so spoiled and entitled in this country we have turned into a bunch of hypocrites! We are blessed and have no idea what hard life really is, and we really need to get some damn perspective and be thankful for what we got.
the news media is cancer in this country, a festering cancer that is going to destroy it.
Trump isn't using anyone, he just isn't going to put up every person or kid who comes here illegal in the Ritz Carlton...
This has to stop. Our governemnt is figuring out what we are going to do with these children. Either the Mexican government will take claim to them or we will be forced to put them up for adoption or foster care. However, we have to follow the proper rules first. Everything will be fine this isn't some evil nefarious plot...FFS man!
these people broke the law coming here, their kids are collateral damage. If the Mexican government cared about these kids they would have already made arrangements to take custody of them. the Mexican government fully intends to drop them in our lap. Yet somehow our President is being blamed for it?
do you realize this so called "tent" is probably a better home for these kids then any home they have had in their entire lives?...do you realize a lot of these kids grow up in literal landfills?
LOOK AT IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
TAKE A GOOD DAMN LOOK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
how dare you try and deomonize the USa and try to demonize our President. Yes, Trump has faults, he isn't perfect, but he has done more for these kids with these tents their their worthless famlily or foreign government has ever done for them. At least in this tent they will get clean food, non contaminated water, and proper vaccinations so they at least have a chance at some kinda life....
We are so spoiled and entitled in this country we have turned into a bunch of hypocrites! We are blessed and have no idea what hard life really is, and we really need to get some damn perspective and be thankful for what we got.
the news media is cancer in this country, a festering cancer that is going to destroy it.
Trump isn't using anyone, he just isn't going to put up every person or kid who comes here illegal in the Ritz Carlton...
This has to stop. Our governemnt is figuring out what we are going to do with these children. Either the Mexican government will take claim to them or we will be forced to put them up for adoption or foster care. However, we have to follow the proper rules first. Everything will be fine this isn't some evil nefarious plot...FFS man!
I am fully aware of the deplorable and dangerous situations these people are fleeing from. You forgot to mention the cartels, gang violence murder and slavery going on... BUT a majority are not Mexican. There are many other latino countries in the south.
Next, how dare I? What a hoot! Because Trump has created this unAmerican crisis through his zero tolerance policy, period. And those tents could be decked out like the taj mahal, but they will still be tents in the middle of the desert and they will still be there without their parents...
You don't get to turn this around on me. If you can sleep good at night and still support this man, then you have no values in common with the human rights and decency America is known for, period.
'Prison-like' migrant youth shelter is understaffed, unequipped for Trump's 'zero tolerance' policy, insider says
Colleagues at a government-contracted shelter in Arizona had a specific request for Antar Davidson when three Brazilian migrant children arrived: “Tell them they can’t hug.”
Davidson, 32, is of Brazilian descent and speaks Portuguese. He said the siblings — ages 16, 10 and 6 — were distraught after being separated from their parents at the border. The children were “huddled together, tears streaming down their faces,” he said.
ADVERTISEMENT Officials had told them their parents were “lost,” which they interpreted to mean dead. Davidson said he told the children he didn’t know where their parents were, but that they had to be strong.
“The 16-year-old, he looks at me and says, ‘How?’” Davidson said. As he watched the youth cry, he thought, “This is not healthy.”
Davidson quit this week after being a youth care worker at the Tucson shelter, Estrella del Norte, for just a few months. He decided to speak out about his experiences there in hopes of improving a system often shielded from public scrutiny. His comments in a telephone interview offer a rare look into the operation of a migrant shelter.
Davidson said he became disillusioned after the Trump administration’s “zero tolerance” policy began sending the shelter not only children who had crossed the border unaccompanied by adults, but also those separated from their parents.
The caseload is straining a facility he described as understaffed and unequipped to deal with children experiencing trauma, such as the three Brazilians. During his time at the shelter, children were running away, screaming, throwing furniture and attempting suicide, Davidson said. Several were being monitored this week because they were at risk of running away, self-harm and suicide, records show.
A spokeswoman for Southwest Key, the Austin-based nonprofit operating the shelter, disputed those allegations Wednesday and said the shelter meets state licensing requirements, including for staffing ratios and training.
ADVERTISEMENT “Our staff have great expertise in dealing with this population,” said spokeswoman Cindy Casares. “We have very high professional development standards.”
Casares said staffing ratios were particularly important. “We cannot operate if we do not have the legally mandated number of staff required,” she said.
In recent months, she said, the company paid staff to work overtime and mounted “a very aggressive hiring campaign.”
According to a statement she released Wednesday, “For the last 20 years we hire staff that have a child care or social work background to be prepared to support the developmental and emotional needs of all children who arrive to our facility.”
According to Kenneth Wolfe, a U.S. Department of Health and Human Services spokesman, the government contracts with 100 shelters in 17 states. The facilities now house 11,313 children.
Twenty-seven of those shelters in Arizona, California and Texas are run by Southwest Key. It is among the largest child migrant shelter providers nationwide, having served 24,877 children last year. Staff members must be bilingual and receive 80 hours of training before they can work with children.
The shelters are state-licensed, including the nearly 300-bed Tucson facility, a former apartment complex. This week there were 287 youth at the shelter, 70 of them age 13 or younger.
By law, the U.S. Border Patrol must turn unaccompanied children over to the Health and Human Services Department’s Office of Refugee Resettlement, known as ORR, within 72 hours. The children are then supposed to be placed with relatives or other sponsors.
ADVERTISEMENT Some immigrant advocates say that under the Trump administration, ORR has become an arm of immigration enforcement. This month, Sen. Jeff Merkley (D-Ore.) questioned conditions in the shelters after he was turned away while trying to visit the Casa Padre facility in Brownsville, Texas, also run by Southwest Key.
The company released a statement at the time saying “with ORR approval, Southwest Key shelters have welcomed elected and other public officials at our facilities in the past, and will continue to do so, because we are proud of the caring environment we provide these children.” The statement noted that “federal employees from ORR visit our shelters multiple times a week.”
The Health and Human Services Department said that “no one who arrives unannounced at one of our shelters demanding access to the children in our care will be permitted, even those claiming to be U.S. Senators.”
The department conducted a media shelter tour in Brownsville on Wednesday and will hold one Friday in El Cajon, Calif. Visitors will not be allowed to talk to people inside or photograph them. Southwest Key’s chief executive emailed staff Tuesday notifying them of the tours and offering reassurances.
“We are very excited about this opportunity to show the world the incredible work our employees are doing to care for the children we serve,” Juan Sanchez wrote, noting Southwest Key had hired 700 new employees who will complete training soon. “I know you’ve been working overtime due to the surge of kids in our shelters. Please hold on just a little while longer. Relief is coming soon.”
Antar Davidson was a youth care worker at a Southwest Key shelter, pictured at right, in Tucson, Ariz. Antar Davidson was a youth care worker at a Southwest Key shelter, pictured at right, in Tucson, Ariz. (Rebecca Sasnett / For The Times)
Davidson, who completed work for a bachelor’s degree in political science at the University of Arizona last year, said he was full of hope when he arrived at the Tucson shelter in February.
Children received “know your rights” presentations from a local advocacy group, then saw clinicians and case workers weekly. They were taken to see doctors and dentists as needed.
Davidson taught vocational and English classes, and started a class in the Brazilian martial art of capoeira. Many of the Guatemalan youth he initially met were indigenous, from rural areas.
Under the zero-tolerance policy, cases that had been handled administratively in immigration court were now prosecuted as misdemeanors or felonies in federal court. Migrants were charged with crossing the border illegally and separated from their children, who were placed in shelters.
Davidson saw more and more confused and upset children, most from Latin America. There also were more of what staff call “tender age” children, those under 13. Some were as young as 4, he said.
“What was once a transient facility with a staff that was strained and struggling is now becoming a more permanent facility,” and more “prison-like,” Davidson said.
On May 27, three Honduran and one Mexican youth scaled the fence surrounding the shelter and ran away. Only one of the Hondurans was caught, he said. Runaways had been a problem at the shelter for years, and officials had already added security doors and cameras. Several youth were being monitored as “run risks,” records show.
Southwest Key confirmed the incident in its statement, and said they reported the three runaways to law enforcement.
ADVERTISEMENT “We are not allowed, by law, to restrain anyone who tries to climb the fence to leave. We are able to talk with them and attempt to get them to stay but we cannot restrain them,” the statement said.
When the Brazilian siblings arrived May 29, they were taken to a classroom, where Davidson said he was told to have them stay because there wasn’t enough staff to supervise the sleeping quarters.
Southwest Key disputed his account, saying in its statement: “Professional translation was already arranged in this situation. We have case managers who speak Portuguese and we use translation services. No minors slept in a classroom. That is inaccurate and is not allowed by law.”
But when five more Brazilian youth, ages 5 to 17, arrived May 30, it was clear that “the kids had no idea what was going on,” Davidson said.
“They had no idea where their parents were. The case managers said it’s going to be a week until we even find their parents and another week until we talk to them. I just saw how they were bungling these cases,” he said. “At that point zero tolerance was in full swing and you could see the desperation: kids running down the hall, screaming for their moms.”
Davidson emailed a written complaint to a regional supervisor that day.
“I would rather see the facility handle this humanitarian situation properly rather than turn my back on the plight of these minors,” he wrote. “With the new laws and influx of increasingly diverse and more troubled [youth], I worry the staff and management here in Tucson are going to struggle even more.”
Davidson said he also contacted the supervisor by phone, and she promised to take action, but conditions only worsened.
“The majority of children are able to contact their families in home country, as well as family and/or potential sponsor in the United States, within 24 hours of arrival,” said Southwest Key’s statement on Wednesday. “Any delay is due to the fact that the child needs assistance obtaining the phone number of the family members to be called.”
But “the staff were really unable to control these kids,” Davidson said.
Staff suspected some of their charges were adults posing as children, he said — they were listed in records as “possible adults.” They had discovered men as old as 26 posing as adolescents, he said. But the way staff handle those suspicions can also cause problems, he said.
Recently, staff questioned a Guatemalan migrant who said he was 13 and had come to the U.S. to join his father. Davidson said the boy was telling the truth, but a DNA test showed that the man he thought was his father wasn’t. After officials told the man the boy’s true paternity, the man “didn’t want anything to do with him,” Davidson said.
After the boy learned the truth, he started scratching himself and attempted suicide, Davidson said. Officials contacted the boy’s biological father, he said, but “he didn’t want him either.”
The boy has been at the shelter for several months under close observation.
Southwest Key said that legally, it could not discuss specific cases, but added that “staff are trained to work with youth separated from their parents. We provide compassionate care, it is core to what we do.”
During the Wednesday tour in Brownsville, officials said they have tried to weed out adults posing as children using DNA tests and dental records.
Last Thursday, the Southwest Key CEO met with staff at the Tucson shelter, including Davidson. He said the company planned to decrease the staffing ratio to one to three employees per child.
Sanchez urged staff to help the migrant children through an “employee give-back program” — a single $240 donation or $10 from each paycheck, Davidson said.
Southwest Key said the donations were for a scholarship program for shelter youth who “want to further education or have extreme health or life problems,” and that Sanchez never vowed to decrease staffing ratios.
“We are hiring additional staff to meet an increase in all our facilities due to the number of children we are being asked to care for by ORR,” the statement said.
Davidson left thinking, “They’re not going to get enough workers.”
He got a new job, and submitted his resignation Tuesday. Davidson said he does not want to see shelters shut down, but feels like a “conscientious objector.”
“I can no longer in good conscience work with Southwest Key programs,” he wrote. “I am feeling uneasy about the morality of some of the practices.”
CHS, get ready for the low white privileged reply "it's better than the trash dumps they lived in before the takers came here"... just saying.
"Before they were sitting on trash piles of American goods. Today they sit in interment canps. If that's not the American dream, I don't know what is."
CHS, get ready for the low white privileged reply "it's better than the trash dumps they lived in before the takers came here"... just saying.
"Before they were sitting on trash piles of American goods. Today they sit in interment canps. If that's not the American dream, I don't know what is."
If we keep them we'll need gulags and chain gangs so we can justify the taxes... "Productive Immigration Reform" ~ Sessions Style
This admin has been playing a shell game about this from the start.
first, they condemn the illegal immigrants. Cool. Illegal immigration is a real problem and has been for decades.
But there is a difference between sneaking across the border and applying (legally) for asylum.
And here's where the crap gets sneaky and sinister: They have recently proclaimed that the US will no longer recognize as legal, people fleeing their countries for personal safety reasons. Abuse, threats of death are no longer recognized as legitimate cause for granting asylum.
So...what this means is that political refugees, potential victims of cartel violence, etc. are now considered on equal status as border jumpers.
Essentially, this contrived, ad-hoc policy changeeffectively designates [b]all potential immigrants from Central America as unwanted illegals, [/b]regardless of their constitutional status.
COS John Kelly said as much, in an interview a week ago. It's designed to be a deterrent. Not a targeted, specific deterrent for illegal immigration... a broad-based universal deterrent for ALL immigration, both legal and illicit.
This is now a closed border. Totally closed. None may pass.
And that is diametrically opposed to the tenets that formed this country in the first place.
It's really (almost) very clever, actually.
"We welcome all who come here legally... the right way." "We will no longer recognize asylum-seekers as legal immigrants." "We propose to reduce the number of legal immigrants by 60% starting now."
Any American who's paying attention can see what's being enacted here. Steven Miller is almost clever enough to fool this son of immigrants.
Fall for this crap if you want to, Dawgs... but this is as cynical a perversion of US policy as has been followed in 100 years.
Once word got out we will let almost anyone in, they came in the hundreds of thousands. Yearly.
US law became a cynical perversion thanks to people taking advantage of us.
It is time to stop it. It is time to fix it. Call your Congressman today. We need a comprehensive immigration law now!
And a bipartisan comprehensive immigration law is fine with all liberals, just don't hold these kids and the daca kids hostage to negotiate for the damn wall.
This whole fiasco at the border right now is because Trump wants US taxpayers to fund his wall... BUT he promised Mexico would pay for it, right 40?
Stop playing games with peoples lives with your emotional outbursts. Learn the facts...
The head of the Department of Homeland Security bashed the media Sunday for their reporting on the increasingly volatile immigration controversy, writing in a string of tweets: “We do not have a policy of separating families at the border. Period.”
Secretary Kirstjen Nielsen added: “This misreporting by Members, press & advocacy groups must stop. It is irresponsible and unproductive. As I have said many times before, if you are seeking asylum for your family, there is no reason to break the law and illegally cross between ports of entry.”
She noted that no one is “breaking the law by seeking asylum at a port of entry.”
The Trump administration, which has called it “horrible” that illegal-immigrant children are sometimes separated from their parents when their parents enter criminal proceedings, has been criticized in recent weeks for increasing the prosecutions of illegal immigrants under a “zero-tolerance” policy that critics say leads to those separations.
A child illegally entering the U.S. is generally separated from adults at the border if the child is in danger, has no clear relationship to the adult, or if the adult enters criminal proceedings.
Through Twitter, Nielsen reiterated that current policies are derived from laws already in the books: “For those seeking asylum at ports of entry, we have continued the policy from previous Administrations and will only separate if the child is in danger, there is no custodial relationship between 'family' members, or if the adult has broken a law.”
She added: “DHS takes very seriously its duty to protect minors in our temporary custody from gangs, traffickers, criminals and abuse.”
Once word got out we will let almost anyone in, they came in the hundreds of thousands. Yearly.
US law became a cynical perversion thanks to people taking advantage of us.
It is time to stop it. It is time to fix it. Call your Congressman today. We need a comprehensive immigration law now!
You and I both know how weak this is as an argument in favor of-. We both know you're weak because you could do nothing to dispute a single fact I laid out. Instead, you engaged in more FOX-like rhetorical "reeny,reeny,reeny" to distract from the indisputable points I made.
Crap this weak would have been thrown out of the untelevised preliminary rounds of Ted Mack's Amateur Hour.
Thanks for playing. Grab another ticket as you exit, and go stand in the back of the line.
Stop playing games with peoples lives with your emotional outbursts. Learn the facts...
The head of the Department of Homeland Security bashed the media Sunday for their reporting on the increasingly volatile immigration controversy, writing in a string of tweets: “We do not have a policy of separating families at the border. Period.”
Secretary Kirstjen Nielsen added: “This misreporting by Members, press & advocacy groups must stop. It is irresponsible and unproductive. As I have said many times before, if you are seeking asylum for your family, there is no reason to break the law and illegally cross between ports of entry.”
She noted that no one is “breaking the law by seeking asylum at a port of entry.”
The Trump administration, which has called it “horrible” that illegal-immigrant children are sometimes separated from their parents when their parents enter criminal proceedings, has been criticized in recent weeks for increasing the prosecutions of illegal immigrants under a “zero-tolerance” policy that critics say leads to those separations.
A child illegally entering the U.S. is generally separated from adults at the border if the child is in danger, has no clear relationship to the adult, or if the adult enters criminal proceedings.
Through Twitter, Nielsen reiterated that current policies are derived from laws already in the books: “For those seeking asylum at ports of entry, we have continued the policy from previous Administrations and will only separate if the child is in danger, there is no custodial relationship between 'family' members, or if the adult has broken a law.”
She added: “DHS takes very seriously its duty to protect minors in our temporary custody from gangs, traffickers, criminals and abuse.”
'KRS Minus-ONE' can spout all the policy she wants. Asylum-seekers are being incarcerated and separated from their kids. Like criminals. Even though they aren't. Thiss is the result of a hastily thrown-together, ad-hoc 'zero tolerance' policy whose only purpose is to keep Trump's goobers all ginned up and rabid for closed borders.
This isn't emotion. This is fact.
You're being handled. Managed. My Pops taught me to watch folks like you. From above.
Illegals are cowards who run from the problems of their own country instead of fighting them. They look at the USA and they COVET what they don't have. So they lie and steal their way into the country to take what is not offered. That makes them thieves. They cause severe damage to our country as they break the laws to be here.
They are not foreigners who have come to our country legally so there is no courtesy due to them. They are invaders who come to break our laws and to take what they covet.
I strive against those who break the laws and seek punishment for the wicked.
Your post reeks of hypocrisy to the point of being absolutely pathetic... To call someone a coward for trying to better their life and/or the lives of their family... escaping some environments that have, in many instances, already taken family members from them by very violent means... sickening
I would bet a month's salary that you have never even been close to seeing first hand what some of these people have experienced in their lives... except maybe on fox news...
You and your attitude are part of the problem... not part of any solution... other than putting people that don't think like you in positions of leadership...
Stop quoting scriptures... you're not fooling anyone...
Thank you for proving my point.
I'm happy to accept your check at any time you like. I've done mission work and helped out more people than I can even count. My own life growing up was so horrible that when I was forced to see a psychologist as part of my college education and against my will that the guy started to cry and couldn't handle dealing with the things I've gone through in life.
I don't make excuses for myself and I don't accept them for others.
If your not willing to fight for your country then why should I wan't you in mine. It's not like you will grow a backbone just because the USA coddles you. It's disgusting. My family has a long, long history of serving in the military. We ALL firmly believe that if you won't fight for your country or your people then you don't deserve a place in this world. That not a political thing because we are all over the place politically in a family picnic. It's a thing where you show some darn loyalty to your people and fight to keep them safe.
I have no use for cowards and never will. I've said so many times before this thread too so it's nothing new I am saying here.
Maybe, just maybe if it's made crystal clear that the USA will not let you in illegally and that if you break the law to get in then you will suffer the consequence then perhaps, just perhaps it will slow down to a manageable trickle.
It's not the president's fault these people are suffering it's their own fault for breaking the law. There shouldn't even be hearings beyond if they will accept their claim for asylum. It should be either yes, no, and here you go. The USA is VERY, VERY generous in the amounts of people we accept for asylum. We rank only 2nd behind Germany and we can already see they are acting fast to reverse that after all the damage it has caused them.
LET ME HELP YOU UNDERSTAND something very, very simple. If you took back all the money we have lost in DAMAGES from illegal aliens You could make every single woman, man, and child a millionaire that isn't already one. Think on that for a moment. Comprehend how massive that amount of damage is that you could see to it that every single American could be a millionaire.
THe damage that illegal aliens are causing the USA is MASSIVE. 140 billion a year in damages just from illegal aliens. Do you even comprehend how much money is being lost? You could literally end poverty in the USA just off the 140 billion dollars a year we lose in damages alone.
But by all means care more for criminals than you do about your own people and family. Good for you! I myself prefer to care more about my own country and it's citizens who have the right to be here.
JC: Here's a really good opinion piece that Laura Bush (President George W. Bush's Wife) wrote. Thought it was relevant here. First Lady of a Republican President. A very good read and take IMO. Pretty much how I feel about the whole separating families bit.
It's posted in the Washington Post, but Laura Bush wrote it
Laura Bush: Separating children from their parents at the border ‘breaks my heart’
By Laura Bush June 17, 2018 at 8:45 PM
On Sunday, a day we as a nation set aside to honor fathers and the bonds of family, I was among the millions of Americans who watched images of children who have been torn from their parents. In the six weeks between April 19 and May 31, the Department of Homeland Security has sent nearly 2,000 children to mass detention centers or foster care. More than 100 of these children are younger than 4 years old. The reason for these separations is a zero-tolerance policy for their parents, who are accused of illegally crossing our borders.
I live in a border state. I appreciate the need to enforce and protect our international boundaries, but this zero-tolerance policy is cruel. It is immoral. And it breaks my heart.
Our government should not be in the business of warehousing children in converted box stores or making plans to place them in tent cities in the desert outside of El Paso. These images are eerily reminiscent of the Japanese American internment camps of World War II, now considered to have been one of the most shameful episodes in U.S. history. We also know that this treatment inflicts trauma; interned Japanese have been two times as likely to suffer cardiovascular disease or die prematurely than those who were not interned.
Americans pride ourselves on being a moral nation, on being the nation that sends humanitarian relief to places devastated by natural disasters or famine or war. We pride ourselves on believing that people should be seen for the content of their character, not the color of their skin. We pride ourselves on acceptance. If we are truly that country, then it is our obligation to reunite these detained children with their parents — and to stop separating parents and children in the first place.
People on all sides agree that our immigration system isn’t working, but the injustice of zero tolerance is not the answer. I moved away from Washington almost a decade ago, but I know there are good people at all levels of government who can do better to fix this.
Recently, Colleen Kraft, who heads the American Academy of Pediatrics, visited a shelter run by the U.S. Office of Refugee Resettlement. She reported that while there were beds, toys, crayons, a playground and diaper changes, the people working at the shelter had been instructed not to pick up or touch the children to comfort them. Imagine not being able to pick up a child who is not yet out of diapers.
Twenty-nine years ago, my mother-in-law, Barbara Bush, visited Grandma’s House, a home for children with HIV/AIDS in Washington. Back then, at the height of the HIV/AIDS crisis, the disease was a death sentence, and most babies born with it were considered “untouchables.” During her visit, Barbara — who was the first lady at the time — picked up a fussy, dying baby named Donovan and snuggled him against her shoulder to soothe him. My mother-in-law never viewed her embrace of that fragile child as courageous. She simply saw it as the right thing to do in a world that can be arbitrary, unkind and even cruel. She, who after the death of her 3-year-old daughter knew what it was to lose a child, believed that every child is deserving of human kindness, compassion and love.
In 2018, can we not as a nation find a kinder, more compassionate and more moral answer to this current crisis? I, for one, believe we can.
You guys never once shed a tear when Barack Obama was famously labeled “deporter in chief” by critics in the immigrant-rights community.
Not one tear for your heroes policy.
Now, as you go on and on with your "Hate Trump on every policy agenda" you cry crocodile tears for the exact same things.
You are as Fake with your tears as the Fake News Media and the Democrats who have zero policies to make America great but use these children like they used the school children over gun rights.
I'm sorry you had it so tough. That however, does not justify being cruel to others or not helping those weaker than you. After reading that blurb I don't know if I should feel sorry for you because you seem to lack empathy and common decency due to your past or if I should just point out how sad and pathetic your worldview is based on what I would guess to be horrible personal experiences.
I've seen abused dogs tied outside, beaten and starved. You just want to show them some love with a simple act of kindness so they understand all people aren't bad, but if you do they will probably bite you because they trust no one... You sound like you are in a similar state of mind.
You guys never once shed a tear when Barack Obama was famously labeled “deporter in chief” by critics in the immigrant-rights community.
Not one tear for your heroes policy.
Now, as you go on and on with your "Hate Trump on every policy agenda" you cry crocodile tears for the exact same things.
You are as Fake with your tears as the Fake News Media and the Democrats who have zero policies to make America great but use these children like they used the school children over gun rights.
No one in the government is doing any harm to these children.
The parents who bring the children along on an illegal border crossing are the ones enforcing negative consequences on these children. Don't cross illegally, and there is no problem.
Large numbers of hispanics cross legally every single day, I guess the racists whom you folks see behind every bush and around every corner are missing the majority of hispanic immigrants to focus solely on the illegal crossers. Wonder if there could be some definite other reason, aside from Racism!, Racism!, Racism!
Obama used to put the kids into real jail with the parents, and oh the wailing and gnashing of teeth that ensued. So now, the kids are not put in jail.
All the parents have to do is get in line and follow the law just like everybody else.
No one in the government is doing any harm to these children.
The parents who bring the children along on an illegal border crossing are the ones enforcing negative consequences on these children. Don't cross illegally, and there is no problem.
Large numbers of hispanics cross legally every single day, I guess the racists whom you folks see behind every bush and around every corner are missing the majority of hispanic immigrants to focus solely on the illegal crossers. Wonder if there could be some definite other reason, aside from Racism!, Racism!, Racism!
Obama used to put the kids into real jail with the parents, and oh the wailing and gnashing of teeth that ensued. So now, the kids are not put in jail.
All the parents have to do is get in line and follow the law just like everybody else.
Life is tough, sometimes. The parents cause the separation, keeping the kids with the parents in jail is not ideal, and in many cases the "parents" are not parents, often there is human trafficking involved.
Sure that is a small number of cases but how small a number is acceptable losses?
If only there was some orderly process where people submit passports and ID's and can be interviewed and a decision made, vaccinations given, criminals and crazies screened out, that might make all this problem go away.
It's not illegal to apply for asylum. You should think a lawyer would know such a basic premise.
But you can't simply apply for asylum because you don't like living in squalor. I do believe you have to show you are escaping some kind of actual persecution.
The best part of all this is all the kids who won't continue to end up being victims of human trafficking.
Are you completely out of your mind? That is just not a rational comparison.
Stopped about 30 seconds in. Y'all can go out behind the barn and play in the daisies with that crap.
That's where the very small children and simple-minded adults are sent during adult conversation, for those who are unfamiliar with the reference.
Of course he went there... they always like to deflect from their true nature...
From the summary: Google Redefines The Word ‘Fascism’ To Smear Conservatives, Protect Liberal Rioters. ....Has Google, the world’s most popular search engine, changed the definition of the word “fascism” to protect liberal mobs using violence to silence those who disagree with them politically? The evidence suggest they have. You see it on signs at every protest or riot — liberals accuse President Donald Trump of being a fascist. The word’s association with Adolf Hitler and its use now is no accident, it’s meant to strike fear in people’s hearts of tyranny.
Merriam-Webster defines the word “fascism” as “a political philosophy, movement, or regime (as that of the Fascist) that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition.” The secondary definition is “a tendency toward or actual exercise of strong autocratic or dictatorial control.”
This definition reflects the fact that Nazis were, in fact, both fascists and of the political left. They were the “National Socialist German Workers Party,” which favored a heavy-handed government in business and the personal lives of its citizens.
The authoritarian government of Nazi Germany not only oppressed opposing political views and used violence to enforce it, they supported a powerful central government which heaped social benefits on its citizens. The second part of Nazism is the “socialist” part, which is very similar to what the modern American political left advocates. For all their bluster to the contrary, Hitler was a man of the extreme left, and so was fellow fascist and Axis Powers member Benito Mussolini.
But if you type the word into Google, the definition they provide is quite different.
The world’s largest search engine pins fascism on the political right, not the left.
Google defines fascism as, “an authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization.” (emphasis added)
The secondary definition is, “(in general use) extreme right-wing, authoritarian, or intolerant views or practice.”
That’s a striking difference from how the word has been defined for decades.
Political conservatives advocate for small, less intrusive government where power rests with the states and individuals, and the federal government lives within its Constitutional restraints. Progressive liberals advocate for just the opposite: a powerful central government with authority vested in a strong leader who has the ability to impose decrees from Washington on everything from health care to education.
Google curiously adds “right-wing” to its definition and omits the “severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition” part.
By the traditional Merriam-Webster definition of “severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition,” the violent mobs protesting and rioting over President Trump’s actions are the ones engaging in fascistic tactics.
The exact reason Google has changed the definition of fascism to reflect on the political right rather than the left is unknown. However, Google co-founder Sergey Brin, one of the world’s richest men, has been a vocal critic of President Trump, an activist liberal, and has protested the President’s executive order on immigration.
Many members of the mainstream media have unquestioningly adopted the new Google meaning without explaining why, leaving their audience with the impression that speech or advocacy contrary to liberal orthodoxy is fascistic when, by definition, it is not.
There's your issue! He very plainly explains he's not making a comparison to putting people to death. Watch the whole thing or stop speaking about things you're obviously uniformed about.
Well ...... if you leave out the whole "putting people to death" thing, you know, to make a reasonable comparison, then almost all of the kids at Auschwitz had at least one parent, and often both, plus grandparents and aunts and uncles, standing right beside and with them the entire time. For the rest of their lives, guaranteed, in fact.
Sure, that makes sense. These situations are so obviously closely related, I don't know how I missed it.
Have you ever seen a live human being with a number tatooed on his arm?
It was a LOT of digits. I have wondered if they allocated blocks of numbers for each camp, or started each camp at "1", or what. Germans are so methodical and orderly.
We are not the babysitter or the welfare state for the entire world, and if you come here, we have rules that we insist on being followed, just like anywhere else.
To repeat, lots of hispanics come in every single day with no problems at all, by following legal procedure. This is not Racism!, Racism!, Racism!
I'm pretty sure Hitler separated a few million families during the Holocaust, but it could have been fake news.
Honestly, interment camps are a much better comparison, but we have a hard time of being critical of the US's history, no matter how atrocious it's been.
Just quickly, Nazi Germany was a right wing government. They privatized many industries and their one claim to socialism, besides a name, is their social healthcare system that they inherited from the 1800's. If he was a man of the extreme left then he wouldn't have hated socialism and communism. Also Mussolini had a very public expungement from the socialist party in Italy when he began his Italian unification idea. This was way before he became the leader of Italy. You won't find fascism on the left, because it requires ultranationalism, which the left obviously does not partake in due to their political philosophy.
Just quickly, Nazi Germany was a right wing government. They privatized many industries and their one claim to socialism, besides a name, is their social healthcare system that they inherited from the 1800's. If he was a man of the extreme left then he wouldn't have hated socialism and communism. Also Mussolini had a very public expungement from the socialist party in Italy when he began his Italian unification idea. This was way before he became the leader of Italy. You won't find fascism on the left, because it requires ultranationalism, which the left obviously does not partake in due to their political philosophy.
Just because established socialists weren't socialist enough for Hitler and Mussolini doesn't mean they weren't. They may have privatized industries but it'snot like those industries then operated without the direct intervention of the gov't. If we ever ended up with single payer type of healthcare system, there's a chance that private insurance companies would still handle the processing and claims. That's not the same "privatized" as what we know in a capitalist system.
Ever look in to the history of the Volkswagen Beetle? Hitler reportedly had a little influence in the design. Once settled, there was this push to get Germans to buy the cars. Problem was 1) few Germans could by the car outright and 2) there actually had yet to be any real mass production so availability was an issue. What they then did was sold stamp books. A family would buy the book and on pay day they could purchase a stamp. When the book filled up with stamps, they could then exchange it for a car.
Thing is, they never really built the automotive plants as the people were led to believe. Hitler used the money from the stamp sales to fund the build up of the Nazi war machine instead.
And then you still have to get around the increase in state run programs and the push to make people more reliant on the state.
I don't agree that ultranationalism is a necessary component. I think the concept of victim vs. oppressor is much more key. With the latter you see how easily violence is justified to counter peaceful demonstration. We see it increasingly on the left with groups like ANTIFA and college campuses. The use of violence in opposition to speech was a hallmark of Hitler's rise.
Well ...... if you leave out the whole "putting people to death" thing, you know, to make a reasonable comparison, then almost all of the kids at Auschwitz had at least one parent, and often both, plus grandparents and aunts and uncles, standing right beside and with them the entire time. For the rest of their lives, guaranteed, in fact.
Sure, that makes sense. These situations are so obviously closely related, I don't know how I missed it.
Have you ever seen a live human being with a number tatooed on his arm?
It was a LOT of digits. I have wondered if they allocated blocks of numbers for each camp, or started each camp at "1", or what. Germans are so methodical and orderly.
We are not the babysitter or the welfare state for the entire world, and if you come here, we have rules that we insist on being followed, just like anywhere else.
To repeat, lots of hispanics come in every single day with no problems at all, by following legal procedure. This is not Racism!, Racism!, Racism!
His point was how it all started. 1933 was very similar to today in America. Tribal divides, anger toward immigrants, Populist power hungry new leader, etc. ; somehow I don't think you watched the whole bit or comprehended the message. I don't think Trump is Hitler 2.0, but I absolutely think he wants to be a ruthless dictator. He has as much as said said so himself. Deny that one.
I absolutely think he wants to be a ruthless dictator. He has as much as said said so himself.
I think he just wants to run the country the way he ran his bidnissez... and doesn't understand/accept the fact that there are rules he must follow as a civil servant. Rules that did not constrain him in the private sector.
The fact that he's binary, intellectually incurious and headstrong to a fault is key in why his presidency has been so rocky and tumultuous. I still believe that it prob won't be the Special Council investigation that will end his presidency. In fact, I've always been of the opinion that he himself will be responsible for his own undoing.
His point was horrible. America today and Germany in 1933 have almost nothing in common.
1918, the return of the army, the losses, Versaille, the stab in the back, anarchy in the streets, barely recovering, then the Great Depression on top of all that. We have experienced nothing remotely similar. Germany had no immigrant problem, illegal or otherwise, the concern here is not immigrants but border control. Germany had no welfare state, and American blacks or Latinos do not control large numbers of banks or consistently have major assets worth stealing. Hitler was not a populist.
Hitler did, however, invent the term "assault rifle", and used it in exactly the same way as American leftists, to frighten and terrify ignorant peasants. He gave the impression it was extremely common, when in reality it was rarely used, almost never in the US case, just like the American left. He also used physical violence, thuggery, and bullying to silence any dissent with proper ideology, just like the American left. His propaganda relied on constant repetition to give credence to ridiculous lies, again, just like the American left.
To suggest such a connection is an absurd exaggeration.
Just quickly, Nazi Germany was a right wing government. They privatized many industries and their one claim to socialism, besides a name, is their social healthcare system that they inherited from the 1800's. If he was a man of the extreme left then he wouldn't have hated socialism and communism. Also Mussolini had a very public expungement from the socialist party in Italy when he began his Italian unification idea. This was way before he became the leader of Italy. You won't find fascism on the left, because it requires ultranationalism, which the left obviously does not partake in due to their political philosophy.
Just because established socialists weren't socialist enough for Hitler and Mussolini doesn't mean they weren't. They may have privatized industries but it'snot like those industries then operated without the direct intervention of the gov't. If we ever ended up with single payer type of healthcare system, there's a chance that private insurance companies would still handle the processing and claims. That's not the same "privatized" as what we know in a capitalist system.
Ever look in to the history of the Volkswagen Beetle? Hitler reportedly had a little influence in the design. Once settled, there was this push to get Germans to buy the cars. Problem was 1) few Germans could by the car outright and 2) there actually had yet to be any real mass production so availability was an issue. What they then did was sold stamp books. A family would buy the book and on pay day they could purchase a stamp. When the book filled up with stamps, they could then exchange it for a car.
Thing is, they never really built the automotive plants as the people were led to believe. Hitler used the money from the stamp sales to fund the build up of the Nazi war machine instead.
And then you still have to get around the increase in state run programs and the push to make people more reliant on the state.
I don't agree that ultranationalism is a necessary component. I think the concept of victim vs. oppressor is much more key. With the latter you see how easily violence is justified to counter peaceful demonstration. We see it increasingly on the left with groups like ANTIFA and college campuses. The use of violence in opposition to speech was a hallmark of Hitler's rise.
Well, it wasn't a one way street. Hitler and Mussolini hated socialism and communism. They weren't just arguing over a name, but had completely different philosophical alignments. That is why arguments that Nazis were socialists never go beyond the name point.
We do need to create a distinction between state economies and socialism/communism though. Just because one has a centralized unit controlling things, doesn't mean that is socialism. For example, the US Government has been the largest driver in industry and technological changes in the private industry, but in no way could be considered socialist.
If you want to make a distinction that buying insurance from one company isn't capitalism, then you need to understand that it is not socialism either. You can not privatize social goods and services and still claim to be socialist.
The idea to create your economy by producing a good to sell back the workers goes completely against the basic premise of socialism. If workers were to seize the means of production, then how could that production be sold back to them? The idea of a stamp book can only be something based in capitalism; "If you buy this good enough times, we will give you a free product. This way you will become an even better consumer than normal."
State run programs can also make more people reliant on private industries. It does not go one way. Centralized power and capitalism intertwined althroughout modern history. When you believe that the left and right are on a 2D plane is when you've already lost your chance to critically think.
I believe that the victim vs oppressor emphasis is just a way for the right to break down power dynamics into easily digestible concepts. In fact Nationalism relies on these hyperbolic power dynamics to create their message. Donald Trump's immigration platform revolved entirely around us and Europe of being victims of immigrants. Even today Trump said he would not let the US become a Migrant tent. Even though he is the most powerful man in America, he still frames the US as a potential victim and that Donny is the only person who can save the US from this fate. Simultaneously whenever he is pressed against, he becomes the victim of a big bad. Whether it is the FBI's investigation or the G7 leaders ganging up on him, he is the victim when things go bad.
Nationalism is easy to create, because it takes an unassuming, banal position like "X country is great." and then continues to hype that idea up in an echo chamber. Of course that position includes many hidden truths. For example, if a country is great, it should have no problem being great, but if there is a problem then the problem is not the country's fault, as the country is great, but the fault lies on some "other". This "other" can than morph into anything that person or nation wants. Salvadorian refugees, Iranian radicals, deep state FBI, globalists. You name it, the other can become it. The "other" in Nazi Germany were Internationalists, socialists, communists and Jews. In Italy they were "anti-fascists"
One thing that also led to the rise of Nazi Germany was hate speech that went left unchecked. Groups like Antifa were crucial to liberating a lot of Europe when no one would fight Italy or Germany.
America today and Germany in 1933 have almost nothing in common.
1. Hitler made allies with other dictators. 2. Hitler was a fascist and a right wing populist. 3. Hitler's policy separated children from their parents. 4. Hitler came to power at the end of a great economic depression/recession. 5. Hitler came to power with a rise of right-wing populism as their conservative party fell apart.
not just this thread, but all the other threads the last few days are really depressing.
this board combined with social media has proven to me that this country is truly filled with nothing but heartless bastards who only care about themselves and/or their group and no one else.
i look at some of the past threads about DT meetups, and i just cant. some have proven that you simply do not have the character for me to ever pursue a meaningful friendship with them. the complete lack of respect and compassion for people who simply dont look like you, or not from the same country as you, truly makes me want to throw up in my mouth.
if this is American values today, then we deserve to fall like the Romans.
I apologize for my tone of the previous post, I allowed my emotions to get the best of me. I apologize for not giving people the proper respect when it comes to this discussion.
I will say their isn't any easy answers here. The right thing to do for all parties involved is to send them back to where they came from. Its unfair to force the American Taxpayer into footing the bill for these kids who are not even citizens. On the flip side, its unfair to the kids to send them back to what is most likely deplorable conditions where they really have no chance.
the sad reality is the USA simply can't take in everyone, we simply can't afford it. We are trillions in debt now, and rising. The days of allowing anyone on to immigrate have to end.
you need to have skills we deem valuable, be it a Dr., an engineer, a computer network administrator or code writer, a mechanic, something...there has to be some skill that contributes to our country to grant enter...we are too large now to just take it everyone including people that have a very high chance of never contributing.
I would be perfectly fine if we took these kids under the age of 5 and put them into foster homes with American couples that either want to adopt or simply can't have kids of their own, however...we just can't take in everyone.
i'd love to take in everyone! I would! i'd like to just accept the entire world...but its just not feasible...this is why countries were founded in the 1st place...to mark territory and resources...there is only so much food and resources to go around, and only so many jobs too, we can't sustain everyone and give everyone a job, a large number of people will end up on handouts simply because their isn't enough jobs to meet supply of people and keeping bringing in more just makes this problem worse.
I don't know what we do at this point...this is downside of globalism....im not sure their are any easy answers to fix it sadly...
Trump can end this policy and practice this very hour, but instead would prefer to use these kids as leverage.
I decided to pop in this afternoon and to see so many people on this board defending this behavior as though it's a good thing is saddening to me. All I know is that a big majority opposes this policy source but there is one demo that supports it 55-35: Republicans. They are the only demo to have majority support for Trumps policy of separating parents and children.
not just this thread, but all the other threads the last few days are really depressing.
this board combined with social media has proven to me that this country is truly filled with nothing but heartless bastards who only care about themselves and/or their group and no one else.
i look at some of the past threads about DT meetups, and i just cant. some have proven that you simply do not have the character for me to ever pursue a meaningful friendship with them. the complete lack of respect and compassion for people who simply dont look like you, or not from the same country as you, truly makes me want to throw up in my mouth.
if this is American values today, then we deserve to fall like the Romans.
Yeah, it's harder and harder to laugh at their nonsense the worse they embrace falling into the quicksand of outright white nationalism.
This is the bottom line. There is no other way to look at it.
They entered the country illegally. Parents go to prison and the children go to child services.
That is what happens when parents here screw up and need to go away. The kids don't go to prison with the parents.
There really is no other way to look at it, I don't care what some of you others think.
I am not saying I like it. I am saying that if the parents gave a rats ass about their kids and don't want to be separated from their kids, don't enter the country illegally.
In 1997, the U.S. Department of Justice agreed to a settlement in a case called Flores vs. Reno. Among other things, this settlement prohibits unaccompanied children who have crossed the border from being held in federal detention facilities for longer than 20 days. In 2016, the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals ruled that this 20 day prohibition applies to both accompanied minors (children who came along with family members) and unaccompanied minors.
This has all become relevant now because of the Trump Administration's new "zero tolerance" policy and the family separations that have resulted from it. Many Republicans, including Trump Administration officials, have argued that separating families is necessary because if a parent requests asylum, it usually takes longer than 20 days, so under the Flores settlement either the government has to let both the parent and child go after 20 days (which Republicans deride as "catch and release"), or detain the parent and release the child in which case they're separated. So they're demanding that legislation be passed overturning the Flores settlement and allowing the government to detain parents and children together for longer than 20 days (and demanding various border security measures in return).
Now this is a bit of a red herring, because the "zero tolerance" policy would separate families with or without the Flores settlement. But my question is, does the Trump Administration have the power to undo the Flores settlement on its own? Can the Executive branch break court settlements it's entered into, or does it require legislation to break a court settlement?
Can the Donald Trump administration unilaterally end the Flores consent decree? No. The consent decree is part of an agreement between parties. The federal government is just one of the parties. A modification would require agreement among all involved parties and the approval of the court. There is no evidence that the other parties are interested in removing the consent decree.
Could the Trump administration ask the courts to remove the consent decree? Yes, but there is no guarantee that the courts would do so. The government would have to establish that the consent decree or its side effects are more undesirable than the wrong that the consent decree was created to address. This is generally a high bar, as the government consented to be limited by the decree. It was part of an agreement to settle a suit. Ending or even modifying it would therefore give the other party room to argue that they should no longer have to comply with their responsibilities under the settlement.
It is for this reason that people who advocate an end or modification of the consent decree look to Congress for legislative action. If the underlying law on which the suit proceeded were changed, that would invalidate both sides of the settlement. They could replace it wholesale with a new system, set forth in legislation.
It's easy to not be moved by this. All it takes is one easy step.
Step One: Convince oneself that these are less than people.
Problem solved.
Sadly, I agree with your statement.
And I can't believe how many people are able to convince themselves of that.
They're children. No matter where they're from. They're children. There's absolutely nothing they could do to deserve this. It's cruel, inhumane, and beneath us as a country.
Quite frankly, I find it embarrassing that I just saw a CNN Poll that basically said 33% of those polled were in favor of this policy. I can't believe the number could be so high.
How heartless can some people be? This policy doesn't reflect my values. Not the ones I grew up with from my parents. Not the Catholic values they taught me. And not the values I've acquired along the way growing up and traveling the world; some of which taught me that 1st) All humans should be treated with respect. 2nd) Children are children. People are people. We are more alike than we are different.
It's just so damn upsetting. At this point, I can't believe I ever was registered a Republican or ever supported any of these people
I gotta say, in my life, I've been blessed with some pretty smart, moral and principled people. From My Parents/family to the teachers who instructed me, to the friends I grew up with to the professional colleagues I've collaborated with-- some of the best folks that have ever had a place on the planet. Keith is one of those blessings.
He popped up on fb today, with a blog entry he wrote 10 years ago. He dragged it back out of mothballs because of today's prevailing atmosphere and headlines. This seems like the perfect time and place to drop some K-Dawg on'em:
This blog entry is dated 8/31/08... just 65 days before Senator Barack Obama won the 2008 general election for POTUS (facts given solely to establish historical context).
__________________________
Sunday, August 31, 2008 My Dog and Immigration
I am worried that my dog and I have different views on immigration.
I believe that America's strength has always been in our immigrants. They come to America to fulfill the American dream. They have brought a strong work ethic which has been the backbone of the miraculous productivity of America. With each wave of immigration they have also revitalized our culture.
My dog, on the other hand, believes in protecting the perimeter.
I was sitting in our backyard the other morning having coffee. We have a relatively new neighbor behind us. There is a privacy fence between us, so until some other neighbor introduces us I am not sure when or how we will meet. This neighbor has a dog, and the dog came to the other side of that privacy fence, and the two dogs started barking up a storm.
This is a regular event. I call Teddy, our border collie, and he obediently stops barking and comes to my side. But it is obvious that he is serious about protecting our border. I have started referring to him as our furry minuteman.
Teddy's views are based on pure instinct. A xenophobic instinct has served pack animals well in their effort to survive. Its hard to hold his views against him.
Humans are the ultimate social animals. So why do the minutemen's instincts not serve us well in our fight for survival?
A society's strength depends on renewal from the outside...renewal of ideas, culture, and even gene pool. Isolationism has never served America, or any empire, well. Successful empires find unique ways of exporting the empire's vision to the outer reaches of the empire, while embracing the best that those cultures have to offer. The "Pax Romana" or Roman Peace was a 200 year period of relative peace in the Roman Empire. During that time Rome built roads and cities that helped the provinces flourish. Military might alone could not have successfully held such large holdings for so long with such relative peace. It was the mutually beneficial arrangement of local rule, military protection, economic expansion, and cultural exchange that made it work.
America is an empire. We established the empire through an incredible industrial growth, which led to an economic imperialism. The current administration has led America to unilateralism in foreign policy. American corporations, with blessings from the government have changed the underpinning of our economy from production-based to finance-based. Both can have disastrous consequences, and we are seeing the beginnings of those consequences now.
In the past, much of the rest of the world wanted to be like America. Now many people around the world hate us. If we wish to retain our standing in the world we have to regain our position of respect. We will only get there by opening our arms to the world, not shutting them out. Much of America is aghast at how prevalent the spanish language has become in our country. I embrace it. This is exactly the type of cultural infusion that will make our country stronger. In the pack analogy, this is akin to the need to breed outside of the pack to ensure genetic diversity.
I should point out that my dog is an incredibly friendly animal. Three-year-old children can pull his tail or stick their fingers in his mouth without fear. And though he barks at the approach of anyone to our front door, he is incredibly friendly once they have been admitted.
Perhaps our views are not so disparate. He just wants an easy path to legal entry. I can live with that.
But I still wish he wouldn't bark every time the neighbor's dog was on the other side of the fence. And I don't think building a taller fence is the answer.
I'm gonna copy it and send it over to my wife (whom immigrated here from Central America, and at one point was an "illegal immigrant"). She hates the word "illegal immigrant" because of the stigma it carries with some people. But, she's now a Naturalized Citizen and IMO she is a wonderful asset to our society. She's smart, compassionate, caring, and a hard worker. She was a poor girl who came here at the age of 12 and made something of herself with very little adult guidance. With a Masters in Neuro-Cognitive Psychology and a solid job in a field she loves with a major company, she's achieved what might be referred to as the American Dream.
My wife's far more progressive than me. I wouldn't be called a Democrat but I deregistered from the Republican Party recently, and I voted for Gary Johnson in 2016 (and don't regret it). Somehow with our political differences, and how opinionated we both are, we are able to make it work.
Anyway, im gonna pass this along. I think she'll like it a lot
Anyway, im gonna pass this along. I think she'll like it a lot
I'm pretty sure she will, PeteyD.
Also- please Let her know that she has other Americans like You, Keith, and Clemdawg in her corner.
Let her know that she is backed up by millions upon millions of other Americans who reject this filthy 'protectionist' ideology, and welcome her to become what we all (sh)are.
Years of backlash: Obama policy on illegal immigrants' children was also slammed by critics
While the Trump administration is being slammed by critics for its "zero-tolerance" policy of separating children from adults who illegally enter the country, the outcry over the federal government's handling of the sensitive issue of how to handle minors is hardly new.
The Obama administration actually expanded the system of detaining families – typically mothers and their minor children – after a huge surge of Central Americans along the U.S.-Mexican border in 2014. The policy resulted in many minors being detained in various locations, in much-criticized conditions, either with their families or by themselves, if they had crossed the border alone.
Videos and photos at the time showed children in tears, many of them still wearing dirty clothes, in detention facilities where they were kept with their families. The conditions -- which ranged from six adults and children sleeping crammed on two mattresses laid out on concrete floors, to sick minors not receiving medical care -- were documented in many news accounts and reports by human rights groups.
At the time, Obama administration officials argued they had no choice but to implement policies intended to deter families from entering the U.S. illegally. Trump administration officials have made similar arguments.
The difference is the Trump administration is now taking children away from parents who are being prosecuted criminally for offenses that often were once considered civil violations. The children are not being charged with crimes, and are being placed in the custody of the Department of Health and Human Services.
Speaking at the National Sheriffs’ Association conference in New Orleans on Monday, Attorney General Jeff Sessions said, "We do not want to separate parents from their children."
But Sessions said word had gotten out before Trump became president that anyone who tried to cross the border with a minor would almost certainly be “given immunity from prosecution.”
“Word got out about this loophole, with predictable results,” Sessions said. “The number of aliens illegally crossing with children between our ports of entry went from 14,000 to 75,000 — that’s a five-fold increase — in just the last four years.”
"We cannot and will not encourage people to bring children by giving them blanket immunity from our laws," Sessions said.
Sen. Ted Cruz introduces 'emergency' bill to keep immigrant families together
Sen. Ted Cruz, R-Texas, on Monday announced a plan to introduce comprehensive "emergency legislation" designed to end unnecessary separations of illegal immigrant children from their parents.
The bill, an answer to President Trump's call for a congressional solution to the situation, would double the number of immigration judges to 750 and mandate that illegal immigrant families be kept together, unless there has been "aggravated criminal conduct" or threat of harm to the children, according to Cruz's office.
The new legislation would also authorize new temporary shelters for immigrant families, and provide for expedited resolution of asylum claims within 14 days.
Sen. Ted Cruz introduces 'emergency' bill to keep immigrant families together
Sen. Ted Cruz, R-Texas, on Monday announced a plan to introduce comprehensive "emergency legislation" designed to end unnecessary separations of illegal immigrant children from their parents.
The bill, an answer to President Trump's call for a congressional solution to the situation, would double the number of immigration judges to 750 and mandate that illegal immigrant families be kept together, unless there has been "aggravated criminal conduct" or threat of harm to the children, according to Cruz's office.
The new legislation would also authorize new temporary shelters for immigrant families, and provide for expedited resolution of asylum claims within 14 days.
BUT DOES IT FUND THE WALL? If it does it's DOA. Trump can stop the separations with a phone call. He did this, he can undo this.
Trump aides plan fresh immigration crackdowns before midterms
White House policy adviser Stephen Miller wants to make sure the president can show he’s doing something about border control.
By NANCY COOK 06/18/2018
Top aides to President Donald Trump are planning additional crackdowns on immigration before the November midterms, despite a growing backlash over the administration’s move to separate migrant children from parents at the border.
Senior policy adviser Stephen Miller and a team of officials from the departments of Justice, Labor, Homeland Security and the Office of Management and Budget have been quietly meeting for months to find ways to use executive authority and under-the-radar rule changes to strengthen hard-line U.S. immigration policies, according to interviews with half a dozen current and former administration officials and Republicans close to the White House.
The goal for Miller and his team is to arm Trump with enough data and statistics by early September to show voters that he fulfilled his immigration promises — even without a border wall or any other congressional measure, said one Republican close to the White House.
Among the fresh ideas being circulated: tightening rules on student visas and exchange programs; limiting visas for temporary agricultural workers; making it harder for legal immigrants who have applied for welfare programs to obtain residency; and collecting biometric data from visitors from certain countries.
Details of the ideas are still being worked out, one White House official said.
In one of the most closely watched plans under discussion, DHS has proposed a new rule that former Obama administration officials and immigration advocates worry could be used as an end run around a 1997 court settlement that limits the time migrant children can be kept in government custody. Putting a formal government rule in place, lawyers and advocates say, could in effect supersede the settlement, allowing the administration to get rid of it altogether by dropping the rule a year or two later.
“Once you rescind that regulation, then you go back to being able to do whatever you want and the detention becomes the complete discretion of ICE,” said Leon Fresco, former deputy assistant attorney general for the Office of Immigration Litigation at the Department of Justice. “That is where people think this is headed.”
The president and his top aides have framed the family separation issue as something Democrats could end by signing on to Republican legislation addressing Trump’s priorities, including funding the border wall — even though the separation moves are solely the outgrowth of a Department of Justice decision and not grounded in a particular law.
Miller, who was instrumental to Trump’s early travel ban — which, like the border separations, triggered widespread public outrage and was put into effect without sufficient logistical planning — is among those who see the border crisis as a winning campaign issue.
“That is the fundamental political contrast and political debate that is unfolding right now,” Miller said in an interview with Breitbart News published on May 24. “The Democratic Party is at grave risk of completely marginalizing itself from the American voters by continuing to lean into its absolutist anti-enforcement positions.”
And some in the Trump administration are not inclined to back down from any of its immigration policies because they’ve been planning them for more than a year, according to one White House official and a Republican close to the administration.
On Jan. 25, 2017, Trump signed an executive order that called for the arrest and detention of people caught crossing the border illegally — a broad preview of the Department of Justice’s April “zero-tolerance” decision to refer all border-crossers for federal prosecution, which has led to the separation of children from parents being sent into criminal courts.
Many of the ideas for enacting more aggressive immigration enforcement or tweaking old government rules originated with the White House’s Domestic Policy Council, which Miller effectively runs.
Other participants in the effort include John Walk, a lawyer in the White House counsel’s office and Attorney General Jeff Sessions’ son-in-law; Thomas Homan, the soon-to-retire head of Immigration and Customs Enforcement; Francis Cissna, director of U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services; Gene Hamilton, a former staffer to Sessions and ex-DHS official, who’s now at the Department of Justice; and officials throughout DHS.
In his Breitbart News interview in May, Miller called for closer examination of H1-B visas, which allow U.S. employers to hire foreign workers for certain specialized jobs.
OMB is currently reviewing a proposal to make it harder for immigrants with visas to obtain permanent residency, including a green card, if they or their children have used government benefits such as Medicaid, food stamps or tax credits. Advocates fear this would keep people from seeking necessary help or medical attention.
The list of proposed rules by DHS, released this spring, offers another road map for the coming changes.
In one interim final rule, DHS would expand and make permanent a pilot program that allows the agency to collect biometric data — such as fingerprints, photographs or retina scans — from certain foreigners at land ports and some airports and seaports, a move that alarms privacy advocates.
“At all of the agencies, there is a steady drip, drip of regulatory and policy changes,” said Jessica Vaughan, director of policy studies for the Center for Immigration Studies, a group that favors lower levels of immigration. “It is clear that Congress is unlikely to help them in terms of legislative fixes and will probably not even give them much more money, so they are going to use the tools they have and address these problems.”
Perhaps the emotional direction will get through to some of you.
"The Statue of Liberty is crying today for all those who filled out the paperwork, paid the necessary fees, and did what was legally required under American Law to come to this Country but now must go to the back of the line, behind those who steal their way in."
Sen. Ted Cruz introduces 'emergency' bill to keep immigrant families together
Sen. Ted Cruz, R-Texas, on Monday announced a plan to introduce comprehensive "emergency legislation" designed to end unnecessary separations of illegal immigrant children from their parents.
The bill, an answer to President Trump's call for a congressional solution to the situation, would double the number of immigration judges to 750 and mandate that illegal immigrant families be kept together, unless there has been "aggravated criminal conduct" or threat of harm to the children, according to Cruz's office.
The new legislation would also authorize new temporary shelters for immigrant families, and provide for expedited resolution of asylum claims within 14 days.
Please show me the legislation that requires families to be separated. They are trying to pass legislation to end it without there being legislation that requires it.
Trump is trying to play hero again and offer a solution for a problem he created.
Perhaps the emotional direction will get through to some of you.
"The Statue of Liberty is crying today for all those who filled out the paperwork, paid the necessary fees, and did what was legally required under American Law to come to this Country but now must go to the back of the line, behind those who steal their way in."
Sad. You condone hurting children, that is who YOU ARE.
Perhaps the emotional direction will get through to some of you.
"The Statue of Liberty is crying today for all those who filled out the paperwork, paid the necessary fees, and did what was legally required under American Law to come to this Country but now must go to the back of the line, behind those who steal their way in."
The weird guy who worships a creepy senile racist pervert in a wig is here to tell us about the "emotional direction".
His point was horrible. America today and Germany in 1933 have almost nothing in common.
1918, the return of the army, the losses, Versaille, the stab in the back, anarchy in the streets, barely recovering, then the Great Depression on top of all that. We have experienced nothing remotely similar. Germany had no immigrant problem, illegal or otherwise, the concern here is not immigrants but border control. Germany had no welfare state, and American blacks or Latinos do not control large numbers of banks or consistently have major assets worth stealing. Hitler was not a populist.
Hitler did, however, invent the term "assault rifle", and used it in exactly the same way as American leftists, to frighten and terrify ignorant peasants. He gave the impression it was extremely common, when in reality it was rarely used, almost never in the US case, just like the American left. He also used physical violence, thuggery, and bullying to silence any dissent with proper ideology, just like the American left. His propaganda relied on constant repetition to give credence to ridiculous lies, again, just like the American left.
To suggest such a connection is an absurd exaggeration.
This is an honest scenario no one will answer. Lets say, I am offered a job lets say in California making 3x my salary, that will give me and my family a better life (in turn my taxes will go from 12% to 25% ). So I pack up, throw my 3 year old child in the trunk instead of his car seat to save space, and take off, driving at high speeds. I then get pulled over, and the officer hears the child in my trunk. What do you think happens? What do you think people will say? I tend to believe those on the left would want the police officer and CYS to take the child from my custody since I was endangering the child. Anyone think different?
This is an honest scenario no one will answer. Lets say, I am offered a job lets say in California making 3x my salary, that will give me and my family a better life (in turn my taxes will go from 12% to 25% ). So I pack up, throw my 3 year old child in the trunk instead of his car seat to save space, and take off, driving at high speeds. I then get pulled over, and the officer hears the child in my trunk. What do you think happens? What do you think people will say? I tend to believe those on the left would want the police officer and CYS to take the child from my custody since I was endangering the child. Anyone think different?
Would the child then go to a cage?
Child endangerment has never been a civil offense.
ahhh, so you don't want to answer the question either. Child endangerment calls for the removal of the child the parents care. You have no problem with that happening to American citizens children.
Why do you want to treat Illegal Immigrants differently?
The Statue of Liberty weeps bitter tears for her fellow Citizens who have been raped, murdered or maimed by the criminal element, mixed in with the illegal immigrants, who slip through our system because our Government failed to stop and find out who is actually entering our Country.
ahhh, so you don't want to answer the question either. Child endangerment calls for the removal of the child the parents care. You have no problem with that happening to American citizens children.
Why do you want to treat Illegal Immigrants differently?
Actually a lot of us have a lot of problems with how foster care is ran, but when you guys just shout "murderer" loudly, it's hard for you to listen to those points. But yes, in the above situation your child would be put into either a foster home or a group home, depending on the age of the child. If we're to play with your direct analogy, the three year old child would go to a foster home and not a juvenile holding center. Also, applying for asylum is not the same as stuffing your 3 year old in a car trunk.
Do you not follow the speed limit? Let’s govenyou a ticket, and then slash your tires to make sure you never speed again.
———————————————
Peen, you know I’m giving an analogy. It remains a valid comparison.
I don’t understand how it can be all about legal vs illegal to you. You ignore soo much more of a complex issue by doing that.
It really isn't more than legal and illegal.
In my analogy I said what if a legal person or persons, such as you and I break a law with our children with us.
We get arrested and the children are placed in custody of children's services. They aren't kept with the parents when the parents are locked up.
I don't like this any better than anyone else, but what do you do? Ignore things because the parents had their children with them while they broke the law?
The President is right, congress needs to legislate how to handle this situation. All he is doing is enforcing the laws of the land.
. Also, applying for asylum is not the same as stuffing your 3 year old in a car trunk.
Throwing your child on the top of the train at high speeds, or hiding in the back of a pickup truck in cabinets with no air, is child endangerment.
Its not asylum, a country has to meet certain requirements for asylum, nice talking point though.
Basic Grounds for Asylum or Refugee Status
To establish eligibility for asylum or refugee status, you must prove you are either the victim of past persecution or you have a well-founded fear of future persecution. In the case of past persecution, you must prove that you were persecuted in your home country or last country of residence.
The persecution must have been based on at least one of five grounds, either your: •race •religion •nationality •political opinion, or •membership in a particular social group.
The threat against you needs to be a nationwide—you won’t be thought to have a well-founded fear of persecution if you could avoid the problem simply by moving to another part of the country.So as long as people still vacation in Mexico on the daily basis...they don't qualify.
The Statue of Liberty weeps bitter tears for her fellow Citizens who have been raped, murdered or maimed by the criminal element, mixed in with the illegal immigrants, who slip through our system because our Government failed to stop and find out who is actually entering our Country.
The guy who posts YouTube tribute videos to a dumb racist creep has deep thoughts on the tears of a weeping statue.
This is an honest scenario no one will answer. Lets say, I am offered a job lets say in California making 3x my salary, that will give me and my family a better life (in turn my taxes will go from 12% to 25% ). So I pack up, throw my 3 year old child in the trunk instead of his car seat to save space, and take off, driving at high speeds. I then get pulled over, and the officer hears the child in my trunk. What do you think happens? What do you think people will say? I tend to believe those on the left would want the police officer and CYS to take the child from my custody since I was endangering the child. Anyone think different?
You're describing a criminal offense and using it as analogy for a civil offense.
. Also, applying for asylum is not the same as stuffing your 3 year old in a car trunk.
Throwing your child on the top of the train at high speeds, or hiding in the back of a pickup truck in cabinets with no air, is child endangerment.
Its not asylum, a country has to meet certain requirements for asylum, nice talking point though.
Basic Grounds for Asylum or Refugee Status
To establish eligibility for asylum or refugee status, you must prove you are either the victim of past persecution or you have a well-founded fear of future persecution. In the case of past persecution, you must prove that you were persecuted in your home country or last country of residence.
The persecution must have been based on at least one of five grounds, either your: •race •religion •nationality •political opinion, or •membership in a particular social group.
The threat against you needs to be a nationwide—you won’t be thought to have a well-founded fear of persecution if you could avoid the problem simply by moving to another part of the country.So as long as people still vacation in Mexico on the daily basis...they don't qualify.
They're literally people applying for asylum, it's not a talking point, it's the facts of the matter. Also, wouldn't hiding in cabinets across an entire country be proof of persecution? Also how many asylum seekers are actually from Mexico? Just because they go through Mexico, doesn't make them Mexicans...
The threat against you needs to be a nationwide—you won’t be thought to have a well-founded fear of persecution if you could avoid the problem simply by moving to another part of the country.So as long as people still vacation in Mexico on the daily basis...they don't qualify.
Do you not follow the speed limit? Let’s govenyou a ticket, and then slash your tires to make sure you never speed again.
———————————————
Peen, you know I’m giving an analogy. It remains a valid comparison.
I don’t understand how it can be all about legal vs illegal to you. You ignore soo much more of a complex issue by doing that.
Just admit your an anarchist who doesn't believe in laws.
We have laws that are written to keep Americans safer than they would be otherwise.
You also don't care about the 140 BILLION dollars in damages to the US that illegal aliens cause every single year too right?
We are not here to be the welfare program for the entire freaking world. Just because people want to come here doesn't mean they are entitled or have a right to be here.
Intelligent people understand cause and effect. Many on this forum don't seem to understand that though. If you flood a country with poor and uneducated masses of people who will lie, cheat, steal, and anything else to get into the country then what will your country change into as they illegally have children here who by default now become citizens. It simple. They bankrupt the system. They destroy the culture and since your new voting class becomes poorly educated they become easy to manipulate by socialism/communism.
Democracy requires a highly educated and moral population to work. They have to be self motivated to work and earn a living. Once you flood the education system the quality of education goes down. When they grow up they become poorer and more desperate and will vote who ever offers them the most government aid. At some point people then become trapped and depended on that government aid and eventually generations grow up feeling they are entitled to those free benefits instead of thinking they must earn them.
At that point democracy dies because all your left with is socialism and communism as the state takes control of your lives for your own sake.
At some point it's going to lead to wars in the Americas because it will be cheaper and more effective to simply conquer these governments that cause us so much trouble than it is to let them flood our borders with all the poorest of their country who wreak havoc on us.
Right now we suffer 9-11 every single year thanks to illegal aliens invading our country. That is a pure, cold, hard FACT.
10.000 children were discarded by their parents and were given to the coyotes to use them as human shieids to enter into our country wheres the outrage from the LEFT.
Also how many asylum seekers are actually from Mexico? Just because they go through Mexico, doesn't make them Mexicans...
hmmm, so if they are coming from another country, through a country that is safe enough for people to live every day and vacation, they could have easily just stayed in that country, huh?
I visit Toluca every year. I have an "adopted" family that lives in a very nice village outside of there through a best friend. We stay at his family home. Going this September for his Grandma's 100th bday. Mexico is a beautiful country, with beautiful people that love their land and love their country with more pride than any liberal I ever met. I wish you would not demean it so.
10.000 children were discarded by their parents and were given to the coyotes to use them as human shieids to enter into our country wheres the outrage from the LEFT
You're also a white American, you could go to Uganda and be safe.
You still cannot answer why in the scenario I presented to you - calls for a man trying to better his life by moving a child for that job is warranted for his child to be taken away, yet the illegal immigrant endangering their child's life is not a big deal and does not?
You're also a white American, you could go to Uganda and be safe.
You still cannot answer why in the scenario I presented to you - calls for a man trying to better his life by moving a child for that job is warranted for his child to be taken away, yet the illegal immigrant endangering their child's life is not a big deal and does not?
Because Mexico is ran by cartels and it's not safe to live their if you're critical of them or the government. People from indigenous communities also face very severe racist attacks from the countries in Central America. I assumed you knew that and that's why you vacation in a suburb of Mexico City instead of the city itself.
Because Mexico is ran by cartels and it's not safe to live their if you're critical of them or the government.
My friends grandma is 100 years old this sept. Shes been perfectly safe. His family has been perfectly safe their entire life. Are there bad parts, yes. There are parts in Cleveland that are not that far off either. Do those citizens get asylum? again, to be a refugee your ENTIRE country has to be effected. It is not.
Because Mexico is ran by cartels and it's not safe to live their if you're critical of them or the government.
My friends grandma is 100 years old this sept. Shes been perfectly safe. His family has been perfectly safe their entire life. Are there bad parts, yes. There are parts in Cleveland that are not that far off either. Do those citizens get asylum? again, to be a refugee your ENTIRE country has to be effected. It is not.
Don’t bring up Chicago ... they can’t connect those dots ... i know from a recent experience ... ..
Because Mexico is ran by cartels and it's not safe to live their if you're critical of them or the government.
My friends grandma is 100 years old this sept. Shes been perfectly safe. His family has been perfectly safe their entire life. Are there bad parts, yes. There are parts in Cleveland that are not that far off either. Do those citizens get asylum? again, to be a refugee your ENTIRE country has to be effected. It is not.
It's almost like refugees status only apply to specific people and not everyone...
It's also like when you work with tourists, you stay safe and keep a low profile.
i sincerely hope willit isn't using his experience as a tourist in a tourist area as a basis for the overall state of the country.
I certainly hope you will read what the definition of what it takes to be granted asylum is. Mexico is not a country one can get it accepted for being from.
i sincerely hope willit isn't using his experience as a tourist in a tourist area as a basis for the overall state of the country.
I certainly hope you will read what the definition of what it takes to be granted asylum is. Mexico is not a country one can get it accepted for being from.
what?
where do you get your information from? you do realize that anybody can apply for asylum, correct?
Despite its close proximity, only about 300-800 people from Mexico are granted asylum in the U.S. each year. According to the Department of Homeland Security (DHS), 667 Mexican nationals who submitted an affirmative U.S. asylum application were granted asylee status in 2015. That number is higher than the norm. For example, only 202 affirmative Mexican asylum cases were approved in 2013.
For grants of asylum in removal proceedings, only 203 out of nearly 9,000 applications in 2015 were eventually approved by immigration judges. That is a grant rate of only 2.3% Mexican asylum claims, compared with a 48% approval rate for all countries overall in the immigration courts.
certainly hope you will read what the definition of what it takes to be granted asylum is. Mexico is not a country one can get it accepted for being from.
is a blatant lie.
willit, you stay posting wrong information as fact, and then use that for whatever weird point you're trying to make.
U.S. asylum law applies to those who have a well-founded fear of persecution “on account of race, religion, nationality, membership in a particular social group, or political opinion.” Those fleeing generalized crime and violence in their home country do not easily fit into these categories. Nevertheless, at times U.S. immigration judges have interpreted this law so as to grant asylum to Central American migrants who can demonstrate “a well-founded fear of persecution” within the standards described above, or who qualify for protection under the UN Convention Against Torture.
how is staying with a Mexican family who LIVES in Mexico a tourist destination.....
Anyone can APPLY for asylum, yes. But to qualify you have to prove that your entire country is suffering persecution. The threat against you needs to be a nationwide—you won’t be thought to have a well-founded fear of persecution if you could avoid the problem simply by moving to another part of the country.
i sincerely hope willit isn't using his experience as a tourist in a tourist area as a basis for the overall state of the country.
I certainly hope you will read what the definition of what it takes to be granted asylum is. Mexico is not a country one can get it accepted for being from.
If you looked at the stats, you would see most asylum seekers are from Central America, not North America. El Salvador, Honduras, Guatemala are the countries that most of these people originate from.
You should both strive for greater accuracy in your information.
As a general rule, asylum eligibility is considered for an entire nation, and not specific parts of that nation, outside of a specific ethnic issue. So, no, the entire country of Mexico is not, GENERALLY, approved as an automatic eligibility for asylum.
HOWEVER, that does NOT mean that no one from Mexico can possibly be eligible for asylum. There are exceptions to every rule, it is not an absolute.
The difference of 2.8% acceptance versus 48% for other countries should pretty clearly point this out.
I've noticed lately that it's always the weirdest and most insane idiots who ramble about "facts" or "logic" or "reason" or "simple minds".
You see it a lot with this Ben Shapiro and Jordan Peterson stuff.
There's a thread in here with a Candace Owens video titled How To Make a Mind. It's funny to see some people live out their 1984 fear without even knowing it.
a liberal judge can grant whatever he would please...doesn't change the law. according to the law, it is not a place that would qualify. which is why you and your bleeding hearts are now throwing a tantrum, when laws are being applied.
name calling, huh? notice how you resort to that each and every time...simple minded folk do tend to do that.
again, the FACTS clearly contradict whatever nonsense you're posting right now.
i posted the facts, and now you're posting feelings. let your roommate across the hall know you need backup.
I've noticed lately that it's always the weirdest and most insane idiots who ramble about "facts" or "logic" or "reason" or "simple minds".
You see it a lot with this Ben Shapiro and Jordan Peterson stuff.
There's a thread in here with a Candace Owens video titled How To Make a Mind. It's funny to see some people live out their 1984 fear without even knowing it.
Owens is a good example.
Dave Rubin, Mike Cernovich... it's telling who they gravitate to.
The most elegant and simple explanation of why Trump's decision to leverage these children as a tool to attempt to prevent illegal immigration was in this article I read today.... it strikes not at whether the law should or should not be enforced - but whether the law is just.
== The Bible, like a gun, is a dangerous thing in the hands of a bigot. Segregationists and autocrats throughout Western history have claimed that Romans 13 covers oppressive or unjust laws. But the centerpiece commitment of Christian social ethics is not order; it is justice. For a good introduction to the concept, Sessions might read the Rev. Martin Luther King Jr.’s “Letter from Birmingham Jail.” “A just law is a man-made code that squares with the moral law or the law of God,” King argued. “An unjust law is a code that is out of harmony with the moral law.” And how should justice be defined? “Any law that uplifts human personality is just. Any law that degrades human personality is unjust.” ==
The bottom line is that what the US government is doing to these innocent children is tragic and inhumane. Hiding behind a position of "were only enforcing the law" is cowardly and disgusting. . . . I understand the desire to prevent illegal immigration. I understand that the parents are breaking US law .. but there is a choice on how to respond. Trump has chosen a response that shows a total lack of compassion. There are other options.
In the far east and middle east I believe they still cut off the hands of thieves. It's certainly a much greater deterrent than any laws we have in the USA .... this child detention policy of Trump's makes me draw an analogy with the punishment of cutting of someone's hand for theft. Sure it's the "law" - but is it inhumane and barbaric. I think so, without any doubt.
The most elegant and simple explanation of why Trump's decision to leverage these children as a tool to attempt to prevent illegal immigration was in this article I read today.... it strikes not at whether the law should or should not be enforced - but whether the law is just.
== The Bible, like a gun, is a dangerous thing in the hands of a bigot. Segregationists and autocrats throughout Western history have claimed that Romans 13 covers oppressive or unjust laws. But the centerpiece commitment of Christian social ethics is not order; it is justice. For a good introduction to the concept, Sessions might read the Rev. Martin Luther King Jr.’s “Letter from Birmingham Jail.” “A just law is a man-made code that squares with the moral law or the law of God,” King argued. “An unjust law is a code that is out of harmony with the moral law.” And how should justice be defined? “Any law that uplifts human personality is just. Any law that degrades human personality is unjust.” ==
The bottom line is that what the US government is doing to these innocent children is tragic and inhumane. Hiding behind a position of "were only enforcing the law" is cowardly and disgusting. . . . I understand the desire to prevent illegal immigration. I understand that the parents are breaking US law .. but there is a choice on how to respond. Trump has chosen a response that shows a total lack of compassion. There are other options.
In the far east and middle east I believe they still cut off the hands of thieves. It's certainly a much greater deterrent than any laws we have in the USA .... this child detention policy of Trump's makes me draw an analogy with the punishment of cutting of someone's hand for theft. Sure it's the "law" - but is it inhumane and barbaric. I think so, without any doubt.
This is more Stephen Miller's doing than Trump's.
Trump is an elderly racist trust fund idiot who yells at the TV all day. His name is on the door, but ain't shaping policy.
Can I call someone a liar if I have factual proof?
Will I get banned if I tell someone to not take their meds?
Will we allow white supremacy to continue to fester on this forum?
I’m pretty sure this place didn’t allow klan rallies when I joined back in 2010.
I've heard you can give people unsolicited ice cream edemas and call people murderers, depending on who you are doing it to. It would nice to get some clarification on the rules, especially if they're trying to reign this behavior in. But what does this former forum moderator know?
So if a single father breaks into a house, and goes to jail, he should be left to go, since he has child?
That's not the crime being discussed. If you think your analogy is the same as what's taking place, then I disagree.
Someone saying that regardless of the crime the Libtards want to give all criminals a cozy warm place to live with their family is badly wrong. But hey - it sounds catchy right. Never mind the facts, just invent something that sounds like something that the folks on the RIGHT think the Libtards on the LEFT *might* say and then we can all have a good laugh at it. Pfft.
WASHINGTON -- Homeland Security Secretary Kirstjen Nielsen insisted Monday that President Trump's administration does not have a specific family separation policy, but separations do happen as a result of enforcing immigration laws riddled with "loopholes."
"Congress needs to fix it," Nielsen told reporters during a specially arranged briefing at the White House. "It's a problem; let's fix it."
Current federal law doesn't allow the government to hold entire families together, she said, though lawmakers in both parties said enforcement is at the administration's discretion.
"There is no law that says the Administration has to rip children from their families," said Sen. Kamala Harris, D-Calif., in calling for Nielsen's resignation.
Sen. Ben Sasse, R-Neb., said "family separation is wicked," and should not be "the default U.S. policy. Americans are better than this."
Amid the criticism, as well as televised images of crying children taken from their parents, the White House sent out Nielsen to speak with reporters, delaying the news briefing for nearly four hours as the homeland security secretary returned from giving a speech in New Orleans.
Nielsen said most of the children in federal custody were sent into the United States without their parents. Those who are detained are treated well, she said, provided with meals, medical care, and educational services, as well as video conferences with parents.
"Illegal entry is a crime," she told reporters at the White House, and parents who engage in it are putting their children at risk.
She also said migrants claiming asylum will not be separated from their families if they make the claim at a specified "port of entry."
Nielsen said most of the children in federal custody were sent into the United States without their parents. Those who are detained are treated well, she said, provided with meals, medical care, and educational services, as well as video conferences with parents.
"Illegal entry is a crime," she told reporters at the White House, and parents who engage in it are putting their children at risk.
She also said migrants claiming asylum will not be separated from their families if they make the claim at a specified "port of entry."
I would think the difference between a father putting his kid in the trunk of a car to save room while moving (?), and a family being stored away in the back of a truck for fear of being killed are two completely different things. On one hand, you have a bad tetris player who is also a bad parent. On the other hand, you have a family relying on their survival instincts by hiding for hundreds of miles.
I'd still rather talk about how this policy is affecting asylum seekers at the border specifically and not illegal immigrants tho. Can you manage that?
I would think the difference between a father putting his kid in the trunk of a car to save room while moving (?), and a family being stored away in the back of a truck for fear of being killed are two completely different things. On one hand, you have a bad tetris player who is also a bad parent. On the other hand, you have a family relying on their survival instincts by hiding for hundreds of miles.
The majority of those coming here are not coming here because they are in fear of their lives, again this is a talking point you and others are trying to push, which is just false. Those seeking asylum , as Nelson pointed out the numbers, and qualified for it, have received it.
So, for the family that is coming here simply because they want to live here and do not want to wait - why is it ok for them to endanger their child?
I would think the difference between a father putting his kid in the trunk of a car to save room while moving (?), and a family being stored away in the back of a truck for fear of being killed are two completely different things. On one hand, you have a bad tetris player who is also a bad parent. On the other hand, you have a family relying on their survival instincts by hiding for hundreds of miles.
The majority of those coming here are not coming here because they are in fear of their lives, again this is a talking point you and others are trying to push, which is just false. Those seeking asylum , as Nelson pointed out the numbers, and qualified for it, have received it.
So, for the family that is coming here simply because they want to live here and do not want to wait - why is it ok for them to endanger their child?
No it's not, and I'll post it against since you've avoided it for the past hour and a half.
Originally Posted By: CHSDawg
Originally Posted By: willitevachange
Originally Posted By: Swish
i sincerely hope willit isn't using his experience as a tourist in a tourist area as a basis for the overall state of the country.
I certainly hope you will read what the definition of what it takes to be granted asylum is. Mexico is not a country one can get it accepted for being from.
If you looked at the stats, you would see most asylum seekers are from Central America, not North America. El Salvador, Honduras, Guatemala are the countries that most of these people originate from.
Your chart shows people who are granted asylum, it says nothing about the number of illegals coming here as a whole.
The majority of people that come here illegally are not refugees or fleeing a country.
they coming simply because they want to live here.
Trump's policy of separating families is a crime against humanity. If this was a 3rd world country we could be looking towards the skies for a drone strike.
You keep ignoring the fact you are trying to compare civil and criminal like you can't or refuse to see it. But at some point that's about what I expected.
People unfortunately tend to have an extremely simplistic view of the law, and only view actions as being "legal" or "illegal", without respect to additional boilerplate like "proportional response."
If someone steals a candy bar, we don't chop off their hand in this country. If someone gets a speeding ticket, we don't take away their kids. Yet people are insisting on navigating this simplistic view because it's the only way they can justify to themselves that we are living through a humanitarian crisis on our very own border. Taking away kids over a civil violation is not proportional, and it only exists because the WH wants leverage for the wall and because Jeff Sessions and Stephen Miller like bringing pain on people they consider undesirable.
And lest we leave Trump out of it, the POTUS himself refers to this problem as an infestation . Unfortunately these dog whistles are not new for him.
This issue is hinged on one simple question: Do you think it is acceptable for the US government to use children as leverage to further their policy goals?
And let's face it, that's what this all boils down to. In the end we'll find that the only way to stop this is to fund the wall. Now don't get me wrong, I'm not against a border wall. But using children in this manner as pawns in a chess match as blackmail makes it very hard for me to support any of Trump's policies.
But see, there's no room for middle ground in this nation anymore. You either support a party all or nothing. No matter what foolish or evil things they do. No matter what moron they elect. No matter how evil their policies.
Here lately I've had more concerns than ever before about a party who claims to have Christian values, who claims to have family values and then supports such a vile man who has nothing in common with everything they claim to stand for.
Talking to trumpian xenophobes about the human decency of caring about brown children is an exercise in futility. This whole forum has degraded to nothing more than a sewer that propagates and justifies American fascism. The voice of opposition has zero counter effect because a few sewer dwellers are deaf to any message not originating from the orange sewage source, rather delivered directly or parroted.
You keep ignoring the fact you are trying to compare civil and criminal like you can't or refuse to see it. But at some point that's about what I expected.
child abuse is now civil and criminal?? Please explain.
Former ICE Director: Some migrant family separations are permanent
"You could be creating thousands of immigrant orphans in the U.S.," said ex-Acting Director John Sandweg. by Julia Ainsley / Jun.19.2018 / 11:54 AM ET Image: Family units who illegally crossed the Mexico-U.S. border turn themselves in to U.S. Border Patrol agents near McAllen Families who illegally crossed the Mexico-U.S. border turn themselves in to U.S. Border Patrol agents near McAllen, Texas, on May 9, 2018.Loren Elliott / Reuters file WASHINGTON — The former head of U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement told NBC News that migrant parents separated from their children at the border are sometimes unable to relocate their child and remain permanently separated.
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Sandweg's warning contradicts White House messaging that the separation of women and children migrants under the Trump administration's "zero tolerance" policy is only temporary.
While a parent can quickly move from detention to deportation, a child's case for asylum or deportation may not be heard by a judge for several years because deporting a child is a lower priority for the courts, Sandweg explained.
Related A day at the border: Gripping images show detained migrant families "You could easily end up in a situation where the gap between a parent's deportation and a child's deportation is years," Sandweg said.
As a result, parents may find themselves back in their home countries struggling to find their children. Many do not have access to legal counsel or understand the U.S. immigration or judicial systems.
Children who stay in the foster system for lengthy periods of time may become wards of the state and finally adopted.
"You could be creating thousands of immigrant orphans in the U.S. that one day could become eligible for citizenship when they are adopted," Sandweg explained.
That scenario could be hard to swallow for immigration hardliners who argue against spending welfare dollars on immigrants and are opposed to a path to citizenship for children brought into the country illegally.
Sandweg says he has seen permanent separation happen when a parent is deported without his or her child.
"This is why family unity was critical for us. With the numbers of families crossing ticking up, [the] Obama administration was concerned about children being left behind," said Sandweg.
Nearly 2,000 migrant children have been separated from their parents JUN.19.201811:13 Speaking on Fox News on Tuesday, White House Director of Strategic Communications Mercedes Schlapp insisted the separations were short term.
"We have come to understand that these families who are separated, it is for a limited period of time between five to ten days," Schlapp said.
But already, immigration lawyers in the U.S. and Central America say many parent immigrants who have been deported are having a hard time locating their children. The Trump administration's "zero tolerance" policy was announced in April.
Parents are given a paper slip written in English and Spanish that explains they have been charged with a crime for entering the United States illegally and will be separated from their child while they await their court hearing.
"For assistance in locating your child(ren), you may contact the Office of Refugee Resettlement," the slip says, giving a 1-800 number.
NBC News called the number and heard a recording that allows the caller to be connected with a case manager regarding his or her child.
We are discussing illegal immigration. It is a civil crime. You have repeatedly made comparisons to criminal offenses. Punishment for civil crimes do not include separating families. There in lies the difference in the comparisons you've been trying to make.
Here lately I've had more concerns than ever before about a party who claims to have Christian values, who claims to have family values and then supports such a vile man who has nothing in common with everything they claim to stand for.
They support him because he's not Hillary. If Trump said anything right, it was when he said he could shoot a person dead in 5th avenue and not lose support.
You keep ignoring the fact you are trying to compare civil and criminal like you can't or refuse to see it. But at some point that's about what I expected.
child abuse is now civil and criminal?? Please explain.
You an others are completely missing my point. I don't like the fact they are being separated, before someone tries to say that I do. I am simply pointing out that child endangerment is child endangerment. Laws should be applied evenly to all.
People crossing the border illegally with children should be detained, as it gives incentive to come across with children if you do not. However, then you are where we are now - with what do you do with the children.
Personally, I feel we need to get legislation done that creates a separate facility to house those with children and expedite their cases. The left, simply wants to let them in, no questions asked.
Here lately I've had more concerns than ever before about a party who claims to have Christian values, who claims to have family values and then supports such a vile man who has nothing in common with everything they claim to stand for.
They support him because he's not Hillary. If Trump said anything right, it was when he said he could shoot a person dead in 5th avenue and not lose support.
And ... "Russia if you're listening,?"....(You know the rest)
The trumpian psyche is like an orwellian fractal composed of selflothing embellishments, nonsensical logic, fascist nationalism, unabashed ignorance, panophobia, confirmation bias, zealotism, and an incessant quest for validation. How does one rationalize with that?
President Trump said what he needs from Congress is legislation allowing him to detain and remove families as a unit without having to separate the children.
President Trump said what he needs from Congress is legislation allowing him to detain and remove families as a unit without having to separate the children.
They'll put forward some garbage legislation that has zero chance of approval from the left to help trump spread his lie that this is all the dems fault... Trump made the policy and could end it with a phone call or the stroke of his pen, no need for an act of congress.
Because a 1997 legal agreement and related policies say children cannot be jailed with adults for extended periods, the administration is separating the families.
‘At Least During the Internment …’ Are Words I Thought I’d Never Utter I was sent to a camp at just 5 years old — but even then, they didn't separate children from families. BY GEORGE TAKEI | JUNE 19, 2018, 9:00 AM Left: A Japanese-American woman holds her sleeping daughter as they prepare to leave their home for an internment camp in 1942. Right: Japanese-Americans interned at the Santa Anita Assembly Center at the Santa Anita racetrack near Los Angeles in 1942. (Library of Congress/Corbis/VCG via Getty Images/Foreign Policy illustration) Left: A Japanese-American woman holds her sleeping daughter as they prepare to leave their home for an internment camp in 1942. Right: Japanese-Americans interned at the Santa Anita Assembly Center at the Santa Anita racetrack near Los Angeles in 1942. (Library of Congress/Corbis/VCG via Getty Images/Foreign Policy illustration) Imagine this scene: Tens of thousands of people, mostly families with children, are labeled by the government as a threat to our nation, used as political tools by opportunistic politicians, and caught in a vast gray zone where their civil and human rights are erased by the presumption of universal guilt. Thousands are moved around to makeshift detention centers and sites, where camps are thrown together with more regard to the bottom line than the humanity of the new residents.
That is America today, at our southern border, which asylum-seekers and undocumented migrants alike are seeking to cross. But it is also America in late 1941, in the aftermath of Pearl Harbor, when overnight my community, my family, and I became the enemy because we happened to look like those who had dropped the bombs. And yet, in one core, horrifying way this is worse. At least during the internment of Japanese-Americans, I and other children were not stripped from our parents. We were not pulled screaming from our mothers’ arms. We were not left to change the diapers of younger children by ourselves.
Photos of children in cages and camps today so strongly evoke the wartime past that former First Lady Laura Bush drew a stark parallel in an op-ed in the Washington Post. “These images are eerily reminiscent of the Japanese American internment camps of World War II, now considered to have been one of the most shameful episodes in U.S. history,” Bush wrote. She reminded us that there are dark consequences to such camps for their residents: “This treatment inflicts trauma; interned Japanese have been two times as likely to suffer cardiovascular disease or die prematurely than those who were not interned.”
When a government acts capriciously, especially against a powerless and much-reviled group, it is hard to describe the terror and anxiety. There is nowhere to turn, because the only people with the power to help have trained their guns and dogs upon you. You are without rights, held without charge or trial. The world is upside down, information-less, and indifferent or even hostile to your plight.
And yet, with hideous irony, I can still say, “At least during the internment …”
At least during the internment, when I was just 5 years old, I was not taken from my parents.At least during the internment, when I was just 5 years old, I was not taken from my parents. My family was sent to a racetrack for several weeks to live in a horse stall, but at least we had each other. At least during the internment, my parents were able to place themselves between the horror of what we were facing and my own childish understanding of our circumstances. They told us we were “going on a vacation to live with the horsies.” And when we got to Rohwer camp, they again put themselves between us and the horror, so that we would never fully appreciate the grim reality of the mosquito-infested swamp into which we had been thrown. At least during the internment, we remained a family, and I credit that alone for keeping the scars of our unjust imprisonment from deepening on my soul. I cannot for a moment imagine what my childhood would have been like had I been thrown into a camp without my parents. That this is happening today fills me with both rage and grief: rage toward a failed political leadership who appear to have lost even their most basic humanity, and a profound grief for the families affected.
How do political leaders convince themselves of the virtues of such a policy? History shows it doesn’t take much. After Japan dropped its bombs, the political scapegoats were obvious. As America geared up for war, the administration needed some way to show that it was being tough on Japan, as it had little military success at the early going to trot out. Being tough on Japan easily translated into being tough on the Japanese here in America. No matter that most of us weren’t even Japanese nationals; nearly two-thirds of those imprisoned were U.S. citizens, after all. But as the Wartime Relocation Authority made clear, “a Jap is a Jap.” That was their own “zero-tolerance” policy.
But how to justify the sweeping internment of 120,000 people, when none of us had actually done anything wrong?But how to justify the sweeping internment of 120,000 people, when none of us had actually done anything wrong? It was Earl Warren — the same man who as chief justice would forge a famously liberal Supreme Court — who helped move that along. Warren was the attorney general for the state of California at the time, and he had designs on the governorship, which he won in late in 1942. Warren took the absence of evidence of sabotage or spying on the West Coast by any Japanese-American as justification to declare that this was evidence that we must be planning something truly hidden and deeply sinister. It was a lie, and a big one, but it was one repeated enough, and said with enough conviction, that rest of the country went along with it. We were the murderers, the thugs, the animals then — and since you couldn’t tell the good from the bad, you might as well round up everyone in the name of national security.
Whenever I draw parallels between today’s border actions and the internment camps of World War II, I am flooded with comments “reminding me” that it was a Democrat, Franklin Delano Roosevelt, who signed Executive Order 9066 and set the internment into motion. This only underscores my point, however: The United States’ flirtation with authoritarianism is not tied to any political party. Even people of good heart and conscience can be swept up in the frenzy. Earl Warren was a Republican, and while he ultimately came to view his role in the internment to be one of his greatest follies, at the time neither he nor others in government — with rare exceptions, like Ralph Carr, the governor of Colorado — saw anything wrong with what he’d done.
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The second lie is that those at our borders are criminals, and therefore deserve no rights. But the asylum-seekers at our borders are breaking no laws at all, nor are their children who accompany them. The broad brush of “criminal” today raises echoes of the wartime “enemy” to my ears. Once painted, both marks are impossible to wash off. Trump prepared his followers for this day long ago, when he began to dehumanize Mexican migrants as drug dealers, rapists, murderers, and animals. Animals might belong in cages. Humans don’t.
I wish that those, like me, who lived through this nightmare before didn’t have to sound the alarm againI wish that those, like me, who lived through this nightmare before didn’t have to sound the alarm again. But as my father once told me, America is a great nation but also a fallible one — as prone to great mistakes as are the people who inhabit it. As a survivor of internment camps, I have made it my lifelong mission to work against them being built ever again within our borders. Although the first camps for border crossers have been built, and are now filling up with innocent children, we have a chance to ensure history does not repeat itself in full, to demonstrate that we have learned from our past and to stand firmly against our worse natures. The internment happened because of fear and hatred, but also because of a failure of political leadership. In 1941, there were few politicians who dared stand up to the internment order. I am hopeful that today there will, should be, must be, far more people who speak up, both among our leaders and the public, and that the future writes the history of our resistance — not, yet again, of our compliance.
Because a 1997 legal agreement and related policies say children cannot be jailed with adults for extended periods, the administration is separating the families.
And yet no president has asked for such a zero tolerance policy until Trump. So now that he created the situation, let's blame others?
Because a 1997 legal agreement and related policies say children cannot be jailed with adults for extended periods, the administration is separating the families.
And yet no president has asked for such a zero tolerance policy until Trump. So now that he created the situation, let's blame others?
So you support opening the floodgates for illegals to enter the US? Opening them 50%? Opening them 25%?
What will it take to make you stop crying?
If they show up at points of entry, no one is arrested. If they try to steal their way in, they get arrested and their children turned over to HHS for safe keeping.
President Trump said what he needs from Congress is legislation allowing him to detain and remove families as a unit without having to separate the children.
They'll put forward some garbage legislation that has zero chance of approval from the left to help trump spread his lie that this is all the dems fault... Trump made the policy and could end it with a phone call or the stroke of his pen, no need for an act of congress.
So we agree that passing legislation is what we are supposed to do, and not govern by a pen, because well, as Trump has shown you - when you govern by a pen, it can be erased. Lets try governing by the rule of law for once, heh?
Because a 1997 legal agreement and related policies say children cannot be jailed with adults for extended periods, the administration is separating the families.
And yet no president has asked for such a zero tolerance policy until Trump. So now that he created the situation, let's blame others?
So you support opening the floodgates for illegals to enter the US? Opening them 50%? Opening them 25%?
What will it take to make you stop crying?
If they show up at points of entry, no one is arrested. If they try to steal their way in, they get arrested and their children turned over to HHS for safe keeping.
Why not, beats supporting needlessly hurting innocent kids! You condone child abuse, that's who YOU ARE!
Exclusive: US officials likely lost track of nearly 6,000 unaccompanied migrant kids BY FRANCO ORDOÑEZ AND ANITA KUMAR
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akumar@mcclatchydc.com
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WASHINGTON The Trump administration has likely lost track of nearly 6,000 unaccompanied migrant children, thousands more than lawmakers were alerted to last month, according to a McClatchy review of federal data.
Federal officials acknowledged last month that nearly 1,500 unaccompanied minors arrived on the southern border alone without their parents and were placed with sponsors who did not keep in touch with federal officials, but those numbers were only a snapshot of a three- month period during the last fiscal year.
“There is a lot more,” said a field specialist who worked in the Office of Refugee Resettlement until earlier this year and was tasked with reaching out to sponsors and children to check on their well-being. “You can bet that the numbers are higher. It doesn’t really give you a real picture.”
The new estimate comes as backlash widens over President Donald Trump's' decision to separate parents and children. Advocates argue the growing numbers of unaccounted children should be expected as families and sponsors become more fearful of federal officials that is now using information from government social workers to run immigration checks and, in some cases, target sponsors, including parents and family members, for removal.
“To the extent that there are problems for protection of unaccompanied children, this will only become worse as they put more kids in the unaccompanied category by ripping them away from their families,” said Clara Long, U.S. researcher at Human Rights Watch.
The revelation that federal officials couldn’t locate more than 1,000 children set off an outcry of concern and promises from the Trump administration to implement stronger vetting procedures of sponsors, including fingerprinting parents and handing their immigration status to Department of Homeland Security officials.
Federal officials said the children were not actually lost, but their sponsors didn’t respond to phone calls checking on them. They emphasized that Office of Refugee Resettlement is no longer legally responsible for the children once they were placed in a sponsor’s custody.
Since 2014, tens of thousands of unaccompanied children have been apprehended during a surge of Salvadoran, Honduran and Guatemalan mothers and children who have flooded the U.S. border fleeing violence and poverty.
Unaccompanied children are generally turned over to the custody of ORR, which will either care for them in a shelter or release them to a family member.
Last month, the Department of Health and Human Services acknowledged that the location of 1,475 unaccompanied children placed were sponsors couldn’t be determined.
Steven Wagner, acting assistant secretary of the Administration for Children and Families at HHS, told reporters that 14 percent of HHS calls to sponsors were not returned.
But to come up with the 1,475 cases, the administration reached out to only 7,635 children and their sponsors. It placed more than 42,497 unaccompanied children with sponsors in fiscal year 2017.
HHS told McClatchy it didn’t have the data of unaccounted children in a reportable format. But based on its own estimates that 14 percent didn't return calls, some 5,945 unaccompanied children are likely unaccounted for. The numbers would be even higher in fiscal year 2016, which included the end of President Barack Obama’s final term when the administration placed more than 52,000 children with sponsors.
In 2017, ORR released 93 percent of children to a sponsor. Of those, 49 percent were released to parents, 41 percent to close relatives, and 10 percent to other-than-close relatives or non-relatives. So far in fiscal year 2018, the administration released 90 percent of children to individual sponsors and of those sponsors, 41 percent were parents, 47 percent were close relatives, and 11 percent were other-than-close relatives or non-relatives.
HHS officials say it’s not the administration’s legal responsibility to locate those children after they’re turned over to the custody of a family member or approved sponsor. And they add that it’s difficult to keep tabs on sponsors who often also are living in the country illegally, move often, and may not want to be located.
RELATED STORIES FROM MCCLATCHY DC Exclusive: Trump looking to erect tent cities to house unaccompanied children Exclusive: Trump looking to erect tent cities to house unaccompanied children Trump administration to fingerprint parents who claim custody of unaccompanied migrant kids Trump administration to fingerprint parents who claim custody of unaccompanied migrant kids “You can imagine that many of those would not choose to speak to a federal official calling them on the phone,” Wagner told reporters. “But there’s no reason to believe that anything has happened to the kids. If you call a friend and they don’t answer the phone, you don’t assume that they’ve been kidnapped. So that characterization that the kids are missing is incorrect. And I just want to emphasize that they are not in our custody at the point at which that voluntary phone call is made.”
The reality is the Trump administration — and the Obama administration beforehand — has lost track and continues to lose track of thousands of unaccompanied minors while ORR does not appear to be trying to keep track of the children once they’re placed with sponsors.
Among the 7,635 children and sponsors the administration tried to reach, Wagner said that 6,075 remained with their sponsors. Twenty-eight children had run away, five had been deported, and 52 had been relocated to live with a non-sponsor. ORR was unable to determine with certainty the whereabouts of 1,475.
The field specialist told McClatchy the goal was not only to speak with the sponsor, but specifically with the children. “I’d ask are you sleeping? Have you been eating well? Have you been having nightmares? Do you have your own bed and your own room?” the specialist said.
But they wouldn’t make follow up calls if the sponsor or child didn’t answer. And more and more calls went unanswered, especially in communities where immigration enforcement had recently occurred.
Sen. Rob Portman, an Ohio Republican who serves as chairman of the Permanent Subcommittee on Investigations, noted in a recent that 1,475 is actually a higher percentage citing that some sponsors did answer phone calls and said they couldn’t locate the children.
“It's actually over 19 percent based on your own data because sometimes you placed a call, you got someone on the line and said I don't know where the kid is,” Portman told Wagner during a recent congressional hearing.
A 2008 law signed by President George W. Bush placed all children who arrive at U.S. borders and ports of entry without a parent or guardian under the care and custody of the Department of Health and Human Services.
Under President Barack Obama this issue grabbed national attention when, in 2015, it was discovered that HHS did not require any meaningful proof that the people who presented themselves as family friends really were who they said they were.
In one high-profile case, HHS allowed six migrant children from Guatemala to be turned over to traffickers who forced them to work in grueling conditions on an Ohio egg farm.
Those McClatchy has spoken with, including case managers, say even the reported numbers are low considering they were called after 30 days. Many more will leave after six months.
“Which means the number of lost kids are being dramatically underrepresented,” said Leon Fresco, a deputy assistant attorney general under Obama. “1,500 is only half the story. It’s one year and we’re not even talking about the entire Trump administration.”
Frank Sharry, executive director of America’s Voice, an immigration advocacy group, said the larger number of unaccounted for children is not surprising.
Sharry said many of the children are placed with family members who are in the United States illegally and may be afraid to speak to federal authorities, even if they are just trying to check on children because of "a climate of fear."
"What’s happened is that ICE has a new policy of going after sponsors," he said. "The bigger story if not that they are losing people - it's that ICE is terrorizing people."
Wikipedia Added US Border 'Detention Centers' to Its List of Concentration Camps Alongside Dachau and Japanese internment camps.
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TWEET River Donaghey River Donaghey
Jun 19 2018, 12:23pm
Photo via the US Border Patrol and Customs agency.
The detention centers along the US-Mexico border housing hundreds of migrant children who have been separated from their parents in the last six weeks are now included in Wikipedia's list of concentration camps, Gizmodo reports. It joins a dishearteningly long list of other sites of atrocity throughout history, from Dachau to the Soviet gulags to America's WWII-era Japanese internment camps.
"As part of the 2018 Trump administration family separation policy, nearly 2,000 immigrant children have been taken from their parents and placed in 'detention centers,'" the new section of the Wikipedia article currently reads. "These centers have been described by those in opposition to the policy as 'concentration camps.' The centers had previously been cited by Texas officials for more than 150 health violations."
The section has, unsurprisingly, ignited a string of debate and revisions since it was first added, with editors of the online encyclopedia arguing about the appropriateness of including these immigrant detention centers alongside Nazi extermination camps like Auschwitz. One user has called for the section to be locked "to prevent vandalism," but it is currently still open for edits.
"No comparison with extermination camps or the Holocaust is being made here," a Wikipedia editor named The Anome wrote in defense of the new addition, arguing that, while the border detainment centers differ from Nazi death camps, they still fit uncomfortably well within the broad definition of concentration and internment camps.
"This is a list of concentration and internment camps, and these are very clearly internment camps," The Anome wrote. "For children. In America. In 2018. For shame."
Even Melania Trump's own immigration lawyer, Michael Wildes, spoke out against the Trump Administration's "zero tolerance" immigration policy, calling it "reminiscent of detention centers of Nazi Germany, of the slave trade" during an interview Tuesday, but Attorney General Jeff Sessions continues to shrug off any attempt to compare the policy to Nazi concentration camps.
"[Nazi comparisons are] a real exaggeration, of course. In Nazi Germany, they were keeping the Jews from leaving the country," Sessions told Fox News' Laura Ingraham Monday night. Ingraham, of course, is the same person who said that the border detention facilities currently holding migrant children are "essentially summer camps."
Unfortunately, all you have to do is listen to the heartbreaking recording of terrified, sobbing children left in detention shelters while the guards crack jokes to know that this is a reprehensible piece of American history and likely deserves its place on Wikipedia's list.
The bottom line: It is official US policy to abuse children. Whether you are OK with that or not is up to you. But that is the policy today, and this entire administration created this policy.
This is the problem with this country. I have read most of the posts....it ranges from people questioning who are real Americans, to white supremacy, to using children as pawns...either way.
Good gosh....just stop.
I said it a page or two back, the problem is with the law. The chambers are working to add clarity. I hope they do in short order. Maybe they all can agree on some things now. Nobody wants to take kids from parents....just stop thinking that.
The President isn't some evil ogre like the Pied Piper who took all the children from the town. He is enforcing the border laws. He should, and by oath is bound to do.
Now we see how our weak border laws and security are creating a crisis.
I hope all the kids get back to their parents shortly. I really mean that, even if I have been called a lot of things thinking I don't feel that way.
The problem is the Law - yes. Partly. But the law has been the same for multiple administrations ... so the problem isn't REALLY the law ... the problem is TRUMP. Spin it any way you like but those are the facts.
The problem is the Law - yes. Partly. But the law has been the same for multiple administrations ... so the problem isn't REALLY the law ... the problem is TRUMP. Spin it any way you like but those are the facts.
Ok....in a way, sure.
However, this President is enforcing border laws unlike many administrations before him. That is the fact.
I say it's about time, so no, the problem isn't President Trump.
Obviously you disagree with him enforcing laws, but I and many others don't.
You said you read many posts ... hopefully you caught mine which was entirely about the law and what makes a Just law and what makes an unjust law ... and there was a paragraph from MLK who summed it up to a tee.
So - when the application of the law (which is subjective, otherwise there wouldn't be this variance in how it has been administered) means inhumanely separating families like this then, no I don't believe it is correct. I think it is disgusting and barbaric. . . . That doesn't mean I want open borders or illegal immigrants to get put up at the Hilton because they have a child in tow ... it means finding a way to send them back and "process" them without torturing little ones. It's not that hard.
The problem is the Law - yes. Partly. But the law has been the same for multiple administrations ... so the problem isn't REALLY the law ... the problem is TRUMP. Spin it any way you like but those are the facts.
Ok....in a way, sure.
However, this President is enforcing border laws unlike many administrations before him. That is the fact.
I say it's about time, so no, the problem isn't President Trump.
Obviously you disagree with him enforcing laws, but I and many others don't.
Someone who we we won't mention posted this...where was all this outcry, where was all the news stations 24/7 on this?
Quote:
Georgia couple loses custody of son after giving him marijuana to treat seizures
I don't know about all that. But I do know this policy is only now an issue because Trump is the president.
The media is out to get him on anything. The libs are out to ignore the past and get him........some damn way, some damn how. And, I'll be called a Trump "whatever", but honestly, I've never seen a mass media and left wing bias as strong against a person as I have with Trump.
That in no way means he should be able to do whatever he wants............but it sure as heck means he shouldn't be fried because he is allowing what other administrations mandated.
The hate for Trump is so deep it's pathetic. And yeah, I have many people in mind. He could find a cure for cancer..........well, he could fund a cure for cancer, and I guarndamtee you, the haters would say "why the hell did he wait so long to show us?
Ain't a damn thing he's done that has been terrible - unless you listen to the so called "main stream media" that is still butt hurt over him winning an election they said he had no chance of winning.
It's damn sad watching people bitch and gripe about his admin doing what O's and Clintons admins did.
Pathetic.
Honestly? It shows me that people in general, and especially on here? Don't give a rip about 'what', they only care about tearing down the guy that beat their girl.
Trump huddles with House GOP on immigration as border outrage escalates
President Trump met with House Republicans Tuesday to discuss immigration legislation as lawmakers searched for a way to end the administration's policy of separating families who illegally cross the U.S.-Mexico border.
After the meeting broke up, the White House announced that Trump had endorsed legislation negotiated between GOP leaders and moderate Republicans that promises to "solve the border crisis and family separation issue by allowing for family detention and removal."
Trump huddles with House GOP on immigration as border outrage escalates
President Trump met with House Republicans Tuesday to discuss immigration legislation as lawmakers searched for a way to end the administration's policy of separating families who illegally cross the U.S.-Mexico border.
After the meeting broke up, the White House announced that Trump had endorsed legislation negotiated between GOP leaders and moderate Republicans that promises to "solve the border crisis and family separation issue by allowing for family detention and removal."
Trump huddles with House GOP on immigration as border outrage escalates
President Trump met with House Republicans Tuesday to discuss immigration legislation as lawmakers searched for a way to end the administration's policy of separating families who illegally cross the U.S.-Mexico border.
After the meeting broke up, the White House announced that Trump had endorsed legislation negotiated between GOP leaders and moderate Republicans that promises to "solve the border crisis and family separation issue by allowing for family detention and removal."
Trump huddles with House GOP on immigration as border outrage escalates
President Trump met with House Republicans Tuesday to discuss immigration legislation as lawmakers searched for a way to end the administration's policy of separating families who illegally cross the U.S.-Mexico border.
After the meeting broke up, the White House announced that Trump had endorsed legislation negotiated between GOP leaders and moderate Republicans that promises to "solve the border crisis and family separation issue by allowing for family detention and removal."
Trump huddles with House GOP on immigration as border outrage escalates
President Trump met with House Republicans Tuesday to discuss immigration legislation as lawmakers searched for a way to end the administration's policy of separating families who illegally cross the U.S.-Mexico border.
After the meeting broke up, the White House announced that Trump had endorsed legislation negotiated between GOP leaders and moderate Republicans that promises to "solve the border crisis and family separation issue by allowing for family detention and removal."
Trump huddles with House GOP on immigration as border outrage escalates
President Trump met with House Republicans Tuesday to discuss immigration legislation as lawmakers searched for a way to end the administration's policy of separating families who illegally cross the U.S.-Mexico border.
After the meeting broke up, the White House announced that Trump had endorsed legislation negotiated between GOP leaders and moderate Republicans that promises to "solve the border crisis and family separation issue by allowing for family detention and removal."
Just going to try and set dems up to look bad... won't work. Trump made this mess, dems say he can fix it on his own. 1 phone call, done.
A phone call is not law, legislation passed by Congress and signed by the President is law.
Are you holding these kids hostage now because your Democrats won't pass this simple law? Shame!
You do understand there is a Republican majority in Congress, right?
Also, kids being detained separately didn't happen until Trump with zero legislation changes, so a phone call should do it. What did it take to set this in motion? It wasn't new legislation.
Trump huddles with House GOP on immigration as border outrage escalates
President Trump met with House Republicans Tuesday to discuss immigration legislation as lawmakers searched for a way to end the administration's policy of separating families who illegally cross the U.S.-Mexico border.
After the meeting broke up, the White House announced that Trump had endorsed legislation negotiated between GOP leaders and moderate Republicans that promises to "solve the border crisis and family separation issue by allowing for family detention and removal."
I now see I was wrong about HRC. I didn't like her calling 35% of Americans Deplorable... but she nailed it.
Nah she's a moron too. She was the only politician dumb enough to actually say she hates her opposition. HRC has always known the political do and do nots, but has been too dumb to walk on that tight rope.
Reports now saying the Trump Administration is giddy about all the turmoil this is causing... It was their plan to generate outrage. They are now deporting the parents but keeping their kids!
And that orange freak had the gall to hug the flag! Like Donny bone spurs remotely understands the glory of that flag! Kneeling in free speech protest is nothing compared to that slimeball even touching the flag for an on stage gimmick, but hugging it and gloating for show is the worst kind of desecration I've ever seen!
Trump huddles with House GOP on immigration as border outrage escalates
President Trump met with House Republicans Tuesday to discuss immigration legislation as lawmakers searched for a way to end the administration's policy of separating families who illegally cross the U.S.-Mexico border.
After the meeting broke up, the White House announced that Trump had endorsed legislation negotiated between GOP leaders and moderate Republicans that promises to "solve the border crisis and family separation issue by allowing for family detention and removal."
Just going to try and set dems up to look bad... won't work. Trump made this mess, dems say he can fix it on his own. 1 phone call, done.
A phone call is not law, legislation passed by Congress and signed by the President is law.
Are you holding these kids hostage now because your Democrats won't pass this simple law? Shame!
You do understand there is a Republican majority in Congress, right?
Also, kids being detained separately didn't happen until Trump with zero legislation changes, so a phone call should do it. What did it take to set this in motion? It wasn't new legislation.
You do understand it takes 60 votes in the Senate to pass a law, right? There aren't enough Republicans. Democrats need to vote too.
But now they are playing politics with this and holding those kids hostage!
Reports now saying the Trump Administration is giddy about all the turmoil this is causing... It was their plan to generate outrage. They are now deporting the parents but keeping their kids!
And that orange freak had the gall to hug the flag! Like Donny bone spurs remotely understands the glory of that flag! Kneeling in free speech protest is nothing compared to that slimeball even touching the flag for an on stage gimmick, but hugging it and gloating for show is the worst kind of desecration I've ever seen!
You really need someone to talk too. Honestly. I think you have some issues that are not healthy.
Trump huddles with House GOP on immigration as border outrage escalates
President Trump met with House Republicans Tuesday to discuss immigration legislation as lawmakers searched for a way to end the administration's policy of separating families who illegally cross the U.S.-Mexico border.
After the meeting broke up, the White House announced that Trump had endorsed legislation negotiated between GOP leaders and moderate Republicans that promises to "solve the border crisis and family separation issue by allowing for family detention and removal."
Just going to try and set dems up to look bad... won't work. Trump made this mess, dems say he can fix it on his own. 1 phone call, done.
A phone call is not law, legislation passed by Congress and signed by the President is law.
Are you holding these kids hostage now because your Democrats won't pass this simple law? Shame!
You do understand there is a Republican majority in Congress, right?
Also, kids being detained separately didn't happen until Trump with zero legislation changes, so a phone call should do it. What did it take to set this in motion? It wasn't new legislation.
You do understand it takes 60 votes in the Senate to pass a law, right? There aren't enough Republicans. Democrats need to vote too.
But now they are playing politics with this and holding those kids hostage!
Shame!
Until the legislation is seen, and voted on, the Democrats aren't holding up anything. Trump started "playing politics" with the kids, and now is blaming others. I'm sure any legislation will have a bunch of other, irrelevant crap in it so that when its voted down. Trump can point and blame others for the kids. And both parties pull that crap.
Trump huddles with House GOP on immigration as border outrage escalates
President Trump met with House Republicans Tuesday to discuss immigration legislation as lawmakers searched for a way to end the administration's policy of separating families who illegally cross the U.S.-Mexico border.
After the meeting broke up, the White House announced that Trump had endorsed legislation negotiated between GOP leaders and moderate Republicans that promises to "solve the border crisis and family separation issue by allowing for family detention and removal."
Just going to try and set dems up to look bad... won't work. Trump made this mess, dems say he can fix it on his own. 1 phone call, done.
A phone call is not law, legislation passed by Congress and signed by the President is law.
Are you holding these kids hostage now because your Democrats won't pass this simple law? Shame!
You do understand there is a Republican majority in Congress, right?
Also, kids being detained separately didn't happen until Trump with zero legislation changes, so a phone call should do it. What did it take to set this in motion? It wasn't new legislation.
You do understand it takes 60 votes in the Senate to pass a law, right? There aren't enough Republicans. Democrats need to vote too.
But now they are playing politics with this and holding those kids hostage!
Shame!
Until the legislation is seen, and voted on, the Democrats aren't holding up anything. Trump started "playing politics" with the kids, and now is blaming others. I'm sure any legislation will have a bunch of other, irrelevant crap in it so that when its voted down. Trump can point and blame others for the kids. And both parties pull that crap.
Schumer says he is not interested in legislation and wants President Trump to just ignore the law, stop enforcing it, go back to ignoring the law like Obama did.
Don't worry. Things like facts, logic, and reason won't slow down Trump haters. They need fantasy and blinders on so they can justify their unreasonable hate.
hated Obama for it. Didn't support him because of it. Politics isn't a zero sum game, especially for a powerless class whose political involvement peaks at insinuating the worst about the otherside while repeating the same wry political party insults.
Reports now saying the Trump Administration is giddy about all the turmoil this is causing... It was their plan to generate outrage. They are now deporting the parents but keeping their kids!
And that orange freak had the gall to hug the flag! Like Donny bone spurs remotely understands the glory of that flag! Kneeling in free speech protest is nothing compared to that slimeball even touching the flag for an on stage gimmick, but hugging it and gloating for show is the worst kind of desecration I've ever seen!
You really need someone to talk too. Honestly. I think you have some issues that are not healthy.
Yes I have issues with the illegitimate FAKE PRESIDENT.
Don't worry. Things like facts, logic, and reason won't slow down Trump haters. They need fantasy and blinders on so they can justify their unreasonable hate.
So now kidnapping and child abuse are unreasonable hate? You're a real piece of work, you are. Is that an orange juice mustache you're wearing?
No, calling what is happening kidnapping and child abuse is unreasonable hate.
There is no kidnapping, there is no abuse, except on the part of the parents who bring their children along during an illegal border crossing.
The illegal border crossings are going to be stopped. How bleeding hearts view the process is not important. It will be stopped. It can be done nice and pretty, or mean and nasty. There is a point wherein how it LOOKS is no longer important because it MUST BE DONE. Optics are not important. Success or failure is.
The illegitimate fascist FAKE PRESIDENT is kidnapping kids and committing child abuse on a grand scale! Human right violation if I ever seen one! Just another disgraceful act to add to his already large tally. Real Americans won't stand for it.
Before you start the hyperbole and outrage against what the media and Left are hyping up about the children of ILLEGAL immigrants, try learning what is FACT, first. Try researching Bill Clinton's 1996 law - Illegal Immigration Reform and Immigrant Responsibility Act. Try learning that these centers where the children are being housed existed during the Obama administration, and were utilized. Try realizing that these children are being cared for in a humane way. The Left and Media are playing you like Eddie Van Halen plays a guitar. Try learning that many of these kids are NOT with their parents. They are being used to get adults into the country through existing loopholes, and the Trump administration is following the law. A court determines whether or not the "parents" are really the parents. Due process. If they ARE the parents, then place the blame RIGHT THERE! They know the consequences ahead of time. And Crying Chuck, a LEGISLATOR, refuses to go along with a new law, you know, the constitutional method of making new law. Not a freaking pen, Maybe you should be giving your side some outrage, for not wanting to fix this.
Perhaps you forgot about this...under Obamas watch no less.
The illegitimate fascist FAKE PRESIDENT is kidnapping kids and committing child abuse on a grand scale! Human right violation if I ever seen one! Just another disgraceful act to add to his already large tally. Real Americans won't stand for it.
Curious, if they came to a port of entry, would they be separated?
Will, this policy was not enacted until last month. You're link specifically refers to children crossing by themselves. What we are doing down in Texas and other places is separating the children from their parents. They were not unaccompanied but now they are by force.
Following the law does NOT make something just. You cannot hide behind this action by saying it's the law. You must explain to people why you believe splitting up families is good policy both humanely for these people and fiscally as it costs us an immense amount of money to split up these families.
I don't care much for who has R or D by their name most of the time, as I'm distrusting of politicians in general. But the facts are the facts: The Trump admin started this policy, and they can end it right now. They can try to hide like cowards and claim that their hands were tied, but it doesn't explain why this very administration did not perform this disgusting act until very recently. It doesn't explain why John Kelly and Jeff Sessions and others drew up plans to enact this policy after Trump was president. It doesn't explain why this is good for Americans or the people who are coming across the Border. It doesn't explain how someone who is fleeing a murderous regime in Honduras and elsewhere would be deterred with separation.
It's cruel and unusual punishment. Would you be OK with losing your children if you were caught doing 10mph over the speed limit? Because unlawful entry is a misdemeanor. We should understand it as such.
I have stated before that they should have separate centers for the families. I do not like the fact they are being separated. However, until the law is changed, it should be adhered too. Shouldn't take that long, propose it, pass it, implement it immediately. The problem is the Dems will not give their votes to get to 60. its a shame.
Ignoring a law (even if it was done in the past) is not what these legislators were sworn to do. They are sworn to uphold the law, even if they disagree with it. This is why we have so much divisiveness. Laws are not touchy feely things you can just choose to only adhere to the ones you like.
I have stated before that they should have separate centers for the families. I do not like the fact they are being separated. However, until the law is changed, it should be adhered too. Shouldn't take that long, propose it, pass it, implement it immediately. The problem is the Dems will not give their votes to get to 60. its a shame.
Ignoring a law (even if it was done in the past) is not what these legislators were sworn to do. They are sworn to uphold the law, even if they disagree with it. This is why we have so much divisiveness. Laws are not touchy feely things you can just choose to only adhere to the ones you like.
The separations is NOT a law, it's Trump's enforcement policy. IF they really HAD to do this, like Trump and company say they do; then it would have been done before and by other Presidents. Don't buy into the BS willit, you are smarter than that and reasonable most of the time.
That's cool, the US can now add "baby concentration camps" to its list of services.
Stop crying and change the law!
I am not a member of US congress so I can't change the law. It's unfortunate you do not know how laws are passed in the United States. Since you do not understand how laws are formed, perhaps this classic video will be of educational value to you:
I have stated before that they should have separate centers for the families. I do not like the fact they are being separated. However, until the law is changed, it should be adhered too. Shouldn't take that long, propose it, pass it, implement it immediately. The problem is the Dems will not give their votes to get to 60. its a shame.
This is false. The legal landscape did not change between the time Trump took office and the time this policy was enacted. All that changed was Trump decided to enforce some laws over others. Please understand the facts and do not buy into partisan politics.
What used to happen was we processed families together when applying for asylum. The new Trump policy is to treat asylum seekers as lawbreakers, which means the parents get deported quickly as the penalty for unlawful entry is deportation. The unaccompanied minors are not charged, as they are minors, so they don't get deported quickly. The quickest way to end this practice is for the Trump administration to reverse course on it's policy. Republicans have already put in two bills but they can't even agree on which one goes to the floor and are stalling because they don't want to be seen as being soft on immigration. The longer we wait the worse this looks for Trump and his party.
Quote:
Ignoring a law (even if it was done in the past) is not what these legislators were sworn to do. They are sworn to uphold the law, even if they disagree with it. This is why we have so much divisiveness.
Laws are not touchy feely things you can just choose to only adhere to the ones you like.
Tell that to the President, who decided to ignore the law that states that seeking asylum is not a crime. This justification of yours falls on it's face on that basis alone.
Yes, he doesn't like the old law either. Now he will make his own.
He certainly doesn't have to worry about the Democrats getting off their butts to change it once he makes it.
He can't make 'laws' on his own, just executive orders that are subject to congressional action. He is caving to political pressure. He should never have done this zero tolerance thing.
They only want LAWS to be enforced when it comes to their issues. 
>) I have no criminal record of ANY kind.
). So I pack up, throw my 3 year old child in the trunk instead of his car seat to save space, and take off, driving at high speeds. I then get pulled over, and the officer hears the child in my trunk. What do you think happens? What do you think people will say? I tend to believe those on the left would want the police officer and CYS to take the child from my custody since I was endangering the child. Anyone think different?
....
